ValiantSalvatore

@Jodistrict Here you go from the author himself. So much stuff get's lost in context. Yes it's Vipassana and not only Vipasanna. As he system of teaching or his teachings is called Unified Mindfulness which emphasises mahsi style vipassana and also includes other traditions the other importance he stresses even more at higher levels is expansions and contractions and his experiences with creating his style of teaching. https://www.shinzen.org/from-vipassana-to-zen/

@Jodistrict UM is a bit broader to say it's only Vipassana yes that is true yet he categorizes it as a mixture between rinzai zen and vispasanna currently as far as I know. Did not work with him years ago where all of this was still cooking. The documents from him and Wiki explain this IIRC.

@Salvijus Yes and how do they differ to someone not practicing your technique there are similarties. I did kriya yoga and you can compare it to shinzens flow and expansion and contraction technique and add a zen practice and the only thing different would be it's exclusive emphasis on different parts of the chakra system as well as body parts and movements. Mudras, Yandras everything can help it depends. In that sense context and experience matters a lot. issue is it's often not properly conveyed imo. and compared. I am giving my best here I did kriya yoga only for 2 months as it was to rigorous even more than zen. Doing it for 3h a day at the end is to much I liked the practice a lot. You can compare the energetic kriya component of kriya to Shinzen flow and working with flow and energies of the body in sight,sound,touch,space. It has a more borad exclusive emphasis and not and inclusive narrow emphasis which both can be utilized with both techniques IMO. Kriya Yoga has so many. Shinzens fits my highly modern lifestyle more as the wording is very appealing to me and simple as well as complex enough. Kriya Yoga was very technical in it's own sense with working with body movements more, breathing etc. I also had what people would call a kundalini awakening IIRC from doing zen meditation but I never did kundalini meditations or smth. like this. It would help to have more discussions that are based on experience and are sincerely considered without a hateful, spiteful, greedy and or non-serious manner. Dunno what he says about this but I'd rate him above Ingram and Ingram says he is a full arhat as far as I know. I don't think Ingram has an inch of what Shinzen actually has embodied. like not even close maybe like 2% close for him 10%.

@Salvijus Shinzen is definitely above a stream enterer the desire to meditate is gone and other charateristics. You can obviously just do it, yet consciouness is just something different. There is no real technique in that sense this is what I believe it's like hearing stories of WWII where people have realized permant enlightenment non-dualy as they were shocked to death basically and their "ego" is gone. Their level of realization now is legit, yet how do you compare it to others to gain clarity similar to Eckhart Tolle's story for example suddenly seeing white light and entering it is a common description in many paths from muslim I bet to christian etc and is an indication of a casual state experience IIRC. So a christain and a vispasanna practicionars have the same degress of realization through different practices and might use different words. Imo Wilber did a great job making ready to use distinctions here. So even let's say TIER 4 can be easily speculated IMO. I don't know them by heart. Of course the practice matters more. Just having spiritual concepts is useful even when they are not 100% correct and accurate. It helps to have a sense of direction.

To be quiet frank Shinzen is definitely not meditating anymore to any of the standards described here or impression people have. Like did you guys read 0 books? Hope this spirit of truth still remains. This is meant positive lol!

@Salvijus No, there are multiple questions. Also asking open questions leaves for a lot of room for interpretation which is good imo. Their teaching style and technique emphasis creates differnt auras and energies no? Which would be one cause for their difference in energy. In that sense style matters. That is what I explained and I showed commonalties as people focus on differences although there are plenty commonalities. The issue is when you want to compare traditions and techniques. The realizations matter more than the experience so it's actually permanent and they seem to differ between tradtions the experience is the gateway into the realization. Then the issue is what tradition gives me what degree of realization for example vispassana having it limits at casual relaziation of non-form IIRC is the content and context of the realization. Let's take a christain as a prime who practices johns prayer of XYZ technique (IIRC there is some effective christian method with that name) which has an emphasis on loving kindness but reaches non-dual realizations. Now it's clear that one entity is has realization X at stage X with content X because of tradition X. This goes for every tradition/technique/method. I find common language for permanent realizations in higher and lower order is missing to make proper distinctions between realizations and to properly understand for example: "Oh Teacher A is talking about an experience in permanent realization/structure-stage/embodyment stage/ Y. There seems to be a confusion between realizations and experience imo in general. For example for me it would be intersting to see. Sadghuru: Traditions: Vibe: Compassioante Structure-stage level: non-dual Random Person X on Forum: Vibe: Cognitive Structure-stage level: casual state Tradition: Goenka vipassana Most prominent quality: As well as discussion with more conceptual use that is moderated at best by moderators to facillitate what Leo wants to teach in terms of spirituality. For example an arhat IIRC means the person has non-dual realization. So you could use the term arhat to say both Shinzen have arhat levels of awakening as well as Sadghuru meaning they are non-dualy realied. Again the issu is conceptual you can have smaller degress of permanent awakening apparently like the casual state. I am stating there is an issue with wording that could lead to clarification issues. If people would use common or more common spiritual language like arhat, non-dual, god-realization, dream state, casual state, psychic state etc. So there would be less confusion, missunderstanding and unneccessary wars. I hope I brought my points across that common conceptual spiritual terms could be used instead of personalized experience to represent a more accurate picture of the realizations. As you'd be forced to make percise distinctions which many do not want to do. I find it for example confusing to read the questions and than answer to I know guru x he is such a charming and loveable character I'd attend any retreat with him. That is good feedback, yet it does not really serve the purpose of making proper distinctions imo. Maybe I am thinking to far ahead, but I imagined this years ago as this would be very cool, to see a bit more turquioise as turquioise communities are highly conceptual. Something like this a list of concepts and characteristics would be cool that can be associated with spiritual attainments and realizations for example. I do this myself so I know most stuff is already mapped. Reading Leo's list the discussions here I don't think many read books from his list. I won't deny it's technical as hell. So yeah.... @Salvijus I am a guy. I did not know that Salvijus means Salvatore in Italy or italian? I know what Salvatore means to some extent I still like the name just hate the guy.

@Salvijus No it's a name of a friend lol I once liked we are not friends anymore. It's a very common pattern also unfortunately.

I never meet both of them in person as they live to far away I've been following Shinzen for about 6 years approx. now as he was the only one making meditation available for me on demand pratically with highly comptent no b.s people. Shinzen has a bit of a rigorous approach that might does not appeal to westerne standars sometimes he is one of the people I'd say where the threshhold beginns of saying this is serious spiritual practice and not my wo-wo teaching group only. As he emphasis retreats a lot and he is teaching meditation forever. I particiapated at least approx 20-30+ micro retreats of 2-3 days over the past 6 years or more as this was one of the only things available to me in terms of retreats. Yoga seems more comfy and less dry but more effort. I interacted with a deeply enlightend soto zen master for western standards let's say who also had more of this tougher eastern approach mindset. A lot of sort of healthy tough love attitude that I find in Zen is lost through the emphasis of the western mindset of wanting everything comfy so a bit of this is lost. I did an introduction course from Sadghurus yoga and I pretty much have every audiobook spoken by him and listend to it's full duration not including retention. So I have definitely a good amount of exposure to what sadghuru wants to teach I dunno how often I was tearing up when listening to him. They definitely have both a different approach towards compassion. I'd agree with @Consilience that Shinzen has a lot of joy his inner child in a sense is so happy and bouncing you would not believe it as well as his wit and solution oriented advice. Also he combined dry burmese vipassana and rinzai zen from mahsi and IIRC his roshi sasaki roshi. I am unsure how advanced his techniques are some I can't follow for very long that are more in the rinzai-zen direction like expansion and contraction techniques and gones.I am not familar with both traditions outside Shinzens context so it's definitely a different kind of practice than what people would imagine and I do believe it can lead to deeper realizations especially if they take the practice seriously. Also his techniques go very far and also similar to Sadghuru goes into the area of high performance. A lot of high performance workers enjoy Shinzen content many people with phd's or impressive academic records and life stories. That is also very inspiring. He also rates himself as a person because people critiqued this about him in the past as someone who is on the dry side of compassion, somehow in the sense of compassion is the healer arts. He compared himself in the video to a surgeon and his healers art and he certainly has that quality. It's not easy to describe imgaine a doctor/nurse/rescue service stiching a wound and after that you notice that you are healed. He is very good at that finding the sweat spot and helping with whatever you need while being very uplifting and inspiring himself. That is sort of shinzens approach to compassion from what I notice and practiced. He does emphasis and include loving kindness meditation in his own system as a vipassana pratice and it definitely works it's a very active style of meditation you have to do a lot in a sense as you label anything. As well as the techniques are endless I don't even want to explore all of them because of how deep they seem. ---- Sadghuru I have less experience with only that what I mentioned. He definitely seems to be more expressive and warm by nature or genetics than Shinzen, Shinzen definitely seems like a person who had to deal with fear more. If we ask about the human side. Which will also coincide with technique choice and teacher preference. Reading Wilber ROT different techniques produce different results vispassana can only lead to casual states of "enlightenment" and won't bring you to non-duality apparently / non-dual embodyment. What I find is that generally yoga people are very much intune with their kinesthetic intelligence especially how it is marketed in the west. Doing kriya yoga for exampled showed me how serious yoga can be done and not what is marketed to the west, altough I find their level of realization is to much in the plain of beign human. Sadghuru like Shinzen combines a lot of Yoga practices seemingly so there is a unification of enlightenment and people create commonalities etc. you can clearly tell this from his talks and books by both. I did hatha yoga, suriya kriya and upa yoga in his online course although the focus was on the theoretical aspects of it and had not all to many practices. Both also love science. In terms of realizations I did not read a single word in the entire thread that would help me clarify as well as explore stuff as I see some issues on the technical side of things, yet I'd personally say Sadghuru is one if not the most enlightend person on earth publically known. With including people in the scene like Adyashanti/Ralston/Young/Kahn/Tolle maybe the Dalai Lama or Mingyur Ringpoche is at such a deep level of realization. I don't think Shinzen can compare to someones level of awakening who grew up in the east and started very young. Shinzen started at 25 and went hardcore. Sadghuru was always like ever since he was born he self-reports this also. Sadghuru seems to me to be one woke "beep" and I can only say after following 6 years of Shinzens work as much as I could he could not compare to Sadghuru. People who generally talk about re-incarnation and are actively spiritual praticioners etc. and more of this sidhi stuff some to be on a different level. Maybe Shinzen has 10% of what Sadghuru has and Ralston 20-25 and vice-versa approx to diminish bias without testing. Shinzen was also initiated in the shingon tradition of Vajrayana and tells crazy visual experiences with what they did there. I never heard someone here speak for example about this tradition and it's techniques and effects. Conceptual common language is really missing here yet if I'd go by what I know I'd put Sadghuru 1 max 2 stages above where Shinzen is when Shinzen is at non-dual and sadghuru is at non-dual I'd say sadghuru is one level deeper. Excluding lower TIER 3 realizations as dream,casual state etc. As well as my experience to higher TIER 3 realms is limited. So I can't really talk about it and usually it's biased towards the teacher. Shinzen is not that friendly with himself either I believe in terms of still wanting growth and impacting with his work. I'd personally say after talking to him a couple of times he has enough humility to admit Sadghuru is on a deeper level if it truely is the case. And I think both would be wise enough to not bother about it. Besides if it's for technical clarification or exploration.

I see. Thanks for pointing that out that is fantastic! Sometimes I get the impression to not even do it at all because it's not a tool for the highest levels. I get what is meant overall. Thanks for providing indirect feedback in that sense!

By which method is it possible to access higher dimensions besides psychdelics are psychdelics themselves a tool for what you'd deem higher dimensions of consciouness? Also my experience with psychcedelics and meditation retreats differ. Ulitmately I don't know what is possible and I am still curious as to what method allows access to higher dimensions of consciouness. With better health I am pretty confident I can fully follow what you want to teach even when I fail alot and form an understanding of what you'd call god-realization. I barely had any of these experiences besides maybe small tastes, so I'd like to experience it directly a couple of times so I know what the work ultimately is about. I soon will do DMT and explore that route for consciouness expanding tools/methods. Obviously also with meditation as it just helps me personally.

@Jannes They include the test results for metals inside their product. Some sellers do this. That is intersting! I saw the number one product often in stores or gyms I would have never bought the product lol as I thought it is some cheap whey powder how ironic. Thank you for sharing the information! It's suprising to me they still do not recommend it to athletes. I hope the test was not very expensive lol, guess for health wealth matters more. Jokes aside hope this is enough info and you can gain value from it.

@Jannes That is an interesting question I don't even know how to google for it properly. I know some sellers include their test IIRC I asked Michael what the results mean for the metal tests. I don't want to give out false information as well as Michael seemed to have changed his mind on stuff and I am not a health expert so I tread with caution. https://www.amazon.de/Nutri-Plus-Shape-Shake-Vegan-Vanille/dp/B00JWLH5UQ/ref=sr_1_8?keywords=vegan+protein&qid=1657390036&sprefix=vegan+%2Caps%2C176&sr=8-8 Apparently a lot of tests are also done in the U.S and they apparently have very bad regulations that battery acid can land in your ketchup. Found the eu-regulations and skimmed the documents I did not find any values. They are just stating they should take measures according to some data they found that is concerning. https://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=OJ:L:2006:364:0005:0024:DE:PDF The American and German situation is supposed to be similar when I Google in German I found this article. That seems quiet insightful as it explains what even the metals cause for issues. https://www.consumerreports.org/cro/2012/04/protein-drinks/index.htm Would also like to see the regulated value that the seller can include in their product. A solution is if the product/seller posts lab results you can easily look up what level of g,mg etc of metal X is toxic and how much of that is contained for example per 100g of vegan protein powder. Then see if it is worth it. I am honest I trusted others also so I never looked that deeply in to it, yet looked for advice. I just made sure it's soy protein and not WHEY or rather plant based instead of animal based. I eat animals I don't really need them in my shake also lol. Found an article with all the infos. It's categorized also as supplement the seller I posted has a picture of the regulation. The article has even more info... https://www.laves.niedersachsen.de/startseite/lebensmittel/lebensmittelgruppen/nahrungserganzungsmittel/schwermetalle-in-ayurvedischen-nahrungsergaenzungsmitteln-164611.html#:~:text=Die Europäische Union (EU) hat,Produkte dürfen nicht vermarktet werden. https://www.gmp-navigator.com/gmp-news/neue-grenzwerte-fuer-schwermetalle-in-nahrungsergaenzungsmitteln --- Yeah sounds like an enjoyable breakfast I like it also for breakfast especially because it's a protein source and it takes longer to digest as well as the associated feeling of satiety is awesome. Love it when my stomach is full for 3-4h with a full breakfast with protein sources in general.

@something_else You're welcome!

@something_else Dunno I posted the kit as a solution to gauge the potency of a tab. Could very well be that it had less and also if you trip multiple times in a week for example the dose will be less intense because of tolerance. It's difficult to trust the information fully out there I'd be cautious and see what works etc. I did not even know a potency test existed before this thread was opened. I'd say your experience sounds normal. Hopefully you are not to bummed out I need for example more than 250ug to trip balls. 400-600 IIRC. 200ug was good yet not satisfiying to me. Sometimes sensetivity varied and I needed less, yet 400+ IIRC. 2 tabs max 3 and I was tripping deeply imo.

As a vegan product in Germany that is cheap and has a short ingredient list I use this, when I can. It's tasty I am not the ultimate health nut the ingredient list is very short basically 4 ingredients. I am unsure how toxic the brand could be. https://de.theproteinworks.com/soy-protein-90-isolate I like to use powders as I have to admit I am not the best at cooking at alot of recepies I wanted to cook. They don't have the ingredients in the store from the program I bought. Did not find a heavy metal test for this brand. I talked to Michael a while ago and as I wanted to take them I showed him a few brands that seemed okay. This is apparently the nr.1 seller for powder according to a German site from the U.K. I tested and liked their products from the vegan section all soy protein powder. A second opinion would be cool.

@something_else Same definitely would like to test for example the sellers products for potency so I know where to buy basically and I don't get scammed. So the link might come in handy in the neat future etc. Yes, I'd need more trips to fully make distinctions can recommend 1P-LSD if you are into visuals internally I was seeing beautiful intricate geometry when I closed my eyes. PRO-LAD was the worst it's also the weakest IIRC in terms of potency. AL-LAD was also great for beginners also somewhat still one of my favs as it had a very mild on-set and still had plenty of depth. I can't find the article with the comparision of the newer more common derivates likes ETH-LAD, AL-LAD, ALD-52, 1P-LSD, PRO-LAD, LSD and a couple of others IIRC ETH-LAD was the strongest and PRO-LAD the weakest. I personally would agree with their rating. 1P-LSD is supposed to be as strong as LSD or even stronger or slightly milder (medium potency - both average in potency/overall strength). I never tried the original LSD. This might help in case you wonder about any issues it could be that it's a different type of LSD etc. PRO-LAD was definitely weaker and I had to take more IIRC. There also seems to be an american version of the testing kit that is partned with the German company. https://saferpsyche.org/#research

As far as I know it's usally 70-100% accurate from reading in terms of potency of the tab. This information is from reddit. I'd also test tolerance levels from when you have last taken the substance so you can compare multiple scenarios. For example if you want to take the same dose when tolerance is still on you need more so the 250ug tab could have the effect of a 100ug tab. https://codepen.io/cyberoxide/full/BaNarGd I had multiple LSD derivates varying in potency it would be more interesting for you I'd say to know what type of LSD it is for example ETH-LAD is stronger than 1P-LSD and PRO-LAD as well as normal LSD as far as I know and has also a different effect. Some more visual, some more body high etc. All derivates I had had approx 200-250ug so I never tested something less. Also from all the offers I have seen LSD seems to be a psychedelic that can easily be produced and sold in masses. So I don't think the seller needs to scam people. I barely see bad reviews also. I'd definitely test the tab to make sure it's okay etc. etc. Trusting gut instinct is okay usually it plays out like I expect then when it's a strong instinct. Max I took I think was 700-900UG with tolerance. Also genetics matter apparently maybe more than I think. 1P-LSD blew my mind away and ETH-LAD was supposed to be very strong, yet it was only comparable to 1P-LSD to me a bit. I also thought these tabs were way to strong from all the 1P-LSD trips I made from that blotter pack in that sense. I also found this just now. As I am unsure how common potency tests are they seem to have developed some solutions, it's to expensive for me so I won't use it. The article is also interesting as it has a more conservative estimate/test of what sellers put in their tabs when advertised. https://www.trippingly.net/lsd-studies/psychedelic-potency-tests-are-here-and-they-work https://www.startnext.com/en/miraculix There are multiple tests for potencies availabile from their crowd-funding company. If I read the article correctly it's a German company and they also do this for MDMA Shrooms and obviously also LSD.

Yeah you can definitely lol.

Does a single puff really last 10 minutes when I puff from the vape? Is it possible to have breakthrough experiences or god realizations through vaping strong and even mild doses of dmt?

How much DMT do you guys mix per ml of vape juice approx? What are good dosage rates for example 1g of DMT in 3ml vape juice? I've read there are many variables so dosages can vary by vape device used is 1g of DMT for example in 2-3ml of vape juice a lot or normal. Also does a single puff really last 10 minutes? I've find this is quiet long especially as you can take multiple hits and intensify the experience. That is why I am asking about the dosage also. I read most information on Erowid and others forums about ratios and how much MG they estimate they take on average per puff when the DMT is vaped.

@Devin Yes agree.

@Devin That is why you have an army and in general military defence for a state/country. I don't know what the security protocols entails.

I dunno I smoke sometimes during phases a lot for 2-4 months max and then I stop. https://integrisok.com/resources/on-your-health/2021/february/impacts-of-chronic-marijuana-use For me when I do it very long all of this becomes truer, yet not abusing it for years I think is just better.

Same I don't find it weird also it's insane how a terrorist organisation can do that, even if you dig up the history and correct human error from all sides possible. Injustices etc. That a small group of people can attack a large first world nation in that sense and cause damage is insane. Also that the nation feels threatend to such extent of it's power that it declares it as a tragey. From any stragic point possible they had to take measures and that alone is quiet insane. Seeing how terrorism sort of becomes more normalized for individuals is also not good. Like mass shootings, mass hit and runs or random attacks with acid, nail bombs etc. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patriot_Day They keep changing laws apparently also when it is and is not. I don't think this has anything to do with Muslims and I bet most would agree with that. I would also never associated the attack with a religon more as an act of power to gain power. As any religion this organsiation used was only a means to gain power and cause damage, threats etc. I think ressources are spent better on peoples growth instead of killing them. Any rage, hate, fear used against muslims in association with 9-11 is absolute horseshit. I don't understand how people could ever relate the two and make it the main culprit.

@OBEler I dunno what is possible I am highly skeptical of this I dunno if there are shamans or something for this stuff with healing plant medicine or so. I'd definitely check in with your friend to see what he even wants and then find the appropriate medicine if possible through a plant healer. Basically the right kind of information I dunno I'd proceed with caution in terms of delusion I mean nothing is really happening to the leg when he takes the psychdelic, but he could for instance have a bad trip because of it or the opposite. I'd really think you'd clarify what issue or obstacle your friend has with his leg and then find a solution for that particular wish. For e.g walking faster during recovery or so. If you really want to help your friend I think this could be good advice and if he is older and has experience with psychdelics he could try. I mean your leg won't fall off from consuming psyches. Hmm... thinking about it if it increases body awarness it should he should at least be able to de-tangle the uncomfortable sensations associated broken leg and feel the part that is injured could be quiet emotional. Really don't know what is possible I'd be curious too if it's possible to heal something more severe in a safe way.