Need help unraveling the mystery that is my sleep

[Hansu]

Hey!

Long story short:
For all my life I have required more sleep than others to feel alert and awaken. I have slept 8-9 hours a day since I was a teenager, for the past 2 years I've clocked in roughly 8.5 hours a night, waking up early even on weekends.

I have been suffering some back pains for the past few months. My last 3 weeks of sleep has been a horror story, because I would wake up 2-3 times a night in pain and I'd have to take pills and walk around to ease the pain just to sleep. Some nights I lost 2 hours of sleep to the pain.

But last night I figured it out. I figured out what caused the pain and for the first time in 3 weeks, I slept all through the night! 8.5 hours of sleep! I wake up with absolutely no pain holy shit Im happy for this!
The problem is, now Im unbelievably tired (My polar activitybracelet rated this nights sleep 4.2/5). Like I hadn't slept one hour last night! It took me this day to figure out that I was never tired in the past 3 weeks despite waking up 2-3 times a night for 20-60 minutes!

In the past 6 months I have changed somewhat that supposedly improve sleep quality, which are weekly excercise, sleeping positions, losing weight and taping my mouth during night to restore natural nasal breathing during sleep. Could it be that I now need much less sleep than the 8-9 hours I've clocked for all my life, or could it be that waking up at night and doing things like drinking water has actually improved my sleep quality more than sleeping through the night?

Thanks in advance!

 

[Hansu]

Is anyone here familiar or have tried shift/segmented sleep?

Basically the idea is that you sleep for X amount of time, wake up and spend time awaken before going back to sleep and wake up in the morning

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/apr/05/tired-segmented-sleep-night
https://www.sciencealert.com/humans-used-to-sleep-in-two-shifts-maybe-we-should-again

Im thinking about trying this. Based on the abstract that I sleep better in pain if I wake up and stay up during night than without pain sleeping 8 hours straight, this might be a huge game changer for my health and solve my sleepiness problem.

[Michael569]

4 hours ago, Hansu said:

But last night I figured it out. I figured out what caused the pain and for the first time in 3 weeks, I slept all through the night! 8.5 hours of sleep! I wake up with absolutely no pain holy shit Im happy for this!

Was there something you took physically? What was causing the pain in the first place? 

 

[Hansu]

@Michael569

The pain is caused by herniated disc. I slept on the floor for a month before moving back to my bed, and in my bed the pain slowly creeped back in a way I didnt notice. Last night i placed wooden blank under the sheets so my lower back and buttocks rest on the hard surface as I sleep, and the pain never came. I didnt take any medicine for last night if thats what you are wondering

[Nahm]

@Hansu Congrats on the exercise & weight loss!! That’ll do it
Self-Love is infallible ♥️

[Hansu]

@Nahm

Thanks! I started exercising to learn more about my body (and to prevent future herniated discs, its a bitch of a condition) and its incredible how much you learn about your body when you exercise mindfully Like you could read about it for years and not grasp as much knowledge as you do after just a month of mindful gym practice

[Nahm]

@Hansu

For sure. “Words don’t teach”.

Try a reiki class. 

?

[Hansu]

@Nahm

Surprisingly I found one in my city! Cant hurt to try it out

Would be my first energy healing class/experience. I've never tried or read on those

[Nahm]

@Hansu

I hope ya love it! 

[Hansu]

@Nahm

EDIT: Sorry, it became a long post but I have been pondering these questions for my past 3 months and its been a little frustrating as the emotional response to the pain resists all my attempts to get rid of it

 

Hey, do you know about mindfully accepting bodily pain?

I have kind of accepted the intense pains I have been having for the past three months and after almost falling for the trap of letting the pain seriously overwhelm me I realized that I have some acceptance over the pain in the long term, but I have resistance to pain in the moment. The painless night in the opening post seemed to be an exception, and the pains in fact returned the following night and last night. I did go to doctor today to forward the investigation on the root problem, but I also want to use my experience to grow my mindfulness and acceptance of the moment.

I have realized that when Im having these pains on night/morning/day time, Im creating a story in my head that I want to get rid of the pains. I have found myself fantasying how good it will feel when Im finally free of these pains, and these thought trains in fact have led to life changing moments as I've picked up on exercise, increasing my flexibility, building understanding on my body and overall healthiness. All this is to find the root of what caused my health problems Im suffering at the moment so I can root them out and never suffer this condition again in my life.

But what I wonder is, that are these fantasies, thought trains and craves for the pain free future that has pushed my healthy habits to action also the factors that are causing my powerlessness to accept the momentary pain I have at times? Or could it be something else? The long term pains I have accepted and they are under control as in, I dont fear the future, but the "in the moment" pains are what overwhelms me and disturbs my sleep and other activities. When I focus my mind on the pain, it only intensifies and makes falling back to sleep harder than it was previously. Should I find the resistances I have (eg. the stories) regarding the physical pain and accept and nullify those factors with mindful focus before I can truly accept and let the physical pain be there without provoking an emotional response? Or should I do something else?

Edited December 19, 2019 by Hansu

[Nahm]

@Hansu

Oh no! Sorry to hear. 

What comes to mind from experience is weight, muscle to fat percentage, and balance. Bit of a shotgun approach, but hopefully something clicks or is useful.

Short term...

You mentioned the plank on the bed helped. Maybe a maximum firmness mattress, if you don’t already have one. 

Daily exercise is key imo. A few things to consider. During, and for a bit after weight loss, many small muscles are adjusting to the change in weight & how it’s distributed, specifically the back, as it was holding the extra weight of the front. This is a good thing, and it plays self out. One thing however to consider... if exercise involves weights / any strength training, you want evenly spread distribution. I had a major lower back pain issue for years, even though I was at a good weight and fit. I found that I had neglected the muscles area lowest on the back. Never even thought of it.  I started doing a pretty simple exercise where I’m basically, from a standing point, lifting each leg up behind me. Like the opposite of a kick motion, but slowly. I used the resistance of about 10 lbs at first on a bow flex. You can google this, it can be done without weights, and lying on your stomach too. After 1 - 2 weeks, the pain was completely gone, and that was maybe 5 years ago or so. Never came back.  So if you’re getting fit, make sure there’s a daily exercise that targets the area of pain. Also have a bone spur in my neck, got a neck weight thingy, and it fixed that too. It’s not perfect, but there’s no pain anymore. I definitely recommend bow flex. They’re simple and last, and old models which are great, can be found very cheap on EBay etc. 

Also, when exercise is done daily, the chemistry of the body changes. @Michael569 would know the details here...but endorphins, etc from exercising in the morning sure do seem to reduce pain all day. It also improves mood & outlook, which also (I believe) psychosomatically have a positive effect. If the pain is too much to exercise, a short term solution might be a steroid shot, with the exercise / fitness being the longer term plan. 

Seeing a chiropractor can help on a few levels. The manipulation overtime can significantly realign and bring relief. Also, if you find a good one, just seeing the X-ray, listening to their explanation etc, Brings a lot of finite awareness to the situation, and sometimes I think the biggest piece is just the going and doing something about it. The body likes that, so to speak, and response in kind with healing. A self-love fest.

I would do some research on an anti-inflammatory diet for sure. Ime, sugar, bread, and any carbonated drinks just blew it up, and it would take days to get back to good. Take a while to get off such roller coasters but it’s worthwhile. The right nutrients, and eating without those foods, allows the body to divert energy to strength & healing, as it is not having to compensate for what is really imo not actually ‘food’ (sugar, bread, etc)

The time of day that you eat could also play a huge role. I know it can be difficult, but try not eating anything after 8...or better yet 7. It might take a few days for the body to adjust to that but it can be a game changer. This could also aid in sleeping through the night, in addition to cutting caffeine off by maybe 2pm. 

This is ‘out there’ for some...but have you tried telling your subconscious you want this? I’ve seen this be very effective. Simply talking to yourself basically, and requesting the subconscious bring healing to the disc, and that the past is changed in kind. 

 

Longer term...

Go get two or three sessions before you assess it.   Then try out that reiki class. Reiki 1 is healing yourself. Powerful stuff. Reiki is arguably the most under-appreciated, underrated practice imo. The release of things emotionally / psychologically benefits the body, allowing more efficient natural healing. We all hold onto a lot, and get used to it, and don’t realize we are. We’re so naturally adaptive it’s nuts.  It takes energy to do that though, and likewise, we adjust and don’t realize low bodily energy has this at it’s root. Reiki 2 is about healing others. This is the real mind blowing stuff. Love in action. Love & bliss through your body would be one heck of a change of pace, and you’d be without the pain. I’d think of it as when you give your self & time for the love & healing of another, as the universe would have it, you are filled with love & healing. But, and I know it’s cliche...the thought about reiki is nothing like the experience of taking the 2 classes. 

There is also Letting go, and moving awareness. Many people find a ‘clearing’ of specific pains, by tuning into the awareness in the body, right where the pains at, and ‘moving’ the pain to another location. It’s a risky thing to say, but, the pain isn’t really from the location it seems like it is, it is all mind. “Loosening up” the relationship between the mind which is where the pain is, and the body where the mind “believes” it to be, can reduce the pain. 

Meditation of course, specifically breathing & filling the body with the breath, as well as walking meditation can be very helpful. There’s a bunch in my signature link. 

Also, Yoga, holding positions and breathing, oxygenates & strengthens the muscle which balance the body, helping muscles acclimate to weight loss muscle / balance shifting. 

I don’t want to assume, so...have you went to the dr’s? Ideally a wholistic one. Again, the hearing, doing, loving your body, taking the time to go, as well as what the doctor recommends diet & weight wise could be helpful. The difference in pain and energy at a high weight compared to a middle weight, in terms of the median ‘healthy’ weights dr’s use as a reference is very significant. And then the difference in going from a middle weight, to the ‘ideal healthy’ weight (example 6’ tall male, 150 - 155 lbs - don’t quote me on that) can be a huge difference. There is a certain carefree-healing-body zone at the most ideal weight. 5 lbs more, and we’re back at the middle weight, with the body spending energy that was diverted to healing. 

Hope something helps here. ??

[Hansu]

@Nahm

Hey, sorry for late answer! I've been rejoining with my family and friends for Christmas

On 12/19/2019 at 10:04 PM, Nahm said:

Daily exercise is key imo. A few things to consider. During, and for a bit after weight loss, many small muscles are adjusting to the change in weight & how it’s distributed, specifically the back, as it was holding the extra weight of the front. This is a good thing, and it plays self out. One thing however to consider... if exercise involves weights / any strength training, you want evenly spread distribution. I had a major lower back pain issue for years, even though I was at a good weight and fit. I found that I had neglected the muscles area lowest on the back. Never even thought of it.  I started doing a pretty simple exercise where I’m basically, from a standing point, lifting each leg up behind me. Like the opposite of a kick motion, but slowly. I used the resistance of about 10 lbs at first on a bow flex. You can google this, it can be done without weights, and lying on your stomach too. After 1 - 2 weeks, the pain was completely gone, and that was maybe 5 years ago or so. Never came back.  So if you’re getting fit, make sure there’s a daily exercise that targets the area of pain.

I increased my weekly excercise from 3 times of gym a week to 3 times of gym a week + 1h of walking on all days with not gym training. As for the gym training, Im doing a program that my personal trainer made for me, and which we update each month. The man specializes in my types of cases, and likes to leave the ones who just want muscle to his employees

On 12/19/2019 at 10:04 PM, Nahm said:

Seeing a chiropractor can help on a few levels. The manipulation overtime can significantly realign and bring relief. Also, if you find a good one, just seeing the X-ray, listening to their explanation etc, Brings a lot of finite awareness to the situation, and sometimes I think the biggest piece is just the going and doing something about it. The body likes that, so to speak, and response in kind with healing. A self-love fest.

Im actually going to a MRI (Magnetic resonance image) tomorrow. I'll be sending the results to my doctor who will determine how bad the situation is. However, unlike my original plan Im going to push and try to get through this without a surgery, because I rather suffer the pain for a little longer than take the risks that the surgery goes wrong. Unless my doctor says it wont cure without surgery.

As for chiropractor, thats definitely on my list as well! And muscle tension releasing massages.

On 12/19/2019 at 10:04 PM, Nahm said:

This is ‘out there’ for some...but have you tried telling your subconscious you want this? I’ve seen this be very effective. Simply talking to yourself basically, and requesting the subconscious bring healing to the disc, and that the past is changed in kind. 

This sounds interesting. Maybe Im subconsciously expecting symptoms as I continuously watch the symptoms mindfully. Maybe I somehow crave them and make them appear? I'll definitely try to talk to my subconscious and try to make it understand that its time to let go!
Something odd I've noticed is that whenever Im doing something that would normally bring pain but that is extremely pleasant to me, suddenly all my symptoms simply disappear.

I was on a business trip two months ago, when my back was in its worst condition. For some reason, all my symptoms disappeared for the 3 days I was on the trip. Also, a month ago as I went to visit my friend after a long long time, and for some reason 99% of my symptoms disappeared for the trip! And last Friday I sat on the bus for 10 hours without problems, but now that I am staying at my childhood home, when I sit down on a chair it wont take more than 15 minutes before my back pain to come back. Its really baffling, I wonder whether the pain is just masked somehow by the positive expectations and experiences, or whether the problem is temporarily cured somehow? Its really odd.

On 12/19/2019 at 10:04 PM, Nahm said:

Go get two or three sessions before you assess it.   Then try out that reiki class. Reiki 1 is healing yourself. Powerful stuff. Reiki is arguably the most under-appreciated, underrated practice imo. The release of things emotionally / psychologically benefits the body, allowing more efficient natural healing. We all hold onto a lot, and get used to it, and don’t realize we are. We’re so naturally adaptive it’s nuts.  It takes energy to do that though, and likewise, we adjust and don’t realize low bodily energy has this at it’s root. Reiki 2 is about healing others. This is the real mind blowing stuff. Love in action. Love & bliss through your body would be one heck of a change of pace, and you’d be without the pain. I’d think of it as when you give your self & time for the love & healing of another, as the universe would have it, you are filled with love & healing. But, and I know it’s cliche...the thought about reiki is nothing like the experience of taking the 2 classes. 

I found the Reiki 1 class in Youtube. Would taking the class in this way work, or should I go to my local teacher in person?

 

On 12/19/2019 at 10:04 PM, Nahm said:

There is also Letting go, and moving awareness. Many people find a ‘clearing’ of specific pains, by tuning into the awareness in the body, right where the pains at, and ‘moving’ the pain to another location. It’s a risky thing to say, but, the pain isn’t really from the location it seems like it is, it is all mind. “Loosening up” the relationship between the mind which is where the pain is, and the body where the mind “believes” it to be, can reduce the pain. 

This sounds really interesting. Like you move the emotional pain to somewhere else where the pain does not exist, so the original pain loses its emotional connection, and as there is no real pain in the new location, it also loses its emotional connection, so in the end there is just the observation of pain but no emotional response. IF I understood right. Im definitely gonna try this

Edit: I tried it. Its very odd, first I mirrored the pain from my left foot to my right foot, and immediately the pain disappeared while I felt some pressure on my right foot! The pain did slowly go back to my left foot, but maybe its just lack of experience? Im definitely going to practice this. Thanks!

On 12/19/2019 at 10:04 PM, Nahm said:

Meditation of course, specifically breathing & filling the body with the breath, as well as walking meditation can be very helpful. There’s a bunch in my signature link. 

I think walking meditation is going to go perfectly with my daily walking practice. Especially since I cant sit for 15 minutes without the pain growing excrusiatingly high.

 

Thanks for your help! Sorry again for the late response

[Nahm]

@Hansu You are not messin around! ??

On the Reiki, I’d attend the classes in person, vs online. 

2 hours ago, Hansu said:

maybe its just lack of experience?

Sounds like it’s coming along pretty naturally. Nice. After a while of ‘moving the awareness around’, then ‘spread’ / feel it through the entirety of the body / the body as a whole, then let it go & feel the ‘weight off’ of it. Try it over and over, going deeper into the relaxation of it. When relaxation gets ‘down to the bones’, in the feeling sense, there’s a subtly nuanced & different, awesome feeling. 

2 hours ago, Hansu said:

This sounds interesting. Maybe Im subconsciously expecting symptoms as I continuously watch the symptoms mindfully. Maybe I somehow crave them and make them appear? I'll definitely try to talk to my subconscious and try to make it understand that its time to let go!

Maybe. I’d just feel into it. In the sense, the pain is made out of the same substance as anything else. It tends to come apart / release & relax with feeling. Not for everyone, but it sounds like it’s working for you. 

2 hours ago, Hansu said:

Something odd I've noticed is that whenever Im doing something that would normally bring pain but that is extremely pleasant to me, suddenly all my symptoms simply disappear.

I was on a business trip two months ago, when my back was in its worst condition. For some reason, all my symptoms disappeared for the 3 days I was on the trip. Also, a month ago as I went to visit my friend after a long long time, and for some reason 99% of my symptoms disappeared for the trip! And last Friday I sat on the bus for 10 hours without problems, but now that I am staying at my childhood home, when I sit down on a chair it wont take more than 15 minutes before my back pain to come back. Its really baffling, I wonder whether the pain is just masked somehow by the positive expectations and experiences, or whether the problem is temporarily cured somehow? Its really odd.

This sounds on the thin line of what happening with the body, and what happening in the experience of the body. It sure does sound like you’re tapping into a gift. Maybe take it a step further from letting go, and ‘send love’, similar to ‘moving awareness’, feeling it slowly ‘moving in the body’. Similar to what you mentioned...’move’ the pain to the other foot, and fill the ‘emptied foot’, focusing on the loving goodness feeling in the foot. The body can do pretty amazing things for pain when you’re doubling down on the well being & self-love as you are. Godspeed, and best of luck with the MRI & dr visit. ??

[Hansu]

19 hours ago, Nahm said:

Sounds like it’s coming along pretty naturally. Nice. After a while of ‘moving the awareness around’, then ‘spread’ / feel it through the entirety of the body / the body as a whole, then let it go & feel the ‘weight off’ of it. Try it over and over, going deeper into the relaxation of it. When relaxation gets ‘down to the bones’, in the feeling sense, there’s a subtly nuanced & different, awesome feeling

I went to the MRI scan today, and while I was laying there with the scanning going on I had some pain on my foot. Not much, but some pain that usually lingers half a day after waking up.

So I did the following: I moved the pain to the right foot, and after a while I managed to make the pain stop while focusing. As I unfocused, the pain came back. So I moved the pain to my right foot, imagining it moving like a blue flame, attracting from the pains original spot to its mirrored new spot, and then every time I breathed I imagined myself inhaling love and acceptance of pain in a form of pink cloud. I imagined the pink substance moving from my mouth to down to my hurting leg, and what happened was that the pain moved higher up my leg. So I repeated what I just did, the pain moved again and again until it was on my lower back, where the pain in fact originates from. After that I remembered your tip to imagine moving the pain all over the body, so I did just that for a while.

After that I imagined that the pink substance of acceptance and love to go into the nerves of my body. I imagined that all the nerves in my body filled with the love and acceptance, and after the pain had disappeared I really didn't know whether it was because the physical condition got better, or because of the mental practice. So I looked for the pain, and there it was! I found the pain in my left foot, it was a bit uncomfortable, but then I focused on subsiding the pain. It subsided! Then I tried it again, the pain emerged and subsided at my will! I was so happy for finding this that I was just laying there smiling for the rest of the scan!

I dont yet know how this will work when the pain is more severe, but tomorrow morning as the pain is its highest of the day, Im going to try it out.

19 hours ago, Nahm said:

Maybe. I’d just feel into it. In the sense, the pain is made out of the same substance as anything else. It tends to come apart / release & relax with feeling. Not for everyone, but it sounds like it’s working for you

The pain is in fact, real. Im not a doctor but when I looked at the MRI scan images, it looked pretty bad. It definitely did not look like it had been healing for 3 months, I might in fact need surgery for it to heal. However, Im not doctor so Im going to leave the decision up to him.

 

19 hours ago, Nahm said:

Maybe take it a step further from letting go, and ‘send love’, similar to ‘moving awareness’, feeling it slowly ‘moving in the body’. Similar to what you mentioned...’move’ the pain to the other foot, and fill the ‘emptied foot’, focusing on the loving goodness feeling in the foot. The body can do pretty amazing things for pain when you’re doubling down on the well being & self-love as you are. Godspeed, and best of luck with the MRI & dr visit. ??

I have previously heard about sending healing energy to an injured part of the body to help it heal faster. I was thinking that I could try this with the herniated disc. Is this the same process as sending love to the foot?

Im glad to hear that the results come to me naturally Part of it could be because Im so motivated to train my body so I wont ever suffer from this problem again. Im too young to live the rest of my life with back problems.

Thanks again for your help, the moving pain tip alone is a life changer!

[Nahm]

31 minutes ago, Hansu said:

The pain is in fact, real.

Of course. It’s just not a separate real. 

33 minutes ago, Hansu said:

Is this the same process as sending love to the foot?

Yes.

33 minutes ago, Hansu said:

Thanks again for your help, the moving pain tip alone is a life changer!

Awesome! ??♥️