Awakenings make everyday life better but strip away the peaks of being human.

[Breakingthewall]

5 minutes ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

I didn't claim that it was in anyway unclear. I just remarked on how different definitions can be at play and usually we deviate after a point. 

I didn't deviate of the point a millimeter . I told Davino that his vision is still that the reality is an individual due his use of the words dream and dreamer. I told him this to make him see it, not to lower him. It's very subtle and important point if you are really interested in breaking the last barrier

[Natasha Tori Maru]

@Breakingthewall nevermind. You are misunderstanding me, or I am failing to make my point clear. Forget about it. There was no criticism of you or what you said in my post.

[Breakingthewall]

9 minutes ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

@Breakingthewall nevermind. You are misunderstanding me, or I am failing to make my point clear. Forget about it. There was no criticism of you or what you said in my post.

I think I didnt get it, even I read 3 times.

Anyway, the point was I'm consciousness vs I'm the fact of being conscious of the nature of what I am. Reality is not "I", but I am is an intrinsic property of reality that is happening. What reality is is the whole not a creator.

If you make the schema dreamer/dream you are closing the possibility or real openess , and that's essential if you want real enlightenment, and you should want it if you are in this topic, because the intermediate point, the solipsist dreamer , the belief of "I'm consciousness", "what I really am is the screen where the experience happens", is a closure and leads to inner isolation 

Edited 4 hours ago by Breakingthewall

[Breakingthewall]

@Natasha Tori Maru I think that those 2 quotes explain my point . The first one is from nisgardatta the second from Hawkins. The one of nisgardatta is the perfect definition of enlightenment. I found it in Gemini when i sent a paragraph that I wrote (the one in my thread enlightenment in two steps, to compare with any possible similitude in spirituality).  It's the same direction . In fact it is exactly the same point.

 

 

When the 'I Am' dissolves into the Absolute, all traces of individuality disappear, but what remains is not the emptiness of a corpse. It is the original source of all life, a state of pure dynamism and unlimited potentiality that needs no witnesses to exist. In that state, you are not conscious of being alive; you are Life itself flowing, a fullness so massive that the birth and death of entire universes are merely tiny bubbles rising to the surface of your own being.

 

The presence of Reality is not felt as a continuous electric shock, but as a background of intrinsic vitality. The physical world is perceived as a hyperrealistic high-definition film, where every object shines with the energy of its own being. The observer has become transparent; there is no longer anyone there 'watching,' only the unfolding of existence.

Edited 3 hours ago by Breakingthewall

[Davino]

@Carl-Richard Thanks, you were very insightful here

[Davino]

4 hours ago, VeganAwake said:

Awakening is impossible to describe because it isn't a something in which could be described. It’s literally nothing. It's reality exactly the way it physically appears now, minus the conditioned experiencer. So its a subtraction, except that which is subtracted, was never real from the start.

How can nothing be described? 

It's the end of an illusory self which was seemingly experiencing its linear life through conditioned filters or the matrix of mind.

The physical appearances of the world stay exactly the same.

What changes is the meaning, purpose and value placed overtop of reality by a self illusion. It's overarching perspective in other words.

So it's the end of an unreal experience of the unreal experiencer 

Its real and unreal.

Unreal in the sense that the entire personalized story of meaning, purpose and value placed overtop of reality is completely false. (Dream Story/Matrix)

Real in the sense that there are empty human bodies seemingly experiencing an explosion of energy, lights, colors, sounds, smells, tastes, feelings, thoughts, other biological creatures, plant life etc....etc....

A "you" being the body or in the body is the only completely unreal piece actually!

That's a very legit facet of Awakening, but only one facet in the Jewel of Awakening.

There are more faces which will synergize beautifully with what you describe.

[Davino]

24 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

The point was I'm consciousness vs I'm the fact of being conscious of the nature of what I am. Reality is not "I", but I am is an intrinsic property of reality that is happening. What reality is is the whole not a creator.

If you make the schema dreamer/dream you are closing the possibility or real openess , and that's essential if you want real enlightenment, and you should want it if you are in this topic, because the intermediate point, the solipsist dreamer , the belief of "I'm consciousness", "what I really am is the screen where the experience happens", is a closure and leads to inner isolation 

Yes, I see through that trap. 

In the field of awareness appears the sense of I and identification. It's this field which shape shifts into all permutations, there's no difference between creator, creating and creaton, it's all the same one dance. It was important for me to get each Awakening separately and then seeing through all of them as One, it gives much more richness than just realising it as One imo.

At the same time Reality can become self aware, like hugging your own back, or a game of aligning mirrors, that's a very legit facet of Awakening.

You may have dissolved the false I, but have you realised that which makes all "I" possible? The source of I or the "I principle in existence" ? How does Oneness play with the fact of existing?

[Davino]

29 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

The presence of Reality is not felt as a continuous electric shock, but as a background of intrinsic vitality. The physical world is perceived as a hyperrealistic high-definition film, where every object shines with the energy of its own being. The observer has become transparent; there is no longer anyone there 'watching,' only the unfolding of existence.

Yep, this is quite accurate.

When the I dissolves some people subjectify everything (there's only the self) or objectify everything (selfless reality). Both views are true simultaneously and can be further dissolved into raw awareness, oneness and silent being/presence.

[Davino]

2 hours ago, UnbornTao said:

 

"State" of "consciousness" - experience. Now consider that whenever you talk you're most likely always talking about this domain - especially because you think that drugs "increase consciousness." Everything you're aware of is experience.

I've told you a million times, I recognise the horizontal dimension of consciousness that is ever present and that allows all of the dance of Reality. From that perspective of all psychedelics are mere appearances.

On the other hand, you deny a million times the vertical dimension of Consciousness which is: given this ever present existence what are it's highest most complete and sublime configurations. Are all permutations equal? Or are there ways where the fullness of existence can shine better? 

That you deny. I embrace both.

[Breakingthewall]

28 minutes ago, Davino said:

You may have dissolved the false I, but have you realised that which makes all "I" possible? The source of I or the "I principle in existence" ? How does Oneness play with the fact of existing?

The I is not false, nothing is false. That idea of falsehood and truth only lead to mental mess. Oneness doesn't play, doesn't want things , if it would do it will do an individual. In fact"oneness" means nothing, only has meaning from the idea of two, it's just unlimited.

The unlimited happens, and in this happening the possibility of consciousness appears because it's possible. In our case, as a process that happens in this universe that we call life, a self preserved process inside another process that the universe is. Just a potential that happens because it's possible, not a god who plays. God is not "who"

Read again the quote of nisgardatta that I posted before, it's a perfect explanation :

 

When the 'I Am' dissolves into the Absolute, all traces of individuality disappear, but what remains is not the emptiness of a corpse. It is the original source of all life, a state of pure dynamism and unlimited potentiality that needs no witnesses to exist. In that state, you are not conscious of being alive; you are Life itself flowing, a fullness so massive that the birth and death of entire universes are merely tiny bubbles rising to the surface of your own being.

 

Edited 3 hours ago by Breakingthewall

[Davino]

6 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

The unlimited happens, and in this happening the possibility of consciousness appears because it's possible. In our case, as a process that happens in this universe that we call life.

This is false.

Consciousness is existential.

In the rest we mostly agree.

8 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

When the 'I Am' dissolves into the Absolute, all traces of individuality disappear, but what remains is not the emptiness of a corpse. It is the original source of all life, a state of pure dynamism and unlimited potentiality that needs no witnesses to exist. In that state, you are not conscious of being alive; you are Life itself flowing, a fullness so massive that the birth and death of entire universes are merely tiny bubbles rising to the surface of your own being.

Yes, I like it.

[Breakingthewall]

26 minutes ago, Davino said:

Consciousness is existential.

What do you mean? That consciousness is essential? It's a possibility, but a possibility in the unlimited is also unlimited. The point is that believing "reality is consciousness" implies a dreamer 

36 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

the original source of all life, a state of pure dynamism and unlimited potentiality that needs no witnesses to exist

As nisgardatta said 

[Davino]

@Breakingthewall Consciousness does not depend on a witness/dreamer; it is aware of both the witness and its absence.

Consciousness is so fundamental it becomes very hard to pinpoint, Consciousness ks always everywhere, it's the medium of Reality, it's existence itself.

Of course no word can encapsulate it, but consciousness is the best word for my taste.

Edited 1 hour ago by Davino

[Breakingthewall]

9 minutes ago, Davino said:

see Consciousness always and everywhere. 

Normal since you are the reality in conscious mode, but this doesn't implies that reality is consciousness but that reality is conscious through the process that is happening now, that's the human being conscious of itself. 

Enlightenment is be totally open to the source, but that doesn't mean that you discover that the human form is false, you perceive the nature of reality and you and the reality are one in the sense that you are the reality in this form. But this doesn't implies that the form is false, only that the form is a form, nor the source but an expression of the source.

Form can change, but the fact of being conscious would be always a possibility then a reality in any possible way. Then this fact will be always the same: reality perceiving itself. 

But it's essential don't confuse the fact with the source. If you do you are trapped, closed to the source. Maybe you will perceive some glimpse, but you will see yourself as the dreamer, the creator, so you will confuse the form with the essence and that's a limit , a closure 

Edited 1 hour ago by Breakingthewall

[Davino]

@Breakingthewall The source is Infinite Consciousness, this moment is a permutation of the source. 

I think you have to be honest and realise you haven't awakened to Consciousness. Be open to that possibility, Consciousness is tautologically necessary.

[Grateful Dead]

I also feel that worldly things lose their allure once you wake up, though I don't view this as a bad thing, but rather as something good.

It teaches you to turn inward and find true, lasting fulfillment within yourself.

I found this very difficult back when I was still taking psychedelics regularly.

And I also find that simple things, like going for a walk, hiking, spending time in nature, cooking, and so on are now far more fulfilling and profound for me than they used to be.

[Breakingthewall]

1 hour ago, Davino said:

@Breakingthewall The source is Infinite Consciousness, this moment is a permutation of the source. 

I think you have to be honest and realise you haven't awakened to Consciousness. Be open to that possibility, Consciousness is tautologically necessary.

Your choice, but contemplate this:

 the Source is not infinite consciousness; it is the absence of limits from which possibility springs, the emission of unlimited potentiality. When you say it is consciousness, you imply that it is someone who does things for a reason, and this traps you. It is the root of solipsism. There are not multiple awakenings; there is only one, and it is not an awakening, it is the total opening of your focus.

Let's see, in your opinion, is the planet Mars conscious of itself? Does it happen because it thinks: I am going to be Mars? Or perhaps because the Source thinks: Let's see, I am going to explore the fact of being Mars? Or maybe I'm imagining mars to believe that I'm a human?

It's not like that. The Source emits possibilities for the sole reason that it has no limits. It is not someone who wants things, it's the unlimited vitality that springs from the bottomless. 

Edited 20 minutes ago by Breakingthewall