soos_mite_ah

Dealing with My Spiritual Ego: The Dangers of the Spiritual Ego and Why People Should Be Careful Some. of. yall. bout. to. be. real. mad. at. me. but. it. must. be. said. While I do get a lot of value out of spirituality and Actualized.org, there are things that I'm very hesitant and even skeptical about. This might look like me turning on this community or not aligning with the main values of this place but I honestly don't care. The two main things that I'm really hesitant about involve the dating advice here, especially for guys who can't get laid, and the enlightenment related things there. I'm not going to talk about the first one because I already wrote about that but I am going to focus on the second one. I suppose that I'm far from having any concerns about enlightenment and transcendence. I think I'm at a place where integration and building a solid foundation to build my life on in order to ground me is much more important. I think getting on the path to enlightenment prematurely can be incredibly dangerous without proper integration. Maybe I'll get to a point where I'll care more about existential and absolute truths years down the road or maybe I won't I don't know. But I know that if I ever get on that path, I want to be able to have some type of framework and some solid foundation because diving in head first without preparation is irresponsible for me and the people around me. There are some methods of getting there that I don't particularly agree with (if you do agree with it idc, no judgement I don't know what's best for everyone) and those include things like psychedelics, fasting, and isolating yourself from your loved ones and abandoning your hobbies and interests because all of your attention should be towards enlightenment. I feel that those things are rather extreme and are things that are definitely not for the vast majority of people. Also, I'm hesitant with drugs in general. I don't care if other people uses them granted they are doing so safely, responsibly, and legally but it's not for me especially when that advice is coming from a talking head on the internet. Upon recent events, this video by Adeptus Psychonautica came out. Some people are triggered because they think it makes actualized.org look bad but I think it's incredibly beneficial for people from the outside critiquing actualized.org because being super insular usually doesn't end well for a variety of reasons whether it be because of self bias all the way to cult like tendencies. I guess I'm not particularly attached to actualized.org and spirituality in general so when people critique these things, I don't feel particularly triggered because to me it's simply a source. I think it can be easy for people to get attached to some sources and some teachers because of the benefits that one gets from their content because it does have to do with those people's survival emotionally and psychologically. Especially if you get help in a vulnerable place and even if you get out of that vulnerable place, there is an attachment that forms, almost like a baby blanket after you grow up imo. I've had something like this come up for me once personally and even though I've never got to the point of needing to defend that source I got value from, it does sting because part of you identifies with the source and teachings therefore when someone critiques that source or teaching, it's like they're critiquing you. I went ahead and watched Adeptus's livestream and I feel like most of it was valid despite what other people may think on here. At no point did I feel that there was slander or that Actualized.org was being dragged through the mud. There are also points where Adeptus talks about the positives of the way Leo is handling different issues such as the phone call he had with Connor Murphey and one of the posts he made on the thread discussing recent events( Around 1:08:00-1:17:00). They talked about how Leo or any of the mods are trying to do anything malicious or create a cult but sometimes it seems like there is one forming around Leo anyway (basically collective ego). Overall, @AdeptusPsychonautica, I loved this video and I think It's important to contemplate on the darker aspects of spirituality and self improvement rather than idealizing it. Here are somethings that I found were really valuable that I want to include in my journal.: Around the 15 minute mark: Mackenzie talks about how these teachings aren't things that were made up by the community rather they are things that were taught by ancient teachers and how back then there were teachers who had communities but since it was in person, the teacher can gage were the students are at and how much they can handle. However, this aspect gets lost when its all on YouTube and on a forum when anyone regardless of how stable they are can access it. There aren't checks and balances. I think this is a very valid critique. It's not so much a direct attack on actualized.org but it's talking about how systemically there are problems and shortcomings. At the 20-24 minute mark, I can see why some people in this community can get triggered. They are critiquing how a lot of the followers think that they are a finished product and they are so enlightened and they egg each other on in order to keep up with the master and meanwhile the master is here talking about "i've gone deeper, I've become more awakened, I encountered a new level of awakening, you can't understand where I've been." And this challenges people to do more and more and more to where it can become compulsive especially because Leo talks in these absolute terms. Adeptus talks about how this might be Leo's personal truth and how he isn't saying Leo is lying or anything like that but it's the way he goes about it. This is honestly part of the reason why I avoid parts of this forum. I personally found that this type of thing doesn't help me and how this type of thing can become very compulsive, especially when it comes to Leo's fanboys. Around the 31 minute mark: If truth realization is not your Moby Dick to where you want to sacrifice everything, go for human adulthood meaning the integration of your spiritual, emotional, relational, physical self to be your most mature self. If you don't want to sacrifice everything, point your hunger toward integration and self actualization. Then in the 37 minute mark, Mackenzie talks about her experiences with nonduality how she felt all the love and light in the moment but then she came back down to just being human again and still having all of her problems that she had before the experience and how that can be discouraging and therefore cause people to go on these endless seeking journeys. I feel like this is where I'm at with my views on spirituality and self realization. I do care more about integration and building a fulfilling life than simply transcending everything and joining the void. Because based on some of the interactions I've had on this forum, teachers that I have learned about in history, and interacting with Leo himself is that even if they get an enlightenment experience, there is still plenty of human shit and blind spots you'll still have. And I think to go towards actualization is to deal with that in a slow consistent way rather than dealing with nonduality and transcendence. Around the 40 minute mark: Mackenzie talks about cleaning up her nihilism she encountered from spirituality and how she started building meaning in the form of close relationships, books, etc. to slowly start rebuilding her ego to care about existing. And then she realized that that was the process that she wanted all along and because she grew up in the shadow of new age culture where ego death, nonduality, mysticism, love and light are more a part of the conversation than anything, she thought that was the way to fix herself. But for her it was more along the lines of deep psychological work, embodiment, and healing that she realized she wanted more of a complete human experience instead of transcending the human experience because that was the thing sold to her as a way to deal with being here. In order to deal with being here, you don't have to leave. You just have to be present and accept the present moment instead of constantly feeling like you have to do more and more to reach a higher and higher state of consciousness in order to be at peace with the present moment. In spiritual communities its like there is always some place else to get to. It goes back to the 27 minute mark where Mackenzie talks about how there are two levels. There is truth realization and done. Once you reach done, that's it there is no more self discovery of lets go see what else I can find. Once you're enlightened, the seeker disappears so if you're seeking more experiences, you're still seeking which can get compulsive. I love this section. While I never became nihilistic, I've had a point where I got really attached to detaching. I journaled about this before and how it relates to my relationship to actualized.org. Basically it wasn't cute. I had a friend who was like "I don't think you even know who you are anymore" because I got caught in this cycle of even detaching from the healthier forms of my ego like my personality, my hobbies and interests etc. It wasn't this enlightenment thing that people often talk about here. And from then on I took a step back from spirituality and self help in order to be more gentle with myself so I can build myself back up again. This was the post I was talking about and here is the part that I think is most applicable to this post: Around the 47 minute mark: I also like how they discuss how people turn spiral dynamics is another dick measuring contest lol. Also Adeptus talks about how it's not about the model itself rather it's about how people use it to judge others and turn it into a dogma. Then Mackenzie talks about how it's important ot just see it as a model rather than THE TRUTH that explains and solves everything because that can be the indication that this is probably a defensive ego mechanism. Reminds me of something I wrote elsewhere in this journal: Around the 1 hour 3 minute mark: Mackenzie talks about how some teachings are vague or are gatekept because the highest teachings can be dangerous. Vague teachings will only make sense when people ponder it for a while and then when the reach a certain place in their journey it will make sense. And that bread crumbing your way to truth is part of a gradual process of direct experience where you figure it out on your own, therefore if something goes wrong, you can still back track. However with psychedelics, you're kind of thrown into the truth and then you may or may not be able or ready to deal with it which can be dangerous if someone doesn't have proper integration. Granted I've never experimented with psychedelics and I don't plan to any time soon, but I do 100% agree with the need for proper integration and the importance of pacing yourself in the journey to find truth. It reminds me of Leo's video on ego backlash where if there is a sudden change, even if it's for the better it can lead to a huge backlash because individually and collectively we want to aim towards homeostasis rather than growth because homeostasis feels safe while growth is a leap into the unknown. And these backlashes, even though they may look like a step back after taking a step forward, are important so that you don't do too much too soon and throw everything off and cause chaos while aiming for growth. The bigger the growth, the bigger the backlash. To me that's important to take into consideration because to me that means taking on too much too soon can yield to a huge backlash which can be pretty detrimental. And to me, it means that it's important to take your time on the journey and pace yourself so that you don't have a backlash that is so devastating that it takes away all of your progress. It simply isn't sustainable. That's something I also learned this year as I've been trying to take a more gentle, slow approach to discipline rather than a rigorous strict way to discipline. It goes back to that feeling of always wanting to get somewhere rather than appreciating where you are now. The spiritual ego wants to be enlightened as soon as possible and if it means taking a shit ton of LSD or 5meo, it will take that route over a slower and more sustainable way like through meditation, self-inquiry, and working on yourself in general. I don't think there is anything wrong with those substances and that there is a time and place for them but when you have a spiritual ego that wants to get more and more enlightenment experiences that last longer and longer and go deeper and deeper, I can see how that can turn very dysfunctional to where someone might contemplate on ending their life so that they are in that state of bliss forever. 1:21:00: "What are things about yourself that you are trying to avoid by transcending that? That's where to start. What are you trying to transcend, why are you so fucking eager to transcend it." I just really like this part. I think a lot of people need to contemplate this tbh and I think this is a good quote to end this post at.

I'd say her work is geared towards a integrative approach where people are trying to integrate parts of themselves through things like shadow work rather than a transcendent approach where you're trying to transcend parts of you. Personally, I got a lot of benefit from this. Integrating the ego and making it whole makes it safer for transcendence because transcending things prematurely can lead to things like creating shadows of repression, which wouldn't be helpful in the path and can lead to a lot of dysfunction.

I'm with @Etherial Cat. I really value your contribution to this forum. I also feel a lack of empathy and proper grounding in parts of the forum. It's part of the reason why I don't go to some parts of the forum tbh. Nowadays, I mainly try to stay in my own lane in my own journals. I glossed over the threads about recent events but after reading some comments, I didn't feel comfortable with really going into it. I just said my piece and went my way. The whole thing was heart breaking and overwhelming. Not to bring spiral dynamic into this but sometimes I feel that people are so focused on stage yellow and turquoise that they don't properly integrate green and that some people who claim to be yellow don't have the best foundation of integration because they are so concerned with getting towards the highest stages as soon as possible.

I second this. I think clearing up issues with absolute truth and relative truth is an important step in making this type of work safer for people who are just getting into it. I have seen people use the absolute perspective in situations where it isn't appropriate nor constructive. I do remember there being threads and posts of people talking about how rape isn't evil. In a philosophical discussion one can make the argument that evil is a label we project on to things to ensure we keep ourselves safe, but when you use that same statement in the context of dating advice or something of that sort, it can be incredibly damaging and gaslighting for people who have dealt with things such as rape or any other form of sexual harassment. Additionally, differentiating between absolute and relative truth and knowing where to apply it is important given the context of the situation. Blanketing over an issue with platitudes of absolute truth can result in things like false equivalency which can also lead to things like zen devilry. I'll use survival as an example. In the absolute sense everything is survival but in the relative sense there are different ways to go about it ranging from healthy and conscious to dysfunctional and unconscious. While the absolute truth that everything is survival isn't false or misleading, it can mesh together healthy forms of survival and unhealthy forms of survival resulting in the false equivalency problem. Some people can look at that without knowing how to differentiate when to implement relative and absolute truths and be feel justified in dysfunctional practices. Same with things like nonduality. While I have limited experience and knowledge regarding this subject and I'm still on the journey of figuring things out on my own, I do believe that for concepts in nonduality, again, there is a time and place for it and it's important to be able to discern that especially when advice is given. This is a good place to go through a vetting process of sorts and try to determine where people are at based on the discussion they are having and meet those people where they're at. Like for instance if someone is in a toxic situation and they can't get out due to logistical issues, it's more important to empathize and validate that experience along with giving that person coping skills in the meantime instead of telling that person that this is a dream and is all in their head since that can do more harm than good. While I do see most users understanding this, sometimes I do encounter people getting so spiritual to where they forget how to behave like normal human beings. I think addressing the time and place to effectively use what we know on an absolute and relative level can work through much of these problems. That will clarify a lot of things that people misconstrue imo. Part of learning is being able to make distinctions and having accurate discernment.

@Ora I had to search up what candida is and yeah I doubt I have that lol. Don't have any of the symptoms except the sugar cravings

I don't have a habit of eating a lot of really sweet things. I never had the habit of eating dessert. But I always crave something sweet after a meal. It isn't overwhelming and I normally don't give into these cravings (mainly because I don't have anything super sweet in the house) but it is something that is rather annoying. So why does this happen and what can I do about it?

On Recent Events on the Forum (Trigger Warning: Suicide) So apparently someone on this forum committed suicide for spiritual reasons so they can experience a conscious death. This was really heartbreaking to read and part of me had no idea what to say because I'm not good at handling things regarding death. My heart does go out to the person's friends and family. But I did have somethings to say particularly on the dangers of spiritual work and how spiritual teachings can me misinterpreted in dangerous ways to harm oneself and others. I have encountered something similar in my journey when I tried to jump into transcendence prematurely. I felt the need to explain my critiques in the thread where people were talking about this because the dangers of spiritual work and how people talk about it I feel aren't addressed enough. There are a lot of potentially dangerous things on here from what I've observed tbh. I wasn't trying to blame or shame anyone. It's easy to just say that the person who committed suicide that it was their responsibility to interpret things in a constructive way. While that is true, I think as the community and as actualized.org is trying to go mainstream (based on the clips channel as well as making podcast rounds), it's important to look at what we can do in our end and have these difficult conversations on how far to take spirituality and where are the lines we need to draw when talking to other people about it, not out of shame or wanting to water down teachings but for the safety, wellbeing, and growth of the people and society around us. There is a reason why some teachers hold back advanced teachings. I know that all teachings can't be idiot proof but I think there are somethings we can still do to reduce situations like these. I can't say I know what those things are but having that conversation discussing these things is important. The thought of leaving people behind, especially little kids just hits really hard for me. I'm tearing up while writing this tbh. I've had issues with suicidal thoughts over the years so I understand to a certain extent. I've also a lot of people who were close to me and while I didn't lose anyone personally to suicide, a lot of those deaths were sudden, a couple of them were violent. Again, my heart goes out to the person's friends and family. I'm probably going to write about the issues I see on this forum. I was originally thinking about getting that out of my system in this journal for the last couple weeks but now I'm also thinking about posting that as a thread. I don't even know tbh.

No these things shouldn't be banned but having some more disclaimers and clarifications regarding how teachings can be misconstrued is very important. It's especially important in this circumstance because of how open/accessible YouTube and this forum is. While I do agree that no one is to blame here, you can't just excuse everyone from responsibility. Not analyzing teachings and the way they are presented as an important factor to consider causes people to take a hyper individualistic route that can easily cause things like this to repeat. Hyper individualism doesn't work to deal with problems like this. I can't say that I know much about what happened or what other factors were at play but I do know from my direct experience that you need to be very careful with what you say and how you say it so it doesn't harm others unintentionally when it comes to higher teachings. Sure Leo isn't to blame and shouldn't be shamed but saying he doesn't have some part of responsibility of how his words can impact the actions of others is incorrect. I agree, there are a lot of fanboys and people who are lost and looking for answers because they are in a painful place in their lives on here. Things like self development and spirituality can attract a lot of people like that and it's important to be mindful of that fact and act accordingly. I second this. Most people need integration rather than transcendence. Transcendence maybe the goal for some but the process of integration is vital so that we can sustain ourselves and turn our needs into shadows and have that blow up in our face in nasty ways.

I agree with much of this. There is a need for more responsibility and more disclaimers when it comes to more advanced teachings because they can VERY EASILY be misconstrued into very harmful ways. Most people aren't ready for advanced teachings and that isn't something that makes that person bad or less conscious. It just means you need to focus on the foundation first because without it, things can get very dark. I have had my own experiences with taking in too much advanced material too soon and having negative repercussions in my mental health. I had to step back and make the decision to not take in advanced material until much later and that has benefited me greatly. Also, sometimes spiritual teachings such as everything is a dream or just meditate on it to transcend the issue entirely can be gaslighting when you are going through difficult emotions. Because often times people in those situations need support instead of being told something along the lines of *your issues are all a result of your ego contemplate on that.* Whether or not that is true isn't as important as if this is going to help the person or hurt the person because that can have a huge impact on whether or not they even get to a higher level of consciousness. I also think that while it can be really good that this forum in general wants to reach the highest truths, I think we need to also see the merits of more basic personal development and not dismiss that as illusions. I made a thread on this forum a couple months back and I think it depicts the importance of being more responsible with the teachings on here (especially in the 2nd page):

This is really tragic. I'm so sorry for your loss. My heart goes out to Soonhei's friends and family

I think environment does play a huge role. I have experienced this as well in my college where most people are blue/orange and yeah if you show a hint of green a lot of people will side eye you or not want to get to know you. I have also experienced this with my family and I have this defense mechanism where I'm super hesitant to open up and discuss things with them. Nevertheless, I still found myself attracting the few orange/green people and green people who have the potential to go yellow that were in my environment. I guess due to my openness with that type of thinking, how I feel at ease with people from those stage therefore making it easier to be around them, and my subconscious beliefs making me naturally gravitate towards those kinds of people. Even though most people at my school probably wouldn't want to be around me if they knew my views, to me it's almost like the process of elimination tbh. I agree with this. I noticed that when people change around their environment and branch out more that they are more likely to develop themselves and move up stages. From my experiences a lot of young people tend to fall in this category since they haven't settled down and gone into stagnation. Granted, I already grew up in a fairly liberal environment where people tended to be orange/green and a lot of people in my area who went off to college came back as very green. Similarly in my family, I have cousins who started out at blue/orange but when they moved away from home and got exposed to the world and different ideas, they came back orange/green or simply green. I think this also depends on area and how often people move around and get exposed to new ideas. But I do agree that a lot of self growth happens horizontally within a stage. I know people here see moving up stages as the goal but I also think that horizonal growth is something that should be recognized more tbh. There can be a lot of growth from unhealthy orange to healthy orange or unhealthy green to healthy green which can go a long way when it comes to the state of you base line consciousness even if you are technically in the same stage. This might be my bias talking but I feel like even if you have the smallest smidge in you, you're more likely to be flexible and open with growth.

@Raphael Omfg I'm flattered thank you I'm so glad that you get something out of this journal I also really like your journal as well and I check up on it pretty regularly

Dealing with My Spiritual Ego : Moving Towards Balance and Integration Taking a couple steps back from really working on myself really helped me get some perspective as to where I'm at in this journey and where I need to go. Here are somethings that I realized were hang ups in me. Taking "Responsibility" for Everything: I think a lot of self-help people even if they aren't heavily in stage orange emphasize on how "you need to take charge," "you need to take action," "you need to take 100% responsibility at everything that is thrown at you." While I don't disagree with those statements, I think audience matters a lot. Sure, there are a lot of people who need that kick in the gut so that they get up off the couch and work on themselves and sure there are a lot of people who need that reminder of "hey stop playing victim and blaming others, see what you're doing to continue this circumstance." But I think for me personally I fall in the opposite spectrum where I tend to internalize things easily and feel this need to take a large amount of action even when something isn't my fault. I think I internalize a lot of things in order to feel a sense of personal power like *yeah I am in control of this situation, this is my doing, I can change it* which isn't a bad thing but sometimes it can be an overcompensation in the face where I don't have control. I know that different pieces of advice are good for different people. It comes down to knowing how to get to a balanced, integrated point from where you are now . I'll use the example of awkwardness. Sometimes I get myself into awkward interactions with people and sometimes it is their fault but instead of recognizing that, I have a tendency to point it back to myself since I have this thing drilled into me that says "don't blame others, take responsibility" and then I beat myself up for and blame myself for the awkward situation. I know that beating myself up and blaming myself isn't actual responsibility. Responsibility is your ability to respond. It's supposed to empower you while blame disempowers you and puts you in a victim mindset of sorts even if it is the case that you are blaming yourself. Shaming yourself is rarely the best way to respond. Sometimes recognizing that something isn't your fault or has any bearing on you is the best way to respond because you aren't internalizing the situation. But for me, I'm nervous about pointing the finger outwards to the people and the situation around me because I'm afraid of the self deception that may come with that judgement. Which brings me to the next point.... The Vast Majority of People are Unconscious: I sometimes get this vibe from Actualized.org videos of this notion that the vast majority people are deluded, dysfunctional, egoic, and just awful people because their consciousness isn't high enough and that includes you too because, hey, you can't point out there without pointing the finger back at yourself. I think there is some truth in this that we are deluded and egoic when you zoom out into the absolute perspective. But for me personally, it made me question and second guess everything I was thinking. While that itself isn't a bad thing, I did greatly benefit from this, but one set back for me was that I underestimated my own growth and I felt this need to hyper focus on some issues I had and make a mountain out of a mole hill. I did a whole post on why it's important to recognize your growth and I feel that it relates well to this section: This video relates to this as well: When it comes to this notion that the vast majority of people are unconscious, not only did it impact my relationship to myself causing me to be harsh and nitpicky with my flaws, but it also colored the way I interacted with others. I did talk about how I was uncomfortable with talking about spirituality and self development with people I knew because I was afraid that they wouldn't "get it." As a result of that along with the notion of how the vast majority of people are unconscious, I built up this scarcity mindset when it comes to who I thought I could really connect with. I think the dating and relationship section of this forum also made things worse because of the types of discussions that take place there. For a consciousness forum, I have found more conscious conversations about dating and relationships in real life. I know a lot of people, particularly men, here don't have the healthiest view on themselves and they assume that everyone is neurotic as they are. They assume that most attractive women are unconscious, they only care about looks because that's where their value lies, and that if you aren't rich, famous, successful, or have a square jaw that you're not going to get anyone's attention. And that's because their insecurities lie in their looks, their money, and their status so they hyper focus on that and also assume that everyone is judging them on the same criteria they judge themselves on. I think I greatly benefitted from getting out of that section of the forum and muting around 30 people. I already have some issues with this notion that good men are scarce and this section just picked at that wound because I felt like I was surrounded by insecure men and it was worse than what I would encounter irl. I know that I talked about dating quite a bit, but I think there is something that is to be said about friendship as well. There is this notion that the vast majority of people aren't looking to develop themselves. I think that ultimately comes down to who you end up surrounding yourself with. Personally, the vast majority of my friendships involved people who were trying to grow and develop as people in some way or another. At times we might have been in different places and stages of our growth and most of the time we didn't put this under the label of "self development" rather we were going through the motions and figuring things out about the world and ourselves but that doesn't mean that my friends weren't oriented around growth since growth can mean so many different things. I think that this notion that the vast majority of people are unconscious caused me to be judgmental with some people in my life and even if I never expressed those judgements, it mainly manifested as me keeping my distance. When in reality, I'm consistently surrounded myself with people who had integrity and cared about growth. Many people like that are out there. In my opinion as long as people are open to working through their problems and they maintain a healthy dynamic, I don't see why I should avoid a friendship or relationship with them. We're always going to be a work in progress and that's ok. Being Above Relationships: Every now and then I come across a thread that reads something along the lines of "are all relationships rooted in survival and selfishness? Is it all ego?" I don't think there is anything wrong per se about ego, survival, and selfishness since it exists in a spectrum but the way that these questions are phrased, there is a connotation of relationships being negative and that you need to transcend your needs. To a certain extent I agree. Sometimes your "needs" can manifest in an unhealthy way like manipulating someone or trying to escape your problems. We should all work towards being self sufficient and being whole in ourselves so we don't fall into things like codependency. But at the same time, I feel like there isn't enough talk about the benefits conscious relationships and how it can help people grow on here. I kind of get the vibe here that the vibe is to be this lone wolf monk that doesn't need/want anyone in their life. There isn't anything wrong with that but I don't think that's healthy for most people in the long run. Sure, it can be healthy for some to have a hermit phase. I know I had one and it came from an authentic and healthy place. But there was a small part of me that felt prideful that I could handle this type of thing when other people couldn't, like I was stronger and more developed because I could be by myself for a long period of time. I also have some dismissive-avoidant tendencies in my attachment style so I think that is also a factor to consider. And upon reflection, I think there was a lot of healing that I went through simply by admitting that I wanted the closeness of other people around me and that I value relationships, not because I had a hole to fill or because I felt lonely, but because I genuinely want to connect to others and build on that connection for the sake of it. Everything in Society is Chimpery and Ego: I do agree that there is a lot of things in society that aren't the healthiest and can serve as a distraction to many people but that doesn't automatically mean that those things are inherently unconscious. I've been letting myself "indulge" a little bit and I don't think it was a bad thing or that it was a back slide. Tbh, it was refreshing. I think it all comes down how you approach a thing rather than what that thing is. I'll use TV as an example. A lot of people zone out in front of the TV and look like they are half dead because they aren't consciously taking in what they are watching. I feel like my parents are like this tbh. But then there are people who get immersed in the show, starts analyzing the plot and the characters, and are overall more conscious about the nuances of the writing and how it impacts viewers and audiences. I know people like this and I've gotten into interesting, conscious conversations about those things. Fashion also gets lumped into egoic societal shit. To a certain extent I get it because people sometimes get consumed by consumerism and materialism and try to change appearances instead of actually working on themselves and dealing with their insecurities. But at the same time, for a lot of people it can be a source of creativity and self expression which is a much more conscious way of going about it. When it comes to doing things that the average person does in society, I don't necessarily think that people who engage in these thing consciously are in scare supply based on the people I have met. Yes for a lot of people, disconnecting from society to get clear on who they are and what they want is important, but that is not a solution that everyone needs to implement imo. I think a lot of people in spiritual circles can get attached to detachment (myself included) and that can cause those people to be harsh on themselves or be judgmental towards others. There is nothing wrong with ego, just make sure you're going about it in a healthy and integrated way. Sometimes you just have to let yourself enjoy the shenanigans of life around you as a way of appreciating life. Sometimes you just have to let yourself be, watch some old Vine videos, scroll through TikTok, and look into the Free Britney Spears movement lol. It's a part of being and accepting imo. I say that because that there is some spiritual people who just write off society as this unconscious blob (intentionally or unintentionally) that they are above. There isn't anything wrong with not resonating with somethings but that doesn't mean you judge others. Self Development is the Main Thing to Focus on: Again, I don't necessarily disagree with this but I think you can take self development too far. It would also be weird to say on a self development forum that self development shouldn't always be the priority. For me, I got to a point where self improvement wasn't always manifesting in the healthiest of ways. While self development is often about dealing with our less healthy, egotistical ways, sometimes you get to a place where there is a paradox and the time you spend developing yourself can be counter productive. At some point you start seeing that time spent developing yourself is still time spent obsessing over yourself and at that point you simply need to take a step back. That's not to say that you shouldn't focus on self development or that you don't ever look at ways to better yourself in any way, I'm just talking about when you turn into a self improvement junkie, you neglect your other hobbies and interests, and you get obsessed with self development and you end up judging people who aren't as obsessed as you're by writing them off as lazy, unconscious, etc.

@outlandish Yeah that happened to me too. I noticed that when I get more fat and protein in my diet, I don't crave junk food period. But I have been getting a good amount of fat and protein in my diet recently so it's probably something else lol.

By exhaust I mean get it out of your system and explore it entirely to where you naturally out grow whatever it is you're exhausting because you see the limitations or because you've reached the point of satisfaction to where you don't feel the need to chase for more. No, you don't need to exhaust every lower value, just the ones that you find yourself resonating with or drawn to. For instance, lets say that there is a part of you that desires success and material wealth. While it's good to know that success and material wealth isn't the main point in life, completely supressing it could lead to creating shadows. Instead, you can have your success chasing phase and enjoy nice things but not having those be the center of your life. Or another example maybe, lets say you're in a stressful situation and you want to turn to organized religion and devote some of your time delving into that to derive a sense of hope. You can still do that while recognizing the limitations of religion and still using your critical thinking. When you get that out of your system, you can be more receptive to a higher value because you don't have your impulses clouding your judgement anymore. Also while you don't need to exhaust every lower value, I'd say that it doesn't hurt to explore a stage to it's entirety to get everything out of it. I've been in stage green for a while and for the longest time I was skeptical of new age spirituality, tarot, and astrology. While I can't say that I really resonate with those things completely, it did help me open up to my emotions more and try to utilize critical thinking in the form of intuition instead of solely relying on rationality.

The whole thing with yellow is that it can see the value of the other stages. Which is why integration is all the more important. I was in a similar position a couple years back where I had a little bit of yellow thinking but I still had hang ups in orange and green that I needed to either address or exhaust. Normally, regression happens when we weren't fully in a stage or if we become stressed and use the coping mechanisms of the previous stage because of a lack of integration. We regress at times of stress because those times reveal the parts the pressure points we need to work through. So that's perfectly normal. The deeper you go into yellow and the more you plug in the issues you had in the previous stages, you will regress less, and even if you do regress, you won't regress nearly as much. For example, one time I was in early yellow and I had something stressful come up and I regressed to orange and got super productivity oriented to deal with the problem. Another stressful thing happened to me recently that was similar to the previous situation but this time since I was deeper in yellow, I did regress, but I regressed into green instead. Just make sure when you integrate and exhaust the previous stages that you do it in a healthy way and that you try to implement the values of the lower stages from an elevated point. I know that might sound confusing but here's an example: At one point I had issues with discipline and productivity, so in other words I had a stage blue/orange hang up. I remember that I tried to integrate this aspect using stage blue/orange methods which involved being strict/rigid with myself, being perfectionistic, and overall being harsh. While I was trying to integrate a healthy aspect of blue/orange, I was going about it in an unhealthy way which to say the least didn't end well. What helped me instead was taking a more gentle and systemic approach to build discipline rather than brow beating myself. In other words, I integrated a stage blue/orange value in a green/yellow way.

Yeah that is a possibility. I do eat a little bit of fruit or dark chocolate as well. It doesn't take that much to satisfy the craving tbh. That makes sense I'll check on that.

Shame Around Being Awkward Part 2: Becoming Comfortable with My Interests Ok so in the original post I had the following points and I elaborated on them but just to make things simple I took the elaborations out so that I have a simple list. I'm going to focus on the items in blue. I have linked that post below if you want to see the original post and the elaborations: Naturally, after making this list, I tried to tackle each point one by one. I started with the first point and I basically tried to get comfortable with talking about my interests without worrying about being seen as weird/ crazy or worrying about whether or not people would get it. I tried to talk about some of interests regarding self development and spirituality with a couple of my friends. It went over really well for me. It helped me come up with more evidence that says "hey, other people can empathize with your experiences, you aren't alone when it comes to these interest in real life." But it also helped me deal with the other reasons why I think I'm awkward. Suddenly, I wasn't worried about running out of things to say or rambling. I was comfortable with what I was talking about and I gained the confidence to keep going because my friends listened to me without judgement. Because I was talking about something I was interested in therefore there weren't any awkward silences that would cause me to think "oh shit I have nothing to say I'm so awkward and I lack social skills." Finally, because I was talking about something I was actually interested in, it felt much more natural to where I didn't have to worry about talking too fast, stuttering, filler words, and not making sense. I noticed that this happens when I get nervous or when I'm not comfortable with what my interests are because when I'm not comfortable with my interests, I'm afraid of talking too much and boring the other person to death or afraid of looking crazy. It really ties into the whole rambling point. I started of trying to tackle the first point only to realize how much it impacted the other points when I put it into practice. Going forward, I think that I can deal with my shame around being awkward by accepting the things that I genuinely enjoy instead of feeling this need to conceal them in order to look sane and rational in front of others.

Cringeworthy Part 3: Some of My Key Takeaways So I stepped back from this book for a little bit to let all of the information marinate. I think the thing that helped me the most in this book is simply understanding what awkwardness is and how it works. By understanding that, it helped me not internalize feelings of awkwardness as much. I talked about this in my Cringeworthy Part 1 post but the big thing that stuck out to me when I was reading was when in p.14 the book goes into how awkwardness is seen as a character trait rather than an emotion or temporary state of being. "American pop culture often depicts awkwardness as a personality trait treating it as if the cause were socially inept individuals." I always thought I was an awkward person rather than someone who experience awkward moments like everyone else. And to me, being awkward coincided with being unlovable, being inconsiderate, being uncomfortable, being weird to where you aren't worthy of connecting with people. A lot of these beliefs around awkwardness also ties into the web of limiting beliefs I picked up from childhood experiences. The book reminded me of a lot of awkward things I did growing up. Like, the most irrelevant memories that I didn't think of for years popped up in my head while reading this. And when that would happen, I tried to do this thing where instead of cringing and curling up into a ball, I would try to reframe the situation and focus on why it was awkward rather than that it was awkward. Like for instance, I remember feeling awkward and dreading my graduation party because my parents basically forced me to have this party and invited a bunch of people from different areas of my life. Before reading this book I would have cringed and been like "omfg I was so awkward I want to forget about this ASAP and just crawl into a hole and die because I hate myself." But after reading this book, I tried to reframe this situation as "this situation was uncomfortable because I was put in a position where I had to play multiple roles at once and that felt overwhelming for me." For me personally the word awkward is loaded when I use it to describe myself. It's very easy for me to internalize because, again, it's treated like a personality trait one has instead of something a person momentarily feels. By reframing this situation in this way, I believe it helped not internalize my feelings of awkwardness as something that I am or something that is wrong or inherently unlovable about me. Rather, reframing this situation helped me see it in a more neutral way that isn't tied to my ego. Or for another example, I thought of the time when I was really nervous at a party and I came off as really awkward. Again, normally my response to when my brain comes up with memories like this are usually like "I want to forget about this and crawl into a hole and die because I hate myself." And in this situation I reframed it as "I wasn't awkward because there is something wrong with me or my social skills but because I was hyper focused on myself to where I wasn't relaxed or focusing on the other person. And being hyper focused about what I do isn't something that is wrong with me, it's something that is natural because I know so much about myself and my flaws since I see myself from the inside out, I'm with myself all the time, and I'm essentially an expert on myself." I also catch myself cringing a lot about what I was like in the past growing up and recently. I try to think of those moments of cringe as an indication of how much I've grown and how much I've polished myself through the process of actualizing myself. Often times we cringe when we feel like we are revealing the unpolished parts of ourselves kind of like peeking into what an actor is doing backstage rather than seeing the actor performing, except here, rather than the actor performing in a stage, we are performing in our social lives. My past and me figuring things out is my backstage moment to how I move about the world in the present. And finally, I really liked the observation on how we are more likely to have a cringe attack when we are relaxed and doing some mindless activity. I have this thing where sometimes in the middle of the night I go into a negative spiral and I made it a point that whenever I catch myself spiraling at like 2am in the morning, I ask myself "am I actually upset about my life, or do I just need to go to sleep?" It's usually the later and just knowing that helps me not get consumed into that spiral and create a healthy form of mental distance. Eventually I didn't have negative spirals at the middle of the night anymore and when I did I didn't take them too seriously. Because usually, those spirals don't have anything constructive to say, it's usually rooted in self pity and self hate. I decided to do a similar thing when I catch myself having a cringe attack and start going on in a spiral of self hatred where I catch myself spiraling and I ask myself "is this something that is actually relevant to my life and things I'm working on when it comes to my growth, or did my mind wander because I was going a relaxing and mindless activity?" I could go on and on about how I'm implementing the things I learned in this book and basically go into each point I highlighted in the previous posts but I'm not going to since what I already wrote pretty much sums up how I'm using this book to shift my mindset in a nutshell

@dflores321 No not really My main source of carbs include fruits, vegetables, brown rice, and a couple slices of gluten free bread. I also eat noodle a few times a week but it's usually lentil pasta or something vegetable based.

The first thing that came to my mind is this video lol

I feel personally attacked. I'm posting this here because I think this is a really important video for me especially considering my subtle addictions.

Cringeworthy Part 2 P.120: "Fewer people are keeping track of your foibles than you imagine." ..."people greatly overestimate the extent to which other people were noticing" ... ' You wouldn't worry so much about what others think of you if you realized how seldom they do.' Basically, if you do something awkward, good news! No one cares. I've heard this so many times before and I find that reassuring every time. Another thing that brings me comfort is this one thing that I saw on tiktok which was along the lines of "it's easy for your mind to come up with that one minutely embarrassing thing you did years ago but how often do you have the same experience except you remember something that was minutely embarrassing that someone else did? Chances are you don't remember those memories and the good thing is that other people probably don't remember that awkward thing you did years ago either." P. 123: The problem is that you assume other people are fixated on the things you are fixated on. Often they are not." Classic self bias P. 125: "Think about what expertise allows you in other disciplines. 'If you're an expert physicist, for instance, you can notice all kinds of small minute details that nobody else can notice.... The same thing is true with yourself. You're an expert about yourself-- you saw yourself yesterday; you know what you look like when you go out to a party versus when you just get up in the morning out of bed; you know so much about yourself. You can judge yourself like an expert does.'" Basically, you're hyper aware about everything you do and therefore hyper critical of yourself because you're an expert on "you." Other people don't know, care, or notice nearly as much. P. 126: "But here is more good news for the overly self-conscious. Even when people do see your screw ups, they aren't judging you as harshly as you think." I feel like there are some cliché parts in this book but I don't think the cliché is necessarily a bad thing since there are some over said words that we could repeat more to grow and ease up the anxiety we have in certain situations. This is one of those clichés. P.138: "Empathy isn't inherently good... It can be a route to compassion, but understanding how someone else feels can also lead to something darker, something more like contempt." P.139: " One of these is cognitive empathy which means recognizing and understanding someone else's feelings but keeping those feelings at a distance. You can imagine what someone is likely going through, in other words, but you don't let it in; you don't feel it yourself. The other kind of empathy is affective empathy , or compassionate empathy and this one is the way we usually use the word: It's understanding someone else's experience and internalizing what they are likely feeling." Reminds me of what Contrapoints' video on cringe was talking about regarding contemptuous cringe vs compassionate cringe. Also I like the idea of empathy being seen as something that isn't inherently good because it's so easy to think that empathy is this all good thing because of the way it's commonly used. I like it because it has a different take on empathy that is more nuanced. I mean after all, to say or do something really nasty that you know will hurt someone horribly, you need to empathize with where that person's pressure points lie...... P.157: Cringe attacks mainly happen when you are alone and/or are doing some mindless activity and you cross paths with something that is vaguely related to a memory in your head which then reminds you of that one cringy memory you'd rather forget. And that moment usually has an element of ambiguity or something that feels unresolved in your mind. I honestly never noticed this until this book pointed it out to me. I think most of the times I have a cringe attack, it's usually when I'm meditating lmao. P.168: This part talks about some action items you can take the next time you catch yourself cringing. Basically, ask yourself three questions: How many times have other people experienced the same thing or something similar? If a friend came to you and told you about this memory, how would you respond to it? Can you try thinking about the moment from someone else's point of view." Because reading a book on cringe reminded me of a lot of cringeworthy things I've done, I had a few opportunities to try this out. And I'd say that this was helpful. P.171: "Humility isn't about seeing yourself in a negative light rather "humility allows you to 'occupy a rightful space, neither too much or too little.' Humility is knowing your place." P.172: "Humility allows you to see yourself as a part of interconnected whole. You matter because of the way you actions impact everyone else." P. 173: "So a cringeworthy moment, then, can be used as a reminder that yours is not the only perspective. Likewise, a cringe attack could become a reminder that you aren't alone in your awkwardness. It's not a feeling that is unique to you. Everyone shares it, to some degree or another, and reminding yourself of that may be one way to minimize the impact of these memories. This part was talking about self indifference and how we should aim for that in the face of awkward situations rather than hyping ourselves up. Again, reminds me of the Contrapoints video. P. 201: " A good life 'isn't so much about success or failure but whether we stay in learning mode, continue to seek out ambiguity, and view uncertainty as the doorway to invention." P. 202: "What if you could reconceptualize social uncertainty so that it started to feel more like 'the doorway to invention?' At one point during the class, the instructor tells us, 'Improv throws you in without a plan, and you figure out how to figure it out.'" This section of the book was talking about improv and how it can highlight awkwardness since both awkward moments and improvised moments have this element of ambiguity to them. These quotes along with the rest of this chapter is about embracing awkwardness. As someone who doesn't embrace awkwardness really well, I really liked this perspective. I also just realized that one of the reasons why I hold on to competence as a part of my identity is because I'm socially anxious and I don't want to look unpolished or unsure about myself and my future because that means ambiguity and that means I'm going to look awkward. Never made that connection before. P.231: "Looking back, it's easier to take a third-person perspective of yourself, with an assist from the natural distance of time." This is one of the things that I use to help me forgive myself when something goes horribly wrong. I guess I could use it for awkward moments as well. Then there is this whole section of how cringing at yourself can be an indication of how much you've grown as a person since in a way you don't resonate with your old self anymore. Or how cringing can encourage more self reflection and growth because it forces you to look at yourself from another person's point of view and see how you are not living up to your on values therefore compelling you to back track, reevaluate your life and try to live it more authentically (that was a different chapter but oh well). This reminded me of this video. I've come back to this video at random points in my life because it's reassuring lol.