vibv

@StarStruck The Absolute is what IS. Everything else are thoughts, ideas, experiences that come and go. That means your enlightenment CAN'T be an experience. That's totally valid. But everything else are assumptions and concepts about that. For example that experience is less important than non-experience. What if experience is the important part and the non-experience is not really that interesting? How could you know that that can't be true? It has to be an assumption, you can't know that.

That makes it sound like it's optional, it's just some details. Just settling into it, but you got the main point figured out. That's exactly what in science happens again and again. The sentiment that it's just a few details that need more figuring out, but we got the gist of it. Only for something to come along and shatter the whole core of understanding up to this point. You'll maybe say "but enlightenment is not science!!", but the same mechanism applies. To think that there's no other possibility and it's just the reality should already make you suspicious, that's a tell-tale sign of being locked in a paradigm. Maybe you even dropped all your ideas and concepts in that moment. But now you've just adopted new ones.

@Water by the River You even deny that it's a framework of thinking and conceptualization. The non-dual awareness in itself is not wrong, but as soon as you're talking about it it's already an idea. Attached to that is the idea that now you've reached some kind of final destination. OR you think that everything else is kind of irrelevant. Both are assumptions and both are false.

It doesn't. At the moment of "enlightenment" you begin (or rather continue) to build a framework around it and it becomes falsehood. I don't exactly question what it points to, it has some kernel of truth. But it's not what's being made out of it, it's not what you think and it's certainly not the end.

That's not at all what I'm saying. Enlightenment is just another thing to transcend.

God didn’t create non-existence. Non-existence created God.

It’s not random but also not deterministic.

1. Pain and suffering are two different things 2. You can’t will yourself to have 0 resistance 3. Without pain no pleasure 4. Suffering is often the best teacher 5. It’s not a bug, it’s a feature 6. Trying to eliminate suffering leads to more suffering 7. The opposite of suffering is Love

Good

@BlackPhil There are actually many worldviews here. In fact we all disagree with each other ?

@BlackPhil Well I don't want to take any healing you received away from you, I'm happy for you. But I don't think you will have much luck here conversing people into your worldview. When I met Jesus he said everything's allright. He can't believe what they did to his teachings when he was gone

@BlackPhil Jesus, isn't a thread enough already

I quite like it here. I thought heaven is a place on earth

I'm pretty sure a muslim would disagree.

But who created the creation? I thought God is allmighty? Didn't create God at least the one that created the creation

@BlackPhil But I'm sure there are people that have never heard of Jesus, nor will they in their lifetime. What about them? How can you look for something when you don't know about it?

Did you test that?

What about people that never come in contact with christianity? Are they just doomed?

@SOUL That's certainly the case when you're on the so-called spiritual path in the beginning. But there can be only one non-experience, because there can't be a distinction between two non-experiences.

I know exactly what feeling you mean. I personally don't experience it on or after most psychedelics. It happens on weed though. It's probably just heightened social anxiety as you said already. Maybe take a few days off after an experience and be in solitude to contemplate the trip.

@Breakingthewall Have you tried to stop pushing? Or are there responsibilities that don't let you? What stops you?

1. is this also the case while on them during the trip? 2. it could be a hint that you're not very connected to the people around you or that you just don't vibe with them. Being sober it's way easier to just pretend. 3. Maybe you just need that time to process the experience. Is it only for a few days and then back to normal or does some of it linger after that?

Having no money can lead to the experience of becoming wealthy, which is way more amazing than just being rich. If you recognize that the people around you are stupid and evil it's a great hint that you have unfinished emotional business somewhere. The people around you are never random. Illness can be really painful and uncomfortable. But it can also tell you that some things you did in your life don't work our anymore. It is the body fighting for its survival, which is an expression of Love. The possibility of illness also gets you to treat your body well. It makes you appreciate being healthy in the first place.

@Yimpa @Breakingthewall It's all perfect in its context. Dysfunction has a reason, often some kind of misunderstanding. It is beautiful because it shows you a lack of understanding of some part of reality. War is perfect because it is an expression of our egoic structures. by feeling the pain and seeing all the tragedy it becomes clear that our ways were wrong. Essentially suffering means that we're not in alignment with Love. Suffering is love because it tells us our disconnection from it in a way that's impossible to ignore. Suffering is often the greatest teacher. No suffering is ever for nothing. It all pans out in the end.

Lucifer literally means bringer of light ? (Edit: correction, it means lightbearer) But in my personal experience so far Love presented itself as an incredibly bright light that touched and spoke directly to my heart. It seemed to not only contain all colors, but all emotions too. In fact I'd say every emotion is a facet of love, like white light shining through a prism. And it had humour, a lot of it.