Paul EMD

Non-ejaculatory Male Orgasm - The Multi-orgasmic Man, To Do Or Not To Do?

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@WorldlySavage  Ok I have so many questions about this. Was this very hard to learn how to do? (injaculation) Does it always require a good amount of conscious control or focus? Do you have to focus the whole time, or mostly just before you come?

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non-climax "sharpening the knife" of not having specific orgasmic turning points and turning away from any point of no return.

What did you mean by this?

 

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@Dumuzzi  So, would you describe it as being like... the transmutation of sexual energies occurs automatically, so you don't really feel sexual urges or energy at all?

Like if a woman was to touch you, do you think you'd also feel nothing? Like no response whatsoever? Or would it be like... a sort of aversion to it?

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6 hours ago, modmyth said:

@WorldlySavage  Ok I have so many questions about this. Was this very hard to learn how to do? (injaculation) Does it always require a good amount of conscious control or focus? Do you have to focus the whole time, or mostly just before you come?

What did you mean by this?

 

@modmyth So... it's 16 years ago I learned this.. Yes, it took lots of control, both the physical muscle control and the emotional and thought control. It was hard (haha). As for consciousness, you need it the whole time yes, it is like an attitude of "I'm going to take the energy created by this act and hold it for myself here and cherish it"... Think about the difference between eating something slowly and cherishing every bite's flavor and texture, stopping to eat before you're full  vs. stuffing your face gluttonously until you can't anymore and falling into food coma.  It's like that.

The real tantric guys consider what I do to be kind of a cop-out.  They don't go over the edge at all.  In the food analogy, they don't swallow their food. They just chew on it and spit it out........ This leads to, yeah, a lot more energy, no release. 

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Posted (edited)

@WorldlySavage  I actually get what you're saying, from a woman's perspective. I have observed something similar, in terms of finding an intuitive balance between energy release/ expenditure (that savoring process) and energy transmutation. Unfortunately I haven't seen much at all that's decent on the subject out there mainly based on online reading, that covers the woman's perspective. It's usually just a man observing a woman... which is VERY different. Like I have read that there is no inherent energy loss for a woman, but also that there is. Like... there can definitely be energy loss.

I've been documenting some of my experiences with energy work at least partially for this reason, in one of my journals (ARS EROTICA). (There is a lot of TMI there too though possibly, heh.) (And at some possible point soon I'll probably read all the existing literature out there on the subject).

Also, sort of hoping to pass this info onto present and future sex partners. Because the vantage point you're coming from is close to what I had in mind, actually. :D

I'm more of a sensualist as well. I've done the straight energy conversion thing as well, where you bypass the "cherishing" and... the side effect of ascetic practices is that you get a super retentive personality. (I mean, quite literally, that's what you're doing.) I don't know. It depends what you're aiming for.

I think it's very possible to get the best of both worlds, but that's where have a sexual partner/ woman might be helpful.

Edited by modmyth

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11 hours ago, modmyth said:

@Dumuzzi  So, would you describe it as being like... the transmutation of sexual energies occurs automatically, so you don't really feel sexual urges or energy at all?

Like if a woman was to touch you, do you think you'd also feel nothing? Like no response whatsoever? Or would it be like... a sort of aversion to it?

@modmyth  I originally practiced it consciously, with a partner. It is similar to what@WorldlySavage describes. After that, I had a Kundalini awakening, though by that time I wasn't with my girlfriend any more and I stayed single ever since.

Nowadays, I still feel sexual urges and pleasure, but it isn't localised in my genital area. The sexual energy, as well as the fluids, that are generated by the prostate and testicles do not flow out (ever), so there are no emissions of any sort, not even during my sleep. Instead, the (internal) sexual organs are overactive and they feed what would normally be released externally into the spinal fluid, which slowly streams upwards and enters the brain via the brain stem. 

The sensation is extremely pleasurable, almost like a full-body orgasm, but it is near-constant. I am so used to it, that I barely notice it any more. It is less noticeable during everyday life, but I'm very conscious of it, when I meditate or when I am engaged in some sort of spiritual activity, even reading spiritual literature, or listening to profound music, for instance. 

The sensation is a pulsating, orgasmic feeling, starting at the testicles and prostate, then a flow of hot plasma up the spine, into the brain, where there is a sensation of heat and light in the third eye area, but particularly at the top back part of the skull and even above it. This area is called Brahmarendra, or the cavity of God. The process I just described is called Urdhvareta. The process can reportedly be reversed if the practitioner wants to engage in sexual intercourse, but to be honest, I haven't tried it yet.

When I practiced the retention of semen with a partner, it basically meant that I could "go" as long as I, or my girlfriend wanted to. Clenching the required muscles at the point of no return eventually broke the barrier to the spinal canal and contributed to my Kundalini Awakening. However, as the years passed, the condition gradually became permanent and I have not had any outwardly visible seminal emissions for over a year. 

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@Dumuzzi  Oh, I can relate to these feelings you're describing (sexual pleasure and energy that isn't localized in the genital area).

Those feelings have been with me since I was very young, I guess, and I always just associated it with 1) "being me" 2) being very sensitive and drawn towards beautiful experiences, and pleasure in general. Like beautiful art or music too. Or the simple joy of just existing. (But also perhaps.. being and feeling hypersensual at a young age.)

It's just that I find that all of that is greatly enhanced by sex, but perhaps it is with my physical/ energetic orientation as a woman that is different. At least, I have been having this inkling.

Anyway, trying to reconcile my own experiences with everyone else's; it's been fairly difficult at times.

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@modmyth  The phenomenon is not well understood and according to science, should not even exist.

I find, that the best description and explanation comes from Gopi Krishna's works. He had a Kundalini awakening in 1937, followed by 12 years of intense suffering, after which he became fully and permanently enlightened.

In the case of women, the mystery increases, because we really don't know how this works anatomically. With men at least we have some idea. I'd be interested to learn more, but it is next to impossible to find reliable information on this. I guess it is a little like female sexuality, much neglected and misunderstood.

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Posted (edited)

Thanks for that reference, I'm going to check that out (along with that book by Mantak Chia that was recommended in here, and that I've seen recommended more than once). Apparently there is one by him about women, but l am a bit skeptical of what I assume is primarily from his perspective, or perhaps distilled second hand knowledge. Since this knowledge is primarily experiential, so if it's a man's experience of a woman's body first and foremost......

But I will read it anyway.

I have been doing my best to map the territory via direct experience here, in terms of energy work (I feel like I keep pimping out my own journals lately. :D)

There's a mix of stuff, some stuff that's possibly TMI, I dunno. I always feel like I should warn people, because it's very personal.

Edited by modmyth

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@modmyth  I had a quick read.

I have no issues discussing sexual topics in a graphic way, when exploring some of the physiological aspects of Kundalini, it is absolutely necessary. 

As for me, personally, I feel very far removed from the topic of sexual intercourse in general, as I'm no longer sexually active. Not because of my age (I'm 40), but because of the way the Kundalini mechanism is playing out in me, diverting all my sexual energies and substances towards a higher purpose. I believe there is an evolutionary purpose to all this and my whole being is currently under transformation, being upgraded, so to speak. According to Gopi Krishna, there are times during the Kundalini transformation process, when all the energy being generated by the genitals is needed to feed said process and all of it is diverted towards the brain. He says that this can be reversed, for instance, when the practitioner wishes to procreate, however, I've never tried it, so I can't be sure. 

Regarding energy work, I get the impression, that your general, relentless horniness is a sign of the rising Kundalini stimulating the lower chakras, especiallly the second and third one. If you were to raise your energies higher, your urges would gradually dissipate and mellow out. But, I'm guessing, that you are perhaps happy the way you are.

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Posted (edited)

@Dumuzzi  I think that's somewhat true. But actually, a lot more energy is coming in through my crown at this point. Sort of multiple processes going on at the same time. Sometimes clashing.

I have this impression that women have a somewhat variable energy orientation compared to men, and that men may benefit more directly from ascetic energy transmutation (which I understand, is not a novel idea), or at least the absence of wasting sexual energy. (But what involves not wasting... how things work practically. That's what I want to make sure I understand.) But it's not completely divergent.

Women have the "grail", in the spiritual sense, in the form of the womb. It isn't just about pleasure or getting off, although it could just be about that too. Inuitively speaking, our ability to create in the intellectual and creative sense involves a different sort of transmutation. I haven't quite pegged it down in clear, nonintuitive impressions yet. Where I can actually describe it a lot better even though I can "see" and "feel" it very clearly.

I think different energy orientations serve different purposes. Like, I have past life memory of different energy orientations and what not. Objectively speaking, I don't consider this process of bypassing the sexual energy centers to be the best one, and possibly only works properly/ ideally for men anyway. It's just that (especially if you are a man), it makes higher centre development much more rapid, but only if it's working properly. If you are an innovative artist, thinker, or scientist, being higher energy centre dominant can work to your advantage if you require an either extreme energy expenditure ("innovative" leaps or perpetual high energy states only in the higher centres) or you're a bit lacking in the upper energy centres naturally. Or you wish to shift your balance. Etc.

 But these experiences are not objectively better IMO. It's a matter of preferences, ethics, and aesthetics. Enculturation, which is relying on info that came before in order to dictate how you should live and ultimately ... dictates the parameters of how you permit yourself to experience in the present.

So many of these practices have an ascetic bias, but I want to understand as fully as I can anyway. But also, I am not an ascetic, or looking ascend and GTFO.

"god" proper does not differentiate. We do. :D

Edited by modmyth

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@modmyth  Yes, I agree with that assessment. 

We all have our own paths to walk and each path is different.

Urdhvareta only seems to be an option for men and there is a physical, as well as an energetic component. Semen is "sucked up" and absorbed into the spinal fluid. 

My own feeling is that orgasms are actually beneficial for womens' spiritual development and are not a drain on their energetic body, but I have no idea how to verify that. Technically, expending sexual energy (orgasms) outwards, should not be done on this path. But what happens, when a woman has an orgasm, where does the energy go? I think that is the big question that needs answering. 

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On 1/6/2020 at 8:26 AM, modmyth said:

@WorldlySavage  I actually get what you're saying, from a woman's perspective. I have observed something similar, in terms of finding an intuitive balance between energy release/ expenditure (that savoring process) and energy transmutation. Unfortunately I haven't seen much at all that's decent on the subject out there mainly based on online reading, that covers the woman's perspective. It's usually just a man observing a woman... which is VERY different. Like I have read that there is no inherent energy loss for a woman, but also that there is. Like... there can definitely be energy loss.

I've been documenting some of my experiences with energy work at least partially for this reason, in one of my journals (ARS EROTICA). (There is a lot of TMI there too though possibly, heh.) (And at some possible point soon I'll probably read all the existing literature out there on the subject).

Also, sort of hoping to pass this info onto present and future sex partners. Because the vantage point you're coming from is close to what I had in mind, actually. :D

I'm more of a sensualist as well. I've done the straight energy conversion thing as well, where you bypass the "cherishing" and... the side effect of ascetic practices is that you get a super retentive personality. (I mean, quite literally, that's what you're doing.) I don't know. It depends what you're aiming for.

I think it's very possible to get the best of both worlds, but that's where have a sexual partner/ woman might be helpful.

@modmyth To quote Funkadelic: Free Your Mind... and Your Ass Will Follow -  the Kingdom of Heaven is within

I appreciate women who are eager to learn about this from a male perspective, so I will elaborate more.  A lot of women that I've been with don't get why i don't cum when sleeping with them.  Some even worry about it, that they are not satisfying me.  Nothing could be further from the truth.

I think the greatest challenge of the whole journey for me was overcoming impure sexual energy in my mind and owning a healthy masculine desire to connect with women mentally, emotionally and physically.  There can be a lot of fragmented desire there.

I'm not talking about impure in a moralistic sense, just in a sense of healthy sexuality free of guilt and free of being cut off from ones authentic self... It's hard to describe but as I started working through that stuff, my masculine energy became a lot stronger and a lot less friction.

It also does reduce the neurotic urge to have sex.  At the time I started I had slept with 3 or 4 girls, but now it's over 30 and I don't regret any of them.  I only end up with women who I actually like, who align with mind body and soul.  I don't really care how many women I sleep with or if I'm with someone or single (mostly single), just that I feel good with my choices and tell the truth in my interactions.

Of course misunderstandings still happen, expectations can still be unmet and form unexpectedly....

I guess what I'm saying, is it helped evolve me to a point, but it's not like it solved all my problems with sex.  It just helped me have more peace with myself about the whole thing. 

 

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@WorldlySavage  I get what you're saying about impure sexual energy and fragmented desire. I went through a similar type of process of needing to own my desire as well, in purpose if not in form. (Actually, I have found writing and journalling about it here has helped me so much with the inhibition. For me, it seemed to be inseparable from this tendency to be one person in private, and another person in public (or being different people around different people).)

So for me, had to go against the grain and just started posting EVERYTHING in a public way, haha. I had this need to completely go against the grain of my social conditioning as a woman, as I was raised fairly strictly/ conservatively in some ways (but not in others).  Just feeling like any space I take up, if not aligned from my surroundings or emotionally detached in some way... is too much space. No space for expression. Like living in a tiny, cramped, little box all the time.

How did you manage to personally overcome your sense of guilt? What helped you reconnect or integrate? (Other than maybe these practices you described?)

Edited by modmyth

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 @modmyth The question about guilt is hard to answer.  It's like "how did you learn how to walk?"

Maybe I never had much guilt, I've still got inhibitions though. It all depends on the other people you're interacting with too. Especially women holding back on their desires, triggers my inhibitions too.  The inhibitions which tell you to "leave women alone, they don't want your sex"... I think that's the male version of what you're describing.  

Things can flow pretty smoothly when "it's on" though.

 

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