Forestluv

I didn’t realize that was your focus. I don’t mean to pull it out of context into another area. My apologies. I certainly see a lot of value in the context you describe above ?

I’m not sure what you mean by identification trait. Regarding the war veteran, I don’t know. I don’t have experience in war or with war veterans. When free of emotional distortion, it seems more like another sense. Like you can’t smell and then suddenly you can. That would be really hard to explain. I’m not sure about the coping mechanism idea. I can see it related to emotional empaths, yet I can’t see how various forms, line geomantic empath, relates to a coping mechanism.

Yes. I know. It’s great stuff. I love it. Yet go into actual domestic violence situations and see how far it gets you. There is more to it.

@DrewNows Curse and gift ate probably not the best terms for me to use - yet I think most empaths would catch my drift. It can certainly feel like a curse or gift, yet that’s probably not the best way to describe it. I can see it as a coping mechanism in some contexts - yet it goes way beyond that. I would call it a developmental line such as the cognitive, emotional and intuitive lines. There is an ability component to it. . . . Calling empathic a coping mechanism is like calling hearing a coping mechanism. When liberated from emotional turmoil - emath can become abilities - a sense - similar to hearing or smelling. It’s not just emotions. I’ve sensed things so obvious that I’m looking around amazed noone else can “hear” it. I’ve learned they really can’t sense it and I just need to act normal - as if I’m not sensing it either. I’m currently observing wether people can subconsciously sense it and are affected subconsciously.

@DrewNows I think that is great for understanding psychological dynamics of violence/nonviolence and it could help a practitioner. I think there is also more to it. When one actually gets into domestically violent homes and is working with actual abusers, victims, psychosis, alcohol/drug abuse, DTs, blood and bruises - one needs a lot more than theory. It’s tough and tumble.,Frankly, theory often goes out the window, I’ve been in situations in which it looks like someone is gonna get hurt bad and I fear for my safety. Diffusing these situations takes a huge amount of social and intuitive skills.

Ime, domestically violent homes generally involve alcohol and drugs issue. It is fuel to the fire. There are cases in which alcohol/drugs are not an issue - yet I’d say it’s the norm. I think state-sponsored social programs can be great. Yet any domestic violence program that does not put alcohol/drug as high priorities areas will be ineffective imo.

From what I’ve seen, domestic violence is commonly associated with alcohol and drug abuse and psychiatric issues. More than being simply being overwhelmed with life. Starting a program of meditation, yoga and stress reduction would be a hard sell. As well, I think it would be insufficient.,Therapy and life skills teaching is needed as well. I tried to start initiatives in this area to no avail. I tried to start a free meditation and life skills meeting for those in abusive environments in my town. It got zero interest. The only way people would attend is if it was mandated by the courts to stay out of jail, to get their kids back, or if they were payed to attend. I didn’t want to go that route. I wanted it to be voluntary - it didn’t fly.

@playdoh Higher consciousness can allow for subtle and sneaky lying. The mind might not even be aware of it.

No it’s not simple. Mind-body conditioning is complex and involves many genetic and environmental components. Prior abuse is a major risk factor, yet it’s not necessary. It just makes showing a different perspective easier. But yea, it’s more nuanced.

The horse shitting metaphor pretty much cuts to the chase.

?. Sure. And smoke a little Green while we’re at it. ? @kieranperez Yes!!! I love it!!!

Yes, it is now my gut reaction. The big changes for me occurred when I did volunteer work with alcoholics, drug addicts, criminals and psychiatric patients. People that were suffering immensely. They had been abused and now harming others. I had never seen this side of abuse and trauma before. It was gut-wrenching. I’m quite empathic and I internalized a lot of it. After this, I saw it very differently. As a cycle of abuse. A cycle of suffering. One movie that had a big impact on me was “Little Children”. Yet it was really intense for me. It’s a story of a cycle of abuse in which most of the characters are both abused and abusing.

♥️ ?

An occasional hippie music festival can be a fun way for Yellow to get a shot of Green without losing independence.

That is a big expansion of love. When I see abuse, I feel compassion for both abuser and abused. They are both suffering and acting out conditioning. There is plenty of delusion. I would also want to stop anymore abuse and then try to help both of them. Stopping the abuse may involve temporarily removing the abuser from society. Hopefully, we could help that person get better. Similarly, when I see a religious person indoctrinating others, I see someone acting out their own indoctrination. I would support bringing awareness to the indoctrination to reduce harm. Yet I wouldn’t hate on someone acting out their own indoctrination. I was hard-core indoctrinated into a religion as a child. It’s really hard to work through. I’m still deconstructing some of that crap - 30 years later. . . And yes, the prison system here in America is messed up.

And what if they don’t have the resources to do so? What if their brain and body has been messed up? What if nobody loves them? What if people hate them? How on earth can such a person heal and get better? I volunteered in a psychiatric ward of a hospital for years. Many abused people never had the chance to heal. They were never loved, They were treated like shit their whole life.

That is a different issue. You just bypassed the compassion issue. We can temporarily remove a person if they are abusing others - so this person does not abuse others. Yet we can do so while loving this person and with compassion. We can try to help this abused person heal. You originally said you hate the people doing the abuse. That is a different issue.

@mandyjw Yes. ♥️ ?

You don’t understand the physiological and psychological dynamics of child abuse. This is one reason the cycle continues. There is a lot of science showing long-term brain and physiological alterations to child abuse - into adulthood. As well, I think volunteer work with adults that have been abused as children deepens one’s understanding. It did for me. You are essentially saying that you are allowed to act out your conditioning, yet hate those that act out their conditioning. People that abuse others are not doing from love - they are acting out their trauma and inner hell.

Ok. Imagine a child has been abused. He has been traumatized. His brain and body have been conditioned in terrible ways. The kid is suffering terribly. We now know that these physiological changes persist into adulthood. Their brains are rewired. You say you have compassion for this abused child. You seem to be saying your compassion is conditional. In what ways can this traumatized child behave that is acceptable to you so you will maintain your compassion for him? What are your compassion “deal-breakers”? For example, if the traumatized person acted out their inner hell by cutting themself, would you still have compassion for them? What if they had a PTSD traumatic episode and screamed profanities at someone? Would you still have compassion for them? What does a traumatized person need to do to go from your compassion list to your shit list?

Wait a second, I’m confused now. You previously said you felt bad for children that are abused. Now you are saying a child being abused is “sad”. Those are two different things. Do you feel bad and have compassion for abused children or do you merely think child abuse is “sad”.

My age question was not about ethics. You say you feel compassion for children that are indoctrinated and abused, yet seem to hate those same abused children when they are adults. When does your compassion for indoctrinated abused children end?

@DrewNows Yes Anthony. I haven’t watched his stuff in the last couple of years. I watched a couple of his workshop videos. At that time he was a self described atheist trying to wake up irrational religious followers. He had an agenda to bring them ip to irrational thinking. Essentially from Blue stage yo Orange stage. He was a bit sneaky about it, since he didn’t tell this intention to his interviewees. Yet I thought he was non-confrontational and respectful. I think he is generally a good advocate to help people evolve Blue to Orange. The world needs people like that. I can’t do it anymore, since I no longer identify with rationalism.

In your op, you said you are upset with religious people because they are arrogant, stigmatize and brainwash others. Now you are saying you are upset about the victims. Those people you seem to hate have also been indoctrinated, brainwashed and abused. They are living out their own childhood indoctrination. When do you lose compassion for them? On their 18th birthday?

Why is this problem upsetting to you?