Lyubov

He never really looked healthy. I’ve seen Chinese uncles and grandpas older than him that looked better and they smoke a pack of cigarettes a day while doing exercise in the park.

I’m not going to get into an argument but I am in China now and have spent a lot of time here in the past. China does a great job with improving on existing technology and they are also efficient in their output, but it is true they lack in substantial innovation, expression and originality. Their work can feel a bit hollow, liminal and unintuitive. They copy a ton and rip off plenty. They don’t invent in the purest sense but mostly copy. Where they excel is in efficiency and application, to a degree not possible in the west. When you spend time around Chinese culture and in China it makes senses why they are experts at machining and doing things efficiently and and when you are from the USA you understand why self expression lead to revolutionary invention and originality. China also is liberalizing in Shenzhen where a lot of their technology is designed and engineered. It is a city right next to Hong Kong and probably their most liberal city besides Shanghai. Not all of China is equally conservative. There are parts of China where there is a degree of permissiveness to liberal ways of life and values.

That’s because to a degree there is a phenomenon where your mind / inner child / ego (whatever you wish to call it) knows the truthfulness of your thoughts and what you’re doing. You mix it that with the altered manic state and there is some degree of agency in it. Especially if it becomes a pattern where it becomes familiar. It’s in that space between it all where you act and keep yourself safe and stop putting energy into beliefs and things which create the manic states. Through his episodes a part of you can shine through telling you it’s not true and not right to align like this. Conor overestimated the control he had over it. It’s why he said it’s an act because in a sense it was but it wasn’t an act where he was pretending and faking everything, it was an act in the sense that he would choose it and feed it instead of heeding advice that he would eventually put himself in danger if he fed into those states.

You can put a warning label on a lot of things and try to wash your underlying intentions and lack of maturity when selling it. I agree he has changed since then. Leo started putting out warnings and changed his tone a lot after a string of suicides on this forum and the original Conor incident in 2021. I don’t know if Conor found Leo before or after Aya. Conor is responsible for Conor though. I think he had many opportunities to get some help and he was warned a lot his episodes could lead to some big mistakes. I hope Leo realizes the amount of responsibility for his retreats. Conor being Leo’s Frankenstein has always been a bit of a running joke on this forum and it really ended badly this time… it kind of puts a whole new weight on this community.

I’m in Xian now

I didn’t watch this video with audio. But look at it… it looks like shit splattered on the floor and walls. He trashed the place he was renting.

This is definitely real. Bangkok Post is a trustworthy source and it’s starting to get picked up by other media now. I’m not surprised either it ended this way for him. I felt a bit of shock and startled finding this out and this whole situation has people who are emotionally invested and connected to it. I went through a similar breakdown after Aya too and it was around the time when Conor did, mine was in 2019 Conor’s was in early 2021 after I had made my recovery and when he was talking to Leo, so this situation parallels mine and I’ve been here since the beginning of it all. I’ve never fully trusted Leo as a teacher since my life destabilizing trip and I believe that’s a good thing. You should not be so trusting of people who share info on psychedelics and teach things that carry significant risk and from my own ethical perspective I’ve sometimes felt that Leo has been slow to adjust and recognize his mistakes in what he has promoted and shared. I’m not the best with words but looking back I think Leo’s old teaching were somewhat flippant and lacked the foresight and maturity to see what releasing the information he did so openly would do to people being funneled to him by YouTube. At the same time though I also see Leo has changed some since then and he isn’t responsible for Conor’s life. Conor fucked up here and he had a lot of time to get his shit together. I don’t think I fall into the category of someone with an axe to grind with Leo but I do feel a bit angry about this. I took psychedelics in 2019 because I saw many videos of Leo talking about retreats and was under the impression it was what I needed to do to get unstuck in life and fix my life and problems at that time and it really really left me fucked up for around a year after and completely upended my life. It’s in the past now and my story ended differently, my life is going so well, I’m spoiled. This touches on something real for me though.

grizzly bears are love, but the bear didn't get that memo. reminds me of the monk who goes to pet the stray dog barking at him after meditating lol, then asks his master why he got bit. love does not mean tuning out reality.

There is a video of his home. looks like he was smearing shit on his walls or some brown substance and drawing with it. His flat tells you everything. He went mad. He jumped into a lake a drowned while out of his mind.

I am seeing a lot of people discuss these things. I'd really like some shortcuts if possible. Are they legit? Anyone experienced with them?

Yeah I did some contemplation and research, there def is a huge social media bot craze where nefarious and corrupt actors pay bot farms to promote peptides on social media. I think what we are seeing is largely overpromising. I'll do further research and possible try ones that have been properly tested for weight loss but I think I'm going to stay far away for any of the experimental stuff. I am not inclined to believe a lot of what I'm hearing on social media. Also, the influencer coach pyramid scheme model is also pretty intrenched in the sale of these substances. So you have grifters selling courses and mentorships on how they can teach you how to start a peptide business.

Went to the Great Wall today lol. A Chinese guy asked me for a photo.

Sometimes. I think the one area I am working on in my life is being open and having difficult conversations in my relationships. I'm still learning and allowing to live in Wu Wei (authentic flow). Everyone has their own story or dynamic with their ego / inner child. I am afraid of many things and will sometimes choose to go back to familiar fallacies. No one does everything perfect and living aligned isn't a competition nor a measuring stick for you being here now vs where you think you should be where there is value.

It's not impossible. I have been pretty fat by today's looksmaxxing social media standard and pulled quite a few beautiful women in my time. Inner game sets you up for the long term game. Things have shifted a bit where I think looks for men are a bit more important but pre instagram it was not as important as having excellent social skills, humor and just all around authentic. Also looksmaxxing is just a ridiculous idea in general. It attempts to coin something that is nothing, just desperation. It has always been well know you should try to be maximizing and doing the best you can to look nice. Fixing your clothes, physique, haircut, etc. Looksmaxxing is just a meme autists and clickbaiters fixate on and now it's being astroturf'd by online casinos and right wing interests to funnel young men into the manosphere so they can be leeched on for cash and views. Ridiculous stuff like bone smashing and taking meth for clicks on social media. This shit is being conflated with going to the gym 5-6 days a week which is a pretty good idea if you are on the come up. It's kinda like how kids or teenagers will do something outrageous for attention and even they know it's built on lies and fallacies but it's silly enough to catch on and grab people's attention and since those things are seen as virtue by certain people, they like the approval, money and fame it brings them.

Thick face is not having a care in the world what other people think of you including most importantly your own doubts about yourself. A person who has cultivated this quality will create a positive image of himself regardless of what others think. It is a common element found in a lot of the earlier pick up artist work and stuff on self help and public speaking. You can be a ruthless thick face guy and also be very in touch with your emotions and actually soften, even Owen has softened quite a bit. There is some wisdom in a good bit of what he says. I think the fundamental element that was taught was it was always about bringing you back to deeper self reflection and fundamentally working where life is arising from. What is the root of it all. You are being told you are valuable as you are, you are capable as you are, you can do great things, now go out and approach. That fundamental element of "being enough" sets you off on a far more positive trajectory than "you are absolutely shit now and need to change your physical body." Now I'm not saying the old school pick up guys didn't have their own baggage or didn't lead to traps as well, but I see the trajectory of the old school Owen approach setting you up far better in life than trying to just optimize the outside because 1) the outside is arbitrary and always changing 2) it shuts you off from becoming more conscious of where you create from.

I also noticed a correlation between the deeper inner game thick face approach and deeper development in life. I've seen the thick face approach lead to guys who actually seem to have matured and developed more as men and people all around, became more spiritual, which ultimately is the point of life. There are guys like James Marshell and even Owen with his own traps are much more developed than any looksmaxer school of thought. I think it's because thick face delusion in a sense is more aligned with the core than looks maxing. Aligning with "I'm great, I can achieve anything" sets you off on a trajectory that compounds from having not aligned with fears and is far more living truthfully than "I hope if I inject this people will like me." I think looksmaxing does take some ownership and responsibility back, it is def better than just sitting around getting fat watching kick/twitch streams and donating to looksmaxers, but the trajectory for looksmaxing is fundamentally flawed, sometimes conflated with good advice like going to the gym. There even is a phrase "gymcels." The inner game approach has it's flaws too but it's much more likely to make you spiritual in the long run. All these looksmaxers will fuck themselves up and I will double down on christianity and put crosses and bible versus in their profiles. You seldomly saw that with thick faced pick up where it was about building inner resilience

Classic old school pickup mindset. This is Owen 101. I come from this generation, The Game / Mystery Method, so I remember back then there was almost zero emphasis on looks except for the occasional coach brining guys out to the mall to replace their rags. Common sense type shit. To be honest, I want to almost say that what old school pick up gets right is that it makes you so delusional that you form such a thick face that you end up persevering towards victory becoming attractive in the process. A thick face is always incredibly valuable in life and in a sense makes life much more enjoyable. The looksmaxing shite I think just has a very weak and sad energy to it somehow poisoned by social media and the arbitrary trends of instagram. Instead of outward socializing it puts you more-so focused just on your looks hoping that is enough for outward approval that you seek. I think there is some positives to it though because I've seen what doors open when you have exceptionally good looks. If i was to be 20 and single in 2026, I think both Owen style pick up but also maximizing in the gym, fashion and finances would be the approach. All this shit doesn't need silly labels. It is no secret if you have social skills, physical health and money and you optimize your life to maximize all of these which is what everyone that's into self improvement is trying to do that you will meet women. It doesn't need to become an autistic meme.

Dude I'm flying to China on Saturday for 50 days. I will be going to 10 cities including Chengdu. I'm really excited. I will be vlogging the whole experience, hope to publish 6-8 videos on the trip. I was there in 2016 for two months. I love China.

I don’t think this place is a cult as of now. As far as I know Leo earns shit from us and isn’t looking for girls to shag from here (he deleted the dating blog post quickly after it went up). We will see what this place turns into if those retreats take off. I do think this community and Leo’s style is dangerous for mentally unstable people though. And I think when his channel was mostly self help stuff but then transitioned pretty quickly into psychedelics/spirituality, it created a pretty dangerous pipeline into a ecosystem with poor support and resources for mentally unstable people.

Call this place a cult, or not. His criticism is valid. This place is a dangerous for some people. Half the community are incels and unemployed people who haven't built a life for themselves and aren't fully grounded in themselves or their integrity. The teachings here are reckless. Leo has gotten better over the years with what he teaches, but his old library is still up. Leo is honestly super autistic and lacks maturity and wisdom to guide most people seriously in my opinion. You have to be able to keep up with his style and his chemistry and his ability to alter his state. And he is thinking of running a retreat with security armed with tasers, a tour up Mt Everest. I hope you're prepared for this because this is the one thing which if even the slightest thing goes wrong, your entire image will be fucked. The criticism is valid. Still Leo is an interesting person and a great writer and I do like him a lot, so his insights are really cool to read and learn from especially on certain topics I gravitate towards. Oddly I don't come here for spiritual teachings, I come for insights more on life and new was of thinking/reasoning. You can split hairs calling this place a cult but yeah, Leo can be an unsafe person to lead. There are much safer and better people to learn psychedelic protocols from. A lot of unwell people will gravitate towards this personality type that lets one give up their responsibility and kowtow to a model and terms of thought that you should be sovereign and the center of yourself, your spirituality. I'm fine with videos like this. The average person should be aware that actualized.org is a dangerous place.

We won't know unless more evidence comes to light. I'm worried a lot of evidence has been destroyed in the files though.

No one knows what happens after death. You don't even know what will happen 10 minutes from now in life.

I watched this doc and it was surprisingly powerful. Thoughts on him? I like him, he was no saint but I like him.

Dude you are grand standing.

Sounds like cope to me