Sincerity

Sorry then. Seemed very relevant to the discussion I’ve had with Carl.

Bruh. You’re not listening at all, are you?

Here’s also another insight related to imposing/unimposing: one might believe that women generally want to be imposed on in a masculine-feminine relationship (meaning they want the man to lead and make decisions in the relationship and all that), but I don’t think this is really about imposing. Women want to be imposed only with the things that they ACTUALLY want. Even if they’re not conscious that they want them. And if a man tries to impose a decision that the woman is truly not aligned with, that will be rejected because she will start to feel like there’s genuine imposing on her now. So healthy relationships and love are always non-imposing in the end. The obvious counter-example is the protecting of a small child from danger by a parent, but I think it’s still unimposing because we’re assuming that the child’s deepest will is to continue living. But at some point the „imposing” attitude of the parent must be let go when the child is conscious enough. * * * * * All this love talk is starting to bore me. Let’s talk about hate now 👹🖕☠️

I think it's a tad more complex than that. Parents could care about you, for example, and yet still have a very limited love. The best they can do, which can be not very much. I'd argue that there could be a truthful enough model (which is still only a model, but hear me out) of levels of love. I'd say that unimposing love is above imposing love, for example. Basing this simply on my own love realizations and insights into what God is about. Does God impose? (question is flawed from the start, but roll with it? ) Regarding tough love: I can share honest masculine feedback with my best friend, and he can do with me. But we both understand that we don't know what's best for each other, and this is always stated when giving our views. Maybe it's not "tough" love anymore, but then again: maybe the virtue of "true" tough love (that thinks it knows what's best for someone and imposes it) is not so high from the start. Ultimately, I think imposing love lacks respect. When you think you know better than someone what's best for THEM, in a way you think you're above them. Also note: unimposing love can be expressed in both a feminine and masculine way. I realize it might sound only feminine, but I'd invite to question this assumption. With feminine/masculine, the question is indeed of style and both are good. The removing of a bear trap example is complicated. If the person doesn't want the trap removed from the start (for whatever reason), I think you still shouldn't impose yourself on them like "I'M GOING TO DO IT ANYWAY." And if they want it at the start but scream during the removal, their deepest will is still the removal of the trap so you're not imposing, you're aligned.

@Scholar He said it's love, I just responded with my view on love. No rigid rules - just how I see it. I'm just thinking here!!! jk

Well, but trans sexuality is not banned on current social media platforms, for example. Why would the AI change that? Your argument is based in human will to marginalize. But human will is already the case even with algorithms and human moderation, no? Also, I think free market could do its job if a given social media platform became VERY oppressive with its AI moderation. Another one would arise which would be less oppressive, and that one people would potentially flee to. But also maybe not, I won't die on this particular hill.

@Scholar I think this is why full transparency of the agent's instructions would be important. But that'd only happen on a consciously led platform. Of course we wouldn't want to marginalize views. In my head the AI would only be enforcing guidelines that human moderators are already tasked to enforce. Again, it'd have to be an iterative feedback process and a golden middle would need to be found.

Actually, an AI agent could have a surprising level of complexity, very comparable (if not better) than that of a human. When a post is reported, the AI could also take under consideration everything relevant that was said before in the thread. It could also take under consideration how many warnings the user already has. Et cetera. Also when doing its moderation actions, the agent would lay out its full reasoning process step by step, so that the context is clear to the moderator who's overseeing the AI. These AI agents are not stupid anymore. They could handle really complex cases.

I just googled whether Invision (the software this forum runs on) has the option of AI moderation. Apparently not yet, but it might be coming: https://invisioncommunity.com/forums/topic/484055-automated-assistant-in-v5/#comment-3005672

Exactly! That too. 🤣 On a consciously led social media platform, the AI agent's full instructions could be made transparent, so that everyone knows what they're dealing with.

@Miguel1 Page 59. Face here, for example:

What a bunch of handsome/pretty guys and gals.

That will be 🔥 for sure!

@Carl-Richard You said that your wish for him to go to therapy is out of love and I said you don’t know that he needs it. I believe there’s a sort of discrepancy between wishing someone does the thing you think is best for them and a love motivation. It feels like it’s love, but I’d argue that a deeper love is when you don’t presume things about people and you let them do their thing in the way that they want. And respect their will, beliefs, choices, who they are. In short: to me, „my wish for someone to do the thing I think is best for them is out of love” is an oxymoron. At least to a degree. There’s levels of love, obviously. I was like that with my ex and other people in the past, but I learned different. I guess you could call the former a more egoic love in comparison. This conversation is pointless and wasn’t even the main topic. Again, my points regarding love/charitability were related to the original post and the constant judging and criticism of Leo I see on the forum overall.

Awesome vibes 🤙

Okay. You think he needs therapy, and I think that you don’t know that he does, and that insisting on what someone else should be doing is not a proper attitude. We’re all just thinking here. „Let’s not hold anything what’s said accountable because it’s just my thoughts.” Also, I’m sure this argument is not being used in a one-sided way. I THINK that’s not the best way to lead discussions. And I can repeat the „you can’t know that” over and over, because that’s what I think. Come on. This is not a good argument in the slighest. Take ownership of what you're saying. Apologies for the sarcasm.

The thing is that you don’t know whether he needs it. He’s already said no, but people love to think they know what’s best for someone else and insist on it. Love is also respecting one’s will and choices, even if you personally would do things differently. But I don’t believe love was the prime motivator for this thread from the start. I was mainly talking about charitability in the context of the original post, not therapy. But I can’t know, you be the judge of what your motivation/dynamic was. I called it child-parent, but it’s about perceived authority in general. You are no stranger to this dynamic. We as Mods experience it at times towards us.

Nope.

Don't be rude.

I don't know what you're on about. Again, I was being light-hearted. And I'm not moderating anything here. Or they won't. But more importantly, the space will be polluted with idiotic arguments for all time.

This wasn't an attack. I was saying it in a light-hearted way. Like genuinely, everything is wrong with that thing you wrote. No offense. But my favourite one was that one: This must be your first day on the internet. Idiots will fight each other to their death. They will never leave. Or this one: I'm SURE the idiot will learn. No doubts there.

There's not a SINGLE thing that is correct here. I'm genuinely laughing out loud. Amazing.

@Carl-Richard Btw, I'm sorry for being overly argumentative with you before. Like weeks before. In spite of any disagreements (which don't really matter in the end), I know you're a good guy. I should've been better.

🎯