Bill W

I'm not going to type out much, it's good you are getting support on here. I'll just like to throw it in that you are talking about it and getting different perspectives. I think that's crucial. I can relate personally to what you are going through. But of course, it's not the same exactly. But keep talking. If you have people face to face you can share this stuff with then I encourage you to do that as well. Don't take one persons advice on here as the Gospel Truth. Get a few suggestions. Vent it out a bit. It might be too late to save them, but it's not too late to save yourself. I'm not saying to definitely leave, or even leave at all as could cause more problems than it solves, but don't go down with the sinking ship if that's what it comes down to in the end.

It's a great post that Drew. I actually mean that, not sarcasm, but........ I just can't get it out of my head, how one removes personal bias from the equation when thinking about is there a God, who is God, how does he operate, what happens when I die, and all this stuff about the universe. When I get an answer I always feel like it's not a real answer. This is thread derailment though (from me, not you). It must take an extraordinary person to short circuit the process and have no personal bias in something they've invested years in. I would imagine the average person who believes they are God etc nurtured this belief for a long, long, time. Invested in it. Shared it. Preached it. Became it. To them it's not a belief, because perhaps belief translates to them as fraud or fake. It's like the term belief is viewed as an insult. Like I am comparing their view on life to believing in Santa Clause or mermaids. I don't mean it like that. I mean how many absolute truth's are there in terms of the discussion on this forum? Look at the dating section for example. Everybody trying to coach everybody else. It's all belief, ideas and personal values/philosophies. I've no problem with it as such as we can learn from others experience and teachings, but lots of it is written as established fact and absolute truth. How can one remain open-minded and humble? That's a projection of mine there, I don't get to define what is open-minded and humble I suppose and I don't get to decide that people even want open-minded and humble. I love the term "not knowing mind". It's so crucial for me. Then again, perhaps I'm more happy to come across as not being any kind of authority on anything LOL Sorry for derailment, I think I need to vomit this stuff onto the thread sorry. I am no better than any other person on here, just curious.

I don't agree but it made me smile literally. In a nice way. I'm not at the point I can accept that explanation, but I am thankfully at a point where humility and being openminded are the two values I am chasing and trying to embody. Even if my posts allude otherwise at times. It's always going to be work in progress for me. Therefore, I don't agree, but I know that I might not have the current awareness or experience to agree. Ask me in a few months when I have 12,000 posts behind me (tongue in cheek)

Great topic. For the people saying you'll end up right back here or your suffering will not end, this is a belief you are sharing is it not? This is something you have come to believe about death, or something you want to believe? It is something others believe and you have agreed with others? I don't know what to believe about death so I do not have a position to defend on what does or does not happen after death. If what you post is not a belief I'd love to be corrected/guided on what it is, if it's not a belief. It's one thing comparing theory and ideas, but perhaps have a think how you would approach the topic of suicide with someone who is in the advanced stages of Motor Neurone Disease, perhaps a friend or family member, who has been told by the legal system he and loved ones have no right to facilitate euthanasia in their own country, but if they have enough money they can go to another country and it's okay. Would you say to that person in the wheelchair who might be going to suffocate to death at some point soon ... "no point in topping yourself mate, you'll be right back here". Or telling him "You are God. You are the Universe". Actually I'll keep open mind hat on here..... of course there could be a situation where to think along these lines spiritually would actually comfort someone, but I wouldn't absolutely count on it! I'm not emotional writing this or angry. It's a really powerful debate all the time about suicide, whether you are coming from an actualised.org perspective or another perspective. I have personal experience, more than I would have wanted to have.

An argument for making new threads pay as you go LOL It was like this when mobile phones started offering loads of free texts as "normal". When people no longer had to pay per text, it changed everything. People starting texting with reckless abandon. We wouldn't get half as many Viagra emails if the sender had to pay to send each one

I think I get your point Shin but not completely sure. I am gullible I know that much! I take things too literally sometimes. When I see stuff on this forum about masculinity and femininity and all this about roles i feel like I've stepped into a time machine and we are back in the last century. However with openmind hat on I have to appreciate I may simply be ignorant which can often be the case ? I also live in a culture where perhaps women are allowed to make more progress than they are in other parts of the world. I am also ignorant around discrimination and oppression to an extent as I am a white, Male, heterosexual with no obvious disability (unless you can read my mind lol). I am English born and bread so language is also not a real barrier for me. I am not in poverty and haven't been overly abused in my life. I may also be projecting my own insecurities as I will never be mistaken for an alpha Male. Never lol. Was going to correct bread but will leave it in for irony

Not trolling here and not demanding a justification. Generally curious and perhaps speaking out of ignorance but..... what is the point of a distinction between man and woman? Or am I just being dim? I am not sure about the need to divide things up so much between men and women? I know I let go of what being a man means a while back. It's one less thing that drags me down or aggravates monkey mind. One less expectation. I feel liberated by it actually.

Actually it would be useful to know if someone is tripping when they post. Not saying this person is tripping or tripping is wrong. Just be interesting to know so the post can be put into context.

Lol ? even Jesus has an off day then, unless someone has misquoted him.

I think you can only edit a post for 48hrs.

Ah! This makes sense now. I remember the thread. Yes this was the post I was referring to. I can see the context of your post now. Not sure I agree with your tactic there but it does reinforce what I've learned from all this (keep an openmind and try to stay in not-knowing mind). Thanks for explaining in a non defensive way.

I need to listen to the whole asshole video. I tried but I need headphones as even with my laptop at full volume I can't really hear you well enough. I listened to a few snippets before I gave up and decided it needs headphones which I don't have available right now. I wanted to share this with you. I've never interacted with you before. I think you can take it as you seem to be working hard on your development and you have a fair bit of support on here. If I didn't think you could take this, or I thought you were overly vulnerable I probably would just remain quiet and leave it alone. It's regards a nasty post you made. I can't even remember the thread or much of the wording, or exactly when it was. It wasn't a post toward me, or even a thread I was involved in (I think). I don't think you post nastiness much, if at all, so I got a feeling you will remember what I'm talking about. You came back onto the thread and made some of kind of apology to the dude I think. I've seen loads of arguments on here and insults flying around, but this comment of yours I recall was nasty, hitting someone well below the belt. He seemed to be okay with it, but that's not the point really. I can't remember if I saw the post before I signed up here or when I was a lurker looking around. The post I saw of yours felt so extreme to me it made me always think of your post every time I saw your username and Avatar on here. All this time I have negatively associated your presence on this forum to that one post you made. Whenever I saw your name on here I thought you were some nasty, bullying internet keyboard warrior. The reason I'm posting this here is that it taught me a lesson about judging someone. I've seen loads of your posts now and you seem much more of a sensitive person than I ever imagined. In fact, I'm pretty sure you would have reflected on your outburst toward this guy. You also have more courage than me in terms of posting these video's and opening yourself up a bit. I respect that. Also, what you did when you unloaded on this dude, I've done stuff like that when I was younger, so I have to realise how hypercritical it was of me to judge you like that. But it honestly did make me think "nasty bastard" every time I saw your name on here. I don't think like that anymore. I owe it to you and I owe it to myself in terms of accountability to make this post. I am not being deliberately vague about your nasty post. I can't remember the specifics, I just know nasty when I see it. I've done it myself!

There's loads I can take from this and I haven't even looked at this colour coded model of self-development. I love the thing about starting with WHY and not the WHAT. Get people on board before you depart from the platform!!!!! I also really like the part about not automatically trying to offer a solution and a FIX. It's easy to jump into solution focused stuff straight off the bat. For some people this is what they want/expect, but not everyone likes this approach. Some need to be disarmed or otherwise engaged before you start offering ideas and solutions. Like you say, some need to be listened to first. People need to vent some times. I also read from your post that it's not about a "one size fits all" response or communication style. Something we say in AA that relates to your bit about picking up your own trash, is to "keep your side of the street clean", sometimes that's all you can do. However, as we know, in life it can be too easy to offer/insist to sweep up someone else's side of the street (under the guise that it's in their best interests), while your side of the stress is a big pile of shit. A kind of "do as I say, not as I do" tactic. I'm also liking the vibe of "concentrate more on what you are doing, rather than what everyone is doing/not doing". So I see advantages in your perspective regardless of all this yellow, green, blue, orange stuff (which I intend to read up as it sounds interesting). Do you have a journal or blog or anything else I can look at?

I like the topic. Anything pragmatic and to do with values I like to read about. I also like to read about things that will benefit those around us and the world and not just our own needs. However, do you mind if I ask for bit more definition of what you mean by survival and what you mean by being? I know it sounds a stupid question but... for example survival could mean just to keep breathing or it could mean much more..... Also what is being? I think this is a term used a lot on this forum, but I am new....

I don't know the Sedona method but have heard of it. I tried to get into some Lester Levinson but not too sure of it right now. I think Sedona method might be modelled on some of his stuff. My own view based on my current understanding and experience is that for me, letting go of troublesome emotions and feelings gets stalled without some cognitive work too. Unless monkey mind is tamed or there is an advanced level of detachment from thoughts, my thoughts get in the way of letting go of my emotions. This is where the David Hawkins book has really helped me out. If I read him correct, he argues that it's pissing in the wind trying to surrender ego dominated perspectives and feelings if you don't accurately identify the pay off's you get from ego running wild. You have to surrender the pay off's first. It makes sense to me. The Osho book I reviewed on here also helps with this. As does the work of Don Miguel Ruiz. I'm really in letting go mode. I'm trying to stop myself being in 'acquire' mode and just keep the focus on surrendering. I have a shit load of crap that needs to be jettisoned to make room for the good stuff. Or... the good stuff is all there already but buried in the shit. Either way, without letting go, nothing good will happen for me.

There is a bible for children. I think it's called the message. I struggle with the King James version so I use a different one. There are some good websites that if you type in the verse it will give you the same message but in easier to understand English language. These sites are good as they link to different Bible translations so you can end up seeing just how 'watered down'the translation is from the King James version. It's good to compare in case you feel a verse has been translated so much that it's lost it's original meaning.

I'm so new to the Bible I am not even sure if this post is what you are looking for. I don't know if these things were said by Jesus or they were said by people who either (a) knew Jesus or (b) are generally passing on his message. I'm at the beginning of my Bible journey and I'm loving it. At the moment I am focusing on how the Bible reflects values to live by, so here are some of my favourite parts from the Bible. Humility James 1:19 My dear brothers and sisters, take note of this: Everyone should be quick to listen, slow to speak and slow to become angry. John 3:30 He must become more important while I become less important. Luke 6:37 Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven Mark 8:34-35 Then, calling the crowd to join his disciples, he said, “If any of you wants to be my follower, you must give up your own way, take up your cross, and follow me. If you try to hang on to your life, you will lose it. But if you give up your life for my sake and for the sake of the Gospel, you will save it”. Matthew 5:5 Blessed are the meek, for they will inherit the earth. Proverbs 11:12 It is foolish to speak scornfully of others. If you are smart, you will keep quiet. Proverbs 18:12 No one is respected unless he is humble; arrogant people are on the way to ruin. Psalm 4:4 Don’t sin by letting anger control you. Think about it overnight and remain silent. Titus 3:2 Tell them not to speak evil of anyone, but to be peaceful and friendly, and always to show a gentle attitude toward everyone. Compassion Ephesians 4:29 Do not let any unwholesome talk come out of your mouths, but only what is helpful for building others up according to their needs, that it may benefit those who listen. Galatians 6:2 Carry each other's burdens, and in this way you will fulfil the law of Christ. Proverbs 11:24-25 One person gives freely, yet gains even more; another withholds unduly, but comes to poverty. A generous person will prosper; whoever refreshes others will be refreshed. Proverbs 31:8-9 Speak up for those who cannot speak for themselves; ensure justice for those being crushed. Speak up and judge fairly; defend the rights of the poor and needy. Forgiveness Hebrews 8:12 For I will forgive their wickedness and will remember their sins no more. Isaiah 43:25 I—yes, I alone—will blot out your sins for my own sake and will never think of them again. Luke 23:34 Jesus said, "Father, forgive them, for they don't know what they are doing Matthew 5:7 Blessed are the merciful, for they will be shown mercy. Matthew 18: 21-22 Then Peter came to him and asked, “Lord, how often should I forgive someone who sins against me? Seven times?” “No, not seven times,” Jesus replied, “but seventy seven times” Other 1 Corinthians 13:4-7 (Love) Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It does not dishonor others, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres. John 14:27 (Fear) I am leaving you with a gift—peace of mind and heart. And the peace I give is a gift the world cannot give. So don’t be troubled or afraid. Philippians 4:6-9 (Prayer) Don’t worry about anything; instead, pray about everything. Tell God what you need, and thank him for all he has done. Then you will experience God’s peace, which exceeds anything we can understand. His peace will guard your hearts and minds as you live in Christ Jesus. And now, dear brothers and sisters, one final thing. Fix your thoughts on what is true, and honorable, and right, and pure, and lovely, and admirable. Think about things that are excellent and worthy of praise. Keep putting into practice all you learned and received from me—everything you heard from me and saw me doing. Then the God of peace will be with you. Paul’s Thanks for Their Gifts Romans 12:2 (Temptation) Do not conform to the pattern of this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind. Then you will be able to test and approve what God's will is--his good, pleasing and perfect will.

I was hoping a thread like this would pop up. Thanks for including me. I'm new to the Bible. All I have is what are my favourite verses and I've barely scratched the service. Catch up tomorrow ?

There is a pandemic on the forum. Apologies if this has been covered before. Does anyone have a theory why we are so Male top heavy? There are a few women bravely flying the flag. Am I being naive in worrying about this? Most of the really bad stuff that happens on this planet is because of man not woman. I just think that it cannot be a good thing to have all these men under one roof. Before anyone asks me to leave in order to reduce the Male cohort by one, I cannot leave. I like it on here if I am serious. Am I the only one who finds it weird that men are giving men advice on how to treat women. Is that not like the blind leading the blind? Half joking here. Tongue in cheek comment. I await the deep actualised.org version of psychoanalysis as to why i have noticed this and think it's an issue.

@integral That's a good one, thank you.

You are right and I was wrong. What I said was false and how you have responded is the truth.

@Psychonaut That's really good thanks for sharing

@jbram2002 Having been and still being in AA this forum is a good place for me further practice humility and open mindedness. I also get to practice giving something and not expecting anything back in return. I can also develop my truth without trying to force feed it to someone else. I'm planning on watching some of Leo's earlier general self help videos at some point. I think there is a few he did that are 30mins long. At the moment I'm not too interested in Leo's current stuff. He is not the reason I am here but that could change, you never know.

Is there any teaching, any book, or any part of the Bible you are finding most helpful right now? Do you feel being on the forum is shedding any light for you? It is for me, I was just curious as to how you are finding it.

That is so beautifully worded, but also so pragmatic.