Forestluv

I’d say it has a double edge. Getting immersed into an enlightenment story can be a distraction and counter-productive.

@now is forever To me, your description of the german quote had an underlying suggestion. I spent many years working within alcohol and drug addiction. I find it to be a complex and nuanced area. I’d consider psychedelics to have relatively low addiction potential.

An enlightenment story can generate a seeking energy that can be helpful in early stages. Yet it also creates separation: there is me and there is enlightenment that is separate from me. Eventually this dynamic dissolves away. Yet, it can take a long time - depending on the mind-body

This assumes an egoic sober mind state is more real than a psychedelic mind state.

Categorizing personality dynamics into “fakers” and “makers” is itself a dynamic of the psychological self. Observe that dynamic without attachment or identification.

@Marc Schinkel Different approaches and environments resonate differently among people.

@Arhattobe There is a dynamic going on in your mind-body that you are unaware of.

That is a great description. That is a good look at a facet and there is more of that “essence” of being. There are other flavors as well. Early in my path the seeking was to find the answer and to figure it out. I read a lot, meditation groups, lots of chats and debates. Then I had 4 or 5 nondual experiences and the energetic seeking completely shifted. The desire and yearning was to BE that nonduality again. It sounds like you are there and it’s really advanced with a form energy that can fuel more development. Ime, I got into a trap of chasing an experience and trying to recreate the experience. One thing I learned is that there are many variations of nondual experiences. If you have an expectation it’s only certain way, you will limit your expansion possibilities. As well, I wanted to re-enter that state and stay there. I saw it as “all or nothing” and I missed lots of subtle nondual experiencies. Rather than expect and crave the “big shebang”, be observant for small glimpses and subtle nondual “teasers”. For me, moments of surprise gratitude and appreciation can open a portal to nonduality. Where I live, we had a major snowstorm today. I worked late. It was cold, dark and snowing as I walked to my car. I was dreading having to brush and scrap the snow/ice off my car. As I walked to the parking lot, lots of thoughts about work were racing through my head. Then, whammo!!! Someone cleared off all the snow and ice off my car. I was so touched and grateful someone did that. It was love. It snapped me back into the Now. I stood there in the blizzard laughing for no reason. For a moment I saw the divine in all that was around me. Being the beauty that surrounded me. Then, it fluttered away like a butterfly to it’s next flower ? One can only surrender ego to a point. Then, grace may reveal something.

I’ve noticed that too. I think there can be a couple ego flavors that do that. There are the strong ego types that drop enlightentment sound bites as it goes off on an ego trip. Then, there are egos that are dissolving and want to hold on to something for grounding. In this case, spiritual snippets. It’s like an unstable, immature start to a higher level of consciousness. It can be awkward. That’s what Carrey looks like to me in that video - like he recently entered a new level of consciousnesd and is unstable and awkward with it.

That’s a really interesting way of looking at it. It threw me for a loop because I’m trying to integrate the material and immaterial. ? I would answer “yes” , in a sense. Animals don’t have the capacity to develop an ego even remotely close to humans. Humans have a highly evolved frontal cortex and DMN. If we agree that an ego is necessary for the subjective experience of being divided, then yes - animals would not have that subjective experience without that input. So any fear that is dependent upon that human-level ego wouldn’t be experienced in animals. However, those ego-related fears that are only experienced in humans are still influenced by the more primitive limbic system. I’d say that humans and animals share some rudimentary fears. And humans also have unique fears - yet those uniquely human fears are dependent, in part, on the redumintary limbic system.

Yes, and the limbic system is within the machine and provides energy to help fuel the process. There is no “instinctual” and “non-instinctual” fear. It’s integrated.

@Jack River ♥️ ?

Posting it twice doesn’t make it true. I’m pointing to something you don’t have an interest learning about and I respect that ?

Be careful about starting a “good ego vs bad ego” dynamic. The entity calling out the “bad ego” is also ego cloaked in goodness. See if you can be a neutral observer. Just observe the psychological dynamic without judgement or criticism. As if you were watching a movie. It gets fascinating. . .

@Jack River It’s integrated, not separate.

Some very deep insights appear on the forum. Some minds won’t “see” it. A mind perceives at it’s current state.

Heehee. Nice. In my experience, it sure does seem that way. Sometimes my ego gets blindsided, and then steps back in to take control. I’d say first order would be getting startled, second order getting embarrassed and third order is a thought story that arises about what happened and what it means.

During meditation, step outside the story of thoughts and observe. Where do thoughts arise from? There is no you writing the thoughts.

A thought-based ego likes to believe it is in control the narrative. The limbic system evolved prior to the ability to think. It is the underlying driver, yet the ego doesn’t like to admit it. We are not the author of our thoughts. Brain scans can now detect thoughts before the person thinks it. The psychological self is one giant smokescreen.

Be mindful about intention. Dynamics of the psychological self get really subtle and nuanced at deeper levels. Rather than seeing beings as “dual” or “nondual”, see what happens when your self dissolves. What is the experience with other beings like? I think you mentioned you are starting to get hints of the paranormal. Well, there is plenty to explore here. Totally drop any agenda (good or bad) and experience the “other” person. There is an awakening of the head and an awakening of the heart. Someone recently posted a link to an Adya talk that explored this realm. It was sooo deep and clear.

Long distance trail running in nature ♥️

I can’t find that requirement in my enlightenment rule book. I thought I got an officially certified version, yet now I’m not so sure ?‍♂️

@DrewNows @mandyjw Nice thoughts and questions. I think it gets tricky using the term psycological. Our primitive limbic system evolved prior to our capacity for rational thought in the frontal lobe. Other mammals have this system - it orients the organism toward survival. In particular, the amygdala stimulates fear. It seems in the human mind-body the limbic system is still a driver toward survival. Experience gets imbedded into it and is generally subconscious. There is also crosstalk with the rational processing center in the frontal lobe that creates “the story”. Of course these are just concepts, yet I think they have practical use.

That would flow me straight to the ER

Maybe during surfing