fopylo

Hi, sorry I didn't really come here to give any advice, but I have a feeling you might be dealing with something I am also (I might be wrong) which is mental masturbation and having fun keeping this story of 'you being too selfless and trying to overcome it by being more selfish' alive. You might be having fun engaging in this problem, but are you ready for if let's say now we all stop engaging here and also the problem is fixed? Sure, people have great advice, but it might actually confuse more if you try to analyze and theories too much. Again, sorry if I'm jumping too quick into conclusion. I might be projecting but just intuitively felt it might be the case. Wish you the best

@Eph75 I've been doing the Do Nothing technique for like a month, 30 minutes every morning. I feel like I'm becoming more at ease with my attention. Allowing my attention to go and wonder like a child following a raindrop with his eyes out of curiosity. Genuine attention. Although sometimes I can get stuck in my mind, and even though it's ok since it's part of the meditation (to accept the monkey mind) it makes me intentionally get into thought stories if I feel like trying to escape (not as serious as it sounds, but the accumulation of it makes it frustrating) and it somehow makes me not aware of the rest of reality, like I'm denying the physical room in which I'm in. Do you have a recommendation for a different ritual? Maybe to do it longer? I would like to hear

@Javfly33 Yeah man I'm noticing this problem is deeper than I expected, meaning I am recognizing that I have more and more shadows and parts of me that I repress without even knowing them, or maybe not repression, maybe they're hidden deep and rarely get the chance to get provoked

@Eph75 So basically occupying your mind with a thought will get you attached to the thought since you build more neural pathways as you keep analyzing? How can you intentionally let go of a thought without repression? Consciously deciding to let go of a thought is like deciding to push it away. Every time I repressed a thought it was because I tried to get it out of my system somehow (which didn't really, just pushed it back), and I did it intentionally. If this example isn't so good then sometimes when I do mindfulness meditation and I try to put my focus on a tree (for example) and then I am starting to have thoughts then I push them aside because I gotta focus, can't lose that focus, and I suppress the thought. I recognize that I'm having thoughts and pushing them aside but then I feel mental dissonance

@Eph75 I will try but it will be hard as I kinda know those people and I'm starting to become part of their group so it's kind of going against my survival. And also what does it mean to 'let go'? I hear it so often but what does that practically mean and how do I do it?

@Leo Gura Shit man that hit. Thank you, I feel better from what you said! I guess I am "better off" by realizing myself more than them and having a deeper connection to life. I have some talents and a general good brain if I'm being honest. Other than that they are still better socially, which is something I strive to be and so I focus on my lack of it which makes me feel bad

@Leo Gura So then in what way am I "better off"?

@Eph75 A few years ago I remember this group, this same group I was talking about, not all of the people but most of them I kinda new and maybe even had some social gatherings with them. That was before I could care any less for a girlfriend or their companionship. I went to those meetings from the approach of "I'm going to go to this meeting of those people just to be with them a bit, but in general I have my other people I spend time with". I wasn't seeking much from them, which left me room to give from myself, from my more authentic self. I did things and behaved in ways that were not signaling that I want something from them. Because I really didn't. In my head I didn't even want to be part of this group (only had with them maybe like 3 meetings at the time). What I heard years later from a girl that left our school, is that most of the girls found either me or another kid attractive (out of the boys there, which there weren't many). I was actually quite shocked. If anything I believed that most of them are after this other kid so I was really surprised. Perhaps I had so little expectations that I didn't even focus on that kind of stuff. But those people are what most people would call in society "the weird people". You know, you find people like that in every place (usually some of them are bi-sexual, gay, into fantasy, generally weird. This is not a stigma but a fact). So it didn't really make me feel amazing because I don't think I'd really want to be with any of them. But yeah, sorry for this long chatter. I think it is to not have expectations and approach it with the knowing that I'm better even if I don't get what I want which leaves me room to be authentic, I guess (?)

@hoodrow trillson Yeah man it is really frustrating, especially for the fact that he invited you and you didn't know anyone there and was killing it way more than him. Try getting into his mind. The dude probably wanted to try and improve as well (a mere guess. Maybe he wanted to work on himself?) and what ended up is that he barely managed and feels bad about himself, and you on the other hand come in at ease not knowing anyone, effortlessly just killing it. I believe this has to do with the fact that he might have too many expectations on how he wants things to unfold (which is the same problem I have) and you probably don't have much expectations and just flow with what is, being authentic, and that's probably the wiser move.

@Leo Gura Thanks for the encouragement. But I am starting to believe less that it is a façade since it seems they genuinely enjoy it. My friend tells me he feels good after those events and they are all quite loose compared to me. I don't want to hold onto what you said as "whoo, ok, so I'm good. At least I know that I'm good and will be better off in the future". If they are feeling good but have a façade, then what is going on with me? What is this "true expression" that most of the people are letting out? If it is genuine, then how is it a façade?

I am meditating and doing this consciousness work in order to unbind myself from the ego and in order to be free and experience more of reality. Leo has a video about how building a self image is key to success, but at the same time I don't understand because like building a self image means strengthening your false self and falling deeper into delusion. There's also this famous book called Psycho Cybernetics which I thought about reading long ago but I haven't because after reading The Power Of Now and watching Leo's videos and meditating, it seems like building a self image will slow the process of dissolving the self. So basically I'm looking for some guidance to reconcile the two. And also, should I even care about building a self image or am I better trying to dissolve the image?

@Leo Gura So then why do you talk all the time about killing the ego and dissolving it? It seems like what you're saying is to build such a strong ego that it becomes so huge until you awaken.

@WelcometoReality Going by that logic, if an enlightened person is experiencing almost infinite levels of happiness does that mean he will have an infinitely powerful self image?

How will it strengthen the ego? It seems like the purpose of retreats is to dissolve the ego

@SamC Interesting. Meditation helps me become aware of the fact that the meditation might be a way to escape, a neurotic behavior. Yeah, I have one month left before I start my camp of 6 months (coming back once every 2 weeks) and I'm starting to get quit anxious. I've decided a month ago that I'll put effort into my meditation practices so that I'll be well off there. But truthfully, I wouldn't be functioning properly without a mere level of mindfulness (just so that I can be aware of things existing for god sake). My plan was to be the most free I can before I start the camp, as well as to go to as many social gatherings before the start of the camp. I've been on summer break for a month and I have 1 month left. I'm still on nofap for a similar reason, and also started getting back into running.

@Eph75 @flowboy Both of what you said are quite similar. The meditation practices indeed help me become more clear about myself and understand myself on deeper levels (my likes, things that make me truly happy, things I really find attractive and the such). Being detached from needs I understand means I have the freedom to choose what I want to pursue without those limitations of the mind. But yet I don't seem to be able to naturally express myself when talking to people I know.

@WelcometoReality But does that mean I'll have a positive self image, or just those general emotions?

@WelcometoReality Wait so what am I left with when I dissolve the negative images through meditations?

@NoSelfSelf Dude what do you mean I haven't embodied? I do my meditation routines

@Eph75 I've actually made not long ago a thread on that: Yes but I honestly crave this attention of looking good and being respected. Being freed from this need is like erasing this desire, suppressing it, and trying to be someone that I'm not (it's true that I am deficiently driven to get the attention). The actual experience once I get it might feel different but the desire itself is something that still feels good in the moment. If being natural means following peoples' leads and not being charismatic then I won't really achieve things, because who will want that? Being authentically beta won't help me get girls or even guy friends.

@Leo Gura Oh I mean, I don't have any plan for meditating every day 6 hours towards Awakening. Also, problematic getting psychedelics because of life situation and logistics. Perhaps I should focus on success... But doesn't 1 hour a day of meditation counter pursuing success? No I don't, in fact only like 1.5 years. For the last 6 months or so I've been introduced to spirituality. But I don't want to bypass. People who are more ignorant seem to be on the better end, not having to think that those are illusions.

@Leo Gura It's just that I don't know which to choose because 1) it seems more natural to start with success and then evolve into spiritual pursuits and - 2) spirituality seems to give the best fruits of life and I'm kinda focused on it now. Thing is that meditation practices are helping me function like a normal human being, which helped me in social interactions. So I guess they can build off of each other, probably slowing down the process than if I'd go full in on one and then the other. Indeed it is harder for me to chase success now that I'm becoming more conscious. How do you deal with this? Do you even still chase success, and if you do then what is the reason behind, the drive?

@Leo Gura Oh so they actually counter each other. Fuck. I was starting to believe the can work together. I want to become very free from my mind and very conscious so that I'm limitless and can be authentic and develop emotional mastery. But Leo, there was a time that you chased success. If you didn't chase success you probably wouldn't have been where you're now, am I right? I don't think I can really take on pursuing success after hearing and experiencing the things I can get from those spiritual practices

@Eph75 Well, yes. Certainly it feels bad. I've been called those things also in the past and it is quite hurting me, my image of myself. I want to be a wise man, strong man, respected, getting attention (especially from women), talented, emotionally intelligent, artist, maybe more. I am being honest, not trying to sound 'transcendentally enlightened' or some shit. This path has disconnected me from what is true. It is bad because I don't want to be seen as "innocent" (but rather as someone wise who understands). Don't want to be tolled "how cute" (it hurts my manhood I strive to be. I'm trying to work on my manhood and such comments make me feel beta). Not trying to be alpha in the very common neurotic way people think about, but more emotional, aware, wise, maybe there is some ego, neurosis. Well yeah I guess being authentic is quite an amazing thing so that I can be free to be who I am. But in the process of being authentic sometimes I'd rather not be authentic for potential hurt that I might get from the surrounding. I can't suddenly own my authenticity on the spot. On the spot I'd care more to survive because it's too immediate. And yeah, I fear making blunders that will make me look like a fucking boy. I'm already quite known for being called a "stoner" (it sounds worse in English, but they called me that in a friendly matter, as I make people laugh with my funny behaviors sometimes. I don't smoke) and I've seen how over the years this image is binding me from changing into a better man, even to become more authentic. Yeah so that's kinda what I was talking about for people laughing at me. I laugh with them and sometimes I don't know if I'm doing it genuinely or to neurotically defend myself, probably a mix of both. I should have mentioned this is probably the least concern, as I have been slapped by life a few times that this knowledge won't help. Hence I try to focus on action such as meditation and exercise. Lately I try to not consume a lot of information so that I won't get addicted to it. In all honestly, I really want and like the idea of being secretly seen as successful among the people I meet. Funnily though, I also fear being seen as successful because I don't want to feel out of the group or ostracized or something. But shouldn't you try to become successful and creating a self image of yourself?

@Snuitje Honestly I don't know. I don't even know why I said it, kind of regretted it and I felt very uncomfortable through the rest of the game. I was literally looking up and closing my eyes (I was already very tired so it seemed less awkward). Yeah this will probably happen sometime soon. @Bando After the meditation session I feel good, but in the real world it doesn't seem to really give me exactly the results I want. But isn't that the purpose of meditation, to surface your subconscious shit into consciousness so that you purify your mind to live with more ease and equanimity? Yeah, thinking about it now you're very right. All of them go out and meet friends way more than I, plus, I'm kinda new to this group. And they are quite weird people