theleelajoker

Enjoyed reading your report. I have read that others point towards childhood trauma, abandonment etc. as (partly) explanation for your experience. Might be that this is the case. Might be that this is not the whole story. Honestly, don't know. I have experienced that the deeper I go, the more the boundaries between personal experiences, family experience, cultural and collective human experiences blurr. I had some similar themes about the dark sites popping up in my life, whatever that means. Trapped in something alone forever, being used by an external force for sth else. Netflix is full of stuff like that (3 body problem, black mirror, the movie passenger, truman show etc) Whatever is going on, take care of yourself.

OK I am with you conceptually. You have an example (or several) for that? As concrete as possible, best from your own experience. How did you recognize this fallacy of self help? What situation and with whom? How did you recognize the roots of your fear? What made it difficult? How did you manage to open up? It would help me and maybe others could get a better access to what your saying, too. Regarding this quote: This is quite funny. Three days ago, I had a LSD trip where I had the realization (at least I believe so) how everything is just reflection over reflection, and projections from me (or better, through me) on others (he is like that, she is acting like this because of that etc). I could almost feel how "me" and "others" are in a mirror cabinet. I decided that my next trip would be together with someone, because the idea is: In this altered state, we could interact differently and see what's behind all this self-referential loops and reflections. I was and still am really motivated to break this cycle. When I read the text above, the memory of this trip and this very moment came up. So, it's an interesting synchronicity. And similar as you describe "there is no manual" I have been recently discussing spiritual material and instructions that others put me in touch with. And my reaction was "best instruction is a empty sheet of paper", just like you say "there is no instruction manual" So, now I am even more interested in practical examples if you're open to share : )

Hmmmm...don't know all of Teal's followers. Also don't really know her. Seen a few videos, read some stuff. My impression front these sources is that she mixes genuine insight and valuable information with personal agenda an narcissistic tendencies . But that's a superficial and far off view with little information...

OK, now that you are conscious of that - what's next? My conclusion after my realization of oneness: Do what feels authentic for me as best as I can. Play the role I have been giving. Short: live life.

+1 Doesn't really matter if she's sad, happy, having her period, vulnerable, angry, full of bliss etc...as long as it's authentic and she just expresses without the intention to manipulate I do respond to that and feel more connection. One time my ex-gf had such a shitty day that she barely want to talk to anyone. She felt like she's a burden for others in this mood. I convinced her to at least sent me a short video message. And seeing her expressing herself I felt like immediately going to see her. Not to change her mood or sth, just to be present with her.

@integral Stage 2 you refer to...? Freud? But that's more for kids so I don't know And how you get to this conclusion? Not saying that is not the case, simply interested in your reasoning. I remember previous comments from you that were helpful in this area.

Awesome mix of perspectives and experiences in this thread! I have myriad of situations with women that align with what has been said. With almost every post, I could relate to a ONS, affair, FWB, relationship etc etc having a concrete person and behavior in mind. The girl that withdraws sex to see if she is more then just a fuck-buddy for you ("gun to your head" style) The girl that desperately wants to get fucked but is not honest enough to herself to just say that (double binds can make a man crazy) The moments when I made it too fast and too much about sex and then I ruined it The drama when I know that No 2 is valid but I still ended up in No 3 The dates where I did not even know if I wanted sex with her and then she's like "you're making me so horny" (I did NOTHING ) The times I experienced that some innocent cuddling is the best foreplay The times when I made it honestly and directly about sex pretty fast and the girl was happy about my clarity The times when the woman made it honestly and directly about sex pretty fast and I was happy about her clarity The problem of getting attached (sometimes me, sometimes her) by just repeatedly sleeping with someone. Effect is much stronger if you don't use condoms (only if relationship + after tests + other birth control) The simple fact that women sometimes love to be seen as a sexual object as it turns them on The simple fact that women hate to be seen as a sexual object because it limits everything else they are The whole problem of sending mixed signals and wrong interpretations: Me, her, both of us. So what's my conclusion re the OP's question? I don't know. Is it even possible to solve this puzzle? Recently watched "The War of the Roses" and one of my ideas from that movie was that no matter what men and women do, it's bound to end in drama So do what you feel like, express it honestly and as authentically as possible. And then let us know what happened

I my personal (sex) experience, I can not remember one woman that did not like this dominant energy. They all liked the idea of being used, of the man being dominant, sometimes calling me out to "use them" or to "fuck them like a ****" and so on. And I happily did, same as I like it when a woman rides me well and uses me for a while : ) A woman once told me "every woman likes controlled aggression". It's all a matter of degree. Sometimes I had to stop myself because I felt eg the girl wanted me to choke her harder but I felt resistance bc I feared it might hurt her. Slippery slope IMO. With one ex-gf, at the beginning I refused to have hard submissive sex with her bc I had the impression that she experienced some (emotional or physical) violence. But she knew how to push my buttons and after a while I was so dominant and aggressive with her that I sometimes felt it was too much. For her it was never too much, she never complained, quite the opposite. Downside: I had the feeling she needs the aggression to feel herself and is not able to feel her body without these extreme. I tried - as best as I could - to experience with her the whole spectrum of sex from "gently making love" to "I use you like a little ****" but it was very hard to open her up for the "gently making love" type of sex. Maybe I was not able to be gentle enough, maybe I needed the hard sex myself, who knows? Today I think 1) it's part of our animal nature that's typically suppressed like @Lise said and 2) I think it can too much and maybe points to some past experiences that keeps people from really feeling their body

What does it mean then for you? I certainly can resonate with "you're just here to create and live life" and the feeling of empty canvas an running away. Been there. Not saying that this is "awakening", we could already discuss what the concept means. But that's not my intention. Simply curios what "awakening" means for you and if it's not about creating life, what is it about in your opinion?

Resonates. "Can't control vibration because you are vibration" "Being both cause and effect" "energetic structure can change itself pushed by the vibration that we call suffering, and no one will ever be able to tell you how" Re last point: you see any other way than suffering? I assume the logic behind your statement is that only when the structure allows to feel "that is not good for me" it sets in a process to correct the current state?

What do you mean?

@Breakingthewall So, I don't see this thread as poop, quite the opposite Don't get why some others post have this flavor of attacking your content. We're just exchanging perspectives, aren't we? I can relate to general ideas you are presenting: My experience matches with your idea that it's not thought that creates being closed, but (also) being closed leads to certain thoughts. Probably there is then a feedback loop. (Certain thoughts can make you more closed etc) Just focusing on thoughts is part of but not the solution in my experience Yes, ego is real. Maybe it's a bug, maybe it's a feature, maybe both. My experience is also that integration> transcendence of Ego. Related to that, emotions have a purpose, they make you move somewhere. So we get motivated to do stuff and interactions with external world is crucial. As I understand your basic assumption is: reality is like it is because it's the most efficient structure and thus the only choice. Nobody in control. That's one possible option. You could also take a different approach: reality could be different, but it's the way it is because supposed to be this way. There is someone or something in control making it that way. In both cases: the solution is to open up to everything as much as possible. Experience it, accept it as it is. Also accept your desires, your ego, your fears, shame etc etc. Because a) there's no other choice so why fight what can't be changed or b) sme or sth of higher intelligence creates this reality this way and who am I to think it should be different?

I can relate to the lack of enthusiasm. For me it comes and goes in waves - some moments I am fully engaged and doing stuff, having fun, playing my role, enjoying the cosmic game and joke. And I also enjoy and appreciate all the good experiences life creates for me - friends, nature, food, women, interactions etc. Other moments I am like "WTF am I doing here. Doesn't make any sense, no purpose, leads nowhere, it's all fake, there are no others, is all reflection etc etc. " and I just want to leave this reality. Tired of this shit. Happy and fulfilled. Not happy and fulfilled. Repeat. So (if you did) how did you make peace with Solipsism? Yesterday I talked to a friend, and she said sth like "So you're lying to yourself, that's OK!" That kind of helped. And then the questions is: Either being non-existent or being in this reality, what would you choose? If you just sometimes feel like being here, that's already a win And lastly - yeah, solipsism gives freedom re guilt, shame etc and there are no "wrong" actions. That helps a bit as well. And is it possible to already be complete & fulfilled in this life? First I did not want to answer bc as described above, I don't fulfill the criteria of "constantly fulfilled in this life." But maybe it's helpful anyway. I honestly don't know the answer and I am asking myself the same thing. Recently I talked to someone who SEEMED fulfilled and happy despite solipsism. Later this person told me that she started to take mood stabilizers. So...taking that experience with a grain of salt. Haven't met someone that is fulfilled, but everybody is a reflection of me so....makes sense I never met someone that is fulfilled. Speculating here, maybe the up's and downs are all we ever get? Does not work for me. Ever tried to actively forget something? Makes some sense on the intellectual level. Especially the "stop wanting things to be real", I can relate to that because I was looking for this "realness". But then - you have to "work" and you have "to learn" to "fall in love"? Doesn't feel right to me. When did you ever work to fall in love with sme or sth? Of course you can say, you must learn and work to realize that you don't have to work and learn to fall in love. But then we go in circles

Agree on the trap of accumulating knowledge. I used to invest a lot of time and energy into these mental models, theories and ideas. Most of it did not contribute much except for one thing: helping me to accept me and my feelings as they are. External validation etc etc It can even be harmful because this supposed knowledge may restrict you into this or that theory. You then project this view on yourself and others instead of doing your best "don't know" mindset. I still need some mental models of the world but it becomes less as I get older. And those I have are updated more often as life proves them all wrong in the end It's like training wheels when learning how to ride a bike: as much as necessary, as little as possible

I assume you speak from experience? How was the backlash for you?

Yes me too

Maybe https://www.actualized.org/forum/topic/58422-san-pedro-trip-jesus-fucking-christ-jesus-fucking-christ-jesus-fucking-christ/

Thanks for bringing up this thread I would never have seen it! I read through all the comments it kind of connects the dots re my last LSD Trip + recent meditation retreats. Some themes connected to the OP recently came up: 1. The borders betweens me and others blurred more and more in everyday life, experiencing countless synchronicities. During my last trip I also saw how others are just my reflection and projections. Similar to the OP, it's became clear that there is no one to ask because it's all "me" projected into this world. 2. This made me really curious to experience what's beyond and behind those reflections and projections ("God"?). But how to find out? Clearly, everything within Maya (this dream) is still infinite reflections. 3. The question how to leave Maya came up more and more ok the last months. Once in meditation I thought if I completely let go in this moment, I'll die. I got scared AF and stopped meditating. 4. I feel two contradicting impulses within me and also see them in others. Partly quoting me and others directly: First impulse: I don't belong here. This doesn't make any sense. WTF am I doing here? This feels strange. Second impulse: I am scared to look deeper. I am scared to look into the past. There is something I am hiding and I don't want to look at it. Let's keep doing the things we are doing and not change. Especially the second part is really scary because I feel like the OP. That I was always looking for truth - but if I am, then way are there so many "others" that want to keep their secrets? Because I am hiding. And it's super strange because some experiences and circumstances drag me deeper into the dream while others help me tremendously to become more free of the dream.Me and all others I meet seem torn about wether to leave the dream or to go on, there are definitely mixed signals. Can anyone relate?

My experience: yes, it's possible. I was very skeptical before. Friend recommended me to do Shaktipat. Did it in person and it had a tremendous effect on me in the following hours. I am talking about "feels like I took MDMA" effect, it was that strong. Long-term effects of this I don't know because many variables etc but this situation I remember clearly. Plus: my friend that did the shaktipat as well felt the same as I did, so it's strong evidence that sth was happening related to your question.

Did not read Leo's Blogpost because I don't value the personal bias and egoic agendas he puts into his "teachings" to make him appear and feel superior and to spread ideas that are IMO harmful. So only referring the quote above by @Spiral Wizard. And I can fully agree to that. It's about balancing, respecting and appreciating all aspects. You align with whatever and whoever is in front of you, and by integrating you can create sth new and "better" (more constructive, mutual beneficial). Just carefully with absolute spreading so called "truth". Maybe one day you wake up and realize that yesterday's truth isn't today's truth anymore...

Disagree with OP. Lots of projection IMO. My experience is that men don't care more or less a about so called "truth". I believe that's an illusion fed by the "teachings" and opinions especially here in this forum. If you take statistics, you have to consider the validity and causality of the tool you're using as a argument. I once talked to my then-gf about my some of my realizations and insights. She did not engage in any discussion, just looked at me and said "see how far you can go". That was the end of our talk and I love how she challenged me to do stuff instead of talking and analyzing. So what's my point? You can take a lot at statistics you mention and say that men talk about things while women embody their truths with actions. In my personal life, I have seen it many times. Re your other arguments I have similar examples. In short, women are equally interested and open to "truth" or whatever you want to call it. They just do it differently. My hypothesis is that you'll see that when you move further on the path

Resonates. With some disclaimer on "life clearly tells you".... sometimes I feel that I these directions are covered by layers of conditioning that makes it hard for me to have a clear picture. Yeah sure it can be figured out, others help me, life gives pointers in my experience but evasion can be very tricky because conditioning not only hides what we are avoiding but also that we are avoiding. But the general message of your posts: I am with you. And the more I seek interaction, honesty, openness and intimate and authentic connections with others, the better things tend to get. And I'm tired of the "no self nothing exists etc etc". Whatever you call it, the energetic structure exists and I can feel that is has some movement. Now "my job" is to align with it as best as possible

OK I looked up the word. It showed me different meanings. Two examples: What I understood : think, reflect, consider, think about, ponder What you mean: consider, view, look at, regard, contemplate, look upon Non-native speaker here, contemplating was always the first meaning for me

"Yeah, I tried to make it experiential through the examples but the truth is people have to spend those hours contemplating this stuff themselves" That's exactly the problem I am pointing to. I say "experience" and you understand "contemplating". Our whole culture is so fucked up with this thinking and contemplating and this forum maybe even more. IMO this teaching of contemplating is nothing but creating the illusion of a solution, the illusion of control. It's a trap. Experience it by feeling it within the boundaries of your own body. Experience it by observing external reality with choiceless awareness. Just let things happen and observe. Consciously observe and gently cooperate with your point of attention. And for God's sake stop contemplating about what you're doing. Sometimes I want to physically grap people, shake then up and shout at them to get out of their fucking head. Probably others feel like doing the same with me from time to time but nobody ever had the courage to do it lol

It does answer why it is the way it is right now, doesn't it? Because there it's the only way, no other choice, no crossroads, no options. And re the raw deals... definitely. You get nothing but agreement from me on that.