Ken Wilber - Why Should I Read His Books?

[CARDOZZO]

For people that have read his books, what did you learn?

I want to read his books but I don't really know why, what to expect, what are the pros and cons, what will I become if read it.

[CARDOZZO]

As Jed McKenna said, you don't need a PhD in waking up.

[UnbornTao]

He sounds overly intellectual and stuck in that domain, a warning sign regarding matters of consciousness. Not sure he knows his nature or if he's coming from an authentic experience. Talks and writes a lot, is smart, and can be convincing to some.

If stages, maps, and models don't help increase consciousness at all, why place so much emphasis on fitting what existence is and what it all means into a form that can be "known"?

David Hawkins and Jed McKenna's work seem much more grounded and experiential.

That said, if you're interested, give it a try. Pick up one of Ken's introductory books and decide for yourself.

Edited August 19, 2024 by UnbornTao

[CARDOZZO]

45 minutes ago, UnbornTao said:

He seems overly intellectual and stuck in that domain, which is a warning sign when it comes to matters of consciousness. Not sure he knows his nature or if he's coming from an authentic experience. He talks and writes a lot, is smart, and can be convincing to some. 

Stages, maps, and models don't help increase consciousness at all, so why place so much emphasis on fitting what existence is into a known formula or conclusion? This just lends itself to believing in it where no consciousness have been had on the nature of anything. 

On the other hand, someone like David Hawkins—setting aside his kinesiology calibration practice and consciousness model, and ignoring some of the New Age elements—appears more genuine.

That said, if you're interested, give it a try. Pick up one of Ken's introductory books and decide for yourself,

I'll follow your advice.

I will pick one introductory book to read  

[BlessedLion]

Wilber is the best in the field imo. If i could only read one author for the rest of my life, it'd be him. The more i study his work the more I'm amazed at his level of understanding and masterful way of explaining the highest spritual truths.

[Guest Nilsi]

Ken Wilber's oeuvre is a tour de force of spiritual writing, offering much to appreciate if you're inclined toward such topics.

His earlier works - The Spectrum of Consciousness, The Atman Project, Up From Eden, and to some extent his magnum opus Sex, Ecology, Spirituality - are particularly gripping. In these, Wilber's spiritual sincerity and his desire to make sense of reality are at their most urgent as he's trying to reconcile his personal experiences and convictions within the context of humanity’s great philosophical and scientific heritage.

The greatest strength of Wilber's work - its vast scope, weaving together a monumental array of materials to map out the "always already true" spiritual nature of reality - is also its greatest weakness. Profound ideas and thinkers in their own right are systematically simplified and, arguably, appropriated to support what Wilber already believes to be true and wishes to conclude anyways.

This is not an academic work, nor is it political, and it’s precisely where it tries to be these things that it lands flat on its feet. However, if you're looking for a comprehensive roadmap to spirituality and don't mind dense intellectual writing, there's much to enjoy here.

Edited August 14, 2024 by Nilsi

[CARDOZZO]

On 14/08/2024 at 1:16 AM, BlessedLion said:

Wilber is the best in the field imo. If i could only read one author for the rest of my life, it'd be him. The more i study his work the more I'm amazed at his level of understanding and masterful way of explaining the highest spritual truths.

 

On 14/08/2024 at 9:04 AM, Nilsi said:

Ken Wilber's oeuvre is a tour de force of spiritual writing, offering much to appreciate if you're inclined toward such topics.

His earlier works - The Spectrum of Consciousness, The Atman Project, Up From Eden, and to some extent his magnum opus Sex, Ecology, Spirituality - are particularly gripping. In these, Wilber's spiritual sincerity and his desire to make sense of reality are at their most urgent as he's trying to reconcile his personal experiences and convictions within the context of humanity’s great philosophical and scientific heritage.

The greatest strength of Wilber's work - its vast scope, weaving together a monumental array of materials to map out the "always already true" spiritual nature of reality - is also its greatest weakness. Profound ideas and thinkers in their own right are systematically simplified and, arguably, appropriated to support what Wilber already believes to be true and wishes to conclude anyways.

This is not an academic work, nor is it political, and it’s precisely where it tries to be these things that it lands flat on its feet. However, if you're looking for a comprehensive roadmap to spirituality and don't mind dense intellectual writing, there's much to enjoy here.

Appreciate your efforts to elucidate why it is worth reading Wilber's body of work.

I got all Ken's books. 

It will be an adventure to deeply understand myself, others, universe, religion, self-actualization & religion  

Edited August 15, 2024 by CARDOZZO

[UnbornTao]

2 hours ago, CARDOZZO said:

Appreciate your efforts to elucidate why it is worth reading Wilber's body of work.

I got all Ken's books. 

It will be an adventure to deeply understand myself, others, universe, religion, self-actualization & religion  

All of them? 

You're gonna get your PhD in (the theory of) waking up

Edited August 15, 2024 by UnbornTao

[CARDOZZO]

18 minutes ago, UnbornTao said:

All of them? 

You're gonna get your PhD in (the theory of) waking up

All of them.

I will be an Awake PhD asshole who corrects everyone  

Not only a PhD in Waking Up but also on Growing Up, Cleaning Up, Showing Up 

Edited August 15, 2024 by CARDOZZO

[CARDOZZO]

 

[BlessedLion]

On 8/14/2024 at 6:04 AM, Nilsi said:

is also its greatest weakness. Profound ideas and thinkers in their own right are systematically simplified and, arguably, appropriated to support what Wilber already believes to be true and wishes to conclude anyways

Hey brother, can you elaborate on this? Do you feel it's too much modelling?

[BlessedLion]

8 hours ago, CARDOZZO said:

All of them.

I will be an Awake PhD asshole who corrects everyone  

Not only a PhD in Waking Up but also on Growing Up, Cleaning Up, Showing Up 

If you truly study and contemplate that work, and make an effort to embody and contemplate it, you will be beyond theory, you will be awake!

[CARDOZZO]

I'm reading "The Pocket Ken Wilber" right now.

I really like his writing style. Poetic, profound, passionate and insightful.

I don't know why but it seems to me that some teachers embody a masculine tough love form to teach spirituality (Ralston/McKenna) where other teachers embody a more feminine compassionate poetic form (Adyashanti/Wilber).

Edited August 16, 2024 by CARDOZZO

[CARDOZZO]

17 minutes ago, BlessedLion said:

If you truly study and contemplate that work, and make an effort to embody and contemplate it, you will be beyond theory, you will be awake!

That's it. Contemplation+Embodiment.

[BlessedLion]

7 minutes ago, CARDOZZO said:

I'm reading "The Pocket Ken Wilber" right now.

I really like his writing style. Poetic, profound, passionate and insightful.

I don't know why but it seems to me that some teachers embody a masculine tough love form to teach spirituality (Ralston/McKenna) where other teachers embody a more feminine compassionate poetic form (Adyashanti/Wilber).

I resonate much more with the more compassionate side of teaching but there is value to that masculine side. It's limited though. The Truth is Love, so it's feminine and i think some of those teachers are missing or repressing that loving side of reality or they just feel it doesn't help their whole "way of teaching"

[CARDOZZO]

2 minutes ago, BlessedLion said:

I resonate much more with the more compassionate side of teaching but there is value to that masculine side. It's limited though. The Truth is Love, so it's feminine and i think some of those teachers are missing or repressing that loving side of reality or they just feel it doesn't help their whole "way of teaching"

I don't know if it is true but it seems that Zen-Based teachings have a more warrior/samurai/masculine way of dealing with reality.

I don't know a lot about the history of spirituality.

[CARDOZZO]

"if you think you don’t understand Self or Spirit, then rest in that which doesn’t understand, and just that is Spirit. If you think you don’t quite “get” the Self or Spirit, then rest in that which doesn’t quite get it, and just that is Spirit."

👁️

[BlessedLion]

2 hours ago, CARDOZZO said:

I don't know if it is true but it seems that Zen-Based teachings have a more warrior/samurai/masculine way of dealing with reality.

I don't know a lot about the history of spirituality.

For sure, ever heard of Renzai?

Ralston, Zen, McKenna, all have this approach, but they are lacking the Heart, imo 

[Guest Nilsi]

6 hours ago, BlessedLion said:

Hey brother, can you elaborate on this? Do you feel it's too much modelling?

The issue is that he overgeneralizes complex philosophical ideas and thinkers to fit his own narrative.

I recall an interview where Wilber mentioned reading two to three books in the morning to gather material for his work. He was specifically searching for certain patterns in these works and selectively used them to confirm his biases.

My main issue is the know-it-all attitude with which he then presents these ideas, as if skimming a few books or reading the glossary of a deep thinker’s work while having breakfast suddenly makes him an authority on the subject.

[CARDOZZO]

8 hours ago, BlessedLion said:

For sure, ever heard of Renzai?

Ralston, Zen, McKenna, all have this approach, but they are lacking the Heart, imo 

True.

Heart, Connection, Poetry, Beauty.