Nothing important is happening

[Mellowmarsh]

3 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

 

Everything is changing, a tree is changing every millisecond. That doesn't mean that it isn't rear, everything is a process, nothing is static

 

So does that mean, according to your logical reasoning the ultimate, unchanging reality (Brahman) is real?

Or, is there no such concept known of an ultimate, unchanging reality (Brahman) existing ? < and that idea is what is the illusion?

 

 

[Wilhelm44]

1 hour ago, Breakingthewall said:

 

There is a process that is happening. This process includes what we call consciousness, in which a subject is represented that interacts with the outside world and needs to self-preservation.

In this dynamic process called consciousness, the subject is represented as the center, but this doesn't imply that it's false. There is a real organism that constantly exchanges information with the outside world and interacts with other conscious subjects, and that can die, live, or reproduce based on this interaction. Where is the illusion? It's all completely real. 

You could say that the process that is happening is not permanent, it's a construction of the reality interconnected with everything else, it's not independent, but it exists. The sense of self if the recognition of being that happens is this process, and also it's absolutely real. 

 

Well yeah, in the sense that the finite and the infinite are one, everything is ultimately real. 

[Mellowmarsh]

37 minutes ago, Wilhelm44 said:

Well yeah, in the sense that the finite and the infinite are one, everything is ultimately real. 

How can one everything exist. How could one know it’s one? 
 

For one to know it exists this one would have to split into two, into knower and known. This would appear as a knowledge of this one splitting in two. And yet if there is only one and only one, then there would be nothing splitting in two, there would be nothing to divide the one into two. So that which is one must always be changeless. The changeless couldn’t change because there’d be nothing to change it. By changing nothing, nothing changes.

That why Einstein said reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one. 

[Mellowmarsh]

“Real” can only be meaningful in relation to its opposite which is meaningless.

 

So ONE is neither real or unreal. Because there is no one because there’s no other than one.

There’s nothing making one real and nothing making one unreal.

Edited 5 hours ago by Mellowmarsh

[VeganAwake]

2 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

I repeat again: the self is the fact of knowing that you are, it's a process that's happening, and it's real, because there is knowledge of being.

Sincere misunderstanding due to partial or incomplete awakening experience.

If the survival strategy/identification game of the self illusion isn’t recognized clearly, I would describe it as incomplete.

[Mellowmarsh]

3 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

I repeat again

Infinity never repeats because Infinity doesn’t have a beginning nor an end.

[Breakingthewall]

37 minutes ago, VeganAwake said:

Sincere misunderstanding due to partial or incomplete awakening experience.

If the survival strategy/identification game of the self illusion isn’t recognized clearly, I would describe it as incomplete.

What is the self according to you?

Would you say that Ramana, Ramakrishna, Jesus, al hallaj , rumi, etc, were ignorants and you are the only enlightened? Or maybe you are misunderstanding any point? Just curious.

Again: the self is the recognition of existing. It the recognition of existing and illusion?

[Mellowmarsh]

Z E N ( zero energy nullified ) 

 

Freedom at zero point.

[Mellowmarsh]

31 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

Again: the self is the recognition of existing. It the recognition of existing and illusion?

The self is a word, all words are labels and all labelled things know nothing of their existence.

 

Existence never knows it exists. The observer is the observed. 
 

The Reality is that Consciousness is a single mirror reflecting itself.

 

The mirror is empty fullness, full of emptiness, the mirror is the placeholder of its own empty reflection. 

[Breakingthewall]

4 hours ago, Mellowmarsh said:

 

So does that mean, according to your logical reasoning the ultimate, unchanging reality (Brahman) is real?

Or, is there no such concept known of an ultimate, unchanging reality (Brahman) existing ? < and that idea is what is the illusion?

 

 

What is the unchanging reality? We could say that is the unlimited being, then it wouldn't be something, not a dimension with some properties but just absence of limitations, absolute openess, previous condition of any form. 

Then there wont be Brahman and form, but Brahman always manifested as a form. The unlimited never changes because it's not anything but absolute depth that translates in being, that manifests as form

[Breakingthewall]

2 hours ago, Mellowmarsh said:

The self is a word, all words are labels and all labelled things know nothing of their existence.

 

Existence never knows it exists. The observer is the observed. 
 

The Reality is that Consciousness is a single mirror reflecting itself.

 

The mirror is empty fullness, full of emptiness, the mirror is the placeholder of its own empty reflection. 

5 hours ago, Mellowmarsh said:

 

 

Anyway your experience is recognition of being. Experience and recognition of being are synonyms. Consciousness is experience, and consciousness implies always perceived change. "Perceived" means self.

The fact of perceiving is the fact of knowing , and this fact is the self . You as a self are not an illusion but an action. Then we could say that this actions is the reality knowing what is. It's irrelevant that reality in not inherently someone or a self, because it becomes a self in the action of consciousness, then the reality is a self now. 

Imo a new born baby or a fish is perception of being, even there is not a model of "I" developed, the very fact of subjetive experience is knowledge of being . For example I took big dose of different psychedelics and any model disappear and what remains is meaningless experience happening, like waves and colors without anything else, and there is recognition of being . The only absence of that recognition is unconsciousness 

It's like there are 3 levels but all of them are modes of the first one

1 Fundamental level: self-awareness or subjective experience. Experience=self -presence because experience implies presence for itself

2 Structured level: mental model of "I" ( not illusory; it is a construct that occurs based on an exchange of information)

3 Narrative level: personal identity.

Edited 49 minutes ago by Breakingthewall