Is it possible to fight evil without becoming evil in the process?

[Zest4Life]

It feels like "good" doesn’t really fight in the same way “evil” does, that’s part of what makes it good. But if good refuses to use the same methods, does that mean evil can only be stopped by something just as harsh?

There’s that line from True Detective about how the world needs “bad men” to keep worse ones away. This scene really raises a question, can you stop evil without becoming a little bit like it?

Where do you draw the line between “necessary force” and “becoming like the thing you’re fighting”? 

Does the intention matter more than the method?

Do you think sometimes being “too good” just lets evil walk right in?

And does fighting evil always have to come from anger, or can it be done from a calm place?

Also, is nonviolence actually strong enough out here in the real world, or is that just something that sounds nice in theory?

 

Edited 6 hours ago by Zest4Life

[Ramasta9]

Krishna and Arjuna parables from the Bhagavad Gita may help

[gettoefl]

Evil is whatever lets badness proliferate. An it's not my problem attitude. Today's world is cast in stone. Tomorrow's world depends on me. Do I end badness or turn the blind eye.

[Zest4Life]

58 minutes ago, Ramasta9 said:

Krishna and Arjuna parables from the Bhagavad Gita may help

That hit me in a new way. The Gita basically says you can fight evil without becoming evil, but only if you fight from a different inner place (duty, clarity, and detachment). That’s the opposite of what turns people evil (hatred, greed, and the hunger for power). Krishna says that sometimes you must act, but how and why you act is what matters. If your motive is service and responsibility, force can stop harm without corrupting you. If your motive is revenge, ego, or pleasure in hurting others, you risk becoming what you oppose. I like Jordan Peterson’s rough way of putting it: "You should be a monster, an absolute monster, and then you should learn how to control it."

16 minutes ago, gettoefl said:

Evil is whatever lets badness proliferate. An it's not my problem attitude. Today's world is cast in stone. Tomorrow's world depends on me. Do I end badness or turn the blind eye.

Socrates once said "the only evil is ignorance", but does that mean no one ever commits evil on purpose?

[Salvijus]

1 hour ago, Zest4Life said:

Socrates once said "the only evil is ignorance", but does that mean no one ever commits evil on purpose?

The choice made has a purpose, it's just that they're unaware that it's an ignorant purpose. 

Edited 3 hours ago by Salvijus

[Ishanga]

1 hour ago, Zest4Life said:

That hit me in a new way. The Gita basically says you can fight evil without becoming evil, but only if you fight from a different inner place (duty, clarity, and detachment). That’s the opposite of what turns people evil (hatred, greed, and the hunger for power). Krishna says that sometimes you must act, but how and why you act is what matters. If your motive is service and responsibility, force can stop harm without corrupting you. If your motive is revenge, ego, or pleasure in hurting others, you risk becoming what you oppose. I like Jordan Peterson’s rough way of putting it: "You should be a monster, an absolute monster, and then you should learn how to control it."

Socrates once said "the only evil is ignorance", but does that mean no one ever commits evil on purpose?

The creation of new Karma in Your life is from this, the Intentions You have within Yourself, in Your Mind start the process of creating new Karma, which is creating new Bondage and Conditioning in a sense..

You combat Evil by Being the Light You Want to See in the World, now if someone slaps You for no reason, You slap them back, don't turn the other cheek, You give back what You give in these matters, so for Evil You may have to fight it with the same tactics they use, but its coming from a different Intention, it is too stop War and Suffering, and encourage more Peace.

Peace Loving doesn't mean no war, if war is necessary You do it, but only for what is needed, all actions we do we should do only what is Needed, no more or less..

Edited 2 hours ago by Ishanga

[gettoefl]

1 hour ago, Zest4Life said:

That hit me in a new way. The Gita basically says you can fight evil without becoming evil, but only if you fight from a different inner place (duty, clarity, and detachment). That’s the opposite of what turns people evil (hatred, greed, and the hunger for power). Krishna says that sometimes you must act, but how and why you act is what matters. If your motive is service and responsibility, force can stop harm without corrupting you. If your motive is revenge, ego, or pleasure in hurting others, you risk becoming what you oppose. I like Jordan Peterson’s rough way of putting it: "You should be a monster, an absolute monster, and then you should learn how to control it."

Socrates once said "the only evil is ignorance", but does that mean no one ever commits evil on purpose?

Yes. But forget the evil doer. Focus on you. How am I going to live is the only question.

[Hojo]

What if you considerate your duty to molest children.

[gettoefl]

1 minute ago, Hojo said:

What if you considerate your duty to molest children.

Trauma is served up for as long as you need the lesson. You are untouchable. Even by an Epstein. Seeing it or suffering it are the same lesson, different intensity. You will get it while you need it. You crafted the lesson. You know what you are doing.

[Ishanga]

6 minutes ago, Hojo said:

What if you considerate your duty to molest children.

The main question about performing action in Life is is it Empowering for all those around You or Not?

Molestation is not Empowering, same as stealing, beating, hurting emotionally, killing for your own benefit, and all the other hideous actions ppl do, these actions dis empower all those around You and yourself..

So that is how You determine what are the "right" actions and "wrong" actions, does it or does it not empower all life around You!

This is the problem with having the "Nothing Exists, No one is Here, Nothing is ever Happening" sort of non dual outlook on life, eventually You don't care what is happening to others or life itself and go numb!!

[Jannes]

@Zest4Life I think you raise a good nuanced point about what rising over evil entails, which is not falling into traps. 

..

Everyone thinks of themselves as good as not evil. The mind can be used to question oneself but moreso to justify oneself. Its more about the attitude and what you value which determines if the sophisticated defense of ones behaviour is leading somewhere devilish or not. 

..

I would add yet another layer of geopolitcs into the mix as you can get insights there as well. The more egoish a country is, the more backlash it will get and the more it needs to defend itself. The US is an example of a country which would need less military if it would act more morally. But also countries without much self defensives capabilites will be eaten alive. 

Its about being as devilish as you need to be and as little devilish as you can be. 

[Hojo]

@gettoeflSo its good then?

[gettoefl]

32 minutes ago, Hojo said:

@gettoeflSo its good then?

What's not good friend?

[Hojo]

@Ishanga What do you think about Robin Hood?

[Ishanga]

10 minutes ago, Hojo said:

@Ishanga What do you think about Robin Hood?

The story of him stealing from the Rich to give to the Poor, well in that situation and context it could be seen as redistribution of wealth lol.. 

If someone is hording all the wealth at the expense of the ppl, like the dictators are doing in South and Central America, they steal the wealth of the entire country for their own purpose and use, while everyone else is starving, well in that context taking from them is not Stealing , it is just redistribution of the wealth of the country to the masses, the masses should be benefiting from the Wealth of a Country if is has any, not just one or two ppl while millions suffer!

So stealing is wrong generally, if I already have enough but still take from another that may not have anything, that is a disempowering action and wrong.. If I have nothing, and I have to steal to get some food or shelther, warmth, security, then I have to do what I have to do to survive, like fighting a War (Kristna and Argun story), if I am a Warrior/Soldier then I should perform the action that is required for the duty that I am performing, I signed up for it, I should be aware already of what is required of me, then I can kill in the performance of my duty, if You don't want that responsibility then don't sign up for it... 

Edited 1 hour ago by Ishanga

[Hojo]

@IshangaWhat if I steal a Television and let my neighbours come over and watch the football game on it? See how wishy washy these theories can go? It can go in any direction.

Edited 1 hour ago by Hojo

[Ishanga]

8 minutes ago, Hojo said:

@IshangaWhat if I steal a Television and let my neighbours come over and watch the football game on it? See how wishy washy these theories can go? It can go in any direction.

TV overall is disempowering, its Entertainment, balance in how I use this Entertainment, am I watching it all day or just once inawhile, nothing is absolutely bad or good, its all about balance, and empowerment and disempowerment.

TV, or any tech, convenience/comfort we have developed or invented, in and of itself is not anything, its is the user that is everything, and how Conscious they are, if they are Conscious then the tech will not rule them, if they are unconscious it will rule them, like ppl on their phones 10hrs a day, it rules them, so that means they are Unconscious..

If you steal a TV, the intention of it and act of doing it will bite You in the end, it will progress to more stealing and such, which is disempowering and wrong in the end...

[Hojo]

@IshangaI steal food from another family to feed my own then.

[Ishanga]

Best we do not Judge too much, in the end if one is "Evil" it will be revealed to them personally via their inner experience and karma being created in their lives, when they come back they may come back as a beetle that gets crushed by someone's foot when they are walking around the street lol!

[Hojo]

@IshangaYou are doing all the judging here. Im asking for clarification.

Edited 57 minutes ago by Hojo