"intimacy"

[Schizophonia]

@Judy2 What are you afraid of if you gain some fat ?

It's an illusion to believe that you can't be loved because you gain a little fat/water retention in your face, maybe in fact you will look better from the outside, but you are convinced of the opposite because of humiliating experiences related to being overweight or something like that.

[Judy2]

suicide has never really been an option for me. it's mostly just a matter of how do i live and tolerate life, how do i survive somehow. 

it's always just about Life, and that i want life to be good and okay for me, and i don't know how to make that happen.

why am i so helpless and weak? Why is this so hard? it's too hard. so hard that the struggle is taking up too much space - not an enjoyable, adventurous amount of space, but it's all one gigantic vacuum of despair and dread and helplessness, of EVERYTHING being affected, nothing being right or easy or simple anymore. it's too much. it's not okay.

whoever scripted this: this is not okay! some sense of quest, challenge, adventure may be fun, may indeed be needed in life - but this is too much! it's taking away way too much from the joy and fulfilment and inloveness that i know life should be.

i don't even need life to be perfect, i'm okay with some levels of challenge and discomfort. but this is too much, God! it's too much. it's taking up too much room and ruining all the good bits. please just let me live in peace, let me be and let me breathe, for once. for God's sake!

[Judy2]

@Schizophonia yeah it's just that there's a whole identity wrapped up in that.

i also feel a lot more free to do stuff, wear what i want to wear, go where i want to go, when i'm skinny.

when i'm too big i have to hide in my room and can only go out at night and can't go swimming and can only wear baggy clothes and have to be ashamed of myself when i'm around people. that has been my lived experience for a few summers while being at a higher weight, and it's not something i'm very eager to re-live.

[Judy2]

@Schizophonia it also doesn't help that i've got a whole lot of other problems (emotional regulation type of stuff and self-worth issues and so on) that i know i need therapy for, which i am struggling to find right now.

and i've got that ed diagnosis on paper, and my life's a mess, which is something i can't fix all by myself.

if i fix the weight part all by myself and still need help with the rest, they might not take me seriously or might discredit the validity of my struggles with body image and so on. i think? basically a big fear is not being taken seriously.

last time i spoke with a therapist i was told about how unusual it was that i managed to weight-restore without therapeutic help when i was 18...and that felt pretty bad, being called "atypical" for that when it was literally me taking a massive, incredible leap of faith and doing what felt like the impossible...because i had to, because otherwise i would have died.

my best friend also does this. not even on purpose, but he invalidates my very real ed struggles and it would be sort of helpful to have something real to show him as to make him understand that i'm not just making this up, and that it's got a very powerful hold on my brain...because this stuff does shape you, when it's all you're thinking about and all that matters throughout your formative years.

[Judy2]

@Schizophonia 

so basically the belief is that my emotional reality i best expressed, acknowledged, and validated, when it's written all over my body...either in the form of self-harm scars, or being too thin.

i don't know what to do with my emotions to express or process them in a healthy sort of way. 

[Schizophonia]

7 minutes ago, Judy2 said:

@Schizophonia yeah it's just that there's a whole identity wrapped up in that.

i also feel a lot more free to do stuff, wear what i want to wear, go where i want to go, when i'm skinny.

when i'm too big i have to hide in my room and can only go out at night and can't go swimming and can only wear baggy clothes and have to be ashamed of myself when i'm around people. that has been my lived experience for a few summers while being at a higher weight, and it's not something i'm very eager to re-live.

Ahah yea but it's not like you'll go from anorexia to overweight, like you eat more and wake up one morning being big lol; you really have to eat A LOT or have untreated hypothyroidism to become overweight.
And even if you were really overweight, it's not like people would make fun of you, and if there are any stares, 

It's probably pointless telling you this at my level, I don't think I'm the one who's going to succeed in reprogramming your subconscious lol, but yea it's in your head.

13 minutes ago, Judy2 said:

@Schizophonia it also doesn't help that i've got a whole lot of other problems (emotional regulation type of stuff and self-worth issues and so on) that i know i need therapy for, which i am struggling to find right now.

and i've got that ed diagnosis on paper, and my life's a mess, which is something i can't fix all by myself.

Erectile dysfunction ? 😅

I must misunderstand.

 

13 minutes ago, Judy2 said:

if i fix the weight part all by myself and still need help with the rest, they might not take me seriously or might discredit the validity of my struggles with body image and so on. i think? basically a big fear is not being taken seriously.

last time i spoke with a therapist i was told about how unusual it was that i managed to weight-restore without therapeutic help when i was 18...and that felt pretty bad, being called "atypical" for that when it was literally me taking a massive, incredible leap of faith and doing what felt like the impossible...because i had to, because otherwise i would have died.

my best friend also does this. not even on purpose, but he invalidates my very real ed struggles and it would be sort of helpful to have something real to show him as to make him understand that i'm not just making this up, and that it's got a very powerful hold on my brain...because this stuff does shape you, when it's all you're thinking about and all that matters throughout your formative years.

Ok it means eating disorder i am twisted.

I see.

 

[Schizophonia]

15 minutes ago, Judy2 said:

@Schizophonia 

so basically the belief is that my emotional reality i best expressed, acknowledged, and validated, when it's written all over my body...either in the form of self-harm scars, or being too thin.

i don't know what to do with my emotions to express or process them in a healthy sort of way. 

What would make you happy

[Judy2]

6 hours ago, Schizophonia said:

What would make you happy

yeah i'll have to think about that😅

probably something like being comfortable with myself, feeling at home, having a grounded sense of self-worth, a stable social circle of people who i relate to and feel connected with, someday a partner and a family and kids...

[RendHeaven]

8 hours ago, Schizophonia said:

Erectile dysfunction ? 😅

eating disorder

[RendHeaven]

On 7/7/2025 at 11:06 PM, Judy2 said:

no one knows this or sees this, i'm all on my own.

https://www.instagram.com/recoveryandiscovery/

[Judy2]

@RendHeaven
thank you:) i know there are also lots of recovery channels on YouTube. at times i do feel understood, listening to some of them. 

 

[RendHeaven]

On 7/8/2025 at 5:43 AM, Judy2 said:

i wonder what you guys think

I read through the last 3 pages and it broke my heart

you're going through so much. I'm sorry.

19 hours ago, Judy2 said:

...but yeah, in practice it's really hard. because my sense of identity and self-worth is 1000% tied up in my appearance. (cause what else is there?)

There's so much more, but I cannot tell you what that is.

From now on, spend some time every day advocating for yourself. Every time you have a depressive thought about your looks, balance that with a charitable thought about what makes you powerful (hint: notice you're still standing even after 27 pages of pain. You've got heart.)

I want to share a performance that really brought me to tears (timestamped). It's in Japanese, but if you turn on CC subtitles then it should translate the lyrics for you. Headphones recommended.

The performer, CHIKA, is singing a song called "BIJIN" (which means: beautiful woman). The core theme is about overcoming the oppressive expectations of looks. She got to this stage through believing in her voice even as the whole world was telling her that she's too ugly (Japan is a very judgemental society especially towards women)

On 6/30/2025 at 1:28 AM, Judy2 said:

i want someone to explain my situation to me and tell me what to do

I don't want to give too much unsolicited advice, because I don't want you to feel attacked or misunderstood or belittled. I understand that even simple words of encouragement from someone else can sound like "you're not enough"

And more importantly I just don't know all the details of your situation. I don't want to give blanket advice that might do more harm than good.

But here's a starting point:

1) Be nicer to yourself. you are your own bully. now choose to become your own guardian angel (against your own bullying voice). If you can attack yourself, then you can also love yourself.

2) Eat. starving yourself is not worth it. Absolute weight should not actually be your prime concern. What ACTUALLY matters is looking good while feeling good. This can be done at 21+BMI as long as you have the right muscle to fat ratio. In other words, you can actually gain scale weight (and thus feed yourself precious calories and nutrients) WITHOUT looking flabby or puffy. If you have your doubts, let me know. I could rattle on and on about this but I'll stop here because I don't want to trigger any hard feelings. My only point here is that looking good is not inherently tied to being stick thin.

3) Gym. Just keep going. Don't make it a chore or obligation. Don't make a whole thing out of it. No guilt. Movement and exercise is self-love. Go because you want to show up for YOU. If you stay consistent, your future self will thank you with tears.

4) Posture. Based on your comment here: 

20 hours ago, Judy2 said:

also, my lower belly tends to stick out a lot. i can feel that it's not fat because the part that sticks out is further beneath the skin. might be either my intestines or my uterus...but it looks like it sticks out in a more extreme way than it does for other women. (i also know the lower belly had that extreme curve to it even when i was a few kilos underweight in the autumn/winter...maybe it's the intestines or uterus being even more pronounced in their curve because of an absence of belly fat? i'm trying not to worry about it...but i do think about what other people think when they see that when i'm wearing gym shorts or a dress. i wonder if they think i'm fat, or quite slim.)

...you almost certainly have a postural issue which is promoting sub-optimal aesthetics. This is fixable. I've done it. Let me know if you want more info. Otherwise, feel free to ignore this comment. Just trying to give you hope that you're not broken or doomed.

5) Patience. I would guess that a lot of the stress and tension and not feeling safe comes from the conflict between wanting to change and become as beautiful as possible VS the belief that it's not possible for you anymore, or the belief that beauty must come from pain and sacrifice and self-harm. This makes you yo-yo between almost giving up VS wanting to go all-in and almost killing yourself.

I want to open your mind to the possibility that yes, you CAN change and be more beautiful... but no, you DON'T have to self-harm. Yes, you can have the best of both worlds. You can achieve a healthy bodyweight, with a healthy relationship to food, with a stellar body composition, with perfect posture, AND feel good AND look better than you've ever looked. If you disagree and think that this is not possible, then that is a sign of close-mindedness.

You can have the best of all worlds, but only if you show up for yourself in small ways, doing healthy micro-habits across a long time horizon i.e. multiple years. This takes vision and faith and hope (+trial and error and studying). Your inner gremlin who wants to be BEAUTIFUL NOW hates to hear this and thinks "ah hell what's the point? that won't work for me. let's just give up"

Don't believe that voice. We're rooting for you.

Edited July 10 by RendHeaven
added minor details

[Judy2]

@RendHeaven thank you, that's very sweet of you:)

1) i'm trying....mostly just sharing the darker thoughts here, too, because they want to be heard. otherwise i feel like i'm all on my own and no one sees what i'm battling all the time. that's why i tend to share more of the negative bits than the positive counter-arguments...but i guess i should be trying to focus more on those...will do.

2) i know that other women can look beautiful and lean even at higher bmis, but i sort of feel like i'm the exception because of the way my face is naturally shaped and because i am short and have got a very narrow bone structure, so i easily get that chubby look, i think. but yes, theoretically you're right and i'm trying to give that a chance.

3) yes that's what i intend to do:) i'm also trying to let go of all those comparisons, but it's been rough these first two weeks, given that i'm new to all of this. i know that thinness isn't the only one way to measure beauty - it's just the one parameter i've habitually focussed on for so long, because that makes for a very simple and clear-cut definition of how i think i can compensate my sense of inferiority.

4) how do you think my posture affects how my lower belly sticks out? i have never considered this possibility before. i always thought it had something to do with indigestion or bloating.

5) there are a lot of other areas in my life that are seeping with instability that i genuinely do not know how to resolve. the body image issue is just the tip of the iceberg. 

 

[RendHeaven]

1 hour ago, Judy2 said:

1) i'm trying....mostly just sharing the darker thoughts here, too, because they want to be heard. otherwise i feel like i'm all on my own and no one sees what i'm battling all the time. that's why i tend to share more of the negative bits than the positive counter-arguments...but i guess i should be trying to focus more on those...will do.

I see

No, I'm glad. In that case, just keep going. No need to change. You had us worried for a sec lol

1 hour ago, Judy2 said:

2) i know that other women can look beautiful and lean even at higher bmis, but i sort of feel like i'm the exception because of the way my face is naturally shaped and because i am short and have got a very narrow bone structure, so i easily get that chubby look, i think. but yes, theoretically you're right and i'm trying to give that a chance.

3) yes that's what i intend to do:) i'm also trying to let go of all those comparisons, but it's been rough these first two weeks, given that i'm new to all of this. i know that thinness isn't the only one way to measure beauty - it's just the one parameter i've habitually focussed on for so long, because that makes for a very simple and clear-cut definition of how i think i can compensate my sense of inferiority.

I hear ya

If you're prone to storing fat in your face, I understand why it's so tempting to keep your bodyweight low.

Muscle will be your best friend going forward for so many reasons - yes, even as a woman. Muscle will allow you to eat and nourish yourself and gain weight without giving you facial fat.

And no, you will not end up looking "too buff," which is a common concern amongst ladies. You will never get bulging arms or shredded veins like a guy even if you tried to, simply because you don't have testosterone coursing through you. What's more likely is that muscle will make you look toned and thick in all the right places, like the glutes (hip thrusts are amazing for this. If the bar looks intimidating, you can pull out a mat in the corner and start with glute bridges).

There's no rush though, of course. Near term goal should just be to fall in love with the gym, to remove any pressure or guilt, and to just show up as consistently as possible.

2 hours ago, Judy2 said:

4) how do you think my posture affects how my lower belly sticks out? i have never considered this possibility before. i always thought it had something to do with indigestion or bloating.

I've actually been very thin my whole life, but for the last 5 or so years I struggled with what I thought was chronic bloating. I would always look pregnant as fuck for no reason, which was jarring because I would be skinny otherwise, and then my fucking gut would blow out like a balloon, regardless of meals. It was so annoying, and I thought I was fundamentally broken. I tried every indigestion hack - low carb, probiotics, prebiotics, antibiotics, parasite cleanse, antifungal medication, more fiber, no fiber, restrictive diets, fasting, electrolyte balance/hydration hacks... Literally nothing worked. I was honestly on the verge of just accepting it forever.

But then earlier this year I discovered that my posture was actually chronically fucked up and that was 100% the culprit. I had a combination of deep anterior pelvic tilt and shallow chest breathing + severely weakened TVA muscles which caused my organs to literally collapse outward. Since I've addressed this, I have a completely flat stomach now, fully relaxed.

The scary thing is, a lot of people actually have this exact same posture issue without even knowing it. It's the screens and the chronic sitting. Also nobody ever taught us how to breathe properly.

If you find yourself constantly looking pregnant, posture would be the very first thing to suspect IMO. If it was indigestion, then there would be pain/discomfort/poor bowel movement as signs, and what you eat (or not) would yield visible differences. If you're looking pregnant all the time no matter what you eat, but it doesn't hurt, and you're sure that it's not fat - then there's a 99% chance that it's posture.

2 hours ago, Judy2 said:

5) there are a lot of other areas in my life that are seeping with instability that i genuinely do not know how to resolve. the body image issue is just the tip of the iceberg. 

One thing at a time. You'll be ok :]

[Judy2]

12 minutes ago, RendHeaven said:

I see

No, I'm glad. In that case, just keep going. No need to change. You had us worried for a sec lol

aaaah....i'm sorry!

 

30 minutes ago, RendHeaven said:

And no, you will not end up looking "too buff," which is a common concern amongst ladies. You will never get bulging arms or shredded veins like a guy even if you tried to, simply because you don't have testosterone coursing through you. What's more likely is that muscle will make you look toned and thick in all the right places, like the glutes (hip thrusts are amazing for this. If the bar looks intimidating, you can pull out a mat in the corner and start with glute bridges).

yeah i'm starting to have a bum now. it's quite the experience. never really understood the hype around why people care about that visually, but it feels nice having one lol. especially when wearing dresses.

34 minutes ago, RendHeaven said:

If you find yourself constantly looking pregnant, posture would be the very first thing to suspect IMO. If it was indigestion, then there would be pain/discomfort/poor bowel movement as signs, and what you eat (or not) would yield visible differences. If you're looking pregnant all the time no matter what you eat, but it doesn't hurt, and you're sure that it's not fat - then there's a 99% chance that it's posture.

One thing at a time. You'll be ok :]

i believe it may be a combination of bloating and bad posture for me. i'll address both:)  which are the muscles i need to train to fix the posture issue? (TVA, like you said?) i think i'm doing an exercise for that at the gym where i press something down with my chest.

[RendHeaven]

5 minutes ago, Judy2 said:

yeah i'm starting to have a bum now. it's quite the experience. never really understood the hype around why people care about that visually, but it feels nice having one lol. especially when wearing dresses.

If you do frequent lower-body resistance training in the gym, as is popular with the ladies, and eat mostly protein (chicken, eggs, greek yogurt, etc) you can almost think of it like the calories you eat will get "gobbled up" by your bum and your face will be spared lol

it IS possible to eat guilt-free and look better overtime! don't give up, keep experimenting until you find what works for you, and continue to show up for yourself

13 minutes ago, Judy2 said:

i believe it may be a combination of bloating and bad posture for me. i'll address both:)  which are the muscles i need to train to fix the posture issue? (TVA, like you said?) i think i'm doing an exercise for that at the gym where i press something down with my chest.

Yes both is possible. regarding the posture side, there's a lot that goes into it so I'll try to just highlight the fundamentals:

• Check to see where your center of gravity is when you're standing straight, feet flat, fully relaxed. You should be "settled" in your heels, NOT your toes - and your "center" should feel rooted in your bum, not your stomach.
• Check if you have anterior pelvic tilt (very likely). If you do, then work on holding posterior pelvic tilt 24/7

• When you breathe in, your core should expand. When you breathe out, your core should contract. If you're breathing in and out through your chest, you will notice your core expansion and contraction is backwards. Work on breathing into your lower ribcage for proper airflow 24/7
• Try to walk or stand or lie down flat more than you sit. Excessive sitting leads to collapse and dysfunction. Occasional sitting is fine, but not hours and hours.
• Do kneeling lunge hip flexor stretch with posterior pelvic tilt. You should feel a stretch all the way up to your stomach due to the emphasis on posterior pelvic tilt

• Do 90-90 ab hold with ribcage breathing. lower back touching the floor. feet barely touching the wall, you should feel this deep in your abs (TVA muscle is your deep lower ab layer). breathe through your core with a forceful exhale, NOT your chest.

• Do goblet squats with a light weight in front of you. This helps with building full body muscle + also ingrains good posture and contributes to flat stomach over time.

If you take these posture steps seriously, you should begin seeing results in your stomach within 1-2 weeks.

But you may find it challenging at first. Especially, holding posterior tilt + ribcage breathing 24/7 and refusing to sit for extended periods of time will demand a lot of awareness and persistence and may become tiring. But if this works and your stomach turns flat, you'll never want to go back.

[Judy2]

@RendHeaven thank you very much:)

[Judy2]

...still had a pretty rough day today.

when i was trying to do my afternoon embroidery and work on my thesis, my neighbour started his opera singing practice and it felt like needles piercing right through me. i grabbed my stuff and almost ran outside while my anxiety was going through the roof. ... waited a bit, then came back, contemplated whether to go get some distraction skills (ammonium and so forth), opted to self-harm instead. because if i work on the tension, there's still the emotion, which i have been trying but failing to resolve for days. and i'm constantly trying to figure out a solution to my situation, and failing. (later i considered that this was bad because once again i taught my brain that cutting is the only way to cope with high stress levels.)

wrote a few texts to my mum and we spoke on the phone this evening. it was a rather invalidating, triggering conversation (of course it was) and her tone only made me feel more uncomfortable and anxious. aaaah! ....feelig so unsteady, SO overwhelmed! 

i hate myself, i'm struggling.

trying so hard to fix my LIFE but i don't know if i can make it happen. i'm trying so, so, so hard, why isn't this working?? i thought i was smart lol, why do i suck this bad? life is so messy i can't find any solutions for anything, because everything always turns out more complicated than it should be and nothing works out as smoothly and easily as it should. (like my thesis. like finding a therapist to work with. like having a basic conversation with my mother without feeling emotionally invalidated and hurt and ugly. talking to my mother about my emotional problems should feel beautiful and helpful - she only made me feel misunderstood and ugly and real bad about myself.)

ouch!

 

it's all so much. why is no one helping me? i feel like i 1000% would need a therapist to explain to.me all of the subtleties of my situation. this is too much for me to cope with. i don't know how to fix all of this. i don't know how to fix my life or how to live a good life, or even a tolerable life where i don't have to be anxious 24/7. I FEEL SO UGLY!. this is all too much. just way too much to deal with, way too much to tolerate or work with.

[Judy2]

i hate myself

[Judy2]

i feel like i need someone to help me with all of this, cause it's all too much.

i'm trapped with a brain that's constantly calling myself or my parents ugly, that gets anxious in most environments because of random noise that i can't do anything about, i'm struggling with my body, my thesis, my future, my social life....everything is so intricate and there are no easy solutions, there are so, so, so many subtleties at play and i feel completely powerless trying to fix any of this or ever achieving any significant amount of improvement anywhere. life will always be a struggle.

i think depression and hopelessness is generally a lot higher than it was just about 2 weeks ago. 

i'm really fighting, i'm really trying to act wisely now and to put all my theoretical knowledge into practice...but it's all SO DAMN HARD.