How do NDEs fit into Leo's framework?

[Loveeee]

21 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

A normie certianly would be too afraid and clueless to choose it. The question is, Will it be forced on them anyway via death?

But even you said it gets boring 

[Leo Gura]

4 minutes ago, Loveeee said:

But even you said it gets boring 

Yes, but with death you don't have much choice. Death forces you to go where you would never willingly go.

You can be formless for eternity and then still incarnate once you're bored. You can sorta have both things, but not at once. Since you were just done with being human, it makes sense that formlessness would be appealing for awhile. Do you really want to immediately incarnate as another human? I doubt it.

Edited 15 hours ago by Leo Gura

[Loveeee]

18 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

It requires death!

Reachable with psychedelics as you said? Even you still haven't though, how

[Leo Gura]

3 minutes ago, Loveeee said:

Reachable with psychedelics as you said?

Not pure Infinity Forever.

The highest levels of consciousness cannot be reached while limited by a human body/mind.

You'd have to become truly completely formless. I have not done that.

Edited 15 hours ago by Leo Gura

[Loveeee]

2 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Do you really want to immediately incarnate as another human? I doubt it.

My human is too limited and infinite love is too unlimited I want something in the middle, I want powers like imagining my 10th anniversary and be there, like astral projection or shifting

And I don't wanna wait to die for that

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

The highest levels of consciousness cannot be reached while limited by a human body/mind.

I mean isn't tripping the undoing of that limit to some degree ? Plus there is no body/mind so how is that a factor 

But surely you've had states that had no trace of body or mind 

Edited 13 hours ago by Loveeee

[Clarence]

4 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

A normie certianly would be too afraid and clueless to choose it. The question is, Will it be forced on them anyway via death?

I don't think it will be. From everything I've read on the topic, nothing is forced, but guidance is given.

You're a really rare case, Leo. I understand it can feel right for you.

4 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

But more importantly, you don't need all that crap. There are much more profound states of consciousness than jerking off your grandfather.

Maybe you don't value that kind of connection as much as I do.

The love I feel for certain people is so deep and profound that reuniting with them after death will be an extremely profound experience. All limits will have disappeared, we'll be able to fully see through each other, and we'll know who we truly are.

Experiencing profound metaphysical love with an "other" qualifies, to me, as an extremely profound experience.

I don't think there's any need to talk down on it, even if it doesn't appeal to you.

[Leo Gura]

8 minutes ago, Clarence said:

I don't think there's any need to talk down on it, even if it doesn't appeal to you.

You are still talking about human love. That's fine. But there is a higher level.

I talk down at it because otherwise you will get trapped in it.

Edited 11 hours ago by Leo Gura

[Leo Gura]

9 minutes ago, Clarence said:

nothing is forced,

Death

[Clarence]

26 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

You are still talking about human love. That's fine. But there is a higher level.

I talk down at it because otherwise you will get trapped in it.

I'm not talking about human love.

I've accessed that kind of love while on psychedelics and through deep intuition. It's metaphysical, not human.

Obviously, you don't have to believe me.

25 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Death

How can death be forced if incarnation itself is a choice? The one that incarnates knows that a finite life won't last forever. It's part of game and the illusion. Forgetting about it doesn't mean it isn't chosen.

[Leo Gura]

46 minutes ago, Clarence said:

I'm not talking about human love.

I know, but it is still about loving humans, as you said.

It is metaphysical but still human-centric.

A higher love is not about humans at all.

But hey, I am not forcing you to not do your love. There are just more radical levels of love.

Edited 10 hours ago by Leo Gura

[Leo Gura]

49 minutes ago, Clarence said:

How can death be forced if incarnation itself is a choice?

But death will come to you against your will. You have no choice about when death finally knocks on your door. It will force you to surrender to it.

Edited 10 hours ago by Leo Gura

[eTorro]

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

But death will come to you against your will. You have no choice about when death finally knocks on your door. It will force you to surrender to it.

I need to train myself—or the mind—to accept that one day I will be dead.

Life on planet Earth is beautiful.

The body is beautiful.

A tree is beautiful.

A breath of fresh air is precious.

How can we all go beyond those and accept death as it takes us? How, @Leo Gura?

[Leo Gura]

5 minutes ago, eTorro said:

How can we all go beyond those and accept death as it takes us? How, @Leo Gura?

The only way is to die before you die, as the gurus say.

Ego deaths and Awakenings are the way.

Transcending death is no small feat. That's what all of spiritual work ends in.

You can't talk yourself into being okay with death, you have to actually go through the experience of ego death and surrender to it.

Edited 7 hours ago by Leo Gura

[Clarence]

5 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

I know, but it is still about loving humans, as you said.

It is metaphysical but still human-centric.

A higher love is not about humans at all.

That's not what I wanted to say.

It can't be about loving humans or about human love, since the illusion of being human completely ceases to exist after death.

It's about the love between two Higher Consciousnesses. It doesn't have to be related to a human life.

I'm not trapped in the illusion of being a human surrounded by other humans. The kind of love I'm talking about goes far beyond that. It would be closer to deeply connecting with another infinite being whose vibrations are so close to yours. That connection would give rise to an extremely profound expression of love.

By "The love I feel for certain people", I meant the love I feel for their essence, their Higher Consciousness, or their divine nature. It isn't about loving their human expression or about wanting to reconnect with their human self.

–

That's not all that I care about after death, but it's not as shallow as you believe it is, either.

Edited 4 hours ago by Clarence

[Clarence]

5 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

But death will come to you against your will. You have no choice about when death finally knocks on your door. It will force you to surrender to it.

When we used the word forced earlier, we were speaking about what happens after death, not about the perspective of the limited human form.

From that perspective, it might seem forced, but from our Higher Consciousness, it's a choice we've made.

[Loveeee]

As Leo said a game needs a sweet spot, if it's too hard or too easy you quit. Being so human is too hard and infinite love is too easy, it's no game

Ain't no way I'm stuck here like that until I die, if that's God's plan it SUCKS, at least let me win the lottery

There must be a way out, "literally imagine anything you want to imagine for as long as you want to imagine it" as Leo said, at least to some degree

It's not that crazy, every night you dream a whole new reality, using psychedelics you should be able to too, people report dreaming full lives with salvia

I want to get consciousness enough to alter the dream and even shift dreams entirely