Chew211

I'm not Leo, but that book changed my entire paradigm of romantic relationships. Though the paradigm was wrong. The Rational Male is wrong, simply put. However, if it moves you away from "blue pill" thinking it's a step in the right direction, but it's extremely flawed. I can go in detail if interested, might have to start a different thread for it.

What i meant was that even women can be in one of those two processes. The two processes can apply for any desire, not just sexual/romantic. Also men are phallic, while women are phallic AND no phallic. The more phallic you are, the more of that anxiety is what pushes you to grow OR cope with Jouissance.

Yeah, there's an anxiety when we're unable to get an object of our desire. This anxiety IS masculinity according to the Psychoanalytic perspectives. Getting laid, getting a girl, finding a partner etc, all these could be desires. To word it simply: we feel not man enough when we can't get what we want. There's 2 ways to deal with this: 1. Jouissance (Enjoyment) We DON'T go after what we want, and so we feel frustrated. When the frustration becomes unbearable we have a temporary release (porn, complaining on this subforum, etc). Then you feel okay for a while, then frustration starts to build up, and it's this endless cycle. Most ppl go with this. 2. Going after our desire This is difficult because our ego is constructed in a way to cope NOT getting our desires. It keeps us from going after our objects of desire. Also this can involve failure, which can be emasculating. S you have this cycle of feeling emasculated and bettering yourself. When you get the object of desire, then it no longer is the only object of desire, so the cycle continues. Desire could be other chicks, or a family with the girl he got, or something in a completely different field of life. The first cycle is a hamster wheel and you stay the same place in life. The second cycle, you're moving forward and growing. The two cycles apply to women as well.

I just avoid it because it's too easy, and attractive people hear it all the time.

Okay, from experience, the opener is something you want to get over with asap. Thinking about what to say either prevents you from approaching or makes the opener too try hard. Saying the first thing in your mind and just going from there. All my success from cold approach (getting laid and/or a relationship of some sort) started off with meh openers. Boring openers, awkward openers, etc. I have done smooth, perfect, Alpha™️ approaches that would have looked badass to an outside viewer, but those didn't lead anywhere. The fundamental of opening is getting it over with.

Romance is a fetishism, and along with it, soulmates.

My recommendation is to use this feeling of inadequacy to further study up your position and then be able to defend it.

If y'all actually approach and get laid from it, you'll realize how simple it is. It's silly seeing someone ask for photo evidence. Lol, could you imagine: Yo, babe, let me take a pic while I fuck you so I can prove to my friends that I can get laid via cold approach. Those intimate pics ain't for sharing

If you want something you find a way to get it. There's guys uglier, poorer, less developed, less healthy physically/mentally, with a smaller sick than you getting some ass. The learning curve for approaching is steep, which is why most people settle for whatever they get in their social circle or dating apps. Or, nowadays, nothing. ----- If you really want to secure didily for yourself in the future though, make sure you're economically well off. Not that you're gonna attract a chick with monz, but because people in general are having less sex due to the economic factors. If you can escape wage slavery, and you aren't working a job that drains you, and you don't hate your life, you're far above most people. Work in your game, yes, but logistics is what let's you actualize your game. I.e., you get more for your game

Idk what you mean by "our" culture, but if you mean the global capitalist consumerist culture that has it's roots in the US, then no, sex (either in abundance or lack) is to distract people from their material conditions, much like other forms of entertainment, including broadcasted politics. When you're distracted from confronting material conditions, you're stick being in the society pyramid that Leo talks about in videos such as 30 Ways Society Fucks You in the Ass, and How to Escape Wage Slavery. Preoccupation with sex, regardless if you have a lot of rules around it or if you're a libertine, is a trapping. The libertine preoccupation with sex though is more of an issue and more harmful (more effective).

There's 2 types of Niceguys. The first type is the Niceguy who isn't nice. Let's call this type the (Manipulative) Weasel. The second type of Niceguy. Is ACTUALLY nice. So nice he's not on the radar. So nice nice that he's not really represented. Let's call this type the Castrati. OP is talking about Castrati. Those who are saying Niceguys ain't nice are talking about the Weasels. Masculine men are assertive in trying to get the object of desire. They don't care about "rules". They also don't care about being confident, looking cool, etc. They go after what they want, and if they fail, then they make themselves better by continuing to try. Castrati do not go after, or in extreme cases don't recognize, their desire. Weasels do go after their desire, but they don't want to deal with conflict, rejection, or any other unpleasantness. Masculine men deal with unpleasantness. Women by default have to deal with unpleasantness. Unfortunately for the guys here, including me at times, the woman is the Subject Presumed to Enjoy-- but such doesn't necessarily exist. Even if there theoretically was a chick like that, that doesn't make the world view any less deluded.

Yes. And also the content is irrelevant to the guys here, because either they follow that normal courtship procedure or don't get laid to begin with. No one here forces sex. And if they did, they wouldn't care to change their ways because of this post. I know there's some cringe here, but we all ain't THAT bad.

Yo... what you described as "her pursuing" is the normal courtship procedure. What you described as not getting the signal is bordering on rape.

Meaning is decided retroactively. You can only be sure of anything after the fact. And of course, the future can hold more interpretations/revisions of a past event. Trying to be sure beforehand is the problem a lot of guys who can't get laid have. The article only seems to apply for stage green people in the west. It's not universal. In Japan for example, it's easier to have sex with a chick than to talk to her about sex. Obviously not EVERYONE, but you get the idea. Going for verbal consent can kill the mood. Sex need not be verbally regulated unless something bad is going to/about to happen. From my experience, girls are rarely 100% sure. Whatever you need to do to make her feel she made the right decision about sleeping with you is done AFTER didily.

@5-D - L O V E Okay, I acknowledge your intellectual honesty. However, just because it's your experience that doesn't make it a cohesive model for human relations/(female) psychology, etc. My recommendation is to study a model, and modify it if you have to, so that you can turn the experience into knowledge. I personally go with Lacanian Psychoanalysis/Freudo-Marxism. Emerald, who's a popular contributor on this forum, goes with Jungian Psychoanalysis. You can pretty much pick anything, as long as it gives you a solid understanding. Though not everything is "good" . Blackpill genetic determinism DOES explain things, but it's a crappy model, and it'll fuck your psychology up. Mainstream RedPill explains everything with Hypergamy, which is oversimplified. But regardless, working models will turn your experience into knowledge, and then such knowledge can be learned by yourself and others, AND can be debated against.

@5-D - L O V E You're fundamental flaw is assuming that you have a significant grasp of (female) psychology. Re-read your own post. Does it not reek of self deception?

If you need to find a coping mechanism for it, then it's a need for you. There are some spiritual practitioners that transcend such needs, but if you're coping, that just means your making up for not having it. You're trying to make up for not fullfiling a need. When I was saying need I meant it in the sense of attachment, not undisputed need. An undisputed need is something you're biological apparatus will die without. An attachment is something that stems from survival needs. We have deep programming in us to drive us to reproduce. Some (spiritual) practices can redirect (some of) those drives into a "higher purpose". I do it to some degree by abstaining from jerking it and watching porn, and limiting my didily time to once a week. In some point in the future I might full renounce didily, but I'm can't do that. If I stop seeing the chick I'm seeing now, then I'll feel the drive to get (a) new chick(s)-- and that takes away from all the high consciousness stuff that I do. When I say it's a need for most people, I mean attachment. We wouldn't be disputing undisputed needs.

For most people, that's just cope. They can't get sexy time, so they rationalize that they're just too far developed to do things to get sexy time, and go on without sexy time, and think they are superior for lack of sexy time. I'm not saying it's you, at least nothing in what you wrote gave off those vibes. Dating isn't serious. Sex isn't serious. It's a need for most people. But it's not serious. There are highly developed people who are married, who have a girlfriend, who have many girlfriends, etc. The only issue is that if a lot of your surplus time is spent with another partner, then that takes away from time to invest in yourself. When it comes to me, I make time for some didily

The James Bond approach doesn't work because once you're out on the field you'll be facing rejection after rejection, and there's nothing cool about that. You don't look cool when you do game most of the time, just like how you won't look cool grunting, sweating, and whimpering in pain whole you push yourself in a hard workout. The results are cool. Having a muscular body is cool. Having sexual abundance is cool. But you don't necessarily look cool in the process of getting those things. Game especially has a steep learning curve. Trying to come off as James Bond is delusional. Trying to ape high value is extra lame. You have what you want, and you go for it, and if you fail, use that as feedback and get better the next attempt. Conversation rate is low. Most people aren't sexually into you, and if they are, they might not be sexually available, and if they are sexually available, maybe you screw it up because of your inexperience. It's not pretty. But people who care about they way they come off instead of the results, or even worse, confuse the two to be one and the same, are inferior.

Human beings be horny.

First off, go after what you want. Make mistakes along the way. You'll inevitably end up hurting yourself and others. But then you learn. And you become a little more refined. And because you developed skills, you can manage to be more empathetic and kind, and still get what you want. Or maybe, you'll get enough of what you want/realize you'll never have enough/realize that this isn't what you really wanted, and then you'll move on to an actual solid stage green, instead of the immature stage green where you're at now. Also in terms of spiral Dynamics, the issue for most guys at the moment isn't primarily with Orange and Green, but rather Purple and Red. You gotta move some of your Purple to Red.

You trying to get over the desire for a relationship is cope for not being able to attain one. It's not that you can't attain one either. It's that you think it's too hard and you give up, and now you need to get over wanting a relationship so you can live with giving up that desire. But that's inauthentic.

Well, this has been a highly informative read.

@gar-4-field Hardcore physical training of se kind. I prefer weight training. Hardcore study of religious/metaphysical Doctrines, philosophy, or Psychoanalysis. (Not new age stuff or run of the mill online courses-- i.e. commodified spirituality/scholarship) . Surplus-- of time and/or money and/or energy, etc. If your busy and tired all the time or stressed, then you're going to be easily overpowered by life. Make logistical moves to increase your surplus. The second part is important to free yourself from the influence of mainstream media, post-industrial education systems, and nihilism. This is my solution, and I have no issues with not being masculine enough anymore. I'm not perfect, but I'm a man.