ValiantSalvatore

@Salvijus No, there are multiple questions. Also asking open questions leaves for a lot of room for interpretation which is good imo. Their teaching style and technique emphasis creates differnt auras and energies no? Which would be one cause for their difference in energy. In that sense style matters. That is what I explained and I showed commonalties as people focus on differences although there are plenty commonalities. The issue is when you want to compare traditions and techniques. The realizations matter more than the experience so it's actually permanent and they seem to differ between tradtions the experience is the gateway into the realization. Then the issue is what tradition gives me what degree of realization for example vispassana having it limits at casual relaziation of non-form IIRC is the content and context of the realization. Let's take a christain as a prime who practices johns prayer of XYZ technique (IIRC there is some effective christian method with that name) which has an emphasis on loving kindness but reaches non-dual realizations. Now it's clear that one entity is has realization X at stage X with content X because of tradition X. This goes for every tradition/technique/method. I find common language for permanent realizations in higher and lower order is missing to make proper distinctions between realizations and to properly understand for example: "Oh Teacher A is talking about an experience in permanent realization/structure-stage/embodyment stage/ Y. There seems to be a confusion between realizations and experience imo in general. For example for me it would be intersting to see. Sadghuru: Traditions: Vibe: Compassioante Structure-stage level: non-dual Random Person X on Forum: Vibe: Cognitive Structure-stage level: casual state Tradition: Goenka vipassana Most prominent quality: As well as discussion with more conceptual use that is moderated at best by moderators to facillitate what Leo wants to teach in terms of spirituality. For example an arhat IIRC means the person has non-dual realization. So you could use the term arhat to say both Shinzen have arhat levels of awakening as well as Sadghuru meaning they are non-dualy realied. Again the issu is conceptual you can have smaller degress of permanent awakening apparently like the casual state. I am stating there is an issue with wording that could lead to clarification issues. If people would use common or more common spiritual language like arhat, non-dual, god-realization, dream state, casual state, psychic state etc. So there would be less confusion, missunderstanding and unneccessary wars. I hope I brought my points across that common conceptual spiritual terms could be used instead of personalized experience to represent a more accurate picture of the realizations. As you'd be forced to make percise distinctions which many do not want to do. I find it for example confusing to read the questions and than answer to I know guru x he is such a charming and loveable character I'd attend any retreat with him. That is good feedback, yet it does not really serve the purpose of making proper distinctions imo. Maybe I am thinking to far ahead, but I imagined this years ago as this would be very cool, to see a bit more turquioise as turquioise communities are highly conceptual. Something like this a list of concepts and characteristics would be cool that can be associated with spiritual attainments and realizations for example. I do this myself so I know most stuff is already mapped. Reading Leo's list the discussions here I don't think many read books from his list. I won't deny it's technical as hell. So yeah.... @Salvijus I am a guy. I did not know that Salvijus means Salvatore in Italy or italian? I know what Salvatore means to some extent I still like the name just hate the guy.

@Salvijus No it's a name of a friend lol I once liked we are not friends anymore. It's a very common pattern also unfortunately.

I never meet both of them in person as they live to far away I've been following Shinzen for about 6 years approx. now as he was the only one making meditation available for me on demand pratically with highly comptent no b.s people. Shinzen has a bit of a rigorous approach that might does not appeal to westerne standars sometimes he is one of the people I'd say where the threshhold beginns of saying this is serious spiritual practice and not my wo-wo teaching group only. As he emphasis retreats a lot and he is teaching meditation forever. I particiapated at least approx 20-30+ micro retreats of 2-3 days over the past 6 years or more as this was one of the only things available to me in terms of retreats. Yoga seems more comfy and less dry but more effort. I interacted with a deeply enlightend soto zen master for western standards let's say who also had more of this tougher eastern approach mindset. A lot of sort of healthy tough love attitude that I find in Zen is lost through the emphasis of the western mindset of wanting everything comfy so a bit of this is lost. I did an introduction course from Sadghurus yoga and I pretty much have every audiobook spoken by him and listend to it's full duration not including retention. So I have definitely a good amount of exposure to what sadghuru wants to teach I dunno how often I was tearing up when listening to him. They definitely have both a different approach towards compassion. I'd agree with @Consilience that Shinzen has a lot of joy his inner child in a sense is so happy and bouncing you would not believe it as well as his wit and solution oriented advice. Also he combined dry burmese vipassana and rinzai zen from mahsi and IIRC his roshi sasaki roshi. I am unsure how advanced his techniques are some I can't follow for very long that are more in the rinzai-zen direction like expansion and contraction techniques and gones.I am not familar with both traditions outside Shinzens context so it's definitely a different kind of practice than what people would imagine and I do believe it can lead to deeper realizations especially if they take the practice seriously. Also his techniques go very far and also similar to Sadghuru goes into the area of high performance. A lot of high performance workers enjoy Shinzen content many people with phd's or impressive academic records and life stories. That is also very inspiring. He also rates himself as a person because people critiqued this about him in the past as someone who is on the dry side of compassion, somehow in the sense of compassion is the healer arts. He compared himself in the video to a surgeon and his healers art and he certainly has that quality. It's not easy to describe imgaine a doctor/nurse/rescue service stiching a wound and after that you notice that you are healed. He is very good at that finding the sweat spot and helping with whatever you need while being very uplifting and inspiring himself. That is sort of shinzens approach to compassion from what I notice and practiced. He does emphasis and include loving kindness meditation in his own system as a vipassana pratice and it definitely works it's a very active style of meditation you have to do a lot in a sense as you label anything. As well as the techniques are endless I don't even want to explore all of them because of how deep they seem. ---- Sadghuru I have less experience with only that what I mentioned. He definitely seems to be more expressive and warm by nature or genetics than Shinzen, Shinzen definitely seems like a person who had to deal with fear more. If we ask about the human side. Which will also coincide with technique choice and teacher preference. Reading Wilber ROT different techniques produce different results vispassana can only lead to casual states of "enlightenment" and won't bring you to non-duality apparently / non-dual embodyment. What I find is that generally yoga people are very much intune with their kinesthetic intelligence especially how it is marketed in the west. Doing kriya yoga for exampled showed me how serious yoga can be done and not what is marketed to the west, altough I find their level of realization is to much in the plain of beign human. Sadghuru like Shinzen combines a lot of Yoga practices seemingly so there is a unification of enlightenment and people create commonalities etc. you can clearly tell this from his talks and books by both. I did hatha yoga, suriya kriya and upa yoga in his online course although the focus was on the theoretical aspects of it and had not all to many practices. Both also love science. In terms of realizations I did not read a single word in the entire thread that would help me clarify as well as explore stuff as I see some issues on the technical side of things, yet I'd personally say Sadghuru is one if not the most enlightend person on earth publically known. With including people in the scene like Adyashanti/Ralston/Young/Kahn/Tolle maybe the Dalai Lama or Mingyur Ringpoche is at such a deep level of realization. I don't think Shinzen can compare to someones level of awakening who grew up in the east and started very young. Shinzen started at 25 and went hardcore. Sadghuru was always like ever since he was born he self-reports this also. Sadghuru seems to me to be one woke "beep" and I can only say after following 6 years of Shinzens work as much as I could he could not compare to Sadghuru. People who generally talk about re-incarnation and are actively spiritual praticioners etc. and more of this sidhi stuff some to be on a different level. Maybe Shinzen has 10% of what Sadghuru has and Ralston 20-25 and vice-versa approx to diminish bias without testing. Shinzen was also initiated in the shingon tradition of Vajrayana and tells crazy visual experiences with what they did there. I never heard someone here speak for example about this tradition and it's techniques and effects. Conceptual common language is really missing here yet if I'd go by what I know I'd put Sadghuru 1 max 2 stages above where Shinzen is when Shinzen is at non-dual and sadghuru is at non-dual I'd say sadghuru is one level deeper. Excluding lower TIER 3 realizations as dream,casual state etc. As well as my experience to higher TIER 3 realms is limited. So I can't really talk about it and usually it's biased towards the teacher. Shinzen is not that friendly with himself either I believe in terms of still wanting growth and impacting with his work. I'd personally say after talking to him a couple of times he has enough humility to admit Sadghuru is on a deeper level if it truely is the case. And I think both would be wise enough to not bother about it. Besides if it's for technical clarification or exploration.

I see. Thanks for pointing that out that is fantastic! Sometimes I get the impression to not even do it at all because it's not a tool for the highest levels. I get what is meant overall. Thanks for providing indirect feedback in that sense!

By which method is it possible to access higher dimensions besides psychdelics are psychdelics themselves a tool for what you'd deem higher dimensions of consciouness? Also my experience with psychcedelics and meditation retreats differ. Ulitmately I don't know what is possible and I am still curious as to what method allows access to higher dimensions of consciouness. With better health I am pretty confident I can fully follow what you want to teach even when I fail alot and form an understanding of what you'd call god-realization. I barely had any of these experiences besides maybe small tastes, so I'd like to experience it directly a couple of times so I know what the work ultimately is about. I soon will do DMT and explore that route for consciouness expanding tools/methods. Obviously also with meditation as it just helps me personally.

@Jannes They include the test results for metals inside their product. Some sellers do this. That is intersting! I saw the number one product often in stores or gyms I would have never bought the product lol as I thought it is some cheap whey powder how ironic. Thank you for sharing the information! It's suprising to me they still do not recommend it to athletes. I hope the test was not very expensive lol, guess for health wealth matters more. Jokes aside hope this is enough info and you can gain value from it.

@Jannes That is an interesting question I don't even know how to google for it properly. I know some sellers include their test IIRC I asked Michael what the results mean for the metal tests. I don't want to give out false information as well as Michael seemed to have changed his mind on stuff and I am not a health expert so I tread with caution. https://www.amazon.de/Nutri-Plus-Shape-Shake-Vegan-Vanille/dp/B00JWLH5UQ/ref=sr_1_8?keywords=vegan+protein&qid=1657390036&sprefix=vegan+%2Caps%2C176&sr=8-8 Apparently a lot of tests are also done in the U.S and they apparently have very bad regulations that battery acid can land in your ketchup. Found the eu-regulations and skimmed the documents I did not find any values. They are just stating they should take measures according to some data they found that is concerning. https://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=OJ:L:2006:364:0005:0024:DE:PDF The American and German situation is supposed to be similar when I Google in German I found this article. That seems quiet insightful as it explains what even the metals cause for issues. https://www.consumerreports.org/cro/2012/04/protein-drinks/index.htm Would also like to see the regulated value that the seller can include in their product. A solution is if the product/seller posts lab results you can easily look up what level of g,mg etc of metal X is toxic and how much of that is contained for example per 100g of vegan protein powder. Then see if it is worth it. I am honest I trusted others also so I never looked that deeply in to it, yet looked for advice. I just made sure it's soy protein and not WHEY or rather plant based instead of animal based. I eat animals I don't really need them in my shake also lol. Found an article with all the infos. It's categorized also as supplement the seller I posted has a picture of the regulation. The article has even more info... https://www.laves.niedersachsen.de/startseite/lebensmittel/lebensmittelgruppen/nahrungserganzungsmittel/schwermetalle-in-ayurvedischen-nahrungsergaenzungsmitteln-164611.html#:~:text=Die Europäische Union (EU) hat,Produkte dürfen nicht vermarktet werden. https://www.gmp-navigator.com/gmp-news/neue-grenzwerte-fuer-schwermetalle-in-nahrungsergaenzungsmitteln --- Yeah sounds like an enjoyable breakfast I like it also for breakfast especially because it's a protein source and it takes longer to digest as well as the associated feeling of satiety is awesome. Love it when my stomach is full for 3-4h with a full breakfast with protein sources in general.

@something_else You're welcome!

@something_else Dunno I posted the kit as a solution to gauge the potency of a tab. Could very well be that it had less and also if you trip multiple times in a week for example the dose will be less intense because of tolerance. It's difficult to trust the information fully out there I'd be cautious and see what works etc. I did not even know a potency test existed before this thread was opened. I'd say your experience sounds normal. Hopefully you are not to bummed out I need for example more than 250ug to trip balls. 400-600 IIRC. 200ug was good yet not satisfiying to me. Sometimes sensetivity varied and I needed less, yet 400+ IIRC. 2 tabs max 3 and I was tripping deeply imo.

As a vegan product in Germany that is cheap and has a short ingredient list I use this, when I can. It's tasty I am not the ultimate health nut the ingredient list is very short basically 4 ingredients. I am unsure how toxic the brand could be. https://de.theproteinworks.com/soy-protein-90-isolate I like to use powders as I have to admit I am not the best at cooking at alot of recepies I wanted to cook. They don't have the ingredients in the store from the program I bought. Did not find a heavy metal test for this brand. I talked to Michael a while ago and as I wanted to take them I showed him a few brands that seemed okay. This is apparently the nr.1 seller for powder according to a German site from the U.K. I tested and liked their products from the vegan section all soy protein powder. A second opinion would be cool.

@something_else Same definitely would like to test for example the sellers products for potency so I know where to buy basically and I don't get scammed. So the link might come in handy in the neat future etc. Yes, I'd need more trips to fully make distinctions can recommend 1P-LSD if you are into visuals internally I was seeing beautiful intricate geometry when I closed my eyes. PRO-LAD was the worst it's also the weakest IIRC in terms of potency. AL-LAD was also great for beginners also somewhat still one of my favs as it had a very mild on-set and still had plenty of depth. I can't find the article with the comparision of the newer more common derivates likes ETH-LAD, AL-LAD, ALD-52, 1P-LSD, PRO-LAD, LSD and a couple of others IIRC ETH-LAD was the strongest and PRO-LAD the weakest. I personally would agree with their rating. 1P-LSD is supposed to be as strong as LSD or even stronger or slightly milder (medium potency - both average in potency/overall strength). I never tried the original LSD. This might help in case you wonder about any issues it could be that it's a different type of LSD etc. PRO-LAD was definitely weaker and I had to take more IIRC. There also seems to be an american version of the testing kit that is partned with the German company. https://saferpsyche.org/#research

As far as I know it's usally 70-100% accurate from reading in terms of potency of the tab. This information is from reddit. I'd also test tolerance levels from when you have last taken the substance so you can compare multiple scenarios. For example if you want to take the same dose when tolerance is still on you need more so the 250ug tab could have the effect of a 100ug tab. https://codepen.io/cyberoxide/full/BaNarGd I had multiple LSD derivates varying in potency it would be more interesting for you I'd say to know what type of LSD it is for example ETH-LAD is stronger than 1P-LSD and PRO-LAD as well as normal LSD as far as I know and has also a different effect. Some more visual, some more body high etc. All derivates I had had approx 200-250ug so I never tested something less. Also from all the offers I have seen LSD seems to be a psychedelic that can easily be produced and sold in masses. So I don't think the seller needs to scam people. I barely see bad reviews also. I'd definitely test the tab to make sure it's okay etc. etc. Trusting gut instinct is okay usually it plays out like I expect then when it's a strong instinct. Max I took I think was 700-900UG with tolerance. Also genetics matter apparently maybe more than I think. 1P-LSD blew my mind away and ETH-LAD was supposed to be very strong, yet it was only comparable to 1P-LSD to me a bit. I also thought these tabs were way to strong from all the 1P-LSD trips I made from that blotter pack in that sense. I also found this just now. As I am unsure how common potency tests are they seem to have developed some solutions, it's to expensive for me so I won't use it. The article is also interesting as it has a more conservative estimate/test of what sellers put in their tabs when advertised. https://www.trippingly.net/lsd-studies/psychedelic-potency-tests-are-here-and-they-work https://www.startnext.com/en/miraculix There are multiple tests for potencies availabile from their crowd-funding company. If I read the article correctly it's a German company and they also do this for MDMA Shrooms and obviously also LSD.

Yeah you can definitely lol.

Does a single puff really last 10 minutes when I puff from the vape? Is it possible to have breakthrough experiences or god realizations through vaping strong and even mild doses of dmt?

How much DMT do you guys mix per ml of vape juice approx? What are good dosage rates for example 1g of DMT in 3ml vape juice? I've read there are many variables so dosages can vary by vape device used is 1g of DMT for example in 2-3ml of vape juice a lot or normal. Also does a single puff really last 10 minutes? I've find this is quiet long especially as you can take multiple hits and intensify the experience. That is why I am asking about the dosage also. I read most information on Erowid and others forums about ratios and how much MG they estimate they take on average per puff when the DMT is vaped.

@Devin Yes agree.

@Devin That is why you have an army and in general military defence for a state/country. I don't know what the security protocols entails.

I dunno I smoke sometimes during phases a lot for 2-4 months max and then I stop. https://integrisok.com/resources/on-your-health/2021/february/impacts-of-chronic-marijuana-use For me when I do it very long all of this becomes truer, yet not abusing it for years I think is just better.

Same I don't find it weird also it's insane how a terrorist organisation can do that, even if you dig up the history and correct human error from all sides possible. Injustices etc. That a small group of people can attack a large first world nation in that sense and cause damage is insane. Also that the nation feels threatend to such extent of it's power that it declares it as a tragey. From any stragic point possible they had to take measures and that alone is quiet insane. Seeing how terrorism sort of becomes more normalized for individuals is also not good. Like mass shootings, mass hit and runs or random attacks with acid, nail bombs etc. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patriot_Day They keep changing laws apparently also when it is and is not. I don't think this has anything to do with Muslims and I bet most would agree with that. I would also never associated the attack with a religon more as an act of power to gain power. As any religion this organsiation used was only a means to gain power and cause damage, threats etc. I think ressources are spent better on peoples growth instead of killing them. Any rage, hate, fear used against muslims in association with 9-11 is absolute horseshit. I don't understand how people could ever relate the two and make it the main culprit.

@OBEler I dunno what is possible I am highly skeptical of this I dunno if there are shamans or something for this stuff with healing plant medicine or so. I'd definitely check in with your friend to see what he even wants and then find the appropriate medicine if possible through a plant healer. Basically the right kind of information I dunno I'd proceed with caution in terms of delusion I mean nothing is really happening to the leg when he takes the psychdelic, but he could for instance have a bad trip because of it or the opposite. I'd really think you'd clarify what issue or obstacle your friend has with his leg and then find a solution for that particular wish. For e.g walking faster during recovery or so. If you really want to help your friend I think this could be good advice and if he is older and has experience with psychdelics he could try. I mean your leg won't fall off from consuming psyches. Hmm... thinking about it if it increases body awarness it should he should at least be able to de-tangle the uncomfortable sensations associated broken leg and feel the part that is injured could be quiet emotional. Really don't know what is possible I'd be curious too if it's possible to heal something more severe in a safe way.

@OBEler What is he trying to heal the functionality of his leg? The tissue of his scar? Strength in his leg? Just heal pain of the injury emotionally etc? I bet if someone can break it down a little there could be ways for a psychdelic to help adress at least one issue. I head stories about healing that seem so odd that they are believeable and at the sametime they are very rare. I am sorry for you friend also. I do think from every story I heard the power of believe is amazing in terms of healing. I never read much about such sever healing cases and miracles. I am unsure how psychdelics can help with the physical aftermath of having fixed a broken leg. I don't think it's a very clever way of healing with not enough research. I have a leg operation too and I can pinpoint the exact issue and research a psychdelic for example. I did not break my leg, yet functionality is impaired. In case you find something I am intersted also lol. I talked to my teacher and I can deal with the physical symptomps and emotional ones through mindfulness and awareness and even send healing energy to it with loving-kindness meditation. The reality of it is a bit more frustrating as it takes time to be gentle and kind to an injury or a place that hurts. It definitely helps I bet it would help any healing process just from the feeling of it. The story I heard was also about the heart chakra and positvity and believe and some part where the heart chakra is there is some gland that is very active that helped fighting the diseas and errdicating it he activated the gland with some kind of yoga? I am unsure and sorry to give a wishy-washy story in terms of accuracy it was from a Yogi and a small YouTube channel. The doctors were unable to help, yet IIRC it was some kind of inflammation or virus. There are also more normal stories I've read a guy being shot in the hip doctors saying he can never walk again making himself walk and run marathons again. I bet they can be a tool in someway and not a cure for something like a broken leg. Sounds a bit absurd, yet who knows there might be a shroom that helps strengthening bones lol.

Continious issues that I encounter for both spirituality and self-help themes Problem of the use of language Issues of veryfing experiences online Techincal warfares about experiences and definitions. Negligent of shadow work, trauma Lazyness and inabillity to work on emotional issues. Meditation as a panacea. Confusing survival and self-transendence Ad hominem attacks Arrogrance and hubris Sexual miscondut by authorities Moral expectation of followers Average SD development Teachers mainly unaware of SD can hinder appropriate feedback as it's just not adressed at that level. Delusion, Paranoia, Schizophrenia, people with mental disorders Sudden traumatic event errupts while working on personal issue X Overprized products Overprized retreat centers and teachers Valdity of claims of teacher/product Toxic communities Underdeveloped EQ in spiritual and self-help circles. No training seldom provided for EQ, for e.g Shinzen now offers a way to communicate with more EQ with his techniques in one modul of his program Only studying one system Giving away your authority Lonliness Blaming others Any online warfare is an issue if it's not a healthy discussing based on respect Not searching for practical solutions for real life opportunities. Esacpism of any form with any substance and or technique Inabillity to assess competencies Appealing to low desires and putting others or the audience into a low vibe state. Like anger, fear, panic, hate etc. Echo-chambers perpetuating any body of thought and believing it's absolute. Believing itself. Trusting the experience of others to much. Not asking for help when needed Use it as an intellectual form of escapism and never do any of the work Exploiting and manipulating vulnerable people or naive people for sex and money. Damaging the physical body because of some rule/regulation/practice scheme etc. A lot of stage blue thinking. Ethnocentric biases I am more spiritual than you because I am from country X. Spirtual one upman ship and ego battles Low spiral development in PD circles a lot of blue-orange. Inabillity to assess the growth of oneself and of other people without personally insulting them. A lot of tough love attitude as an inabillity to express real love Using spirituality as escape Not using any feedback mechanism Not uniting feeling, knowing, thinking and your intuition. Solely relying on any of these only is quiet stupid imo. Not thinking you have toxic peers and your enviroment is toxic. Risk blind behaviour, overeager, not enough patience, rushing experience and result. Overly competetive people. Shaming others Drug abuse, addiction, relationship problems won't get solved by meditating alone etc. Abundance of techniques and confusion. Not knowing using different techniques produces different results. For e.g classic vipassana won't give you a non dual permanent state. Not stating the obvious. Terminologies of teachers inabillity to differentiate reaching emphasis. For e.g one teacher might emphasis love more than truth etc. Lack of open-mindedness Crossing boundaries not having boundaries Assertivness Isolation, sigma male attitude, mysogny, sexism, racism, homophobia. The illusion of online support Internet as a distraction Demonizing other schools and techniques and methods. Lack of taking responsibility for survival means. Lack of talking about morals in a way that is fitting for the 21 century. I find myself having to rely on "prudency" a lot. Comparrison mindset and competitive mindset. Blind faith. Overly focused on the mind Difficulties getting people out of their head and into their body. False sales promises Incorrect data, lies, deceit, fake credentials, again issue of validity. Confusing the map for the territory Just being there for connection and bonding. Lack of opportunities for engaging with self-help content outside larger more densly populated areas. Lack of research Know it all assholes Not expressing what you feel dissociating from emotions through meditation. A common complaint I heard about classic/traditional vipassana. Amorality, uncaringness, cheaters, people unwilling to do the "right" amount of work. Excusing the human condition to not work on it and improve it Unfortunately a lot of unfortunate life experiences, which can be uninspiring as a young person. Can be demotivating. Inabillity to recognize spirituality and people motivated to do spirituality and not dogmatic religion. That would be blue although it can be authentically spiritual. Orange basically is where you pick up the people and tell them there is god.. Nihilism, inabillity to create meaning Not having values not knowing what you want in life or in sector out of a product or course. Lack of vision Burn out Workaholics. Specialness, belongigness, elite attitude Fake humility. Lack of leadership especially for guys imo, giving direction, supporting, mentoring and the theory behind it. Loosing friends through growing and implementing Seeing failure as a setback Confusing signal for noise.. Let others dishearten you Not doing any mistakes Not staying positive and hopeful Glee Us against them mentality The pleasure of disrespecitng one upping Not consulting doctors for physical concerns etc. Knee hurts etc. Aftershocks after any conscious tool as been used Using recreational time in a way that is nuturing to your soul. Instead of running only programm Y on the weekend feeling burned out after. Superiority complex Inferiority complex Not differentiating self-help and spirituality and not seeing how it dove-tails into each other etc. Overidentifiying with a significant experience. That is about it and what I encountered personally and also just generally. Might be good food for thought it's not far of from everyone elses experiences I feel etc. Mostly it comes down to doing what works in a healthy enviroment. Although seeing my list and personal experiences it's a trial and error process with a lot of refinement for sure. Hope this helps!

Is the MBTi not declared as scientifically unvalid in some areas? I like the MBTI model. I generally find my experience conincides with compatability charts of the mbti model. I don't find it useful even after contemplating cognitive stacks and shadow functions for a while for all types and how they interact with each other. I find the Enneagram suprsingly more truthful especially in combination with the mbti model you can come to absurd conclusions how people will interact. Also the big 5 model is useful to sort of gauge the others persons temperament it's not that cognitively focused as the mbti. Where it's mostly about types and how they think without diving into cognitive stacks and FI v.s FE how they express and feel their emotions, preferences, tendencies etc. Same with SI v.s SE for example. Just to add to the experience. I dated an ENFP and one INFJ and INTJ and others also, who I'd rather type with other models. I find intutives as an INFJ the best to deal with, yet only using the MBTI does not account for the complexity of the other person most of the time. For example dating the INFj girl as an INFJ there was less connection then I expected etc. You can argue it's because of how FE functions in INFJ's because they express their feelings outwardly etc. In comparison the ENFP girl was way more grounded in her emotional reality. Then it seems so unaccessible to me when I don't reveal what I feel my experience with FE vs FI interaction both as 2'tier function or w/e. Or second order w/e. In this cogntive stack model idea thingy. It's for sure interesting, yet when I think oh the ENFP girl is a 9w8 or 9w1 the whole experience changes and the dynamic of the interaction. I find the Ennea lense sort of has more depth also the compatability charts that exist within the Ennea model also conincides with my experience mostly, after some time.I like both models, they also both have neuroscience, it's kinda weird to think about that then when interacting with others lol. What about this HEXACO-Model that has 6 instead of 5 traits and is an expansion sort of the big-5 model? Is that model valid IIRC it measures honesty or sort of has some moral/ethics trait listed.

I dunno what to completely think about this subject. I am going to add some thoughts that might aid the decision making process. As well as add my own experience I mostly used the dark net and real life to gain access to stuff so far. The site I used was taken down by some international security agency (like FBI). I used it at the time to buy legal substances. As I distrusted clear net sites, as they seemed to be fake and not professional enough. I mainly received LSD derivates that were legal during that time. Now I found at least one clear net site, that would give me access to certain subtances. I already test ordered other stuff that arrived. Basically I used the clear net and the dark net to gain access as well as also offline for example in person. Overall I'd say if Leo has trusted members I would just open a list where people have access to the sites. The most important thing would be able to implement it and work with psychedelics as a tool. Constant discussions about sourcing could corrupt the whole process with fake information, sites, trolls, scammers etc. If it would be regulated by mods and the content of the websites approves Leo's standard of what he teaches. For example would you source a dark net site that includes the offer for people to buy herion? I would include a list of websites that seem to cause the least harm possible here for people as information is easily abused and turned against etc. At the sametime people are responsible for their actions and the dark net site that sells herion might has a higher level of security then the clear net site. So there might be a benefit of listing it or one substance is legal that is illegal in another country. I see the overall issue with security and people not going crazy from consuming the substance. If there are well-known somewhat safe places (there will always be a risk imo). I would be for a list of sites that explains security measures, explains legality to some extend, as well as has reviews. I can only speak for the dark net that it was suprisingly professional. Although there are limits. I never explored the option fully. The good thing about constant sourcing would be having updates on legality statuses, website takedowns, exposing scammers etc. The negative thing is some would test it in good faith and get scammed. I'd recommend making a list of sites where you can have access to stuff and explain an overall policy on how, why and what is done with the information made available on these sites So you'd have the abillity to explore and find out for yourself. Yet, sort of as an authority not recommend buying from places, yet somehow ressources have to be gathered, so websites etc. Have to be explored in some sense and having a list from "seasoned psychonauts" would make the whole ordeal a lot more easier. Then to look up how many eyes are spying on my ass. Then to review sources once a year or so. You could also make a list with the worst sites possible to get psyches on. Basically an anti-sourcing list never get from these sites or so. So you'd also add clarity and transparency to the entire process. If people would really then use these sites, they'd be close to unsoundness of mind. In terms of image and repute I am unsure how pro-sourcing would affect the organisation etc. There will always be the one person who does something stupid and people love to complain so. I really do not know.

@somegirl Without going in-depth. I saw their wedding video as well as bought a relationship course from them. I did the online dating course from him and it seemed kinda tier 2. It kinda worked online though, yet it has close to nothing spiritual so it's not really at the upper end of tier 2 IMO. Just very functional and lean ways on how to handle a relationships, communication and let's say stuff that relates more to EQ skills. Like humour, descalating a situation etc. I would love if more people would be like this that would make dating more pleasent. It's enormously difficult to find people interested in co-creation. So many stuck in Green/orange and Orange/green. Just from dating it's unfortunate to witness that as well as how frustrating it is how many dont even integrate base desires, instead just chase them. I liked their wedding video that definitely showed me how a serious commitment looks like. As well as co-creation as far I know they are also business partners no? They have some company that mainly uses Facebook currently for marketing purposes they have a channel there about relationships or communication IIRC, I had the impression they saw a business opportunity there because of the streaming/vod/video/family oriented market w/e. Anyway humans are far off from developing that level of integrity/passion alone. I saw maybe one couple so far besides them that sort of looks like this. I do think it takes a dedicated couple and leadership from the man to go into this direction that it fails will be inevitable to find a women like this is like finding 1 in a million. Imagine people doing what they did in the video in public. If people are not consistently developing these fields and are concerned by them it's not going to grow, I never saw a single friend of mine work on a relationship even buying a book on the subject matter. Most just learn from ther peer group and stay stuck in their ways of attracting /dating etc. Which says a lot about development imo. I tried a Tier 2 relationship course just by how much conceptual work that is and close and how many exercises it had. I don't think a lot of people would do the course even if it is highly enjoyable, because it creates so much clarity. It takes also a lot of time and communication it would fine tune and go into deeper detail than what the video showed. What the video showed was a Tier 3 relationship from David Deida's Model... Tier 1: Macho jerk Guy, Housewife - Dependence Tier 2: Business relationship you meet my needs I need yours deal? - Independence Tier 3: Mentioning unacknowledged resentments, feelings etc. Finding space to express every thought, be present with the other partner, feel what the other partner feels, don't interrupt etc. Do the same - Interdependence. SD Tier's and how David Deida explains relationship Tiers or Levels is different. It's like an independent line of development. Tier 3 is truely Tier 2 in that sense for relationships as it's so ground breaking. Many are just hardcore stuck in their orange desires as the desire of achieving and presenting that achievement is as latent as every before. With social media how many couples truely enjoy their relationship as deeply as they seem to on pictures on insta etc? Most happy couples I see are elderly how accept their partner 100% and their flaws and quirks, also and learn to love them. Also just finishing half the course gave me more insights into my dates. Especially also as a guy how much energy and leadership abillity it costs to handle a relationship at Tier 2 when I dated I had a lot of knowledge to go by in order to see the signs of how the relationship could unfold as well as problem areas etc. As well as how difficult each Tier would be to handle for me + inclinations etc. Btw I also lost all literally all friend becoming Tier 2. Now they are back. It's odd. I'd love to see and hear more example of Tier 2 relationships just to learn visually lol. I dunno like some stuff is a bit wild what one or even two Tier 2 coaches of relationships and sex teach about porn. For e.g saying they never see this in a fully loving relationship. I can see why in the sense of when you love each other that much why even need it etc? Yet there is so much stuff needs in a relationship differ from couple to couple I presume. I like to think deeper about this topic or even to explore the practicalities as I knew already some of it. I do think for guys just going through the courses attraction and getting laid is more important. This sort of Tier 2 vision you really need to have the time/space and energy to do it also luck with another person. Just becoming better socially I do think is more important than just jumping straight into relationships as they seem to cause so much pain and frustration to people. I do think it's worth the risk I'd rather try to create something like that than the shallow waters of how society runs relationships currently jumping from one hedonic means to the next. To become the ultimate "Horndog". Who pleasures me the most? I dunno I find it weird I took a lot of time offline to develop myself in the area SD growth and had to deal with various backlashes as I still am. Just from having the blueprint most relationships are stuck in an Orange and/or Green reality. Some might have a sliver of yellow cognition, yet the entire process of how attraction works. Starting even from genetics and how your parents raised you affects what you are attracted to and loved by and how relationships are done. Is not explained so I miss the wholeism in their approach to understand dating. Yet, many don't know how and or why especially for their specific case !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! As nobody really talks about this. The guy has a YouTube Channel as far as I knew the stuff is outdated, some of the material synchronizes with the newer material that was posted here, at best just take a look again this is mostly for guys. Just by skimming the video for 5 sec or so, this is stuff I've done now like this mindfulness techniques lol I've done for years and is also included in courses. This is good content imo. I just don't see it properly reflected imagine the exercises above being done current average Green. How much dogma and believe could enter into the process of just being mindful of emotions. Also how much energy that costs at the beginning it's not easy. https://www.youtube.com/c/DoubleYourDatingDD/videos https://www.youtube.com/user/EbenPaganMedia/videos Both channels have videos from him. The one below is for businesses. I did not finish the Tier 2 course completely as I noticed I do need another partner and attraction/dating is more important at the beginning. Anyway. Just saying it takes more effort than it might look like especially the maintenance part of the relationship at that level. I am pretty sure it will oscilatte pretty heavily, especially at the beginning. After the 6 months test period. Hope this does not sound to cold hearted! Was not my intention. This sort of has been my experience and I had high quality dates that are better from what I can perceive from this forum. A couple of them. Unfortunately I was not all to interested as I did not want to deal with the logistics and some just did not work out from their end. Can't also really apply the material in this region etc. Not enough people. There are multiple scenarios I can run a lot of it depend on development in all quadrants. I can't really adress the topic without including what I find whole in it. ---- What I currently hate personally about dating? Narccism and self-centeredness Focus on achievments and results and caretaker qualities, instead of character qualities and looking for character not even personality which is more an image, yet what is embeeded beneath the image To many image problems with who am I associated with what is Person X in the world. Flaking Lack of open-mindedness Lack of responsibillity Ghosting Shitty role models Lack of being direct and honest, a lot of agendas. Orange/Blue I laugh everytime how painfully real it is for some people and for me also. Hedonism and pleasure oriented I dunno there are some parts I don't like and these patterns are becoming more obvious, the more I get experienced with the topic. For example going out and being a ressource provider and just having that potential alone is as valueable as having the ressources. I attract a lot of women who are into strength for example a super blue/red masculine trait. Etc. perspective matters so much. I am just leaving this here. As I don't really care anymore a I am already integrating it at my speed. So yeah hope this two ressources might add a little more consciouness to the dating/business section. In short IMO: Most people want to survive in relationships and not even thrive like the couple in the video, even less want to strive/thrive and transcend.