being invited to clubs

[Olaf]

I have had many times with my wingmen that we got invited to go to clubs by girls that we approached. I wonder if this is a good thing or not, one time they wanted to kidnap my wingmen into the club hahaha. But I see this many times even in a few seconds. But then I wonder, is that because they want free drinks or truely attracted? 

Edited 9 hours ago by Olaf

[Valach]

Just go there if you want to go there. Stop strategizing so much.

[LordFall]

I would recommend trying it a few times but more than likely you'll realize it's a bad idea. Better to invite women to your events than to come out to the club with them. It will leave you in a reactive frame where also she'll probably subconsciously or intentionally put you against other guys she knows or random dudes that come up to hit on her. If you've been gaming a lot then you might be able to meet other women there and merge sets and use the opposite effect on her but either way you start off at a disadvantage.

It's not a bad thing to experiments with environments that don't favor you but in general you obviously should build a social life that works for your goals and not against them. 

[Olaf]

@LordFall good one, yeah you basically are stepping into her frame and world instead of you leading the way. Yes yesterday we went with them and it wasn't that bad, not asking for drinks or anything, but still I like to lead the way rather then being lead somewhere and step into someone elses frame. Thanks for your perspective. 

[Valach]

Just now, Olaf said:

@LordFall good one, yeah you basically are stepping into her frame and world instead of you leading the way. Yes yesterday we went with them and it wasn't that bad, not asking for drinks or anything, but still I like to lead the way rather then being lead somewhere and step into someone elses frame. Thanks for your perspective. 

See the nuance here. You even thinking about it is you being in her frame. The whole frame control think is essentially a loosing game.

[Olaf]

@Valach frame is important

[Zenterus]

This is a win win situation if you play it right. I recommend you go with them as LordFall said and use them as social proof at least to help you with other girls. Dont buy them drinks and if they start flirting with other men or trying to get you compete with them, tell yourself that she has now been friendzoned, in your mind, and get them to approach new sets with you or just go off to a new girl and start talking to her (the social proof will make the set open a lot easier).

[LordFall]

1 hour ago, Valach said:

See the nuance here. You even thinking about it is you being in her frame. The whole frame control think is essentially a loosing game.

There is a difference between being stuck in your head constantly overanalyzing social situations vs having an overall strategy for your dating life. Joining girls on nights out a few times and having fun is fine. Then I would suggest to sit down and think on whether you enjoyed it as it is or do you like bringing girls into your life more.

To me catering the environment overtime makes much more sense and makes it possible to justify socializing continuously since I also build value for the ecosystems I'm building as opposed to just using socializing to blow off steam or to to pull women.

I hosted a content mastermind a few months ago and it was both a fun way to meet new chicks and also it helped my agency and community. About a month before that I went out for drinks which chicks that invited me out and it was fine and fun but the ROI was much lower. 

Edited 4 hours ago by LordFall

[Olaf]

@Zenterus right so use them as wing woman

[Valach]

3 hours ago, LordFall said:

There is a difference between being stuck in your head constantly overanalyzing social situations vs having an overall strategy for your dating life. Joining girls on nights out a few times and having fun is fine. Then I would suggest to sit down and think on whether you enjoyed it as it is or do you like bringing girls into your life more.

To me catering the environment overtime makes much more sense and makes it possible to justify socializing continuously since I also build value for the ecosystems I'm building as opposed to just using socializing to blow off steam or to to pull women.

I hosted a content mastermind a few months ago and it was both a fun way to meet new chicks and also it helped my agency and community. About a month before that I went out for drinks which chicks that invited me out and it was fine and fun but the ROI was much lower. 

Sure, but the underlying strategy is still coming from a place of neediness so there is this paradox where you are actually in her frame (eventhough I would suggest dropping the whole notion of frame all together).

[Ulax]

17 minutes ago, Valach said:

Sure, but the underlying strategy is still coming from a place of neediness so there is this paradox where you are actually in her frame (eventhough I would suggest dropping the whole notion of frame all together).

Issue is bro that you are advanced so when you let go of frame, you automatically are in a high-value frame because of positive experiences. And so things just 'flow'.

When people are still without all those positive experiences, when they let go, they are not in a high-value frame.

[Valach]

7 minutes ago, Ulax said:

Issue is bro that you are advanced so when you let go of frame, you automatically are in a high-value frame because of positive experiences. And so things just 'flow'.

When people are still without all those positive experiences, when they let go, they are not in a high-value frame.

You do not need many though. My only positive experience was with your mom.

Edited 1 hour ago by Valach

[Ulax]

2 minutes ago, Valach said:

You do not need much though. My only positive experience was with your mom.

I am glad to hear you and my mom get along so well

[Valach]

1 minute ago, Ulax said:

I am glad to hear you and my mom get along so well

She told me what a good boy you are.

[Ulax]

Just now, Valach said:

She told me what a good boy you are.

 

[LordFall]

17 minutes ago, Ulax said:

Issue is bro that you are advanced so when you let go of frame, you automatically are in a high-value frame because of positive experiences. And so things just 'flow'.

When people are still without all those positive experiences, when they let go, they are not in a high-value frame.

I think you're overthinking it man, equating intentionality and lifestyle design with "neediness" is a complete category error.

By that logic, building a business is needy because you want revenue, and training in the gym is needy because you want strength. Building a high quality lifer requires designing your life, career, and social environment from first principles rather than drifting passively into whatever situation presents itself.

Expecting to get high-ROI outcomes in life without a coherent strategy isn't "non-attachment", it's just laziness disguised as philosophy and I don't think it produces high quality results for many people. 

[Ulax]

3 minutes ago, LordFall said:

I think you're overthinking it man, equating intentionality and lifestyle design with "neediness" is a complete category error.

By that logic, building a business is needy because you want revenue, and training in the gym is needy because you want strength. Building a high quality lifer requires designing your life, career, and social environment from first principles rather than drifting passively into whatever situation presents itself.

Expecting to get high-ROI outcomes in life without a coherent strategy isn't "non-attachment", it's just laziness disguised as philosophy and I don't think it produces high quality results for many people. 

You tagged wrong guy lol

[Valach]

5 minutes ago, LordFall said:

I think you're overthinking it man, equating intentionality and lifestyle design with "neediness" is a complete category error.

By that logic, building a business is needy because you want revenue, and training in the gym is needy because you want strength. Building a high quality lifer requires designing your life, career, and social environment from first principles rather than drifting passively into whatever situation presents itself.

Expecting to get high-ROI outcomes in life without a coherent strategy isn't "non-attachment", it's just laziness disguised as philosophy and I don't think it produces high quality results for many people. 

I think you wanted to react to me and not to the good boy.

Intentionallity is important yes. It is always about the place it is coming from. What we are describing here is obviously putting these girls on a pedestal. Instead of asking "what produces the best results" or "what makes me look the best", you should ask "what do I genuinly want to do?".

But I understand it is very hard to do when your identity is wrapped around getting approval of woman.

Edited 47 minutes ago by Valach

[Valach]

Just now, Ulax said:

You tagged wrong guy lol

He just knows you need some attention since mommy's been busy lately.

[LordFall]

4 minutes ago, Valach said:

I think you wanted to react to me and not to the good boy.

Intentionallity is important yes. It is always the place it is coming from. What we are describing her is obviously putting these girls on a pedestal. Instead of asking "what produces the best results" or "what makes me look the best", you should I ask "what do I genuinly want to do?".

But I understand it is very hard to do when your identity is wrapped around getting approval of woman.

Yes I was replying to your comment. I personally enjoy building an intentional social life on my terms. Going clubbing with random chicks is not part of my ideal lifestyle. If it is for you then more power to you but conflating strategy with neediness is a strange idea.

I think perhaps you're judging yourself for desiring high quality women and great results and projecting that shame unto others? To me hosting events feels like things clicking into place and is much more fun than pure nightlife ever was. 

Edited 45 minutes ago by LordFall