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Hardkill

Why isn't white collar crime considered a form of Stage Red?

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I do recall Leo having said in his Youtube vid on Spiral Dynamics - Stage Red and other mods on this forum having mentioned various kinds of white collar crime including insider trading, Wolf of Wall Street moments, embezzlement, racketeering, etc. all representing a type of toxic Stage Orange.

However, I thought that one of the main features that differentiates toxic Stage Red from toxic Stage Orange is that Stage Red usually breaks the laws of of any established society whereas Stage Orange generally abides by them.

Yes, white collar crime is not a kind of violent crime, and I do remember Leo saying that violent crime falls under the category of toxic Stage Red. However, white collar crimes are done out of excess narcissism, sociopathy, or psychopathy and impulsivity which are all Stage Red traits. Although I know that Leo still says that people like Donald Trump are primarily Stage Red, because of how incredibly narcissistic, sociopathic, and impulsive he has always been not to mention a lifetime criminal. Yet, a person like Trump has never committed any violent crime (at least as far as know) and doesn't even seem like the kind of a guy who ever has had that in him. He instead has been a white collar criminal. So, why couldn't you argue that someone like him represents a toxic version of Stage Orange?

This is why I am still not 100% clear on the exact differences between Stage Red and Stage Orange.

 

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In my interpretation - Red is often impulsive and would not have the means to exploit the system in such a way. Arguably robbing a bank is the equivalent for that paradigm. Orange however see's the bigger picture and understands how to game a system in a less abrasive fashion. Being a capitalistic system rather than purely tribalistic / hierarchical.

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See, I am still getting used to the model but..

You can be at stage orange and still have stage red attitude operating at orange. I think.


 "Unburdened and Becoming" - Bon Iver

                            ◭"89"

                  

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