Mu_

Just wrong? I’m fine with that but was hoping for a fun discussion. Anyways I agree god is forever with no outsides or insides but infinite? <shrug>

I agree it has no constraints and I’m fine with leaving it at that. My only point was how 0 constraints can mean a lot of things.

I know I was joking. your believing the meanings that words have on your experience apply to actual reality. finite seems to mean constrained and non finite seems mean infinite which you seem to think mean unlimited amount. god is forever with no before pr after and experiences. But this doesn’t mean experiences an unlimited variety. I don’t know high variety. A lot?

That’s almost like saying if a sentence didn’t have a period it would run on forever. lol ok not quiete. you seem to be stringing together a lot of ideas that make sense to prove something that doesn’t necessarily imply such. not finite doesn’t mean infinite. I know I’m breaking the wall that comes after the 4th wall is broken. voids aren’t true nothings, true nothings don’t exist, that would mean god doesn’t exist and it’s obvious there is something rather than nothing otherwise this conversation wouldn’t be happening. Or at least seem to. having no constraints does not mean it will do everthing imaginable that can be thought about. God will do what god is and does, it doesn’t mean it will experience inside out pink elephants

Sure I could describe all sorts of things like this but it never really gets at what it is like to experience it. and no where did you get the idea I think it’s bad or wrong to distinguish. my only point was you can experience experiences but never experience isolated by itself.

Ya I experience tree like stuff in a variety of ranges, same with food and what seem to be all sorts of separate or non separate things. And yes I call them experiences sometimes or god or distinctions. I don’t think I ever refuted experience and said I experience what ever in senses and what not. I think the thing I was pointing out is there isn’t an experience of experience, experience and what seems to be content is one.

No of course not. But this does not mean it goes infinitely in any direction. And it doesn’t mean it’s nothing either. Very mysterious it is 💩 Authority? Not sure why that random word came up? but with no authority then it’s it’s own authority your thinking? I to thought something similar at one point as well, but it dawned on me that this doesn’t necessarily mean it chooses what it does, nothing made it, it’s always been being what it is timelessly as it does. Choice, no choice, who knows and no one’s asking the question, nor is it begging to be answered by some outside force. If you feel compelled to ask and inquire, then great Again god which you right now can feel like it has choice and other times not, both seem real and experientially it seems true, it doesn’t need to be inquired past that

If something has no constraints it doesn’t necessarily imply unlimited or infinity. God can experience itself in all sorts of ways, the degree to which isn’t necessarily infinite. It can be boundless, bound, feeling like there is control and feeling like there isn’t, random or predictable. All sorts. The notion that all those can be counted is just “now” experiencing that idea. again it’s not important in my opinion if god has 1 trillion possible ways of experiencing a hundred or infinity. why is god the way it is? And how exactly is that? In my experience it’s not just one way.

I agree philosophically lol that a concept of something isn’t the same as the thing itself but in reality there are no things, energies or no-things so the whole notion that you can have or there is concepts of things or anything, is an illusion at best. domt get me wrong I use to believe and feel and experience this idea that I was distinguishing between a thing and the concept of it, but this to became a illusion that comes and goes. im getting the feeling you don’t know what I mean.

I know here on this forum it’s used to mean the same thing as god or nothingness for the most part, so I’m fine with leaving it at that. but when we are going to have a balls deep honest conversation and try and clearly get to what it is, I can’t in good faith say it has anything to do with numerical or conceptual ideas of infinity in the scientific sense. It “may” be and that would mean there are an actual never ending amount of different possibilities it can experience, but this will forever have to be up to casual musings and speculation which seem to be one of the many possibilities. another way to put my idea is there is no way to get outside of one’s SELF to observe this and count how many possibilities of experience are possible. I csn acknowledge there are a lot but just how many, well as many as there are possible and that is non-countable and unknown or perhaps only 1 trilllion. and here’s where it gets even more mind fucky and perhaps more irrelevant so don’t take it to serious, even if you think and experience being able to count how many there are that to is just a now moment in god thinking it’s counting experiences of many types, when in reality there are never many anything’s, it just seems that way.

@Leo Gura Bery interesting, a lot of these came to me as well in similar ways but I landed on a couple of distinct differences. Infinity id argue is one “god idea”, when in actuality the amount of possible experiences possible in which can be experienced is uncountable and is how ever many there is, which isn’t necessarily infinity. I’d also argue control is another “god idea or experience”, with neither control or no control being a real anything, it’s simply god happening as it always has and remains to be. It has no preplaned plans to plan any more than it doesn’t. and I’d say distinction is a moment of god experience believing something called there is or isn’t distinction. But all in all really great stuff, I’d be interested in some counter discussion on such matters because there’s very few others to go into his kinda stuff with lol, if at all hahaha.

@Natasha Tori Maru I will add that experience itself does prove one thing about reality itself, and that is its conscious and that there IS something rather than nothing. True nothing could not exist otherwise there wouldn’t be this experience and once understood that there IS rather than there isn’t, you can understand through investigation that “something/god/existence” can not come from nothing or somewhere else or something else and there for “what ever this is” has to of always been.

When I referred to old, I was talking about my old way of thinking about this subject. did you read any of my responses, I did answer it in a different way.

I think I know what your getting at and it use to be fascinating, not to say im over it and in a more enlightened space, it’s just that I can’t relate to that old way of thinking and approach. there just isn’t a way to isolate experience or approach it outside of experience/concept. Exoerience\seemingly real things/God are not isolated and different things, energies or experiences. sensations and concepts aren’t actually isolated either, it just seems that way.

To much? By what metric? My experience of experience is sensational, and conceptual, which is a experience as well. Or maybe another way to put it is I don't experience experience, just experiencing.

I can answer this indirectly. God can experience and dream up, up down, left right, in out, emptiness fullness, self none self. But can not experience "none experiencing". hypothetically there may be none moments in which God doesn't experience but it would never be known so its really pointless in talking about it. I think the dilema of the human mind or a type of god experience, is on some level there is a notion of stuff and its ability to be non awake or awake. But experience isn't a independent seperate element of anything. And there isn't a action of God doing experience either.

Its always interesting to read about other peoples awakening and the views that emerge from it. I can tell you've been somewhere in your journey, a lot of what you share lines up with mine in a similar way but what i've come to but the conclusions and expression is slightly different. I'm not sure there is an honest way to ultimately and objectively state what Gods intentions are as an ALL and always has been singularity in motion. Its refreshing to my mind to understand it isn't a negative thing, or a deliberate anything being harmful as an act, for a lack of a better expression, it just IS. Yet you are right, it includes all forms of experience some of which could be hellish to experience. And ya one can embody SELF in such ways that are truely beyond words and heavenly. I'm not sure I can agree with the idea that a separate or a connected someone to God, can be truely in direct control and choosing everything that will happen in its life. I can see that it could appear that way for a prolonged amount of time, but not sure one can claim it will extend past the moment of its experience, maybe im wrong, and kinda hope I am.

well this sounds good and all, are there any demonstrations of this happening in a current country or is every nation still in survival mode?

I want to preface a bunch of what I'm about to say as perhaps uniformed, and welcome any info that counters these idea's. Perhaps even sources and links to such idea's as well would be helpful as well. Is income equality actually good for the environment? This is a question that I've playfully thought about, since equality is a subject that I've often felt should be pushed for. However, if the majority of the population suddenly had more access to goods than they did before, I'd image there would be a much larger and broader increase in consumption of goods, increasing the strain on the environment and the population it would cause. I'm not sure the earth is ready for a dramatic shift in income wealth and prosperity, there needs to be a fundamental shift in how we view the earth and how our consumption habits actually impact it and are willing to do something different (of course technologic energy advancements could shift all this, but are not guaranteed), or else the problem will only get exacerbated. Thoughts?

Ya I've listened to a bunch of his stuff. However to your point, we kinda went through that phase for the most part, although to some degree its always gonna be relevant. AI is the new ramp up many of the nations are in now, however I have my doubts in its usefulness and if its going to spur a rebellion if those in power aren't careful with its implementation, you can only displace so much before people really have nothing to lose and fight back.

Probably true as well....

Ya I feel you, but more environmental strain leads to more pollution which is more deaths and sickness for all species (including humans). So while there is starvation, the short-medium term may be worse for everyone if the environmental issues get accelerated....

Hopefully will within the year.

What would god create a hammer from? There’s nothing outside of god for something for it to make something else. God is a hammer just as much as anything else. just as true, is anything that could be said to be anything is first and for most god appearing as something else.

I truely feel ya, yeah, I know what you mean and are trying to accomplish. Perhaps I dont feel Razar is coming from that in this moment and its not needed to address that in this moment. That said, unfortunaletly?, that is part of Gods will and journey as well, and will seem to happen again. Here's the thing, I don't believe there is a way to "FULLY" encompass God/what is, in a description, an experience, a book, an anything or a nothing........ From my experience, everything you could say is partial and yet total. When Oneness is understood and pervades, it forgets non-oneness experience and vise versa.... and yet both by definition are One and the same, but neither are the same "experience" One description of truth and the experience its expressed from lacks another aspect of truth, and yet by many of the accepted definitions of understanding Self and the actuality of going through the process of, its all Self, so its not false to say everything is true, including all contradictions, and including the contradiction of the last statement into infinitim, but honestly the normal "mind" can find this troubling and sometimes propel into insanity... I have no point in what I'm saying, just saying what I've noticed to this point... so take it for what you will.