Forestluv
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Posts posted by Forestluv
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On 3/28/2024 at 5:52 PM, Javfly33 said:5-MeO is great but i wouldnt say "one dose and they are cured". 4weeks in 55%, 12 weeks 45%, well we all know that the percentage Will be going down once the weeks and months pass. We all been with psychedelics in that phase where we think It has cured us...
Weeks and months *already* passed. They released data for a 12 week follow up.
About half the patients were 'cured' in the sense that they no longer qualified has having depression, based on standard clinical tests for depression diagnoses.
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Today, Beckley psytech released initial results of a phase2a (mid-stage) clinical trial for treatment-resistant-depression using synthetic 5-meo-dmt.
To enter the study, participants must have clinical depression in which previous treatment options failed (such as SSRIs). Participants were given a single 10mg dose of 5-meo-dmt intranasally. 55% of patients were in remission at week 4 and 45% of patients were in remission at week 12.
This is the longest follow-up study for 5-meo-dmt. The sample size is small (12 patients), yet very encouraging. TRD is extremely difficult to treat, since standard treatments have already failed. 5-meo-dmt pretty much cured 50% of patients. Non-psychedelic treatments are nowhere close to this. The closest would be psilocybin - which has about a 35% success rate in clinical trials. Yet this involved multiple doses (two or three).
I find it interesting that a single 10mg dose was able to have such an effect. This seems like a relatively low dose (although it was intranasal, which may be a bit stronger than plugged).
As well, participants did not have to go through any lifestyle changes. They came into the clinic for two hours, received a single 5-meo dose and psychological support. And half the recipients were cured. . .
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On 10/22/2023 at 3:15 PM, HairyMystic said:His argument was, what if human beings have a limit to what they can be conscious off and that there is something beyond consciousness or an infinite mind itself? Something that we cannot put into words or understand at all.
Your friend has created a construct of absolute infinity which includes four components: 1) infinity includes “things” ,2) consciousness is awareness of things, 3) being conscious of this infinity would mean being aware of all things, 4) humans have a limit to what things they can be conscious of. . . Within the construct your friend created, they are correct: a human mind could not be conscious (aware) of all things.
There are many other constructs that could be created. For example, rather than “consciousness” meaning human awareness - we could create a construct in which “consciousness” is Everything (which is the same as Nothing). Now imagine a space of Nothing in which any thing can exist and appear. Here, the Awareness is not knowing and understanding every single thing that exists within infinity (your friend’s construct). Rather, the Awareness is of the infinite nature itself - both known and unknown to a human mind. Here, there is awareness that a human is within infinity and that a human mind knows of a subset of things within infinity. Within this construct, it is irrelevant whether the human mind knows about a thing, can explain a thing or understands a thing. In terms of things, a human mind would have knowledge / understanding of a minuscule percentage of infinite things (0.000000000000. . . . . .%. An infinite number of zeros). Yet there is awareness of the infinite nature itself.
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I haven't taken 5-meo-dmt for over a year, perhaps two years. Over the last week a got a sense it's time. Mind, body and spirit felt aligned toward it. I didn't even know if my stash in the refrigerator was even good anymore. So I decided to take 20mg - a dose that used to have a moderate effect on me.
In the past, 5-meo would dissolve everything into a state of clarity, a space of emptiness, of omniscience. Yet last night was very different. It was sooo different than ordinary reality. I can't create context with it because there is nothing similar here. It was like an alien world.
From a human perspective, the ramp up was ok. There was moderate physical discomfort, probably due to having a full stomach. Yet no mental struggles. Yet in terms of awareness the deepest part was mostly a black out. There was very little cognitive awareness. It wasn't until the come down that awareness began to return. There was awareness of so much, so unique. It felt like too much expansiveness, uniqueness. Thought arose that the mind cannot handle this much and the mind-body began to get anxious that it couldn't be handled. New awareness that there is a "me" and a "normal" mindspace somewhere. That "me" desired to return to it - yet the mind-body was unable to. There was a space in which psychosis entered and anything could have happened. The anxiety increased and I was very close to spiraling downward into an insane panic zone.
One thing that got me grounded, was an arising awareness that these are temporary effects that will wear off. Before this time, there was no sense of time. Yet now there was awareness that I was under the influence of a chemical which will wear off. Or, we could say that mental imagery / story was created. I looked at my watch: it was 9:23pm. Thoughts arose that this is 5-meo and the effects will lessen rapidly - perhaps in 10min, so hold on. It's amazing how much this helped the mind-body to settle down. There was a desire to do something normal to get grounded - like yoga. Yet I jut couldn't get into a semi-comfortable space.
Once there was a sense of being somewhat together, there was a desire to go outside for a walk. Then, I knew I was returning ok and there were thoughts like "Oh, my god. Wow! Oh, my god". Everything in this normal reality was seen differently. It seemed so odd that I live immersed in this reality and interact with it - as if that's all there is. . . There was a sense of gratitude that I was able to explore so far in consciousness. There was a sense of knowing that I ventured to a place very very few minds have. There is a sense of grounded confidence when I speak to others of mind and forms of reality - it's not theory. There is a sense of knowing that comes with direct experience.
From a personal perspective, most of the trip was in a blackout zone. And, most of the space with presence of mind was uncomfortable. Yet there was also something so fascinating and curious to an explorer of consciousness. Tonight, I do it again at half the dose. I'm curious if half the dose will give me access to last nights "realm" yet also allow presence of mind and a settled mind-body.
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I just realized I projected something I value onto another. I highly value awakenings that are transcendent and integrative. Yet for others, their intention may be realizations related to personal development and practical life issues.
I'm usually very in tune with encouraging others along their own path, whatever that may be. It's interesting to watch how my mind assumed that what I value is of inherent value. My intentions were good, yet I was on the wrong wavelength.
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@Scholar Thank you for reminding me that there are various flavors of "breakthrough". As you can sense, I'm oriented toward transcendent realizations. It's good to hear that you had breakthroughs relative to your intention of life purpose. I hope it continues to be a good tool for you.
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@Scholar The reason I returned and posted on the forum again was because I read your thread, reaching out during your trip. I got the sense you were on the verge of a major breakthrough and wanted to assist if I could. It turns out I was wrong. I wish you the best.
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When the self of self melts and becomes fluid, it can flow into new spaces - like a river.
In my mind space, there is awareness of patterns that arise - like certain types of behavior. For example, there is a pattern of uncomfortable feelings associated with being the center of attention in public spheres. As well, there is a pattern of opening up deeply with someone I resonated with. Even if I just met that person. However, there is no longer a self that identifies with those arisings. For example, there is no engagement with thoughts like "I don't like attention in public" or "I like to have deep conversations with others". Those thoughts may appear and I can say those things to others, yet the identification isn't there. And even if identification appeared, there is awareness of it.
The lack of identification opens up expansive space for exploration. Identification goes very deep into both conscious and subconscious mind spaces. What I describe next is quite simple, yet not easily accessible. . . If a mind space is not attached to a personal identity, it opens the possibility of many personal identities to arise. . . And curiosity is a key to experiencing and exploring that. For example, I watched a documentary about a woman with multiple personalities. I got so curious what that was like. Having a fluid mind means that the mind state of "me" watching "her" can exist or cease to exist. . .
The next day, I was hiking in nature and the mind space was clear. Then, different aspects of personality began to arise. If there was a strong sense of "me" these personality appearances would have seemed foreign and invasive. There might be anxiety and arising thoughts like "Where are these bizarre voices in my head coming from? How do I make them stop? Am I going crazy?". Yet with a fluid, curious mind those appearances are allowed to exist without resistance or fear. The allows for an experience of a mind with multiple personalities. . . Here, the mind's eye can learn what the experience is like and to observe how the mental dynamics work.
One thing I've learned is that there can be traps within personality dynamics. I have a good sense of being trapped within what would be considered "insane". It takes skill to enter that space and not get trapped. The trick is how deep I go. At first, I'd just dip my toes in then pull out. Yet over time, my mind has become fluid enough to let that personality structure go as well. It's sorta like having a dream in which you dream that you have multiple personalities. You wake up shaking and in tears because it was so real and you still believe you are insane. Then the mind realizes "Oh, it was just a dream. What a relief". Then there is a miraculous shift to the regular personality and there is no lasting effect. The person moves on with their day. Sometimes, I can do that in regular awake life. There is a "dream" during the day that becomes real - there is no questioning it - just like you wouldn't question whether is dream is real while sleeping.
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6 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:When was that (if it's not inappropriate to ask)?
Eight years ago.
Yet I've tripped many, many times since then. So I don't know if the contraction within a logical mindset would have eventually returned if I never tripped again. . . However, the second trip was about two months later and the consciousness shift was maintained. People that knew me were asking "What happened to you?". They sorta recognized "me", yet also recognized something was very different. Some were very curious, others were disturbed.
There were still some personality traits that persisted and I still had access to logical perspectives that I was previously was contracted within. To this day, I still have access and some of those logical creations are beautiful - like art. Yet they also have walls and sharp edges - that always get revealed to me. I quickly lose patience and interest with a mind that is confined within logic.
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4 hours ago, Razard86 said:Nah most logical types stay there unless immense suffering happens. The logical dream perspective is actually very hard to break out of lol because it is the most pervasive one there is. He would need to trip ALOT, and I mean a dose high enough to give him a breakthrough, and even then that won't be enough because he is going to need to realize that there is no difference between his trip and what we call regular reality.
Things rings true in my experience and observations. . . I was hardwired as logical before my first trip. I accidently overdosed 10X on that first trip and went so deep that the logical perspective was destroyed and couldn't be rebuilt.
You write about how there is no difference between trip and regular reality - this knowing / wisdom / embodiment can go very deep. As you are likely aware, it's not a logical understanding. I've seen so many logical types take ownership and contextualize a trip as an experience into their logical dream perspective. Here, the mind creates logical explanations of how dream and regular reality is the same - yet that isn't the deeper knowing / wisdom / embodiment.
For logical types, it does seem that repetitive high doses may be necessary. I've also noticed that if a logical mindset isn't smashed early, it can adapt and become stronger. If the mind can take ownership and contextualize a trip into it's previous logical narrative - it gets stronger - like a boxer that gets knocked out and then develops stronger defenses and resistance. In hindsight, I was fortunate to have accidently overdosed.
Regarding immense suffering. . . Those early trips involved some wonderfully blissful spaces - yet also some extremely difficult spaces as consciousness was being transformed. There are mind-body spaces so extraordinary it can put immense stress on the mind and body, including insanity zones. There was a time period of two weeks in which I couldn't work, drive a car or be around human beings. If so, I would have been put in a psychiatric unit. The only spaces I could dwell was solitary in my house and solitary in nature.
Conscious awareness and embodiment of a unified reality can open doors to areas few minds have access - yet there can also be issues from the perspective of regular human reality. Mind spaces can arise in which there is no distinction between tripping, dreaming and regular reality. For me, it initially caused intense anxiety and sometimes panic. I'd be at work and be unable to tell if this was a trip, dream or regular reality. . . Over time, I've learned to flow with it - yet it can some skill. Sometimes I need to create distinctions and modify behavior.
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If you have freebase and a dry herb vape, vape it t 430+ degrees. Smooth as silk.
To prevent 5meo residue from clogging my vape, I sprinkle the 5meo on some type of herb
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1 hour ago, OBEler said:@Forestluv whats the price to pay?
Had a first full breakthrough recently and it was easy. Felt complete normal after and was carrying on with my normal day
That’s awesome. I’ve had those as well. No entry fee needed? ?
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@Scholar I hope you get another opportunity ? ?
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1 minute ago, Scholar said:As you should be.
You didn’t fully breakthrough on your last trip.
If you continue with psychedelics, I’ll be curious to see how a true breakthrough trip unfolds for you. I’m talking about a breakthrough so deep there is no return to dwelling within the previous mind structure. You haven’t gone there yet. And you may choose to never go there. . . There is a price to pay. ? -
14 minutes ago, Scholar said:This translates to: Being stuck in L-Mode causes me suffering.
If thats a serious comment, I’m flabbergasted.
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@Scholar I’m not disagreeing with the constructs you’ve created. There is truth and value within those constructs. There is infinite exploration within that structure, yet for me it’s also limiting on other planes of expansion.
My mind is highly fluid, so I don’t resonate with definitions and statements of what is, is. To me, everything you stated of what IS above, is true within that framework. Yet it can also be dissolved, partially or fully. And then re-molded into many different forms.
I’m not saying you are wrong or another view is more right or better.
This thought below gives strong contrast among mindspaces.
27 minutes ago, Scholar said:By imagination you just mean existence.
First, this assumes a knowing of meaning for another. How do you know my meanings of “imagination” and “existence”? I’m not saying you are wrong. I’m saying it is a contracted mindspace. The idea is followed by a lengthy description of a structure to hold imagination and existence. There seems to be a lot of insights within that structure. I’d actually like to play around with some of the points you make, yet your descriptions seem very very restrictive. To me, there is a lot of rigid “this is how it is”. It’s brilliant within an area, yet it’s not how my mind works. My mind doesn’t like to dwell within solid constructs. It likes to continually create, de-create and re-create. Being beholden within a mind structure is like being in prison to me.
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7 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:@Forestluv Enough fairy tales, you are supposed to be a respectable scientist!
Haha, yes.
Years ago, I was a scientist trying to imagine being a mystic. Now I’m more of a mystic pretending I’m a scientist at work. So far my colleagues haven’t caught on to my act, yet they are vaguely aware something is going on behind the curtain. -
45 minutes ago, Scholar said:With imagination, you do not manifest through control, but rather through intention and believe. So, to visualize a cat, you have to convince yourself that you are seeing a cat. You don't actually create the cat by some direct means, rather, you simply imagine you were seeing the cat until you convinced your brain to such a degree that the cat appeared as a visual phenomenon in your mind's eye.
Though, the subconscious and dreamlike state cannot be controlled this way. It requires vision, intention and belief.
I can see how intention and belief could be used to develop a particular SuperNormal ability, yet this is not my area of SuperNormal ability. That type of intention and belief could allow entry into an area, yet would actually be a major block to me and prevent me from entry into the area I describe.
For example, there is no way I could enter a forest thinking “I believe this is a magical forest and I am a Shaman with SuperNatural powers. If I believe enough, it will manifest”. This won’t work for the space I describe since “Belief” assumes the unreal “appears” to be real because I tricked my mind to “believe” it’s real. Yet the space I describe is as real as any other real, so the dynamic of belief prevents entry, because a “real vs imagined” dynamic is created.
Rather, I would enter the forest and allow space for creation - and what arises, arises. If a magical forest appeared and I was a Shaman, thats as real as if I was walking through a “regular” forest with “ordinary” trees, birds, flowers and bees. They are both imaginary as well.
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51 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:Yeah, of course. You're tapping into the Infinite Imagination aspect of Consciousness. It's like a primodial soup of imagination and it tends to be very choatic, unlike the material dream.
In addition to chaotic spaces, there are spaces in which there are naturally flows. . . One time I was in a forest and the environment transformed into a mystical realm of dark magic, spells and ancestral spirits. This could have become very chaotic, yet it became a curious exploration in which I was shown a new way of relating to reality. A way many people have and do.
In addition to an Infinite Imagination aspect of Consciousness, this space can also include aspects of Infinite Insight, Wisdom and Understanding. ?
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13 hours ago, Leo Gura said:The higher degree of consciousness you reach, the more physical reality will melt before your eyes into a liquid mindscape.
Higher consciousness is liquid, lower consciousness is solid.
If you become conscious enough, your couch can literally melt into a talking dragon. This is a good example of what I mean by "higher consciousness".
You ain't really conscious until you start seeing dragons.
One time I became so conscious I started seeing dragons and demons crawling between the gaps in empty space. That's when things get interesting. That's when you really start to understand CONSCIOUSNESS.
I experience a curious aspect within these highly liquid realms: a curiosity of creation. With an underlying awareness of construct awareness, there can be a sense of being the creator of the dragons. Perhaps akin to the "Magician" level within Cook-Greuter's "Construct-Aware" stage. There is a sense of "me" creating, yet if that "me" tries to take more control, the creation is usually lost. I've discovered a few dynamics at play:
1) Complete dissolving of self and emergence of Creation that is appearing.
2) A sense of "Co-creation" in which there is a sense of self, yet also a Higher Self. This would be similar to a lucid dream in which the self realizes it's dreaming and begins co-creating with a Higher Dreamer. Yet there is a very fine balance. If the self tries to take too much control, the Co-creation is lost.
3) A sense of full control over the dream. As an example, one time I was doing Yin Yoga (long hold stretches) and went into the "Co-creation" realm. I noticed that I could start transforming the pain of the stretch into different forms. At first, the "I" surrendered into what was transforming and allowed it to happen. Yet the "I" gained the ability of limited control - as if it was a magic wand. Yet it wasn't something I could intentionally do, it was more of a gift / grace / higher wisdom. I then had full control and able to do whatever I wanted with the pain sensations. I transformed them into the texture and taste of chocolate. I transformed them to flairs emanating from my joints. I could make them chilly snowflakes or a warm whirlpool. . . When I eventually snapped out of it, I realized I held that posture for about an hour and went way too far. I was in severe pain and I must have strained tendons / ligaments / muscles - I was in pain for about a week. . . I'm convinced that I could have been naked under a pile of snow and felt no discomfort as I was creating. In this case, the saying "Don't forget the body" rings true.
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28 minutes ago, emil1234 said:The message has been haunting me for the past two years, and ive been trying to disprove it to myself in my head everyday, coming up with reasons for why it cant be true and so forth. However the trip kinda threw it right in my face like "haha how are you gonna disprove this?"
So in a lot of ways the reasons i decided to take the trip a week ago, was very much in order to disprove this former insight that I had.
To me, this looks like a contracted mindspace into binary thinking of either true or false. This can lead the mind to try and prove or disprove.
Another view is to go prior to the subconscious assumption of "That is either true or false". In the space prior to that assumption, the mind can see phenomena as itself - without labeling it or defining it. In this fluid state of consciousness, the phenomena can be seen as both true and false. . . of partial truths and partial falsities. There is also a mindsapce in which that all dissolves and there is an absence of true / false - where that interpretive lens doesn't exist.
Another framing of this would be the mind's desire to determine what is "real" and what is "imagined". Yet going prior, the real vs imagined distinction doesn't exist. There is simply what appears as "ISness".
At the human level, sense-making of what is "True / Real" vs "False / Imagined" has practical value since it is grounding and practical to the survival of the human mind-body. Yet it is also rigid / contracted and is a block to fluid / expansive states of consciousness.
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This thread has stimulated my mind. Below I share some ideas, based on experience. The ideas are both true and false, depending on the perceptive lens of the mind.
One mindspace dynamic is the mind trying to control the mental narrative. . . Struggling for control during a trip and trying to regain control after a trip. . . Such as trying to control the narrative of what an experience ‘means’ in logical, reasonable sense-making. This can help with grounding the mind-body and lead to the creation of many constructs - often quite insightful. Yet it is also a contracted mindstate and limits mind fluidity, exploration and being construct-aware.
There are many rational / logical realms that are amazing. There is infinite exploration within those realms - yet they can also have “guardrails” inhibiting broader exploration - especially for minds that like control of creating intellectual, logical constructs of reality. Venturing to the edge can be a “stretch zone” , venturing beyond it can be a “panic zone”. Ime, the key to breaking through barriers is surrender - both during and after a trip.
My first trip was solo with 5-aco-dmt. I wanted to do a light trip of 10mg, yet made a dosage error and took a mega 10X dose of 100mg. It went so far that that the “I” that controls logical sense-making of what “real” is never came back. From a personal perspective, its had both pros and cons - the mind can have an extraordinary ability to be fluid, imaginative, transcendently aware and to constuct-deconstruct. There exists a fluid “co-creation” with self and Self. Yet it can also be very difficult to communicate and relate to most people. Its also allowed amazing connections with a few people.
From a human perspective, highly intense trips can open breakthroughs, yet are more difficult to integrate and embody. They have the potential for unimaginable insight, expansion and neural plasticity- yet can also be very strenuous on the physical mind and body - in particular, the nervous system. Similar to exercise. . . Moderate exercise and occasional intense exercise is healthy stress on the body - yet too much intense exercise can cause injury and takes a toll on the body.
These days, my mind is so fluid that it can venture “way out there” on its own, with shamanic breathing or a light-moderate psychedelic dose. Yet at times, I still need to remind myself “Don’t forget the body” when venturing beyond.
Regarding trip sitting: Imo, if the biggest worry for two novices is how to stay calm and kill a trip if intense terror arises - they should drastically reduce the dosage. In many cases, novices should be cautious when wielding magic wands that have extraordinary power.
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@mr_engineer I agree that creating standards involves biases and can be difficult, yet that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t do it. Creating laws also involves biases, yet that doesn’t mean we should have no laws.
My point was not that creating standards is bias-free and agenda-free. That certainly is an issue in creating standards. My original point was that having zero barriers paradoxically reduces maximum free speech free speech potential as does having too many barriers.
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9 hours ago, Mada_ said:Twitter's mission statement reads "to give everyone the power to create and share ideas and information instantly without barriers."
That sounds good idealistically. Yet paradoxically, having no barriers reduces the overall power for everyone to create and share ideas.
People often have an either / or mindset in which there must be either maximum 100% moderation or 0% moderation. Yet it is more nuanced. Too many barriers, as well as too few barriers, will reduce overall power to create and share ideas.
in Psychedelics
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Yesterday I received my first shipment of Malt and will try it this weekend.
I agree that 5meo is great for consciousness work. I can also see it stimulating transcendent experiences and deep insights, which could relate to healing.
Along the love- lines. There are ongoing clinical trials with MMDA (also a love drug), which has shown effectiveness with TRD and PTSD.