Vercingetorix

exactly the kind of dad that leads a the nice guy syndrome (I have a similar dad).}} Did you start reading/hearing it?

If you have enough girls to approach after screening to enter into state/flow, sure. If it's just not to approach - approach instead.

@Jannes Hi let me guess ,You didn't have a healthy Masculine role model in your life? Book - No more mister nice guy helped me a lot in that. Advise: Stop being needy. Unhook from neediness by: 1) Practicing pickup / being social ( "Invincible" course by David Tian is great) 2) Creating abundance of friends and a social circle. 3) Meditating and learning to enjoy the moment 4) Creating a life of Flow and taking joy in what you do 5) facing loneliness and accept it or even enjoy it

I was contemplating attraction and evolution today and I Think I had an Important realization -The understanding on the gut level of the idea (that before I understood only conceptually, not really resulting in a behavior change) - that Girls are attracted to status, non neediness, confidence, leadership etc. the same way I'm attracted to their beauty. That being nice, loving, selfless and caring is a great (for being happy and spiritual and godlike) but in the dating world if I have only that - it will attract a girl the same way I am attracted to a fat ugly chick. and I see how this realization is changing me and is giving me the motivation I need. But I still struggle to understand the complete picture - why is it so? If the idea is that this evolutionary process took place when our ancestors lived a Tribal life of Hunters-Gatherers - why the girl that is attracted to the Manly Alpha man vs a Girl that is attracted to the Beta male, will have a higher chance to pass her genes on? Do Beta male children have less chance of survival? Something still baffles me about it. I'm struggling to correlate the "attraction list" with survival benefits: non neediness, confidence, fun, humor -> correlates to health, resources, status Making her feel a range of emotions -> social skills -> easier to survive when you have friends and status Sense of life purpose and leadership -> decisiveness and confidence -> can face and overcome obstacles But I still can't see the picture, imagine how the life of a Beta male looks compared to the life of an alpha male. (if there are any documentaries recommendation about it I would like to know). Can anyone see it clearly and explain how all these traits or lack of them leads to passing your genes and having offspring or not? Another question: has beauty evolved in women only because Men want to have sex with them more which gives them the survival edge or is beauty also connected to health for example?

This afternoon I opened a girl in a creepy way....I saw her on a cross walk but decided to walk to another direction. then when I looked back i saw she comes to my direction. So I stopped and waited for her, ...hesitated for a few seconds and she noticed me but I said fuck it I'll do it anyway... I opened direct and was needy and shy in my voice and when I stated my intent she had this disgusted face like I'm a cockroach ? and she shouted "what? no!!! and Don't follow me!!!" That stung a bit. Fucking bitch ? It was a good reminder for me approach detached from outcome, not needy. After a few minutes of shame and me breathing in the insult i started to feel good, as if i faced the worst. had a few nice chats with other chicks, met my ex by chance and we had a fun conversation and later that day received a lot of attention from girls. Felt like energy flow state.

@Leo Gura @something_else to be clear I don't resent her. It's in good humor. I thank her for the feedback. But I have some anger on the situation that I express like that. @Bird Larry Calibration @Breakingthewall yeah It really helps me If I can approach the first set of the day and experience a rejection (or a good reaction.) @Danioover9000 haha we should make a thread about funny approaching stories to give motivation to each other. I like "Sasha daygame" (and marcus) mindset of "approach and you'll have either a success or a funny story to tell".

@Vrubel I can connect to that. My best approaches are when I tell myself "just be yourself" and then I I would be a bit shy But 100% authentic and smiling and she feels it and usually I would get a really good responses even if she is not interested. When I approach like that I also feel really good inside myself, It just feels right. Problem is that it still requires a lot of courage and there is still resistance. I'm gonna experiment with it then next weeks. haha you read it wrong, I actually don't struggle with the conversation thanks though @JonasVE12 Your answer resonates with me. I read it a few times and I'm digesting it little by little. it's similar to what I'm doing - beside going out to practice I do also a lot of contemplation about the subject to find and clear blockages. To be conscious that everyone is me - I can be conscious of it most of time But in places like pick up where fear and shame arises - so far it's not available for me consistently. I remember In the past when I practiced it a few times I could really feel the connection and the fear would disappear but I couldn't be conscious of it consistently. But I feel like I'm very close to step over the fear. @Ulax thanks, I use similar mindsets. I like the reframing of anxiety as butterflies.

When I'm going out approaching girls with a wing, I can approach consistently without any problems. But I couldn't find yet a reliable wing, and don't want to depend on that. And when approaching by myself -I find it very hard and I can't do it consistently. (unless I'm in flow state). I also have high resistance to starting indirect and asking "direction questions" or "what is the time?" (shame of being caught lying I think). I tried working with many mindsets like enjoying the moment, just being honest, be curious about the reaction, enjoy the rejection, and they help relieve the pressure but get me in my head so I'm not sure that's the solution. Btw after I approach I find its not too hard for me to keep the conversation going. Anyone familiar with my situation and can share his way of breaking through it?

@patricknotstar and what's the evolutionary reason for that?

@NoSelfSelf gotcha The difference is that a natural Alpha male had a role model, a masculine father that he could mimic subconsciously so of course he doesn't have to think about women. But for someone like me that didn't have a healthy male role model, my whole system was wired for failure with women... so you think that by not caring about women I will succeed with them? ? no, the only way is to understand deeply and consciously, to use my mind to learn the theory, and fix all the bugs in my system. And it's a beautiful and loving process ?

sounds like you were doing it right. maybe placing your hand as much as possible near the area that needs healing? How is your dog Doing?

@Razard86 Thanks although this post is about understanding how evolution shaped us, not practicality

@hoodrow trillson Of course they do. But I know some HOT guys that suck with women. So it's less important for them than for men. I never saw a hot girl that couldn't have many guys... But what is the evolutionary incentive for Men to be beautiful? is it connected to health? If a girl will be attractive to an ugly guy, her daughters will be ugly and Men will not want them so they will have an evolutionary disadvantage? @NoSelfSelf What makes you think that I "care about woman"? (Do you mean seek their approval?)

When you speak to her lean over and talk to her ear, very close, with your hand - Like you would speak to a friend in a noisy place or whisper to someone.

@JonasVE12 Nice guide

I have a female friend. We've started to get close and meet more often. I start to fall for her. It's a bit complicated: * she's the best friend of my ex and in the past my ex was jealous about me and her being close. * she is in love with another guy that don't really return the favor. * In the past I confessed that I like her and she said she is not into me.. On the other side: we have very fun, open and deep conversations - It feels as if we can talk for hours. She initiate a lot of it and invite me to do things together We touch each other a lot and hug each other for long times some worrying signs: * Part of it is about her asking for favors helping her with stuff * I keep a secret - Most of the time I feel in the moment and flowing but sometimes when I think that I want to touch her intimately or kiss her or say how I feel I suppress it in the fear that she will reject me / End my hopes that there is a chance for more / I will lose her friendship * I start to notice needy thoughts and start to think about her more often and I kind of stopped to have the motivation for practicing pickup She feels special to me because it seems that it's very hard to find someone like her: she is quite spiritual and evolved , super kind and gentle, has a compassion evoking life story. and I find her vibe and energy attracting and resonating with me. Theoretically I'm happy to just be her friend. I love her even if she is not into me. But I see that practically it's hard for me to be myself and enjoy and feel free when there is this tension. maybe I need to find a way to express it in a non serious way, make fun of it? My Dilemma: should I "game" her, try to make her attracted to me? It feels a really needy and desperate thing to do. Should I tell her honestly what I feel for her? Should I not overthink it and just be spontaneous and in the moment If I feel that I want to hug her or touch her to tell her an ask if she wants it too? My fear is that she will say I don't feel any attraction for you and don't want anything more that friendly touch. It will be a bit hard for me to hear. And if she is really not into me does this relationship has a chance or is it doomed?

@flowboy Usually the memory that comes up on this subject is when I was like 11 and I liked a girl and I made a "move" (something like tried to be funny by stealing chips for another girl) to impress her but this move made the other girl go completely ape shit crazy and lose her shit on me and the girl I liked kind of said nothing but buy the way she looked at if, it felt as if she was supporting the other girl. So expressing my desire for me means I'm gonna get yelled at humiliated. About the anger and hurt: I'm not sure if we mean the same thing or not. letting go and focusing on love (and also Tonglen meditation) does breaks the needy and selfish conditioning in my experience. I agree that feeling the hurt/pain fully is important and I do it. But just thinking selfish needy thoughts is of no use. when you do it the energy goes to the mind and makes you distant from your feeling and body. Update on the situation: I feel that I unhooked from her and don't care too much if she likes me or not. I focus on other girls and enjoying my life. I feel free to tell her anything and it fells as if the power dynamics between us changed for now.

"Be the change you want to see in the world" - Open the most conscious business you can. see if it works. Remember that everything negative you see in the world is a reflection of something in yourself. think about the positive aspects of money, what it has enables us humans to do. I adopt through affirmations that money=love. when people pay you money, they give you theirs thanks, gratitude and ultimately their love! when you pay someone, he will use it to feed his child, go see a beautiful movie, pay his rent. is there anything more loving than giving people the freedom to use this love as they want? Are you sure your mind is not just using this excuse to avoid doing the hard labor and emotional pains of developing your business?

@flowboy It's true to an extent, there were moments I was hiding my attraction but all in all I do think I was honest al told her multiple times about my interest in her. she knows! yes! when I practice pick up I am always going direct these days. There are moments when I feel needy and at those moments If I imagine seeing her with the other guy or thinking about losing her it's painful and I do feel angry. but If I let go of the neediness, Focusing on my love for her as person, on Other girls, on trust - I find peace in myself. So is it hiding my anger and hurt? It feels more like the unhooking from an addiction of being needy.

Yes it's possible. the traits complete each other, not cancel each other. Then you have more freedom in any situation to behave the way you want. You have the freedom to adjust yourself to other people and what they need, to all different kind of situations. If a woman feel confidant around you - why won't she also appreciate deep intimacy for example. the feminine traits are a great bonus for if you have the masculine ones.

@flowboy I appreciate the advice. I have to reflect on it. I don't feel like "playing games" is the right approach for me. if just feels...wrong. If when I'm honest with her she doesn't appreciate it - maybe it's better that we won't be together. It makes me feel sick to start pretending and playing games. maybe that's my block? the nice guy symptom? Our last meeting was interesting - on the one hand she seems really happy to meet me, we were pretty drunk, had a lot of physical touch and had deep and intimate conversations. I felt confidant and free. On the other hand - She started to talk about another guy she talks with and that she is falling in love with him (it's a second guy beside the other one she was "in love" with), and a few times during the date she sent him pictures and stuff... I mentioned my feeling for her once and she said something like "don't do it, it's not mutual". Since then she send me a message of how I am but then asked for pictures and didn't reply or heard my voice messages and didn't answer the one time I called her yesterday. She is going through a lot of stuff right now so I'm holding my judgment of why she behaves this way and focus on other girls. logically speaking right now the odds don't seem to be in my favor but I'm interested in how things will unfold and the heartbreaking process is pretty fun.

@marinaaniram I am also going through a heartbreak so I can share my approach to it. Motivation: "keep breaking your heart until it opens" - Rumi I think falling in love is amazing - I see how it develops me spiritually - my compassion for people, my authenticity, my ability to be childlike without ego and defenses, focusing on what's really important - my happiness and bringing good to the world all rise up. But getting your heart broken is the true spiritual challenge, the true path to freedom . Can you keep loving the world when your heart gets broken? I find it's a fascinating challenge for me. I find that my love doesn't depend on if I am loved back. But of course it's super tricky - because the automatic reaction of the mind is to all day start visualizing all these negative scenarios of being rejected and if I'm not careful I can easily enter Into self pity. So my way to deal with it is: First: allow emotions to rise up and cry! cry! cry! this is the purification process that will allow you to become confidant, authentic, not afraid of rejection in your life because you accept and face the worst. "Sad music" helps me connect to my emotions and cry (I can share with you my playlist haha). Also, the sadness that I feel - I can feel the love behind it because truly - "Sadness is the shadow of love". so I embrace it and actually enjoys it. Second, guard yourself from self pity thoughts - no need to repress them of course but don't let them take control. don't indulge in them. When you notice them make a conscious effort to think about something productive. One good way for me is to think about other girls, to go out and meet other girls, etc. I find it supporting Third I contemplate about the girl/boy that broke my heart and about love: If I truly Love them don't I want the best for them? If the best for them is not with me - why will I not be happy for them? am I Selfish this way? why? (trying to understand myself, not judging). this contemplation often leads me to peace of the situation (at least until the next wave ). can I still love the person even if he/she doesn't love me back? I would also contemplate - Why do you feel stupid? Is blaming yourself spiritual? those are interesting reactions. good luck on the broken heart path haha

Is it a healthy defence mechanism for evolution to be attracted to the other sex so you can reproduce? A learnt and conditioned behavior from from society or my parents? is there delicious unconscious stuff hidden behind it to contemplate or is it just the way it is. what do you guys think?D id anyone contemplate it and derived some Juicy answers?

@flowboy @flowboy I met her again (we met late around midnight) - and at the beginning of the meeting I was a lot in my head and I felt awkward so I was uncomfortable so say anything sexual. later, I become more confidant and wanted to address the issue. I had a good opportunity because we talked about sex and attraction so I wanted to say "So for example when I look at your lips I feel that I want to kiss them do you not feel the same way for me?" but as I was about to say so she said she needs to go to the toilet and when she came back she said she is tired and she wants to go home (an hour and a half into the meeting) So I I thought it's a bad idea to open it up when she is tired, so I just said there is something I wanted to say but I'll keep it for next meeting.

@flowboy nice metaphor. Strangely, it did happen to me in the past that I fell in love with a girl I wasn't too much attracted to physically I agree that it's super unattractive to hide my desire and feelings from her. And I saw myself doing it with her to a degree. (hence I opened the topic) . I guess the only solution is to be willing to lose her friendship? I'm going to express my desire unapologetically otherwise I know I won't enjoy meeting her. If she doesn't feel the same it's still ok, Probably we will remain friends. I think I confuse expressing my desire unapologetically with neediness. I'm afraid to express it because I'm afraid I will be seen as needy? That's interesting. @RMQualtrough I like this plan It might work actually