Curing all diseases & Biological Immortality - Backed by Zuckerberg

[LordFall]

1 hour ago, Eskilon said:

Yeah you have a point I havent started a bussiness yet but I do know about bussiness and plan on starting one. And Just because you have started a bussiness yourself that doesnt mean you know about capitalism more than I do. Capitalism is an idea, an abstraction with rules and behaviour, you starting a bussiness have nothing to do with deep understanding of sytems in an abstract level, the skills are different. Just like you can drive a car, with relative success but doesnt know jack shit about what a car is, why it was designed the way it was, how it works mechanically, all the factors that went into making it, the pros and cons of every decision and so on. But hey, you know how to drive one, you are successful in it, you must know a ton about cars right?

Just because you are practical that doesnt give you an upper hand here, dont kid yourself. Praticality doesnt necessarily mean a deep understanding of things.

Capitalism is exploitation and no ammount of twisting on your part will change that. Even Leo will agree with this and he has much more success in bussiness than you do.

I do believe I understand capitalism far more than you do and I'm willing to have a respectful debate to prove it to you. 

You started out your comments on this thread with this remark 

> It makes no sense living forever in a dogshit system like capitalism. Only for those who are at the top of the pyramid maybe then it could make sense if you are neurotic enough and scared of death.

You’re assuming capitalism is a static “pyramid,” but the entire historical record points the opposite way. The only reason most of us aren’t breaking our backs in fields or factories anymore is precisely because market incentives pushed technological progress, productivity, and specialization. Capitalism didn’t trap people in exploitation—it freed billions from subsistence labor and created the surplus that even makes conversations about AI, automation, or extended lifespan possible. People have been exploited since the start of capital accumulation when a dude found out that instead of farming all winter you could just raid farmers during harvest season and have a labor free lifestyle. That's just the laws of nature and has nothing to do with capitalism. 

There's many reasons that the current of standards of living of people in western society has been declining in recent years but most of it have to do with macroeconomics linked to money printing and an unsound currency but not really to the foundation of capitalism i.e. free enterprise and private property.

 @Natasha Tori Maru There's absolutely massive amounts of corruption in the system. I don't think it's anywhere the amount to say business and capitalism are not successful systems. The problem is to compare it to an imaginary perfect utopia vs the other systems that exist in reality like the savana and jungle, monarchal systems or slavery fueled economies that were the norm in the past. 

Calling my points toxic positivity is a bit wild and I don't think you can back that up. I could claim that most of the comments on this thread are ungrounded negativity though. 

 

@LoneWonderer I don't disagree with you but I will say that I believe that we already have amazing systems of educations that are gonna take us towards this equal opportunity society that you seem to advocate for. First of these new breakthroughs was the internet where most people globally with any type of electronic device can educate themselves for free and pursue advanced fields of knowledge previously unavailable to people like we do here on this forum. AI will only spread this further with having a private advanced intelligence tutor at any time and giving anybody access to the labor of AI agents for very cheap. 

[LoneWonderer]

10 minutes ago, LordFall said:

 

@LoneWonderer I don't disagree with you but I will say that I believe that we already have amazing systems of educations that are gonna take us towards this equal opportunity society that you seem to advocate for. First of these new breakthroughs was the internet where most people globally with any type of electronic device can educate themselves for free and pursue advanced fields of knowledge previously unavailable to people like we do here on this forum. AI will only spread this further with having a private advanced intelligence tutor at any time and giving anybody access to the labor of AI agents for very cheap. 

Technological breakthroughs are speeding up and like you state they do seem to be speeding up human evolution. There does seem to be a awakening of sorts happening unprecedented in human history. I will agree with you here. I'm skeptical however how far it will take us. But yes, we do live in exciting times!

Edited 23 hours ago by LoneWonderer

[Leo Gura]

26 minutes ago, LoneWonderer said:

Technological breakthroughs are speeding up

Peter Theil makes the case that tech breakthroughs have slowed down in the 21st century.

[LoneWonderer]

3 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Peter Theil makes the case that tech breakthroughs have slowed down in the 21st century.

I have not heard of this. Will have to look into it.

[Leo Gura]

11 minutes ago, LoneWonderer said:

I have not heard of this. Will have to look into it.

Sure, he talks about it often in his podcast interviews.

Major scientific breakthroughs have been few in the last 50 years relative to the previous 50. Consumer tech has little new science in it.

Still waiting on those hover cars 

Edited 22 hours ago by Leo Gura

[Eskilon]

1 hour ago, LordFall said:

You’re assuming capitalism is a static “pyramid,” but the entire historical record points the opposite way. The only reason most of us aren’t breaking our backs in fields or factories anymore is precisely because market incentives pushed technological progress, productivity, and specialization. Capitalism didn’t trap people in exploitation—it freed billions from subsistence labor and created the surplus that even makes conversations about AI, automation, or extended lifespan possible. People have been exploited since the start of capital accumulation when a dude found out that instead of farming all winter you could just raid farmers during harvest season and have a labor free lifestyle. That's just the laws of nature and has nothing to do with capitalism. 

There's many reasons that the current of standards of living of people in western society has been declining in recent years but most of it have to do with macroeconomics linked to money printing and an unsound currency but not really to the foundation of capitalism i.e. free enterprise and private property.

I didnt say anything in being a static pyramid, only that it is a pyramid. And you cannnot deny that. The sytem MUST have inequality to function and at its current form insanely unfair hierarchies. 

No matter how hard you try, you cant justify the existence of Billionaires. Especially a world where tons of Billionaires exist while people dont have basic necessities covered and the Billionaires still dont give a fuck about people. This is the kind of people the systems breeds. Truly beautiful system HAha.

Stealing is law of nature？ How can you back that up without sounding like a fool? 

Edited 22 hours ago by Eskilon

[LordFall]

@Eskilon 

I can very easily justify or explain the existence of billionaires. Business operates through the marginal cost principle which is the increased cost that you accrue from repeating a service over time which then creates economies of scale. You can create a service business today for almost $0 but being able to scale that business to tens of thousands of dollars and then millions and then billions is an exceptionally hard thing to do. 

You then have to separate an economic model from a political model. Taxing wealth usually doesn't work because it creates capital flight and tax heavens. You can't blame capitalism for that, we don't have a world government or global entity that could regulate such a thing, its just a systemic issue of our species. 

Stealing is definitely a law of nature. Think about that for a second then I'll explain it.

I just asked chatgpt for a precise number but predation is the dominant ecological strategy on this planet and 70-90% of animal species engage in it regularly or once in a while. Theft is a more civilized version of the basic law of nature which is basically kill or be killed. Only about 15-25% of animal species are classified as herbivores and basically "kill" unconscious vegetation as opposed to other organic beings. 

The fact that we as a species are mostly cooperative globally and trade and live together with a few wars is basically 95% peace. The last 5% is gonna be hard to achieve but that's what AI and blockchain technology will help bridge I believe. 

[Eskilon]

11 minutes ago, LordFall said:

I can very easily justify or explain the existence of billionaires. Business operates through the marginal cost principle which is the increased cost that you accrue from repeating a service over time which then creates economies of scale. You can create a service business today for almost $0 but being able to scale that business to tens of thousands of dollars and then millions and then billions is an exceptionally hard thing to do. 

Just because something is hard to do that doesnt mean you deserve billions in cash in your bank account while everyone else is a pleb. Who decides  that, you? lmao.

 

13 minutes ago, LordFall said:

You then have to separate an economic model from a political model. Taxing wealth usually doesn't work because it creates capital flight and tax heavens. You can't blame capitalism for that, we don't have a world government or global entity that could regulate such a thing, its just a systemic issue of our species. 

No.

The only reason capital flight exists and tax heavens exist is because capitalism exist. Capitalism is the structure, while those 2 things are content. Capitalism is the source of those problems.

15 minutes ago, LordFall said:

Stealing is definitely a law of nature. Think about that for a second then I'll explain it.

I just asked chatgpt for a precise number but predation is the dominant ecological strategy on this planet and 70-90% of animal species engage in it regularly or once in a while. Theft is a more civilized version of the basic law of nature which is basically kill or be killed. Only about 15-25% of animal species are classified as herbivores and basically "kill" unconscious vegetation as opposed to other organic beings.

Stealing is definitely not the same thing as killing. You are twisting words here to make a poor point.

 

17 minutes ago, LordFall said:

The fact that we as a species are mostly cooperative globally and trade and live together with a few wars is basically 95% peace. The last 5% is gonna be hard to achieve but that's what AI and blockchain technology will help bridge I believe. 

Cooperative lmao. The engine of capitalism is competition, every monkey for himself, individuality above collectivism. And theres plenty of conflict all around, we are definetly not as unitive as you are saying here, not even close. Toxic positivity for real

[LordFall]

28 minutes ago, Eskilon said:

Just because something is hard to do that doesnt mean you deserve billions in cash in your bank account while everyone else is a pleb. Who decides  that, you? lmao.

 

No.

The only reason capital flight exists and tax heavens exist is because capitalism exist. Capitalism is the structure, while those 2 things are content. Capitalism is the source of those problems.

Stealing is definitely not the same thing as killing. You are twisting words here to make a poor point.

 

Cooperative lmao. The engine of capitalism is competition, every monkey for himself, individuality above collectivism. And theres plenty of conflict all around, we are definetly not as unitive as you are saying here, not even close. Toxic positivity for real

That's what I mean by you don't understand capitalism. The market sets prices. You don't "deserve billions in your bank account" you make a business that has that valuation and you sell it. Do you think people that buy businesses are dumb and just buy them because some random guy said his business is worth billions?

Capital flight was a thing in the times of the Phoenician and ancient rome. Capitalism depending on how you define it only really emerged around 1500. 

[Natasha Tori Maru]

40 minutes ago, LordFall said:

Do you think people that buy businesses are dumb and just buy them because some random guy said his business is worth billions?

They buy them simply to make more money past the point of need.

Humans are greedy and that need makes capitalism poo. Humans are part of the system you cannot remove from it.

Ideally arguing for capitalism isn't going to work because the whole point is the system isn't being used properly.

We are looking at how it is applied here. And it is currently being leveraged to exploit those at the bottom.

Have you noticed that many of the solutions you propose on the forum relate to 'start business and make money'? Just a theme I have noticed.

[Eskilon]

40 minutes ago, LordFall said:

The market sets prices. You don't "deserve billions in your bank account" you make a business that has that valuation and you sell it. Do you think people that buy businesses are dumb and just buy them because some random guy said his business is worth billions?

Yes? Who is the market anyway? A group of people isnt it not? Why are they saying that x product has a value of y isntead of z? Some group of people are defining that value. Some random people are defining what is and what isnt worth billions. What I am saying that criteria is completely arbitrary. 

You still didnt answer my question, what is the justification of billionaries existence? Apart from greed, power hungry behaviour and histrionism? You cant asnwer me that without some bullshit you tell yourself lol.

[LordFall]

Bro what are you talking about the market is the entirety of humanity's wants and needs separated by supply and demands in terms of services and products sold to people in different countries. It's not arbitrary or random at all. Try selling an hour of your consulting for $1M and see if it works. Some people can do it. 

I don't know what you mean by justification, it's a system of cause and effects. What is the justification for mountain lions eating deers? 

Sure you can say that we as a species should come together and figure an international system of checks and balances beyond what we currently have but that's not an argument against capitalism it's an argument for a better UN basically. 

I haven't said any bullshit. Have you ever taken an economics class or read an economics book? If you're uneducated about these topics I can understand that they make you emotional as they're hard to understand but don't pretend to be an expert in capitalism if you haven't studied it. 

[Eskilon]

@LordFall  Just say you cant justify the existence of billionaries, thats ok, and expected, even though you said that you can easily do it up above lmao. I think they didnt taught that on your classes in economics isnt it so?

And yes the value of things is an impossible question and arbitrary. Why should an apple be worth $2 dollars instead of a thousand, or instead of any other value? You cant just say scarcity or some bullshit like that because scarcity is a lie -- money is infinite, and theres plenty of food for everybody; So how much should an apple be priced? 

 

 

Edited 20 hours ago by Eskilon

[LordFall]

 

[Natasha Tori Maru]

Wooooosh

[Ramasta9]

@LordFall I am simply a mirror, a reflection, showing you something bigger  I could... but timing is excellence.

[pablo_aka_god]

It's a really useful experiment what BJ is doing, we'll see how long all that tech affords him to live and learn from it.

I don't envy his lifestyle and the guy doesn't look very happy. But the fact that he has donated his life to become a lab rat and share it in public deserves respect.

[pablo_aka_god]

Trying to maximize health constantly becomes neurosis at some point.

There is a sweetspot where someone can be very healthy and also not a robot and my thesis is someone like this will even live longer than the robot. 

Edited 6 hours ago by pablo_aka_god