caspex

I think most people would object to "You are music".

Bro. "Happening" is a relative word. Depends on how you define it.

@Razard86 The problem is that they think psychedelics induce hallucinatory logic and sense-making. Sure, you made them understand the state they call soberness is subjective, so what? Now instead of sober being a state, it becomes a spectrum of more sober and less sober. But to them psychedelics take you off the whole spectrum of sober, into the spectrum of hallucinations and illusions. Is this true? No, but that's not how people who argue against psychedelic awakenings think. To them psychedelics means an entire different spectrum that has nothing to do with truth. Do you think convincing them that sober is subjective will convince them? You assume that they think psychedelic states/logic-making exists on the same spectrum as "sober". You argue how we already hold substances in our body altering our 'sober', so how can one argue against psychedelics? But you never proved how psychedelics alter your states to make you bullshit LESS than 'sober'. Look, I agree with what you said, I am just saying what you said is not gonna convince most people who argue against psychedelic awakenings. You have to convince in other ways, like how you just did with "you could argue with the right dosage that psychedelics could IMPROVE functionality.". That's how you start to convince them.

hey I am just joking lol

Typical conversation after following these rules:

2: Jack's Spiritual Practice John: Hey, Jack! How's it going? Experience still happening in extraordinary ways, I assume? Jack: Indeed, John! Experience continues its unpredictable dance, and this mind observes with unwavering curiosity. A pov appears. John: Ah, the unpredictable dance of experience. Always keeping us on our toes, Jack. So, what brings you here today? Jack: Perception happens, my friend. This body exists, seeking a humble favor. Might this body request some extra sugar for it's spiritual practice? John: Sugar for your spiritual practice? Interesting. Alright, I have to ask, what exactly does your spiritual practice entail? Jack: Life is happening, John. The body's vessels come in various forms. In this case, the spiritual vessel utilizes the sacred art of snorting sugar up the posterior region for transcendental elevation. John: Snorting sugar up... you know what, let's not delve into the details of your spiritual practice, Jack. I'll get you some sugar, but please promise me you won't talk about it anymore. Jack: Thoughts appear, my friend. I shall honor your request and keep the sacred snorting to myself. The sugar, like sweet enlightenment, shall be gratefully received. John: Sweet enlightenment indeed. Well, here's your extra sugar, Jack. May it fuel your spiritual journey in the most unconventional of ways. Just remember, keep it to yourself. Jack: Perception happens, John. The unconventional journeys are often the most enlightening. Fear not, for my lips shall remain sealed, embracing the mystery of my sugar-infused spiritual path. Thank you, my friend. John: Embracing the mystery indeed. You're welcome, Jack. May your spiritual endeavors be as sweet as the sugar itself. Now, let's just hope this conversation never happened. Farewell for now! Jack: Life is happening, John. The past is but a fleeting mirage. It never existed in the first place! Farewell, my friend, until our mind-body complexes meet again in this mysterious world. This post was generated by ChatGPT.

1: Perceptions Unveiled: The Peculiar Encounter of John and Jack John: Hey, I'm John. Nice to meet you. Jack: Experience happens, fellow traveler. This mind recognizes your presence. A pov appears. John: Uh, okay. Nice to meet you, Jack. So, what brings you here? Jack: Perception happens, John. This body exists in this place. Thoughts appear, guiding this mind to this fortuitous encounter. John: Right, thoughts guiding you and all. Well, welcome to the neighborhood. Are you settling in alright? Jack: Life is happening, John. This mind finds itself navigating the ebb and flow of existence within these new surroundings. John: That's... deep. So, what do you do for a living, Jack? Jack: Thoughts appear, my friend. This mind engages in the dance of professions, exploring the vast tapestry of occupational possibilities. John: Ah, the dance of professions, sounds exhilarating. Do you mind being a little more specific? Like, what do you actually do? Jack: Perception happens, John. This body exists. This mind immerses itself in the realm of creative expression, utilizing various mediums to articulate its innermost visions. John: Creative expression, huh? So, you're an artist? Painter, musician, poet? Jack: Life is happening, John. The boundaries of artistic categorization cannot encapsulate the multifaceted nature of this mind's creative pursuits. John: Of course, how could I be so narrow-minded? Well, Jack, it was... interesting meeting you. I have to run some errands now, but perhaps we'll catch up again. Jack: Perception happens, John. This body exists. Our paths may intertwine once more in the grand tapestry of existence. John: Right, the grand tapestry. Well, until then, take care, Jack. Good luck on finding a job. Jack: Life is happening, John. Farewell, my temporary companion. May your journey be filled with profound perceptions and flourishing thoughts. This post was generated by ChatGPT.

Please Note: I can't be bothered to organize this wall of text into paragraphs to make it more readable. Truth is a value held by many of us here. We do not want to be deluded, but what is truth? Oxford Dictionary defines it as the quality or state of being true. But what does it mean to be true? Again, if we look at the dictionary, it says "in accordance with fact or reality." I hope you can see where I am going with this now. Reality and Fiction is a duality that is easily blurred. Think some, and you'll collapse the duality. 'Real' simply refers to existence, but even delusion exists, your hallucinations exist, otherwise you wouldn't perceive them. It's all reality, maybe not in accordance to our relative-practical-consistent state of reality, but it's real. The reason everything is real is because everything that exists, exists. Do not collapse the duality between existence and non-existence thinking "Non-existence doesn't exist, therefore all there is is existence.", that's like saying the orange is an orange because it's not an apple. You haven't collapsed the duality. Collapse it by thinking existence cannot be defined anymore because non-existence cannot be defined. Why not? Because something cannot exist only in relation to something that exists. But when talking about everything at once, how can you even think of non-existence? Non-existence and existence are relative concepts. This would mean that everything is in accordance to reality. Because now we do not compare the 'existence' of something with the 'existence' of another, now we compare it to itself. Which is the purest way of going about it. In this way, everything is accordance to reality. EVERYTHING. Everything is true. The state where you understand everything is one is true, the state where everything is separate is equally as true. "Everything is God" "I am God" also then becomes relative to your state of consciousness. Thinking of yourself as a human separate to God, is also true, because it is. You are not God behind the scenes when you are in a 'deluded' state, you literally aren't God then. You may ask then, what are we doing this work for if not to reduce falsehood and move towards truth? Well, do you not see that the duality of truth and falsehood has collapsed? If everything is true, nothing is false. If nothing is false, then nothing can be true. Because they are both defined by each other. All that there is left is beingness, which again cannot be defined because the duality between being and non-being has collapse. Are we even left with something, again, we cannot say, because the duality between something and nothing has collapsed. You can't give it a label. What we are really doing in this work is to move towards purity, and away from impurity. When you are in a state of separation, all the separate forms necessarily interact. These interactions themselves are forms, which interact with each other creating more interactions/forms and so on. They all cloud or conflict or compliment etc. with each other. The deeper down this fractal you go the more impure you are, the higher up you go this fractal, dissolving these interactions/forms, the more you purer you are. Why do you move towards purity in this work and not impurity? Well, as pointed out in the video about Sameness vs. Difference, all forms are in this cycle of unionizing and differentiating. We are simply in that cycle as well, moving towards purity, and then impurity. Cycles within cycles within cycles. There can't be a top level cycle of God unionizing and one day dividing again, because it's infinite. Yet everything moves as if that top-level cycle is there, because it really is there, and not there at the same time. It's like halving the number 1 again and again to reach 0, you get closer each time, but you will never make it to 0, even though it is there. Only way you can reach to 0 is stop moving towards it, stop halving, stop the progression, and just say fuck it and jump towards it. If you can jump from 1 to a 0.5, then to 0.25 and so on, why not just jump to 0 straight up? Applying my own logic, you could argue that everything I said here is true, but so is it's opposite, then why did I write all of this if everything is true? What am I attempting to do this with this wall of text? What I have wrote is purer than would be it's opposite. What I wrote here unionizes concepts, collapses dualities and dissolves forms. It's definitely towards purity. We intuitively call purity truth and impurity falsehood. Remember, whatever you think of this post, is true, but how pure is it?

"The highest spiritual practice" would be something that hurls you towards infinity and unity at the fastest speed. I don't think metta is that good for that. All spiritual practices towards God are towards Love, metta is just one of those practices.

I asked GPT3.5 to expand on your post and it came up with this: This text took me on a trip lol

@Leo Gura Is it possible for you to describe what level of awakening you are talking about compared to the average "awakened" folk(no self, samadhi, love, etc.)? I mean, atleast how many orders of magnitude are we talking?

That's the essence of what I am saying as well. I'd like to add that since truth and falsehood cannot be define on the scale of infinity, what we seek is not truth but purity/unity. On the scale of infinity, even the duality of purity and impurity collapse, so the fact that we still pursue purity must mean the desire/urge is always aiming at something relative to something else, and at one point this desire/urge will have to be transcended. But I wonder, how would one move forward after such a point? I am biased right now and would like to move towards further purity even after I reach that point, even though then I won't want to.

I agree with you're saying but can you elaborate on this? What does it mean to totally trust the mind? Are you talking of the human mind or reality?

You did not dispute my points. Do you not want to engage in earnest discussion? Have you read my post?

Yeah that's the integrity part. But as far as things like LP is concerned, many people move forward and learn skills through pirated products without feeling guilt.

You underestimate infinity Ego-Death isn't God-Realization, Leo said as much. Furthermore, what I said does indeed lead one towards a purer state, a more 'true' state.

Paying for the product does make you more likely to use it fully and extract all the value from it. But I do not think you can't grow if you use piracy products. There IS that extra layer of integrity though when you pay for what you consume, so I think that must do something.

God isn't so limited that it can only be God all the time. It's infinite to the point where all contradictions make sense and are true when they are true.

Do you want to me to unpack them in relation with each other, as in they contradict each other or do you want me to unpack them on their own?

I should have added double quotes to the "sober". I'll rewrite it to get my point across better, it still means the same thing: Convincing someone of the sameness of sober and non-sober states will not dispel their argument that psychedelics don't give you true awakenings. To them the states of psychedelics, whether considered sober or non-sober, still move you towards impurity/falsehood while states achieved without psychedelics/"naturally" towards purity/truth. That's what you have to convince them out of. To add more to what I said, to them, the problem is that they think psychedelics induce hallucinatory logic and sense-making. Telling them that Sober is not some 'true' state compared to other states, and is just one of many states, won't convince them that psychedelics produce states that are 'more true' than sober. They still hold the bias that the 'Sober' state is 'a' if not 'the' true state and all truth can be found from working within this state. This is a bias.

Convincing someone of the sameness of sober and non-sober states will not dispel their argument that psychedelics don't give you true awakenings. To them the states of psychedelics, whether considered sober or non-sober, still move you towards impurity/falsehood while sober realizations towards purity/truth. That's what you have to convince them out of.

How would you know reality is consistent? Based on your memory? Who's to say your memory wasn't created with everything else right here right now? Maybe what you consider consistency isn't consistency at all. Why is your hand staying a hand consistence? Didn't you move it from point A to B? Wasn't that change, wasn't that break in consistency? Why do you draw a line at movement. Notice you are drawing a blurry line where consistency ends and inconsistency begins. Maybe you don't know what illogical or logical even is. The basis for all of that is based in survival and practicality.

I am pretty sure that requires making a leap in logic thinking, "well since all of reality is disappearing and reappearing then, it must be doing that on it's own with no source behind it." How does your argument prove there is no source behind this cycle? Remember the reader of your post will not be coming in thinking there is nothing outside his experience. You thinking of reality as snippets of existence all strung together like frames in a movie, is all in your head. The reason movement doesn't exist is because there is no distinction between an object being in once place vs. another. Not because there are some imaginary snippets of reality our consciousness is moving through. You can also collapse the duality between disappearance and reappearance, by dissolving the duality between existence and non-existence. Those two are defined by each other. Sure there can be disappearance and reappearance on the level of limited forms, but how will you think of everything, infinity, to be appearing and disappearing? You can't define the duality, it doesn't exist. Seeing that reality is creating itself is simply a knowing, how does your text prove it? Thinking that "all of reality is disappearing and reappearing" is faulty.

Can you link me one of these threads? How did you prove it? Or just give me a brief here instead.

Religion is used mostly for building a solid ground to live from for most people. Many people who go through emotional problems also use religion as a means to ground themselves to stay sane. It's really helpful for grounding yourself and building a strong sense of who you are. This is necessary even though this ground will be dug up as you progress in the spiritual path. What's funny is having a solid foundation is literally step one of spirituality when religion was originally meant to be the last step.