Adyashanti - Good Karma? Bad Karma?

[Ishanga]

2 minutes ago, RisingLane said:

Why would a follower of Actualized.org define God in that way? God is Infinite Nothingness.

Maybe loving it and accepting it are the same thing. 

Tell that to Jesus.

how does infinite nothingness have will?

[RisingLane]

6 minutes ago, Ishanga said:

As soon as someone says there is no choices being made, and I say there is, right there is obvious proof that there is choice lol...

No one claims that choices aren't being made. Clearly, choices are made, but they aren't made freely.

7 minutes ago, Ishanga said:

do they choose what to wear or what to eat or how many breaths they take each min or what to look at/not look at?

Your preferences are influenced by conditioning. Your breathing occurs automatically. Your gaze is directed by an intelligent designer who can lead your attention wherever they want you to focus.

[Breakingthewall]

5 minutes ago, RisingLane said:

Reminds me of Jed McKenna, who claimed he’d rather end his own life than spend a year in prison, or even push children in front of a train if that’s what the universe required of him.

I exaggerated a bit before . anyway, just 1 years in prison sure it's interesting. 25 years what a hell, maybe it's better to die. But honestly, I think I would commit suicide only in case of terminal, degenerative disease, and I would never harm innocent people. But who knows, we don't know what we would be like in extreme circumstances.

[RisingLane]

8 minutes ago, Ishanga said:

how does infinite nothingness have will?

Infinite Nothingness has Infinite Power and Infinite Will, and it's willing this moment into existence. As an Infinite Mind, it can imagine anything it desires, just as your finite mind creates thoughts and ideas within the limits of its conditioned will.

[RisingLane]

5 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

I exaggerated a bit before

I'm pretty sure Jed was exaggerating as well, which just makes it even funnier.

[Ishanga]

14 minutes ago, RisingLane said:

No one claims that choices aren't being made. Clearly, choices are made, but they aren't made freely.

Your preferences are influenced by conditioning. Your breathing occurs automatically. Your gaze is directed by an intelligent designer who can lead your attention wherever they want you to focus.

Once there is the ability to make choices, there is Will. Of course not all our choices are an example of free will, but they can be, that is the whole point, you can progress to it, but if I have to go to a certain place my will will direct me down a predetermined path, but this is just reality.. Again Free Will is not about absolute control over everything, its about Me and My ability to determine How I am within Myself, that is totally an ability I can have, via that more choices become available to me, vs. not determining what my experience is and blowing in the wind.  Having a Suffering mind will make You not want to get out of bed in the morning, having a Blissful Mind will make You want to get out of bed in the morning, I choose to be Blissful, life is much easier this way..

And Yes thank God that Breathing happens automatically, but I can control that too if I want to. You can even get to a point where Your completely conscious while in Deep Sleep, totally aware but fully asleep..

You need to expand Your horizons and not get caught up in the dogma of predetermination!!

Edited Friday at 10:56 PM by Ishanga

[Breakingthewall]

On 12/12/2025 at 11:47 PM, RisingLane said:

Infinite Nothingness has Infinite Power and Infinite Will, and it's willing this moment into existence. As an Infinite Mind, it can imagine anything it desires, just as your finite mind creates thoughts and ideas within the limits of its conditioned will.

Then it's something not nothing, a creator with a will, and then the reality is dual. A creator in one side and a creation in another 

[RisingLane]

4 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

Then it's something not nothing, a creator with a will

Nothingness can feel a lot like something. It’s essentially Infinite Potential, and when you experience it, you can’t help but wonder why it’s called Nothingness—yet somehow, it still makes perfect sense.

4 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

and then the reality is dual. A creator in one side and a creation in another

I’m still trying to wrap my head around it. It’s basically a question of monotheism versus monism. Bernadette Roberts would argue that the creator and the created are distinct, with a Great Divide separating the Uncreated from the created. Leo, on the other hand, merges everything into one, saying God is the very thing it creates, even the ego. I’m still uncertain.

[Ramasta9]

What is the question here? So much commotion, and whats with always posting the guru videos in comments and responses, and not knowing the truth or speaking from yourself, that only reveals your confusions further. That's still groundless wisdom, speak, don't whisper others voices.

Speak, if you have something to say, don't speak just because you wanna say something.

[RisingLane]

2 minutes ago, Ramasta9 said:

What is the question here?

The question is simple: Does free will exist or not? Before diving into that debate, we should first answer a few key questions:

• What exactly is will?
• What does it mean for the will to be free—and free from what?
• And if free will does exist, who actually possesses it? 

4 minutes ago, Ramasta9 said:

not knowing the truth or speaking from yourself,

Fine, I’ll speak from my own experience. I honestly don’t feel like I have free will. Do you?

[RisingLane]

Even Einstein was a determinist 

[Joseph Maynor]

It's so hard for me to listen to that Adyashanti video.  Reminds me of what I used to think many years ago.  

[Ishanga]

Both exist, predetermination and free will, we humans have to figure it out which one to use, that is one of our roles here, no other life form on this planet has as much choices as we do, most animals are mostly predetermined living forms, we are too in lots of ways, but we have access to levels of Consciousness that animals do not, that makes all the differences, and one of the qualities of High Consciousness is choosing how to be and choosing your destiny..  At the sametime there is always a randomness to things, that is the chaos and beauty of creation, its set up in a way that potential is mostly unlimited, limited physically but living things are way more than just physical objects..

 

Edited 12 hours ago by Ishanga

[Ishanga]

Wolfgang Smith, Mathematician and Physicistm he spent years with the Yogis in India, called them Giants, but was more of a gnostic Christian I would say, Here is what he says about Free Will..

"Wolfgang Smith explored the concept of free will within his broader metaphysical framework, particularly through the lens of "vertical causality," which posits that higher levels of being—such as the intellect and the soul—can influence lower levels, including the physical world. He argued that free will is an expression of this vertical causality, where the human soul, as a higher ontological reality, exercises causal power over physical processes, thereby enabling genuine freedom of choice. This view stands in contrast to the mechanistic worldview of modern science, which reduces all causation to physical interactions and thus undermines the possibility of free will. Smith maintained that the corporeal world, which includes human experience and consciousness, is not merely a projection of the physical universe but a real and ontologically distinct domain that allows for such higher-level causation. He emphasized that the collapse of the wave function in quantum mechanics, which requires an observer, hints at a metaphysical order where consciousness and will play a fundamental role, aligning with his notion of vertical causality. In his work, Smith asserted that the traditional tripartite cosmology—comprising the corporeal, the physical, and the spiritual—provides the necessary framework to understand free will as a real and meaningful phenomenon, not an illusion produced by deterministic processes."

 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wolfgang_Smith

[RisingLane]

Quantum physics doesn't offer a path to free will. Frankly, nothing can, because the idea of free will is, at its core, a fantastical concept. Hoping for free will to exist is akin to wishing Pinocchio could become a real boy – it's something only magic could accomplish! Our heightened consciousness compared to animals doesn't automatically grant us free will, either.

[Arthogaan]

Angelo also speaks very clearly about this:

https://youtu.be/Jc2hOTNpTbY?si=xvufZgwcrPxUTLFN

[RisingLane]

6 minutes ago, Arthogaan said:

Angelo also speaks very clearly about this:

https://youtu.be/Jc2hOTNpTbY?si=xvufZgwcrPxUTLFN

Nice!

Letting go of free will is a beautiful thing. It’s surprising how much we resist it. Many people would rather endure the burden of free will than embrace perfect determinism.

Interestingly, the idea of free will, or liberum arbitrium, was introduced by Saint Augustine as a way to tackle the problem of evil. Unable to accept that God created evil, he attributed it instead to human free will.

[Ishanga]

1 hour ago, RisingLane said:

Nice!

Letting go of free will is a beautiful thing. It’s surprising how much we resist it. Many people would rather endure the burden of free will than embrace perfect determinism.

Interestingly, the idea of free will, or liberum arbitrium, was introduced by Saint Augustine as a way to tackle the problem of evil. Unable to accept that God created evil, he attributed it instead to human free will.

Its exactly this..,and Your the one that brought Einstein into the conversation.. We can all go back and forth and post this video and that video contradicting the other person's video, quote this or that person, and I find it interesting that even in the objective world of facts that science is supposed to be about there are varying opinions on the same subject, if that only doesn't tell You that free will exists as a possibility for Human Beings then I don't know what will..  

This is just a perfect example of extreme belief blinding ppl, please all that read this look Above!! 

[RisingLane]

22 minutes ago, Ishanga said:

there are varying opinions on the same subject, if that only doesn't tell You that free will exists as a possibility for Human Beings then I don't know what will..  

What do differing opinions have to do with free will? Sure, people have different perspectives, but that doesn’t prove that those opinions, beliefs, and viewpoints were freely chosen. They obviously weren’t. 

23 minutes ago, Ishanga said:

This is just a perfect example of extreme belief blinding ppl

Either I’m exercising my free will to believe in determinism, or you’re destined to believe in free will—until you’re not. Which seems more likely?

I’m not concerned with convincing anyone of determinism. If believing in free will still works for someone, maybe it’s best not to take it away too soon—it could be like training wheels. I used to believe in free will myself; I wasn’t always a determinist.

[Ishanga]

14 minutes ago, RisingLane said:

What do differing opinions have to do with free will? Sure, people have different perspectives, but that doesn’t prove that those opinions, beliefs, and viewpoints were freely chosen. They obviously weren’t. 

Either I’m exercising my free will to believe in determinism, or you’re destined to believe in free will—until you’re not. Which seems more likely?

I’m not concerned with convincing anyone of determinism. If believing in free will still works for someone, maybe it’s best not to take it away too soon—it could be like training wheels. I used to believe in free will myself; I wasn’t always a determinist.

My last reply on this subject here anyway, my choice eh:)

Differing opinions means looking at the same evidence, same #'s and such and interpreting it differently via a choice of how to interpret, based on their own choosing of understanding,  It doesn't get more objective than physics and/or other sciences does it not? Then how to have a disagreement? Its in interpretation which is choosing to see it differently..

And Free Will is not about belief,, Now I've already said that the majority of ppl live predetermined lives, karma rules them, so predetermination is alive and well in tons of ppl, but so is choice and Free Will, as well as Randomness and chaos.. Its all of this stuff mixed together.. but hey anything can be argued and said to be not true based on the individuals personal logic, which is again a choice.. We all make tons of decisions everyday, some are predetermine (like my body it wants to go pee mostly at the sametimes everyday, but I can hold it, and if I try hard enough change that routine and predetermination to some other time.), and some are based on high level of choice, those that are highly Conscious have more access to Free Will and out of the trap of predetermination than those of lesser consciousness..