This is what healthy orange looks like

[Nivsch]

@undeather There is some yellow in the way he understand we have to change US and not to try harder.

But he is stuck in the mechanical way of changing ourselves and doesn't say a word about psychological change. 

Healthy and developed orange who just started swimming in the shallow water of yellow.

But actually give grades doesnt make me feel good. I dont know him deeply enough. Just saying about this specific video. 

I learned from this video to be more in the present and mindfull in present moment and do less distractions, instead of "trying" to do something. 

 

Edited December 17, 2019 by Nivsch

[Nivsch]

@Preety_India I agree with you. Whats important is the healthy sides of every stage.

If you honestly feel mentally and physically healthy in life (to you and to other people) you dont have to change nothing if you dont want.

If you are not satisfied, than use this SD map and lead yourself up.

Edited December 17, 2019 by Nivsch

[Haumea2018]

5 hours ago, Nivsch said:

stuck in cosmic consiousness? ?

Cosmic consciousness is partial enlightenment.  It's not the end of seeking.  You still have an I-thought which is now ripe for all types of inflation as you identify with all of creation.  The label is really something that sounds much more impressive than what it is pointing to.

If you're stuck in cosmic consciousness...well, Wilber illustrates the problem: instead of dropping remnants of the subtle ego you cling to models of development that guarantee endless seeking.

In other words, you're too afraid to become self-realized; it becomes about the seeking, not the finding.

If you never knew a thing about SD you would be no worse off and very likely much better off as far as surrendering your ego attachments, as Bill W described above, especially if you're a typical thinking/conceptualizing personality, because "more of the same" keeps you stuck.  The people who are intensely into SD are the people who need it LEAST.  They'd get closer to enlightenment by playing a sport or going out to a club to socialize.  It's easy to do stuff that's already in your comfort zone, but it gets you nowhere.

Edited December 17, 2019 by Haumea2018

[LfcCharlie4]

@Haumea2018 I agree about your SD points. 

I think its an awesome model that can help illustrate psychological development, and is great at what it does and hs many uses and can also be incredibly helpful in certain areas. 

But, like you said for those still seeking it needs to be dropped for a while like everything does, and then after it may return to be used as the tool it is to evaluate psychological development, but not as a Bible like it often is around here.

Like all models, it has its uses, I think SD is one of the better models, but in terms of awakening, it can become another issue that you just can't seem to drop. 

[Haumea2018]

Hey Charlie,

I think the cases where SD is MOST beneficial would be for certain personality types for whom systematizing/conceptualizing is not a strength, like MBTI ESFJ e.g. In other words, traditional conformist types.  Alas, most people on this forum are already strong intuitive/conceptual types, so they need it least.  It's the bane of seeking to focus on what you're already naturally good at.

 

 

[LfcCharlie4]

@Haumea2018

Oh yeah I don't mean in terms of seeking and self realization. 

I mean in terms of evolutionary/ developmental psychologically and understanding how people develop psychologically, it was never made for non duality so maybe the issue lies there?

[Haumea2018]

@LfcCharlie4  That's correct, the basic problem is that the I-thought creates projections, which overrides any supposed evolutionary benefits from a more evolved perception of social order.

I mean, the 20th century showed this amply; we were more advanced than cavemen, but we could also do a hell of a lot more damage than cavemen as well, and this problem doesn't suddenly go away because we're "green" or "yellow."  We just have more novel, advanced ways to create evil and suffering, always in the name of good.

Without self-realization, it's not going to deliver on its supposed evolutionary benefits.

Edited December 17, 2019 by Haumea2018

[LfcCharlie4]

@Haumea2018 Yeah I get you. 

Although I think a John Lennon type hippie is less likely to commit 'evil' than say the CEO of an  Oil company,as they are technically destroying the Earth, but as you say the full problem needs more Self-Realized people who can then go about tackling these issues with the understanding All is The Self, and from a basis of love instead of the basis of wanting power and greed etc. 

 

[Haumea2018]

Hey Charlie,

Yes -- Ram Dass has a great graphic in his book "Be Here Now" that explains it pretty well.

Edited December 19, 2019 by Haumea2018