A lesson in space and time

[Carl-Richard]

2 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

No, there is not. Everything is in constant change. The self , the center or perceptor seems to be the unchanging receptor of the experience, but it's precisely the "illusion". It's created by the perception of change. 

If change is constant, change has a changeless element to it. Change requires non-change. That's basic non-duality.

 

2 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

Consciousness is nothing, it's just the reality appearing as an structure perceptor / perception. It's an arising of the reality 

Consciousness is an appearance. Reality doesn't need conciousness to be, but conciousness arises. As it arises it's infinite, but not absolute. It's an essential nuance

If it's constant, it's absolute.

[Davino]

55 minutes ago, Hojo said:

Thats why meditation to focus on yourself is a thing. You can get lost because its all in your face. Its not if, but when you forget again. Thats why we spawn here we forgot.

I don't understand what you mean.

[Breakingthewall]

6 hours ago, Carl-Richard said:

change is constant, change has a changeless element to it. Change requires non-change. That's basic non-duality.

 

What is constant is the nature of the reality, the unlimited, as the tao te king said, it can't be named. It's not conciousness, that's a mistake. Conciousness arises in it

[Carl-Richard]

31 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

What is constant is the nature of the reality, the unlimited, as the tao te king said, it can't be named. It's not conciousness, that's a mistake. Conciousness arises in it

So you're a materialist? 

[Breakingthewall]

Just now, Carl-Richard said:

So you're a materialist? 

What is a materialist? What is matter?

[Breakingthewall]

8 hours ago, Davino said:

did have that realization but with time Solipsism matured in me. Now I see a boundless Consciousness Field which is Reality itself morphing into sensations at every moment and that shines through everyone's eyes.

At an Absolute level I am Infinity I am God, The One.

Yet this Infinity replicates itself into multiplicity and that is when human-me and other-Is happen. 

I agree but thats not what leo means with solipsism, you can ask him directly 

[Carl-Richard]

10 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

What is a materialist? What is matter?

You could also be a dual aspect monist when I think about it. You believe consciousness arises out of something that is not consciousness.

[Carl-Richard]

10 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

I agree but thats not what leo means with solipsism, you can ask him directly 

If Leo thinks a toilet exists but not other people, he puts primacy to some spatio-temporal entities over others, hence his metaphysics depends on space and time, hence it's not absolute (because space and time is relative).

[Breakingthewall]

25 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

You could also be a dual aspect monist when I think about it. You believe consciousness arises out of something that is not consciousness.

Consciousness is a stable relational structure in which absolute reality reflects itself synchronously, generating the appearance of a center of perception, from which reality is observed and experienced. It is not a substance, nor a universal witness, nor a separate entity.

Consciousness is not something that exists "in itself," but a form that reality takes when it synchronizes itself in a coherent and sustained manner. It is not a foundation, but a local manifestation of the foundation.

Absolute reality is not consciousness, but the limitless. Consciousness occurs within the limitless, as a form that arises when there is sufficient synchrony between relations. It is a node of relational coherence.

When certain relations stabilize and coherently forward each other, an apparent center of perception appears: this is what we call consciousness. The self is a structure derived from consciousness when it identifies with particular forms of memory, desire, or body. But consciousness can exist even without that self.

Consciousness is the process by which the infinite experiences itself in a particular form. It is neither a thing, nor a center, nor a witness: it is a synchronized, reflective relationship.

Just as a whirlpool is not something distinct from water, but a stable form that water takes when it is organized in a certain way, consciousness is not something distinct from reality, but a stable form that the infinite takes when it synchronously reflects upon itself.

Or is another words: the tao that can be named is not the true tao

Edited May 28 by Breakingthewall

[Carl-Richard]

6 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

Consciousness is a stable relational structure in which absolute reality reflects itself synchronously, generating the appearance of a center of perception, from which reality is observed and experienced.

No, that's you describing individualized mind-body consciousness. Consciousness exists before that. You can deconstruct your mind and body right now if you try to sit very still and become one with silence and that which doesn't move (it usually takes practice of course). But you don't even need to do that; deep sleep is pretty much the same thing, but you probably don't notice that you actually are conscious during deep sleep, because you're too identified with your mind and body to notice the transition or subtlety of the state.

Edited May 28 by Carl-Richard

[Breakingthewall]

10 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

You can deconstruct your mind and body right now if you try to sit very still

Yes sure , very still with quadrillions of processes happening. I know what's meditation btw, I meditated 2/3 hours by day many years, I was only concerned about meditation. This narrative about conciousness is advaita. Ralston, spira, adyashanty, mooji, even Ramana maharsi. It's wrong. Nobody never get enlightenment following those teachings. But what to do? This is spirituality. A mess absolutely wrong in its basis. Idealism vs materialism by kastrup, for 12 years old minds. Or the screen of spira. Or Ralston. They are not enlightened, even close. They are absolutely wrong and the fact that human spirituality has in they the higher expression shows the level of current spirituality 

Edited May 28 by Breakingthewall

[Carl-Richard]

1 hour ago, Breakingthewall said:

Yes sure , very still with quadrillions of processes happening. I know what's meditation btw

I don't think you do.

[Breakingthewall]

3 hours ago, Carl-Richard said:

I don't think you do.

Maybe because you are a lost kid that can't open his heart , who defend himself with barriers , unable to real understanding, to real openess. Don't worries, you are not alone. In fact almost everyone is like you. Closed. That's human life. 

Edited May 29 by Breakingthewall

[Carl-Richard]

1 hour ago, Breakingthewall said:

Maybe because you are a lost kid that can't open his heart , who defend himself with barriers , unable to real understanding, to real openess. Don't worries, you are not alone. In fact almost everyone is like you. Closed. That's human life. 

I'm just saying what I think. I could be mistaken.

[Breakingthewall]

4 hours ago, Carl-Richard said:

I'm just saying what I think. I could be mistaken.

It's bit disappointing to have a conversation about a topic like conciousness and instead to try to make your point say those things like : you are not awake, etc. That put spirituality in the level of joke. Well, it's what spirituality is 😅

[Carl-Richard]

6 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

It's bit disappointing to have a conversation about a topic like conciousness and instead to try to make your point say those things like : you are not awake, etc. That put spirituality in the level of joke. Well, it's what spirituality is 😅

I didn't ask you about whether you have meditated for many years or your "level of awakeness". You brought that up.

[Wilhelm44]

On 5/27/2025 at 9:57 PM, Davino said:

I did have that realization but with time Solipsism matured in me. Now I see a boundless Consciousness Field which is Reality itself morphing into sensations at every moment and that shines through everyone's eyes.

At an Absolute level I am Infinity I am God, The One.

Yet this Infinity replicates itself into multiplicity and that is when human-me and other-Is happen. 

This is what Leo talked about in the video of Infinite Gods, that is Solipsism matured. The mindfuck is how every realization can coexist simultaenously and even contradictorily. My Mind can shape itself into so many perspectives, combinations of them and states of Consciousness that it's even hard to have a preference for one over the other, infinite relativity meets infinite love, for the miracle of existence happening in every breath.

So you saying other people's pov is just as real as yours ? This solipsism thing sure is tricky.

Edited May 29 by Wilhelm44

[Breakingthewall]

42 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

I didn't ask you about whether you have meditated for many years or your "level of awakeness". You brought that up.

You told me : you could deconstruct your body and your mind if you sit very still. It's a great recommendations but I already did meditation, that's why I told you. I just wanted to explain you that if I'm talking about conciousness, etc it's because I did such things as meditation, psychedelic, etc. Maybe you want to explain that such thing as meditation exist, and I'm thankful for the recommendation, but I already know it. That's why I told you: I already did a lot of meditation. Then you answered: I don't think so. Well, in those terms it's difficult to have a debate. Anyway, I already said what I think about conciousness paradigm 

[Carl-Richard]

36 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

You told me : you could deconstruct your body and your mind if you sit very still. It's a great recommendations but I already did meditation, that's why I told you. I just wanted to explain you that if I'm talking about conciousness, etc it's because I did such things as meditation, psychedelic, etc. Maybe you want to explain that such thing as meditation exist, and I'm thankful for the recommendation, but I already know it. That's why I told you: I already did a lot of meditation. Then you answered: I don't think so. Well, in those terms it's difficult to have a debate. Anyway, I already said what I think about conciousness paradigm 

You can do meditation for 20 years and not get much results, just like you can do philosophy for 20 years and believe in solipsism.

Edited May 29 by Carl-Richard

[Breakingthewall]

34 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

You can do meditation for 20 years and not get much results, just like you can do philosophy for 20 years and believe in solipsism.

Ok, then you think I didn't get any results. It's a bit arbitrary to say that in a conversation about consciousness. Instead, you can argue your position, not try to belittle your interlocutor.