Israel / Palestine News Thread

[Raze]

Ben Gurion is a mixed bag. He actually avoided completely ethnically cleansing the Palestinians when he could have.

[Leo Gura]

6 minutes ago, Raze said:

There was never any evidence he was a pedophile, the only person who accused him later dropped the accusation 

He admits to getting a massage in Jeffery Epstein's mansion "but keeping his underwear on".

If you buy that, I got some Doge coin to sell you.

Quote

HillTV noted that December 2000 travel records found on Epstein's plane mentioned a "massage" that was scheduled for "AD." Dershowitz told HillTV, "That was in my wife's calendar. My wife scheduled a massage."

https://www.theroot.com/alan-dershowitz-sure-i-got-a-massage-at-jeffrey-epstei-1836314016

Edited October 3, 2024 by Leo Gura

[Raze]

1 minute ago, Leo Gura said:

He admits to getting a massage in Jeffery Epstein's house.

That doesn’t mean he was engaged in pedophilic activities. I could also say the creator of the Simpsons Matt Groening got a massage from Jeffrey Epstein sex slave to imply he’s a pedophile because that did happen, but we actually know he didn’t know she was a sex slave and it was just a foot massage. 

[Leo Gura]

15 minutes ago, Raze said:

creator of the Simpsons Matt Groening got a massage from Jeffrey Epstein sex slave

If that actually happened, that is super suss and I would not give Matt Groening the benefit of the doubt.

If you are getting massages at Jeffery Epstein's house, you should be on a national pedo watch list.

Edited October 3, 2024 by Leo Gura

[Raze]

1 minute ago, Leo Gura said:

If that actually happened, that is super suss and I would not give Matt Groening the benefit of the doubt.

If you are getting massages at Jeffery Epstein's house, you would be a national pedo watch list.

It was learned from the woman’s testimony herself, and she herself avoided saying anything sexual or abusive happened with him.

 

[Leo Gura]

I will retract the pedo accusation for the sake of rigor. Dershowitz is gross enough without it.

Edited October 3, 2024 by Leo Gura

[Inliytened1]

49 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Good. Keep an open mind and do more research. Your perspective will widen.

That's what it's all about.  I know I have bias towards Israel but I never said i agreed with how they responded.  They should have stopped long before they did.  I knew the numbers were high but the children does sting.  Yet other than that still support what they are doing.  They wouldn't even have a state right now if they didn't - they would probably be wiped out.   Call them bad guys, evil, Hitler, all that but they are a product of their environment as are you and me.

Edited October 4, 2024 by Inliytened1

[Leo Gura]

59 minutes ago, Nivsch said:

I wrote you what I think a page ago.

The reason I mentioned terrorism is because Israelis love calling others terrorists.

Do you see the double-standard of calling Palestinian leaders terrorists for trying to create a state for themselves but then saying it's "out of context" to call Israeli leaders terrorists?

If terrorism was okay to found Israel, why is it not okay to found Palestine?

Terrorism is a tool to found a state.

Edited October 4, 2024 by Leo Gura

[Inliytened1]

1 minute ago, Leo Gura said:

The reason I mentioned terrorism is because Israelis love calling others terrorists.

Do you see the double-standard of calling Palestinian leaders terrorists for trying to create a state for themselves but then saying it's "out of context" to call Israeli leaders terrorists?

Yes I get it.  Its all about perspective.  

US likes doing that too.

Who the terrorist is depends on what perspective you are looking at it from.

All of them have done "evil" of some sort but as you pointed out it comes down to degrees of that and also the context in which certain atrocities "happen".   Of course here we are splitting the needle so I see where you are coming from.  But relatively speaking we must still split that needle.

[Nivsch]

10 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

The reason I mentioned terrorism is because Israelis love calling others terrorists.

Do you see the double-standard of calling Palestinian leaders terrorists for trying to create a state for themselves but then saying it's "out of context" to call Israeli leaders terrorists?

I understand, yes, but I didn't say 'out of context' about that, but about the displaying of the evil way Ben Gurion did as was "THE way" Israel has founded, which is unfair because it was just a slice of the story of this giant long war, which even it was an end result of 30 years of escalation from both sides started mainly from the 1920s.

Edited October 4, 2024 by Nivsch

[Raze]

If Israel bombs irans oil and Iran bombs other oil in the gulf as they threatened it could crash the economy. 

[Inliytened1]

22 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

 

Terrorism is a tool to found a state.

This nullifies using the term at all then when referencing individuals that found states.  Better to say they did things they aren't proud of to achieve a higher goal.  Maybe you widened your perspective tonight too and stop with the hatred.

Edited October 4, 2024 by Inliytened1

[Leo Gura]

15 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

This nullifies using the term at all then when referencing individuals that found states.  Better to say they did things they aren't proud of to achieve a higher goal.

That doesn't work because the major terrorist Arab leaders are doing their acts in order to help Palestine gain statehood.

Are you okay with 9/11 being considered a thing they did to acheive a higher goal?

No.

The problem is that in the West, terrorism has become a Western propaganda term which means "unjustified violence", but of course this is a deeply biased and ethnocentic definiton because terrorism has always been done as a means towards a greater good, like fighting unjust oppressors and establishing national sovereignty. The problem with the West's framing of terrorism is that terrorism IS justified in the minds of those who do it. The West is shocked to learn this fact. But that's only because the West has been so self-absorbed as to not care would the needs of those it oppresses.

The game here is to oppress the hell out of the 3rd world and ignore their feelings until they finally lash out in anger, then slap the terrorist label on them so that all of their greivances can be ignored.

It's an abuse and gaslight strategy. Very psychologically devious.

Edited October 4, 2024 by Leo Gura

[Nivsch]

11 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

terrorism has always been done as a means towards a greater good, like fighting unjust oppressors and establishing national sovereignty

But stage Red life meaning and sense of purpose is gained by ever expanding and conquering, what would make extremists groups like hamas, Hezbollah and the like act the way they act even without any oppression or injustices, but just from the fact that an unwanted stranger is stuck between them.

Edited October 4, 2024 by Nivsch

[Leo Gura]

2 minutes ago, Nivsch said:

extremists groups like hamas, Hezbollah and the like act the way they act even without any oppression or injustices

Not necessarily. Pleny of Arab states are not out to conquer anyone.

You can't just assume the worst about Palestinians.

[Inliytened1]

23 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

 

The problem is that in the West, terrorism has become a Western propaganda term which means "unjustified violence", but of course this is a deeply biased and ethnocentic definiton because terrorism has always been done as a means towards a greater good, like fighting unjust oppressors and establishing national sovereignty. The problem with the West's framing of terrorism is that terrorism IS justified in the minds of those who do it. The West is shocked to learn this fact. But that's only because the West has been so self-absorbed as to not care would the needs of those it oppresses.

 

Ok so we both then know what the true definiton of terrorism always has been.  Your idea of how the West holds Terrorism can also be said to be subjective   Terrorism is justified in the minds that do it but remember this fails to take into consideration that some people are just plain bad or deluded..  So they might not always do things for the greater good.  Take Hitler.   Germany was wronged yes but he had a greed for power that was unbinding.  He wanted complete control of the world and his own Master race in charge.   This is sick.  It's not for the greater good.

And yes as nuts as 911 was it was done by the minds who did it for their own greater good.    However there was a level of delusion here because such acts only inflicted pain it didn't help a political cause.

Edited October 4, 2024 by Inliytened1

[Nivsch]

1 minute ago, Leo Gura said:

Not necessarily. Pleny of Arab states are not out to conquer anyone.

Because they are already Blue+

2 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

You can't just assume the worst about Palestinians.

Not about Palestinians but about the Right wing of them and the extremists.

[Karmadhi]

28 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

That doesn't work because the major terrorist Arab leaders are doing their acts in order to help Palestine gain statehood.

Are you okay with 9/11 being considered a thing they did to acheive a higher goal?

No.

The problem is that in the West, terrorism has become a Western propaganda term which means "unjustified violence", but of course this is a deeply biased and ethnocentic definiton because terrorism has always been done as a means towards a greater good, like fighting unjust oppressors and establishing national sovereignty. The problem with the West's framing of terrorism is that terrorism IS justified in the minds of those who do it. The West is shocked to learn this fact. But that's only because the West has been so self-absorbed as to not care would the needs of those it oppresses.

The game here is to oppress the hell out of the 3rd world and ignore their feelings until they finally lash out in anger, then slap the terrorist label on them so that all of their greivances can be ignored.

It's an abuse and gaslight strategy. Very psychologically devious.

Leo do you plan to do a video on "What is terrorism" where you explain this at length and give concrete examples.

Perhaps it can be released on your blog if you are scared to put it on Youtube.

I think it would hopefully change the attitude of many people on this forum among others that are not on this forum.

 

Edited October 4, 2024 by Karmadhi

[Inliytened1]

2 hours ago, Karmadhi said:

Leo do you plan to do a video on "What is terrorism" where you explain this at length and give concrete examples.

 

That would make a great video but I see flaws in his episode on how Everything is good and there is no evil because that fails to consider certain possibilities regarding what is in the mind of the person doing the acts.  Not that evil exists or for that matter good but delusion exists and is not accounted for 

Edited October 4, 2024 by Inliytened1

[Leo Gura]

29 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

Ok so we both then know what the true definiton of terrorism always has been.  Your idea of how the West holds Terrorism can also be said to be subjective   Terrorism is justified in the minds that do it but remember this fails to take into consideration that some people are just plain bad or deluded..  So they might not always do things for the greater good.  Take Hitler.   Germany was wronged yes but he had a greed for power that was unbinding.  He wanted complete control of the world and his own Master race in charge.   This is sick.  It's not for the greater good.

Good is a relative thing.

Some might say that stopping abuse of Palestinians is for the greater good.

The Palestinians are not Hitler. They have no plans of global domination, nor any capacity to do it even if they wanted. They are not even capable of conquering the Middle East.

Edited October 4, 2024 by Leo Gura