I LIKE the last of us 2 for this reason.

[Eren Eeager]

I like how it killed Joel ( the main charachter in the previous part) from the beginning like fuck u yall, I don't care about how attached you are as human beings, this is reality bitches!!. By the way Joel deserved it, he killed the scientists team that was about to save earth from the plaque. So he is not the absolute good you all wanted him to be

It is silly how movies, and games protray main characters as absolute good and invincible. The last of us two said a big fuck u to all of that.

Just look at people's reaction to the death of their beloved all good Joel. It is just too good.

 

[DocWatts]

Eh, my problem comes less from them killing Joel, and more from the fact that a revenge story is one of the less interesting things they could have done in the setting they created. I would have preferred something that further fleshed out the world they created, and that spent more time exploring Joel and Ellie's complicated relationship. 

I'll give them points for taking a huge creative risk at least, even if the end results weren't what I would have liked to explore thematically in a TLOU sequel.

 

Edited December 6, 2020 by DocWatts

[r0ckyreed]

4 minutes ago, Eren Eeager said:

By the way Joel deserved it, he killed the scientists team that was about to save earth from the plaque. So he is not the absolute good you all wanted him to be

Deserve is relative and is creation of your mind. Nobody deserves anything really. 
 

Realize that Joel killed the scientists out of love, and realize that you would have done the same thing if you had a daughter figure.

He did it out of love. The game goes full circle if you think about it. In the beginning, he lost Sarah and in the end, he was faced with this losing his “daughter” again.

He did not want to lose Ellie like he did Sarah.

You have to realize that those scientists weren’t all good either. I mean they were willing to sacrifice a 14 year old girl for a vaccine without her consent.

She was in comma and they couldn’t wait for her to wake up? I mean they put her on all those drugs and they rushed the surgery when they could have waited for her consent.

Realize that almost everyone would have done what Joel did. If Marlene could have compromised with Joel and postpone surgery till Ellie wakes up, this wouldn’t have happened. The fact that they were going on with it was troublesome.

Also, Joel did not care as much about the vaccine because of how screwed up and monstrous humanity has become. It blows my mind that Ellie did not see this in part 2.

She felt like she had some obligation, but even if the vaccine is produced, you will still have those cannibals, tribes l, and hunters who are still ruthless and they are immune.

Society in that game likely won’t ever go back to normal.

I mean Joel really didn’t have a choice. What would you expect him to do after all him and Ellie have been through? He was gonna fight for her like he did when David got her.

You are right that Joel may not be “good” but he has finally come to terms with himself from before the pandemic. The 20 year period, he did crap things to survive. But now his survival and sense of purpose has been as a father figure to Ellie. 
 

The thing that pissed me off was that he saved Abby’s life and yet she still killed him. I mean she did the exact same thing Joel did really. 

[Eren Eeager]

26 minutes ago, r0ckyreed said:

The thing that pissed me off was that he saved Abby’s life and yet she still killed him. I mean she did the exact same thing Joel did really.

Abbys is not all good also. But I was focusing on Joel the character that people loved and praised. Both of them followed their egos. Joel did not think of the greater good and Abby could not forgive. Playing with Abby, the character that killed your beloved JOEL was an on point challenge for people attachment to the main charachters in movies and video games which is something I find cool. 

[r0ckyreed]

26 minutes ago, Eren Eeager said:

Playing with Abby, the character that killed your beloved JOEL was an on point challenge for people attachment to the main charachters in movies and video games which is something I find cool. 

I agree. I grew to becoming attached to her as well and her friends.
 

it is important to notice that The theme of the first game is utilitarianism. If you listen closely, Joel explains this to Ellie in Pittsburgh and the theme is throughout the game as well.

I realized that TLOU showed us utilitarianism and the problems of it. 
 

The greater good is relative thing. The surgery wasn’t guaranteed to work. But even if it did, the vaccine wouldn’t restore humanity like I said. It would only make humanity more immune I think. We would still have The Rattlers, David’s camp, and Scars, and other clans like that around.

But it is hard to tell what the fireflies would have done with such a vaccine. I don’t know lol.