Ulax

Sure thing dude. I'll end my side of the discussion here. I enjoyed talking with you.

I'm picking up that you wanted more consideration of your views. Also, that you want better understanding of your views and the positive intentions you believe are behind them. Partly also because you believe that I saw your suggestion as bad, even though you were only trying to help through voicing the suggestion. Is that right? From my perspective, I was being sincere when I said contacting a moderator could be a useful solution regarding whether my comment is inappropriate. As maybe I am mistaken in thinking that I have communicated in a a respectful manner. I thought my suggestion of a moderation could be a harmonious way of resolving our different perspectives in a way that meant both of our views were considered in an equal and fair way. Also, reflecting on when you made your request, I didn't feel hostile after seeing it. I think its important to ensure that people are held accountable for the way they comment, and I don't think I'm an exception to that. Instead, I felt worried that I had indeed written in a way that could be classed as gaslighting. Its just that upon checking what I wrote I don't think it could be classed as gaslight. Does this make sense to you?

@Tron Okay sure. So my perspective is that every emotion we feel is an expression of a need. If we feel a positive emotion, then that is a result of a need having been met. If we feel a negative emotion, then that is a result of a need not being met. Further, all communications are an expression of a need as well; either its a result of a need being met or a need not being met. Actually everything we do is an expression of a need. Every person has the same set of needs. However, given our life experiences and biology we all develop different strategies for meeting our needs. So, through the lens of my perspective, it may have been that the lady, in saying what she said from the car to you, was trying to meet their need for significance, i.e. that she mattered. Maybe when she was young she learnt that the only way she could reliably meet her need to matter was by adopting the strategy of telling other people what to do. And, perhaps for you when you heard what that lady said to you, you felt dehumanised because your need for acceptance switched from being met to being unmet. Perhaps, when you were young a parental figure told you what to do in a similar kind of tone to that woman, and you believed they didn't accept you in that moment. So, you unconsciously learnt that when people talked to you in that way, that you were not acceptable. Returning to the idea of the person of the similar age to you in the same circumstance having a different reaction. That person may have felt compassion instead because they had a different life experience or biology. Perhaps, a parental figure never spoke to them in that tone, and they always felt accepted no matter what. Hence when the women speaks to them from the car there need to be accepted is still met. Hence, they instead guess at an understanding that the lady speaking from the car is trying desperately to meet a need to matter. And with that, the person meets a need for understanding which evokes the positive feeling of compassion. The above are all guesswork from me. What I'm trying to communicate is less about the exact need that is at play. Instead I want to communicate the idea that when trying to understand why people act in certain ways, its less important to think about what they say, and instead think about what need is being expressed. For example, when a person says, 'women power' in a jubilant and excited manner, its not really because of something inherent to 'women power'. Instead it is an example of people meeting a need. So, its really a celebration of survival. Hence, from my perspective, nothing is actually ever said that is personal towards someone else. Does this all make sense to you? I'm curious to hear your thoughts on it. ---------------------- If you want me to recommend a book, that provides a more in-depth understanding of this perspective, I can do so to. Would you like that?

As I read your comment, I felt frustrated because my desire to be understood isn't met. I'm not intending to communicate an invalidation of feelings or that someone's feelings are wrong. I understand you have a different perspective on that which you seem confident in. I would like to maintain harmony between us. A solution could be for you to contact a moderator, or report my posts as a means of getting a third party to decide whether my comments are inappropriate.

Sure man. Sounds like you're pretty assured that any guy would have thought she was acting stupidly but may have had a different level of response. As a side note, I think its important for me to note that I'm not intending to communicate that you were wrong to react, or feel the way you did. Or that another guy's potential reaction is better. I can tell you my perspective about what is at the cause of why you felt dehumanised. Would you like that?

Hi @Tyler Robinson. I don't believe what I've done amounts to gaslighting or is manipulative. It sounds to me like you don't trust that I'm acting out of a desire of contribution. Is that right? I understand you think that my intention is to change Tron's understanding of how he felt or get him to feel something different than he did in the moment. And that I am judging the dude. Perhaps you think that I am being respectful in my comments. Is that right? My intention is not to cause a change in feeling or to judge. My intention is to contribute by providing a perspective regarding why we feel as we do.

Okay. So you felt dehumanised. Do you think you felt dehumanised because of what she said? Or do you think you felt dehumanised because of how you interpreted what she said? Is it possible that if another guy your age experienced the same sort of communication in the same kind of circumstance, they could have had a different reaction? i.e. compassion, confusion, instead of a feeling of dehumanisation.

For those who want a stage Green+ perspective on Law, I'd recommend this book.

So you had a sense of being dehumanised?

So, when you heard the lady say what she said, in the tone you heard her say it in, you felt like she was trying to make you feel like you weren't acceptable?

Okay dude. I get you. So, to my understanding, you see the motivation for her behaviour as being to shame a man for pleasure later. Let's say that it is entirely accurate that that was her motivation. What do you think determines whether she gets pleasure from shaming men?

@Tron You're welcome. What do you think guides human behaviour? For example, what do you think guided the behaviour of the women in the car when she said what she said to you?

Okay. So, here's how I'm understanding what you've said. There are a lot of guys on YouTube who claim to be giving direction to men, but you don't trust that they are acting with integrity. Plus, you don't fully accept 'red pill truths' but you do accept some of what they say. You see good parts and bad parts to the women's equality movement. And something that you see as significantly wrong with the women's equality movement is inconsistency/ incoherence in what the movement asks for. One one hand you see women claiming that the equality means that women should be seen as independent from men, and that men shouldn't try to 'look after' women. On the other hand you have an experience of a woman claiming that equality means men should look after women. Which doesn't make sense to you, and leads you to conclude that the views of the women's equality movement are incoherent/ inconsistent. Hence, you find it confusing. When you talk about these inconsistencies you find that numerous people think you don't respect women. However, your confident that you do actually respect women, and have a a couple of examples which you give as evidence for this. Have I understood you correctly?

@Tron Is there anyone on YouTube that you find yourself agreeing with most of the time?

@Tron Who, if anyone, do you watch and agree with on youtube? Jordan Peterson?

@Alexop Hey dude, sounds to me like you want a trustworthy understanding of why the LGBT movement seems to take some of the viewpoints it does in very progressive countries, and whether this is healthy. I'll try and help you with that goal. Here are my recommendations: Firstly, if you're not familiar with the spiral dynamics model, I recommend studying it. Assuming you aren't familiar, here's a short intro to spiral dynamics: Secondly, if you find yourself as being aligned with many of the views of Jordan Peterson, I'm confident the 'making sense of Jordan Peterson' video on the actualized.org will help your goals. On another note, Leo, the guy who runs actualized.org, has various significantly longer videos on spiral dynamics. These can be found on the main actualized.org channel. If you want a deep understanding of the spiral dynamics model, I'd recommend watching and studying the content of those videos.

First off, I like the desire to grow dude. I'd recommend the following. Firstly, unless your already familiar with the form, I'd recommend getting a personal training session to get a really understanding of how to do the overhead press and Romanian deadlift. Plus any other compound exercise if i missed one. Secondly, I'd also research about what type of diet will support your goals. On the other hand, unless you want to stick to your own programme, I'd recommend you purchase or get access to a well regarded home workout programme instead. If you get a well regarded programme then I'm confident you'll avoid many of the mistakes that prevent people from getting results in this area.

@at_anchor Hiya, I felt moved reading your post. It sounds to me like you may have experienced abuse by people with personality disorders related to sociopathy and malignant narcissists. I can only imagine the depth of the effect that has had on you. I relate to what I see to be your experiences of humiliation and dehumanisation that came with those experiences. To my understanding, I have experienced abuse at the hands of multiple malignant narcissists myself. However, I will note that the extent or magnitude of how my experiences relate to yours I do not know. I personally do not, when acting consciously, judge suicide. And, to my mind, everyone who chooses the route of suicide has some reason, based on fulfilling some need of there's. Albeit, it may be that their perception of reality was very skewed such that that was the way they thought they could best meet that need. That said, I don't recommend you seriously consider suicide as an option for now. The way I think about it is that you have all of eternity to be dead. So why not stick around and see how it turns out. Experiment with different ways of approaching life and see how it works out. To my understanding, there are numerous people in the world today and throughout history who have dedicated their careers to trying to help people who find themselves in the type of situation you are in today. I don't think many people will be able to really comprehend the abuse that it sounds like has occurred to you. However, many of these mentioned people will comprehend. They will understand. And, some of them will be able to help you transform your life. I would recommend that you seek these people out. If you would like, I can recommend some mentors that I think could be of value to you.

I prefer Tao over God for the same reasons. But I giggle when I think of Leo exclaiming, 'I am the force!' in his awakening videos. Switching to actualized.org might help with the cult accusations against actualized.org though. Critics will just think we're a bunch of hardcore star wars nerds instead ?.

If governments developed social programmes that met the need/ needs that porn meets then porn would not be popular. I'd say porn can be and likely is for many an unhealthy way that people meet their needs. However, there much more unhealthy and actually dangerous ways that these needs could be met in the absence of porn. I also intuitively agree @Someone here about the positives of porn surrounding lower sexual assault cases. Its intuitive as I don't know of the scientific consensus on the issue, or if said consensus reliable or persuasive.

I'd consider whether you actually hate men. To my understanding, any negative emotion is a sign that some need or needs of yours are unmet. So, it would seem to me that you feel hate and then project that hate onto men. Hence, your belief that you hate men. Also, I sense from your example that you think people should guess your boundaries. For example, number 2, 3 and 4. I think the root of your anger could be that when people don't guess your boundaries, then you feel a lack of respect. Then invoke the strategy of judging them as a means to meet your need for respect. Just a guess. Also, I note you said you often feel like you're bottom of the barrell. It sounds to me like you are quite status oriented in your understanding of social situations you are in. Would I be right in saying that you see non-socially calibrated people as lesser people than calibrated people? Another interpretation that comes to mind is that you are projecting the contempt that you would hold for yourself if you were to not act in a socially calibrated manner onto others. If the above does resonate, I'm not intending to cast blame or fault on you. Instead, I'm trying to point you towards what actually might be at the root of the experiences you describe.

@Harikrishnan Honestly I think reliance on astrology is a codependent symptom of magical thinking.

I empathise with your perspective about how democracy is the tyranny of the masses. It seems to me like you are arguing in line with the idea that there are systemic and inherent problems that flow from democracy. It seems to me that you want competence, and trust when it comes to the governing structure, and you find those desires fulfilled in the linked video. I watched around 30 minutes from the start of the video. My personal experience of the video was that I was surprised, and encouraged by the perspective that the main speaker took. The idea that democracy has bred oligarchy is something I liked. I liked the structure of the the discussion on this point because it seemed to be answering the question of, 'What are the big picture consequences of instituting democracy?'. I would have liked to have seen more discussion about the following things: - Why the speaker believes that democracy leads to oligarchy. - More discussion of sociological research Overall, intuitively, the advocated governmental structure doesn't appeal to me. I also liked the way the discussion was approach in terms of some of the questions it tried to answer. Further, I also would have liked more in depth discussion of the above stated things. On a psychological note, what came to mind when reading your post was that your alignment with this view seems to have a level of unconsciousness to it. I sense that you are posting as a means of meeting a desire for significance. I sense this particularly from what I see to be you creating an 'in' group and an out group. I would recommend being wary of why it is that you choose to align yourself with the views you do, and also why you choose to post in the manner you do. I'm not intending to communicate fault or blame. Instead, at least in part, I want to contribute to your level of consciousness about your actions, as well as help others not feel insignificant as a result of reading this post. I will note that my view of your intentions is only a guess. Hence, it may be mistaken. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- On another note, I think De Tocqueville's view on democracy could be of interest to you. I'll link a video here. The video provides an interpretation of De Tocqueville's analysis of the problems that come with democracy.

I don't think you have interpreted my comment as I intended. Essentially, no one is to blame. There's just various systems at play which are causing the conflict. Study the system and you study the problem.

@Danioover9000 Could be because podcasts help meet people's need for companionship and belonging, in a way that doesn't threaten their need for acceptance. I think particularly today there are a lot of lonely folks out there