Preety_India

@abrakamowse hopefully.

I was a part of such media sites. They don't last long. Like abrakadabra, they disappear into thin air

People use messenger on Facebook. Nobody reads your messages. The same goes for Whatsapp although I don't have it. Chats are encrypted.

2NDPH21AUG645PM 2431 A: ...they’re going to great links, like, I’ve had people that I haven’t talked to in, 2432 like, a year trying to contact me, like, people, like, old coworkers that I hardly 2433 even know are, like, “Hey, are you okay?” 2434 2435 Q: Well, just continue to do what you’re doing and your choice whether to talk to 2436 them or not. Again, you don’t have to talk to them if you don’t want to. Um, 2437 and just I - like we said before, your dad is probably your best ally in this and 2438 hopefully he’ll take some of the brunt of, uh, these people phoning and - and 2439 tell them to go away if that’s your wishes, and then, uh, go from there. But 2440 stay in touch with me. If you go somewhere, like, you know, if you’re gonna 2441 leave the state or whatever, just make sure you - let me know your phone 2442 number, um, and - and, uh, an address where - if I had to send you legal 2443 correspondence, you know, I could send that to you. Okay? 2444 2445 A: I will - I will definitely do that. I, you know, I’ve already discussed the 2446 situation with my dad where it’s, like, you know, I really need to see A, 2447 what’s going on with my employer and B, like, I kind of wanna wait until a lot 2448 of this media stuff happens and figure out, like, who is safe to give my new 2449 phone number to and who is and right now, I don’t have an answer for that, so 2450 I’m just kind of rolling with the number that I have. 2451 2452 Q: Uh, I... 2453 2454 A: So, we... 2455 2456 Q: Exactly, so... 2457 2458 A: ...we will see and I’m... 2459 2460 Q: ...uh, your number is, um, like, that information is, uh, available to, uh, the 2461 defense and the prosecution. When - when I write a re- like, if you change 2462 your number, um, it is available to - I - I have to generate a report so that goes 2463 out in discovery, so that could be, uh, something that they would see. Now 2464 whether or not they share that with the media or not, I mean, I’m not 2465 concerned that the prosecutor’s office is going to. I know my office isn’t 2466 going to, um, so just keep that in mind, um, you - you know, changing your 2467 stuff, uh, you - you’re almost obligated. In fact, I’ll tell you you are to keep 2468 me updated because you are a witness and you’re critical in this case, so we 2469 know how to - if somebody, you know, an attorney needed to get you for a - a 2470 hearing or something, uh, how to get in touch with you and that’s really what 2471 it’s about. Um, it’s not us keeping track of you or any of that stuff, so just - 2472 just remember that. 2473 2474 A: Oh, and I - I would definitely keep you guys in the loop. I mean... 2476 Q: Okay. Good. 2477 2478 A: ...and - and I guess, uh, my last question is how long does it usually take for 2479 them to find people? ‘Cause I feel like I’m pretty stashed because of how I’ve 2480 kept my information for the last, like, few years anyways, I think, has... 2481 2482 Q: I... 2483 2484 A: ...done me some justice. 2485 2486 Q: ...I don’t know, I mean, it just depends. I think if - sooner or later, I mean, it’s 2487 - you can always find somebody, I’ll tell you that. Now they have a lot of 2488 money and they have a lot of resources and - and they have a big desire to 2489 figure out who you are, um, so... 2490 2491 A: Right. 2492 2493 Q: ...I mean, do I think at some point that, you know, you’re gonna have to tell 2494 them, no comment or I don’t wanna talk to you or give a statement, whatever 2495 you decide to do, um, yeah, I do. And - and when - I don’t know, I mean, 2496 that’s a personal thing for you and - and your family, how you guys wanna 2497 decide to deal with that and maybe even, um, you know, with legal counsel at 2498 some point, you might wanna have somebody just to say, “Hey, leave my 2499 client alone.” Um, you know, I don’t know. And maybe that’s just your dad, 2500 uh, your dad seemed very concerned and willing to help when we met last 2501 week and maybe he’s just the right person to answer that question, uh, or, you 2502 know, to tell the media, “Look, my daughter’s not interested in talking to any 2503 of you, stop.” You know, um, I - I don’t know. And - and it’s not really a 2504 great question for me. I’d like to tell you, uh, I mean, I know what I would do, 2505 but I can’t tell you what to do. Do you know what I mean? 2506 2507 A: Right. 2508 2509 Q: O- only... 2510 2511 A: Right. 2512 2513 Q: ...you can make that choice. 2514 2515 A: Okay. 2516 2517 Q: So, but, uh, you’re... 2518 2519 A: Oh, understood. 2521 Q: ...to answer your question, I think if they wanna find you, they’re not gonna 2522 stop until they do. I - I really do. 2523 2524 A: No, I - I agree. I think - I’m - I’m impressed with the lengths that they’re 2525 going to right now. It’s kind of nice, but they haven’t done it yet. They’ve 2526 been looking for two days and they’ve been unsuccessful. 2527 2528 Q: Well, hopefully if you wanna stay hidden you will, and if I can help in any 2529 way - not with that stuff ‘cause I’m not really able to do that, but, um, you 2530 know, the rest of the stuff - I know we had you talking to (Hazel) and it 2531 sounds like we got that stuff going. If anything new comes up, don’t hesitate 2532 to call me. Don’t make it - don’t think like you’re bothering me or this is a 2533 problem. This is what I do. This is very important getting all this down... 2534 2535 A: Okay. 2536 2537 Q: ...and getting it - getting a record of it is very important, okay? So don’t 2538 hesitate to call me. 2539 2540 A: Okay. And then my question, um, can they, like, release my name to the 2541 papers if they have, like, no information on me? I’m sure that they’re trying 2542 to, like, put two and two together at this point, but I feel like that would be a 2543 very bold statement to be, like, this is who it was when they have no idea. 2544 2545 Q: I mean, so I - can they - they’re - they can do anything they want really, um, is 2546 there repercussions for doing anything? Of course. Um, do I think that they’re 2547 gonna be cautious? Um, I - I think that the media really, you know, they get 2548 involved in all these cases and they don’t report, uh, something until they - 2549 they know accurately, um, especially names because if - let’s say they say 2550 that, uh, your name is, you know, Nikki somebody else and you’re the wrong 2551 person. Do they open themself up to exposure to a lawsuit for slandering 2552 somebody’s name? Absolutely. So I don’t think that you need to worry about 2553 that, um, I do think it - like I told you this morning, there is some warrants that 2554 have gone out, um, I do believe that they’re sealed, uh, that do have your 2555 name in it because of the phone information, um, some of that stuff between 2556 you and Chris. Your name is in those. Now those are sealed. When those 2557 come unsealed, I don’t know. Um, that - that’s a judge’s decision, not mine, 2558 so a judge can continue to keep that sealed for the, you know, the length of the 2559 investigation if he wants to because it protects our investigation by not 2560 releasing information. And that’s the purpose of that is so people don’t know 2561 what we’re doing so the media can’t dig and find out what we’re doing and 2562 they can’t damage the case that we’re building, so, um, that - that could go on 2563 forever, so I - I don’t really have an answer for that. I - I don’t know how 2564 long. 2566 A: Okay. 2567 2568 Q: It - it varies, um, you know, depending on the judge and - and some legal 2569 decisions. 2570 2571 A: Okay. 2572 2573 Q: All right? 2574 2575 A: All right. Well, I... 2576 2577 Q: Hang in there. 2578 2579 A: ...appreciate your time and if I think of anything else, I will let you know... 2580 2581 Q: Okay. 2582 2583 A: ...but hopefully that is the end of it and... 2584 2585 Q: Great. 2586 2587 A: ...I will send you that, um, that record just for this month and then I’ll see if I 2588 can, like, clean up the Excel thing, but I don’t like something that you can 2589 manipulate data. I’d rather just give you - wait till the end of the month and 2590 give you the .pdf for the 14th... 2591 2592 Q: Sure. 2593 2594 A: ...moving forward. 2595 2596 Q: That’s fine too. 2597 2598 A: That would make me feel better. 2599 2600 Q: That’s fine. And then, um, I will be in touch with you here in the next, you 2601 know probably sometime next week to try to get you set up to come in and sit 2602 down, uh, to talk about all this information. 2603 2604 A: Okay. 2605 2606 Q: Okay? Hang in there, (Nicky). 2607 2608 A: All right. Thank you. 2609 2610 Q: All right. We’ll talk to you soon. 2611 2612 A: Ha- have a good night. 2613 2614 Q: You too. 2615 2616 A: Bye. 2617 2618 Q: Bye. The time is 8:14. Gonna end this recording. 2619 2620 2621 The transcript has been reviewed with the audio recording submitted and it is an accurate 2622 transcription. 2623 Signed Agent Kevin Koback

2NDPH21AUG645PM 2161 2162 A: But I’ll let you guys look at that conversation and my phone and maybe... 2163 2164 Q: No, no, no. 2165 2166 A: ...you guys can figure out something... 2167 2168 Q: It makes perfect sense to me. 2169 2170 A: ...that I can’t. 2171 2172 Q: I know exactly what they’re saying. So that was their only... 2173 2174 A: So... 2175 2176 Q: They were saying if you had the cloud it would’ve been backed up to the 2177 cloud, but since you didn’t, you - the messages are gone. 2178 2179 A: Yeah. And my iPhone Cloud is not backing anything up either... 2180 2181 Q: Right. 2182 2183 A: ...so - I... 2184 2185 Q: Okay. 2186 2187 A: ...it - it’s just not active so I’m really sorry about that. But... 2188 2189 Q: That’s okay. 2190 2191 A: ...um, on a good note - so then, um, I found this thing under data usage. I’ll 2192 show you. I was gonna bring my laptop in when I come, um, not that you need 2193 anything off of there, but just so I can, like, show you the - my Verizon 2194 account and maybe we can see if we can dig up some stuff on there, but I 2195 found a, um, I found, uh, messages and it wasn’t the actual body of the text 2196 message, but it was, like, the date and time and the phone... 2197 2198 Q: Okay. 2199 2200 A: ...number that it went to, and I received it and I got really excited. I was, like, 2201 “Oh, my God. It’s a message log.” And even if it wasn’t the body of the 2202 message, it would probably help us to figure out what’s missing and what’s 2203 not. And I was super excited and then I started scrolling through it and 2204 realized the last ones that they have are from 8-14, so I think they keep ‘em 2205 for a week and then they get rid of ‘em. 2206 2207 Q: Okay. So did you screenshot that? 2208 2209 A: I wish I would’ve known that two days ago - what’s that? 2210 2211 Q: Did you take a screenshot of that or anything like that? 2212 2213 A: I mean, I can if you want me to. 2214 2215 Q: Or is it - is it in your... 2216 2217 A: It just... 2218 2219 Q: ...is that in your personal Verizon account? 2220 2221 A: Yes. 2222 2223 Q: Yeah, so would you just, um, like, print that page or do something for me? 2224 ‘Cause in the event that they are just, you know, computer generation 2225 deletion, uh, if there is something there, I’d like to try to save it as much as we 2226 can. 2227 2228 A: Well, I mean, I wish you guys would’ve told me this, like, two days ago 2229 because if they’re only saving - it looks like they’re not saving the body of the 2230 messages. It looks... 2231 2232 Q: Right. 2233 2234 A: ...like what they’re doing is they’re saving the date and time, it’s like a 2235 timestamp for the text messages... 2236 2237 Q: Sure. 2238 2239 A: ...and who they came from, and it looks like they’re only saving ‘em for a 2240 week, like... 2241 2242 Q: Right. 2243 2244 A: ...today they went to 8-14, and I’m afraid that if I wait, tomorrow they’ll only 2245 go to 8-15. 2246 2247 Q: Right. 2248 2249 A: You know what I’m saying? 2251 Q: Yeah, so if you print those tonight... 2252 2253 A: So, and - and I was... 2254 2255 Q: ...that’d be great. 2256 2257 A: ...just, like, I know, I was so bummed. I was, like, the two days I needed, like, 2258 right before where they cut it off. 2259 2260 Q: Yeah, that’s okay. 2261 2262 A: Um... 2263 2264 Q: I think we’re gonna be okay with what we have, um, like I said, I’m just 2265 trying to make sure we have as much information as possible. And sometimes 2266 it takes a little bit of extra work to get to that information, but I’m okay with 2267 that because it could be very important later on down the line. It could be very 2268 important now, um... 2269 2270 A: Uh... 2271 2272 Q: ...but, I just don’t wanna lose... 2273 2274 A: ...I agree. Well, and ‘cause it’s, like, I know that sometimes, like, I can miss 2275 some things, but also, like, I want you guys to see those texts because maybe 2276 there is something important there that I can’t even think of, you know... 2277 2278 Q: Sure. 2279 2280 A: ...or not only that, but, like, it validates everything that I’m saying to you 2281 guys... 2282 2283 Q: Right. 2284 2285 A: ...you know? 2286 2287 Q: Okay. 2288 2289 A: Um... 2290 2291 Q: Well, I’ll work on the texts and, um, like I said, I’m gonna talk to, um, the 2292 other agent who, um, is kind of the - the lead agent on this case, and I think 2293 that she’s gonna wanna sit down with you and kind of, like, go through the 2294 contexts of the messages to get a better idea, you know, ‘cause text messages 2295 are just words, you - you - we don’t know what was said before that in a 2296 phone conversation, or what might’ve been followed up in a phone 2297 conversation or what started - prompted a text message to be sent, either from 2298 a prior meeting or something like that. So it - it’ll be very helpful. Um, I don’t 2299 think that’s gonna happen this week ‘cause I know she’s super busy, so just be 2300 patient with that. Uh, that information isn’t going anywhere, we have that 2301 retained. And - and I appreciate you saying that you’ll, uh, cooperate in doing 2302 that. 2303 2304 A: No, I mean, I really wanna help you guys, I mean, I - I have no reason not to 2305 help you guys. I, uh, I - I’m - I can’t even believe he’s trying to blame this on 2306 his wife. I - I just - I can’t even imagine, like, how hard he’s making this on 2307 the family right now. It’s just - it makes me so sad. It’s so sad. 2308 2309 Q: Right. 2310 2311 A: I, uh... 2312 2313 Q: All right. Well, keep taking... 2314 2315 A: ...we- 2316 2317 Q: ...notes as new things come to mind. 2318 2319 A: Okay. Um, but I was gonna tell you I did get my phone log... 2320 2321 Q: Okay. 2322 2323 A: ...um, um, I got everything through the 13th was on my last month’s billing 2324 statement, so I got a .pdf of that. I did save it. It’s on my desktop, um, and it 2325 shows all my inco- incoming and outgoing in it and it - it shows, like, where it 2326 was generated from so, like, if I was at work it shows, like, Platteville, and if I 2327 was at home it says Thornton, like... 2328 2329 Q: Sure. 2330 2331 A: ...um, I’ve got those. 2332 2333 Q: Do you have, um, do you have my email address on my business card? 2334 2335 A: Okay. You want me to just email that to you? 2336 2337 Q: That’d be great. Then, um... 2338 2339 A: Okay. And then I... 2341 Q: ...that’d be the easiest for both of us. 2342 2343 A: Okay. And then my next billing cycle, uh, started on the 14th, so if you guys 2344 want home, I mean, if you want the phone records from the 14th, they’re not, 2345 like, in this nice .pdf because they haven’t billed ‘em for me yet. They’re, like, 2346 in this weird, shitty Excel file and I tried to, like, open it, and, like, like, make 2347 it user friendly and readable, and I don’t - I feel like it’s an Excel sheet. I - I 2348 don’t - I don’t know... 2349 2350 Q: It’s fine. Yeah... 2351 2352 A: ...what to do with it, I mean... 2353 2354 Q: ...I know what it - it’s in. You - it - it’ll be fine, uh, you can send it to me 2355 however you have it. 2356 2357 A: So you want the Excel? Okay, so do you want the Excel sheet too? ‘Cause I, 2358 like I said... 2359 2360 Q: Sure. 2361 2362 A: ...I have the .pdf copy goes... 2363 2364 Q: Yep. 2365 2366 A: ...through the 13th, and then the Excel is, like... 2367 2368 Q: That... 2369 2370 A: ...sheet is, like, 14th on, but the date - the dates don’t show up on the Excel 2371 sheet when I - when I downloaded it. I don’t know. I gotta look at it and see... 2372 2373 Q: Okay. 2374 2375 A: ...if I can get that to - to work. And if - and if it doesn’t work, I mean, at the 2376 end of this billing cycle, which will be in probably, like, three weeks or so, uh, 2377 then I can give you the 14th... 2378 2379 Q: Yep. 2380 2381 A: ...you know what I mean? 2382 2383 Q: And then just - yeah, you can just send me everything that you have, uh, off 2384 this most recent, and then when your bill comes in if - if you’d be, uh, if you’ll 2385 remember to just send that to me. And, um, we’re... 2386 2387 A: Yeah. 2388 2389 Q: ...we’re getting those records, but again, I always like to ask - they’re your 2390 records, so I always ask for you to share those with me, uh, that way, uh, it 2391 just shows cooperation, number one. Number two, if we don’t have 2392 something, then I don’t have to go back and write a warrant to get it. You’re - 2393 you’re, uh, consenting to give it - that stuff me and - and it’s helpful to our 2394 investigation and that’s all that we really care about. 2395 2396 A: I know. And I want you guys, you know, to - to - to do the best that you can 2397 and so anyway that I can help - I’m really disappointed about those texts. I 2398 just - honestly, that wasn’t the first thing on my mind when I, like, deleted 2399 them. I was just, like, I was so disgusted with him. I was, like, “I don’t even 2400 wanna look at this, like, you need to go away from my life, like, right now.” 2401 And I just boom, got rid of it. 2402 2403 Q: Okay. 2404 2405 A: I didn’t even, like, realize, like, “Oh, my God. These guys are gonna need...” 2406 2407 Q: You ca- 2408 2409 A: “...these.” Um... 2410 2411 Q: It’s okay. You - you didn’t know. We - we’ve talked - don’t beat yourself up 2412 about the texts, we’ll figure it out. 2413 2414 A: I (unintelligible). 2415 2416 Q: Okay? 2417 2418 A: Okay. 2419 2420 Q: All right? 2421 2422 A: I’m - I’m hoping we can recover most of them. Um, I think I had one more 2423 thing to say to you. I don’t know. The media is, like, really (unintelligible). 2424 Today it’s crazy. After I got off the phone with you, I literally probably got, 2425 like, numerous phone calls from friends and numerous texts from people 2426 saying that the media is, like, coming to their houses and asking them 2427 questions. So I don’t know. I must be hiding out pretty well because... 2428 2429 Q: Good.

2NDPH21AUG645PM 1981 black, wife beater and I just remember, like, seeing this - and - and again, like, 1982 I am not - I’ve never been in that room so I don’t know... 1983 1984 Q: Okay. 1985 1986 A: ...100%, like, “Oh, that was it.” It just - it - it kind of looked like something 1987 very elegant and it definitely was not what was in the basement. 1988 1989 Q: Okay. What’s next? 1990 1991 A: Um... 1992 1993 Q: Keeping you on track. 1994 1995 A: I’m trying to go in order. I think that’s it. 1996 1997 Q: Okay. 1998 1999 A: I think that’s all I’ve got. 2000 2001 Q: So, I asked you a couple questions, um, when I was driving, when we talked 2002 earlier today, and since we weren’t... 2003 2004 A: Okay. 2005 2006 Q: ...on tape, I’m gonna just ask again, um... 2007 2008 A: Okay. 2009 2010 Q: ...which was, uh, when - when I - I called you after we looked at your phone 2011 download and told you that the messages you deleted, um, like, right now, 2012 they don’t look, I mean, I can’t see them, so I’m trying to recover them, like I 2013 told you, through, uh, some computer forensics. We’ll see if we - we can get 2014 that done. But, um, one of the questions that I had for was if you ever social 2015 media and you said you did not. So... 2016 2017 A: No. 2018 2019 Q: ...you don’t use... 2020 2021 A: I - I don’t. I... 2022 2023 Q: ...any social media, you’ve never used Facebook or Facebook Messenger, uh, 2024 with Chris? 2026 A: No, nothing. I’ve never used any social media with him at all. I have 2027 LinkedIn, um, when him and I first started hanging out, um, for business 2028 purposes, but it was something that I was, like, never on and then, um, 2029 honestly, once all this - all of this news media stuff and everything started 2030 happening, I deleted the - the LinkedIn just so that it’s - it’s harder for these 2031 people to try to come track me down and ask me a million questions, um, but 2032 I... 2033 2034 Q: Okay. 2035 2036 A: ...never, ever spoke to him on that. I don’t even think he has it. I don’t even 2037 know. I, like, never used it... 2038 2039 Q: Okay. And then... 2040 2041 A: ...so I don’t know. But as far, like, actual, social media, I haven’t had any of 2042 that other stuff, like, Twi- I’ve never had Twitter, I’ve never had Instagram, I 2043 haven’t had Facebook since 2016 so no, him and I never had any connection 2044 on any social media. 2045 2046 Q: Do you know when he closed his Facebook? 2047 2048 A: No, no, I’m glad you brought that up because I forgot to write that down the 2049 other day. He mentioned that to me on Saturday when we were at dinner. I 2050 think it was either when we were walking in the restaurant or walking out of 2051 the restaurant. 2052 2053 Q: Okay. And what did he say? 2054 2055 A: He just, like, offhandedly was, like, uh, “I shut down my Facebook.” And I 2056 was, like, “What? Why?” And he’s, like, “‘Cause I’m never really on there.” 2057 He’s, like, “She used to be on there all the time, uh, for work.” And he’s, like, 2058 “But I don’t need it.” And he just, like, it was, like, very, like, random, 2059 nonchalant comment. And I was... 2060 2061 Q: So do you - was... 2062 2063 A: ...surprised. Oh, and then I - no, no, no, no. And then I asked him, I said - I 2064 said, “Did you - did you shut it down all the way?” And he kind of, like, gave 2065 me this puzzled look and I was, like, “You have to actually, like, write 2066 Facebook with a letter, I mean, not, like, a letter, letter, but you need to send 2067 them an email. You can’t just deactivate it.” I was, like, “You need to send 2068 them an email that says I want you - I am so-and-so. I want you to shut my 2069 account.” 2071 Q: So what was his response to that? 2072 2073 A: Um, um, I don’t remember what he said to me. 2074 2075 Q: So do you think he... 2076 2077 A: I really don’t... 2078 2079 Q: ...just deactivated it... 2080 2081 A: ...I don’t think he did it. 2082 2083 Q: ...not shut it down? 2084 2085 A: That’s what I think he did... 2086 2087 Q: Okay. 2088 2089 A: ...but I don’t think he - he - I don’t even think he knew that he hadn’t 2090 completely gotten rid of it. 2091 2092 Q: Okay. 2093 2094 A: ‘Cause I’ve done it so I know what you have to do to do it. 2095 2096 Q: Okay. Anything else? 2097 2098 A: Uh, no, but that was just kind of offhanded that you - you mentioned that, so, 2099 yeah... 2100 2101 Q: Okay. 2102 2103 A: ...but we - no - no, we never - we never talked on Facebook. 2104 2105 Q: And then I - I asked you, um, if - if necessary - if for some reason I needed to 2106 get your phone, um, that, uh, you would be willing to provide me the handset 2107 if - if necessary and you s- you were in agreement to that? 2108 2109 A: Yeah, I mean, just - you guys just give me something else so that I can, like, 2110 get ahold of people in my life that I need to get ahold of and, um, that’s fine. 2111 2112 Q: Okay. 2113 2114 A: Can I have it back when you guys are done though? I mean - and if you need 2115 to keep it I can, like, go get another phone if I have to. 2116 2117 Q: Well, we - we can work that out should that come up, um, I’m... 2118 2119 A: Okay. 2120 2121 Q: ...still waiting... 2122 2123 A: Okay. 2124 2125 Q: ...waiting for a call from the, uh, computer forensics expert to - to... 2126 2127 A: Okay. 2128 2129 Q: ...give me an idea because of your - your phone’s an iPhone, which makes an- 2130 my knowledge of this is that if you deleted something of- off an iPhone, it’s 2131 gone. Now I - I don’t know if that’s true or not, so I asked you also, uh, to call 2132 Verizon, ‘cause that’s your provider, and to see if they could give you some 2133 advice on that. Did you happen to do that? 2134 2135 A: I did. So, um, I - I got on their online chat and I - I saved that in case, for some 2136 reason, you guys need it you can see that I asked them. Um, I was able to - 2137 they told me that there’s, like, several cloud storage devices. They said that 2138 Verizon has a cloud and iPhone has the cloud, um, and I checked and, of 2139 course, my iPhone cloud backup is not, uh, it’s not active... 2140 2141 Q: Okay. 2142 2143 A: ...so go figure? I just - I don’t - I don’t pay attention to that stuff, I really 2144 don’t. 2145 2146 Q: Well, that’s... 2147 2148 A: Um... 2149 2150 Q: ...why I asked you if you used any cloud stuff earlier, um, so none of that was 2151 active? 2152 2153 A: No, that was not - and then I asked ‘em, they’re, like, “Well, your - your 2154 phone works with Verizon, uh, Verizon iCloud.” And I was, like, “Well, how 2155 do I activate that? Like, how do I open that - open that? Where do I find that 2156 in my phone?” And he’s, like, “Oh, it’s an app. You have to download the 2157 app.” And I was, like, “Well, is anything from previous conversations gonna 2158 be on there if I haven’t downloaded the app yet?” And he said, “No.” 2159 2160 Q: Okay.

1666 deals with that stuff, but they do call people, like, in my department and they 1667 say, “Hey, I’m on this - this jobsite and, you know, like, a tank battery’s 1668 leaking or, like, a - like, a - a oil tank’s leaking or something like that.” And 1669 then we go out and assess it and clean it up and so on and so forth. So 1670 (unintelligible)... 1671 1672 Q: So those are actually specialists that go out and clean this up and he’s not one 1673 of those people? 1674 1675 A: No, he’s not, but sometimes, like, those guys, like, his job is important to, like, 1676 shut in oil wells if there’s a leak or, like, shut valves if there’s a leak, like, he - 1677 he manages the equipment, so - so when he was, like, he’s, like, “I gotta go 1678 check out a release.” And I was, like, “Why are you going to do that? That’s 1679 not your job.” And he was just, like, “I just need to go check out some of the 1680 equipment where the release occurred.” Now that part didn’t really seem too 1681 odd to me because, I mean, it make sense that they’re, like, “Hey, we have a 1682 release.” Send an operator out and make sure all - oh, he said he had to do a 1683 lockout/tagout on the site, um, so that means that depending on where the 1684 release is, if it’s near a piece of equipment that could be pote- have, like, 1685 potential energy to be hazardous, what we do in the oil industry is what’s 1686 called lockout/tagout. And certified operators, such as himself, um, will go out 1687 there and they will pull a lock with a tag on the, like, the - on the piece of 1688 equipment where you operate it, um, so that it cannot be in use, like, they’ll 1689 de-energize the piece of equipment and, like, shut it down, and then they’ll put 1690 a lockout/tagout tag on it and then the point is is, like, so then if the 1691 environmental team comes in to clean up the mess, nobody accidently 1692 reenergizes this piece of equipment while we’re trying to clean up the mess 1693 because it could injure somebody. Does that make sense? 1694 1695 Q: Yes. I got it. 1696 1697 A: Okay. So - so now I’m remembering this just now and he was, like, he’s, like, 1698 “I think I gotta go do a lockout/tagout on some of that equipment for the 1699 release.” 1700 1701 Q: Would that be something that would’ve been tracked? Certainly, um, there’s a 1702 lot of, uh, paperwork and safety requirements and all sorts of things with each 1703 site, so if he was actually going to do a lockout/tagout, would that be 1704 something that I’d be able to look at - record at Anadarko and - and know that 1705 he was actually assigned to do that? 1706 1707 A: To be honest with you, probably. Again, I do not work with him, um, but if 1708 there’s one thing that I do know about Anadarko and I love and I’m gonna 1709 miss those guys so much, it’s the fact that they’re very safe, like, that is - 1710 they’re one of the best oil and gas companies because of how safe they are. 1711 Um, so with that being said, I would be willing to bet that there’s typically... 1712 1713 Q: Well, like, you... 1714 1715 A: ...a protocol. 1716 1717 Q: Right. So I - I mean, th- there would have to be a known problem for him to 1718 do a lockout/tagout, right? 1719 1720 A: Yes. 1721 1722 Q: So... 1723 1724 A: Yes. 1725 1726 Q: ...somebody would’ve had to call and said, hey, there’s a - in your guys’ 1727 words, release, um, at this site and then some boss or whoever it may be 1728 would call Chris and say, “Hey, Chris. I need you to go check this out. If it’s 1729 so, you’re a skilled, um, equipment operator, you make the decision. You lock 1730 it out if you have to.” Then the environmental team comes and cleans it up, so 1731 there’s gotta be, like, a track... 1732 1733 A: Yep. 1734 1735 Q: ...record of all that going on? Um... 1736 1737 A: Uh, I’m assu- I’m assuming that there probably is because lockout/tagout... 1738 1739 Q: ...because if... 1740 1741 A: ...I mean, it’s - it’s to save lives so it’s a very serious thing... 1742 1743 Q: Right, it’s a safety thing... 1744 1745 A: ...and, like, certainly - certain people - yeah, and, like, only certain people are 1746 authorized, like, I couldn’t lockout/tagout something, like, I don’t have... 1747 1748 Q: Right. 1749 1750 A: ...that certification. 1751 1752 Q: Plus you’re shutting down... 1753 1754 A: It’s not... 1756 Q: ...a piece of equipment that makes money. So, um... 1757 1758 A: Yes. 1759 1760 Q: ...somebody wants to know that, right? 1761 1762 A: Yes. 1763 1764 Q: Somebody - there... 1765 1766 A: Yes. 1767 1768 Q: ...there is a, I mean, there - it - it’s a business. I’m just trying to think as a 1769 business person how they would - would do that because certainly if you’re 1770 doing that, they wanna get the team out there and clean up whatever is going 1771 on as soon as possible so... 1772 1773 A: So... 1774 1775 Q: ...they can piece of equipment back in order and running so they can continue 1776 to pump oil. 1777 1778 A: Understood. Understood. Well and, too, the thing - the other thing too is the, 1779 like, he hadn’t even looked at the site yet so it’s, like, how do you know that 1780 you need a lockout/tagout? I don’t know. Um... 1781 1782 Q: That - and that’s what I’m saying. 1783 1784 A: ...that is - that’s (unintelligible)... 1785 1786 Q: I mean, I would like to - it’s something for me to investigate. I’m just kind of 1787 trying to get a - ‘cause you obviously know a lot... 1788 1789 A: Yeah. 1790 1791 Q: ...more about the oil industry. I don’t know anything about it. That makes 1792 sense to me... 1793 1794 A: And that’s good. 1795 1796 Q: ...um, so that’s good. Cool. Thank you. 1797 1798 A: Yeah. I - I didn’t even, like, think of that till just now, so anyways, that is a 1799 question for Anadarko. That is not a question for me. 1801 Q: Yep. 1802 1803 A: Um, but, um, anyways, so he told me that he was gonna have to do that and I 1804 was, like, “All right. Cool.” You know, and then, um, and then - so he didn’t 1805 show up for wo- I mean, well, he did show up for work on Monday, but 1806 supposedly he was in the field. Um, and then Monday evening, um, after my 1807 friend (Jim) left, he - that’s when, uh, Chris and I spoke on the phone in that 1808 first, really extended conversation. Again, I don’t know exactly what time it 1809 was. It was late, but that first, really extended conversation. That’s when he 1810 started saying kind of all that really creepy stuff and then, um, he - in that 1811 conversation I started questioning him. And I was, like, I was, like, did you 1812 really - I don’t even remember exactly what I said, but I asked him, I was, 1813 like, “Did you really go to a job site this morning?” And he was, like, “Yeah.” 1814 I was, like, “And who told you to go there?” And he - I think he said that his 1815 foreman had asked either him or his - his, like, co- cowing man is this guy 1816 named (Troy). I don’t know (Troy). I don’t even know what he looks like, but 1817 I do know he - he exists, so he - he - I guess their foreman relies on Chris and 1818 (Troy) to kind of, like, run their little part of the field. And so Chris was, like, 1819 he was, like, “Yeah, my foreman asked either he or (Troy) to go out there and 1820 go look at it.” And... 1821 1822 Q: Do you know his foreman’s name? 1823 1824 A: Um, I don’t - he’s got a few of ‘em I think. 1825 1826 Q: Okay. 1827 1828 A: I wanna say... 1829 1830 Q: That’s okay. 1831 1832 A: ...I wa- wanna say (Luke Eppel), but I don’t know. You’re gonna need to find 1833 that out with Anadarko too. 1834 1835 Q: Okay. 1836 1837 A: That’s an Anadarko question. 1838 1839 Q: That’s all right. 1840 1841 A: Um... 1842 1843 Q: And I know - I know who... 1844 1845 A: ...but I... 1846 1847 Q: ...(Luke) is and I know who (Troy) is, so we probably have already answered 1848 that. Um... 1849 1850 A: Okay. 1851 1852 Q: ...all right? 1853 1854 A: Yes. 1855 1856 Q: Great. 1857 1858 A: So, um, anyways, um, so I told him to prove it ‘cause at this point, I mean, the 1859 things he’d been saying, like, the sheets was kind of weird. You know what it 1860 was? It was the wedding ring comment that freaked me out, like, the sheets 1861 did, like, was kind of weird at the time, um, and the fact that I thought he had 1862 maybe had just lied to me about their separation, but it was, like, the wedding 1863 ring comment, like, he was so callous, like, he was just ready to, like, cash it 1864 in and get some money... 1865 1866 Q: You were telling... 1867 1868 A: ...and I was just, like... 1869 1870 Q: ...him to prove what? 1871 1872 A: To prove that they had told him to go to the field right away. 1873 1874 Q: Okay. So... 1875 1876 A: And he’s, like, “How do you want me to do that?” And I was, like, “You take 1877 screenshots of your Anadarko phone and you text them to me.” 1878 1879 Q: And did he do that? 1880 1881 A: And I ma- yes, he did. 1882 1883 Q: Okay. All right. 1884 1885 A: And he didn’t - he didn’t send me the whole conversation, but it - there was 1886 two pictures of a release, um, followed intermittently with, like, there was 1887 texts, like, on either side of the picture and, um, it looked - I, like, I - I didn’t 1888 get everything. He just sent me, like, part of their conversation and I didn’t 1889 have dates and times on either, like, you couldn’t see the dates and times of 1890 what he was sending me, so he could’ve been sending me something that was, 1891 like, not recent. It could’ve been something from, like, weeks ago and I 1892 wouldn’t’ve known, but, um, he sent it to me. And he sent it quick, like, it 1893 just, like, instantaneously when I asked him for it, like, I was still on the 1894 phone with him and... 1895 1896 Q: Right. 1897 1898 A: ...then I looked at it while I was still on the phone, and it looked - it - it made 1899 sense with what he’d been saying, but... 1900 1901 Q: Okay. 1902 1903 A: ...the only thing in there - yeah, like, it almost looked like someone else was 1904 originally gonna go to that site and th- it looked like the conversation - 1905 someone I interpreted it, the conversation that he had had with his foreman 1906 and with (Troy) or whoever was in that - that conversation, it looked like the 1907 conversation had occurred probably at some point over the weekend. And then 1908 it looked like (Troy), I think, or somebody else in the field was originally 1909 gonna go out there on - first thing on Monday and he told them not to worry 1910 about it and that he would do it. 1911 1912 Q: Okay. 1913 1914 A: And - and I, again, I don’t know the exact words, like, I don’t have that whole 1915 conversation. Again, that is something that you - you need to go to Anadarko 1916 for that. 1917 1918 Q: Yep. Okay. What’s next? 1919 1920 A: Uh, um, and yes, well, then that was - and that conversation - that’s the end of 1921 that and then... 1922 1923 Q: Okay. 1924 1925 A: ...um, what else - what else - what else? Oh, um, so, uh, okay, and then that 1926 same night, um, remember I told you we had that one, big phone conversation 1927 that you and me just discussed, and then we FaceTimed for, like, two 1928 minutes... 1929 1930 Q: Right. 1931 1932 A: ...and then - and then we had another big phone conversation? 1933 1934 Q: Yep. 1936 A: So when - when we FaceTimed, um, I don’t know - I don’t know. I’ll just - I 1937 don’t know if it’s relevant but, like you say, just say it anyways? Uh, he was 1938 wearing a black, wife beater, um, I think it was black. And I told you guys that 1939 he was laying on a mattress that had no sheets? And, um, so I’ve been in his 1940 house, but I’ve never been in his kids’ room or the room where his wife slept, 1941 like, I went upstairs once, but it was back to that little playroom where all the 1942 books are at? 1943 1944 Q: Right. 1945 1946 A: But I did not go in any of their rooms up there, like, ever. But I remember that 1947 the time I did go upstairs, his - the bedroom door to the upstairs bedroom, like, 1948 the main room was open and I really, like, I didn’t wanna look, but, like, just 1949 when I was walking by, I noticed that they have, like, a really, big bed, like, 1950 uh, it was, like, a tall, pillory - just, like, a big bed, uh, frame. And so, um, I 1951 don’t really know exactly what it looked like. It just looked like a quick 1952 glance or whatever - it’s just, like, “That looks really big and, um, nice, you 1953 know.” 1954 1955 Q: Sure. 1956 1957 A: Uh, but again, like, I didn’t go in there so I didn’t get, like, a good view of it, 1958 but I noticed that night that we were FaceTiming, I was trying to figure out 1959 where the hell he was because I was, like, I was, like, he was laying down 1960 talking to me and he didn’t have any sheets on the bed, um, but the 1961 background didn’t look like the basement. And I’ve seen the basement and 1962 I’ve seen the bed in the basement, like, I’ve seen his little dwelling area down 1963 there and it didn’t look like that. And I saw, um, it kind of looked like he was, 1964 I mean, he was laying down and he had the phone, like, facing him, but you 1965 could kind of see in the background, like, the bed and it looked like - like a 1966 really, elegant, really tall bedframe. 1967 1968 Q: So you think it was the master bedroom? 1969 1970 A: Yes, I do. 1971 1972 Q: Okay. 1973 1974 A: I think it was. I didn’t - I didn’t ask, but I’m assuming it was and just no 1975 sheets on there. 1976 1977 Q: Okay. 1978 1979 A: Like, I remember the mattress - if I remember pro- properly, I think it was 1980 blue, but I don’t remember, um, 100%, but he was just, like, laying on it in a

1396 1397 Q: Right. 1398 1399 A: And the first one was the one where he mentioned the sheets - the smelly 1400 sheets with his kids, and that was also the one where he was telling me he was 1401 gonna go get his wife’s wedding ring appraised. Um, that same conversation, 1402 he - I don’t remember exactly how he phrased this. I, like, I don’t remember, 1403 like, what led to this, but he told me, um, something about, like, he mentioned 1404 that he had told - I don’t know what he said. He said something about the 1405 separation and how, like, she was okay with - with the fact that he wanted a 1406 separation or that, um, something like that. And I remember thinking to 1407 myself, like, wait a minute. Wh- oh, God, I don’t - I’m, like, drawing a blank. 1408 It - here’s the deal is, like, he had been telling me the whole time that I was, 1409 like, spending time with him. That he was getting separated - getting separated 1410 and he kept saying that he was the one who initially initiated the separation 1411 and then that it was more of a mutual thing, like, he said that he was the one 1412 who had initially brought it up... 1413 1414 Q: Okay. 1415 1416 A: ...uh, like, before we had met, and then, like, she was onboard with it where 1417 she was just, like, “I’m not happy either. Let’s do this.” Um, and then I, um, I 1418 remember telling you guys that when he was gonna go to North Carolina, I 1419 kind of, like, backed away from the situation and I was, like, “Hey, I think you 1420 should try to fix things with her because you have a really beautiful life with 1421 her and I think you should try to fix stuff.” And he kept telling me, like, you 1422 know, “I don’t want to. I don’t think she wants to.” And I was just, like, 1423 “Please try, like, just please try.” Like, I just thought he had such a beautiful 1424 life and - and, you know, and I was willing to just leave, like, leave his life. I 1425 was, like, “If you work things out with your wife, I’m gone.” And, like, I - and 1426 - and that’s fine, you know, and - and he’s always be, like, “Well, what about 1427 us?” I’d be, like, “Don’t worry about us, like, try to fix stuff with her.” And he 1428 said, “Okay, I will.” And then when he went to North Carolina, he told me 1429 that he sat down and had a conversation with her and that he told her that he 1430 wanted to fix it. That is what he said to me. He told her that he wanted to fix it 1431 and she said, “No.” That she still wanted the separation and that she was ready 1432 to file for divorce. So I was under the impression, when he got home from 1433 North Carolina, that the divorce was file. That was what I was under the 1434 impression. And so then on Monday when we were on that one phone call 1435 where he was just saying all sorts of weird stuff, he’s, like, again, like, I don’t 1436 remember exactly what was said, but it was something along the lines of, like, 1437 um, “She was okay with the fact that I wanted the separation.” 1438 1439 Q: Right. 1441 A: And then I remember asking him, I was, like, “Wait a minute. When you were 1442 in North Carolina, you told me that you tried to fix it with her and she was the 1443 one who said that she didn’t wanna fix it.” 1444 1445 Q: Okay. 1446 1447 A: And he’s, like, no, I just - and then he goes, “No, I just told her that I still 1448 wanted, you know, to continue with the separation.” And I’m just thinking in 1449 my head, like, “He lied to me. God, he fuckin’ lied to me.” He lied so much. I 1450 - it’s - it’s... 1451 1452 Q: Okay. So that just struck you as another lie? 1453 1454 A: Yeah, so that one I don’t - well, it - it - yeah, well, and then now I’m seeing 1455 the news where he’s telling everybody that he separated from her on - that he 1456 said he was - he told her he wanted a separation on the Monday that she went 1457 missing and I’m just thinking in my head, like, “He told me that he had 1458 already had that conversation with her before I was in - even in his life.” 1459 1460 Q: Well, and so not to ‘cause you anymore stress, but so when you’re talking to 1461 him on Monday, this is Monday, right? This isn’t Sunday, this is Monday... 1462 1463 A: No, this is Monday. 1464 1465 Q: ...so this is after the event? This is after the murders? 1466 1467 A: Yes. 1468 1469 Q: He - he... 1470 1471 A: Yes. 1472 1473 Q: ...is telling you that he - she mentioned, uh, that it was o- she was okay with 1474 the separation, although you know now... 1475 1476 A: Yes. 1477 1478 Q: ...that, um, that wasn’t accurate with those - that was something different than 1479 he had previously told you and certainly she couldn’t’ve been really saying 1480 anything unfortunately. So, I - I mean, he’s making - he’s making up stories 1481 after his wife is deceased. Do you - is that a fair statement? 1482 1483 A: Yeah, well... 1484 1485 Q: Is that - I’m - I’m kind of trying to follow where you’re going. 1486 1487 A: I - I don’t honestly, I - it just struck me as odd because I don’t know if he was 1488 talking about the conversation they had had that day, or... 1489 1490 Q: Okay. 1491 1492 A: ...he was talking about North Carolina. So either way... 1493 1494 Q: It just struck you as a lie? 1495 1496 A: ...it was weird - it - it - it struck me weird because he said that he was the one 1497 that was, like, pushing for it now. And I was just thinking in the back of my 1498 head, like, he - he made it sound like when I first got into his life that he was 1499 the one who had brought up the separation, but that she was, like, super gung- 1500 ho about it, like, he made it sound like she was all onboard with it. And then 1501 when they were in North Carolina, he’s the one who said that he tried to fix it 1502 and she wa- didn’t want anything to do with it, so it was weird to me when he 1503 was saying that he was the one that initiated the separation. ‘Cause I’m, like, 1504 “Wait a minute.” Like - and I think he - it - it was weird to me because I think 1505 he was referring to - to either whatever happened on Monday morning, or he 1506 was referring to whatever happened in North Carolina. And I was just really 1507 confused because I was, like, “Well, at that point, I thought she was the one 1508 pushing you away, like, not you pushing her.” 1509 1510 Q: Gotcha. Okay. All right. 1511 1512 A: Um, so I - I don’t - it’s just a lie. 1513 1514 Q: Yep. 1515 1516 A: I mean, honestly, I don’t know if it has any significance or it’s just - it was 1517 just a lie that I caught him. I don’t, I mean, I think everything he told me was 1518 a lie, but it was, like, a lie on top of - it - it’s a lie that contradicted the 1519 previous lies that he had told me. 1520 1521 Q: I understand. What’s next on your list? 1522 1523 A: So, uh, uh, let me see. Okay, so then in that same, exact conversation two 1524 more things happened. 1525 1526 Q: Okay. 1527 1528 A: One, um, I was asking him about his daughters EpiPen because I know that 1529 (CiCi) has that tree nut allergy... 1531 Q: Okay. 1532 1533 A: ...and I was, like, I was, like, a- again, like, I don’t remember, like, word for 1534 word, but it was something along the lines of, like, “She didn’t take your 1535 daughter’s EpiPen?” And he was, like, “No.” And I was, like, “Well, aren’t 1536 you a little worried?” ‘Cause I was, like, trying to do my own reconnaissance 1537 and I was, like, “Aren’t you worried about that?” And he’s, like, he’s, like, 1538 “Well, we have, like, a stash of them in the basement.” Or something like that. 1539 And he’s, like, “She probably just took one of those.” And I just thought it 1540 was weird because several weeks earlier he had told me how expensive 1541 EpiPens were so I’m, like, “If they’re that expensive, how the - how do you 1542 have a stash? You don’t have a stash. Nobody can afford a stash of EpiPens.” 1543 1544 Q: Right, they’re very expensive. 1545 1546 A: And - yeah, so I almost was, like, so at the time, like, I didn’t think anything 1547 of it, and now that I’m thinking about it I’m, like, “Well, that was a lie too.” 1548 And so... 1549 1550 Q: Okay. 1551 1552 A: ...so there’s that. And then, um, also in that same conversation - so then I 1553 started questioning him about why he didn’t go to the office on Monday. And 1554 I was, like, uh, you know, and again, like, it’s not an abnormal thing for him 1555 to not go to the office, but it’s less common, like, I would say it happens 1556 maybe once, like, every couple weeks or maybe once or twice a month, like 1557 it’s - it’s pretty in, like, it occurs so it’s not, like, extremely abnormal, but I 1558 just thought it was ironic that his wife was missing and he wasn’t at the office 1559 that morning. 1560 1561 Q: Okay. 1562 1563 A: And so - and he - or here’s the deal. So Sunday night he had told me, “I have 1564 to go straight to the field.” I mean, I guess that’s something else you probably 1565 wanna know... 1566 1567 Q: Okay. 1568 1569 A: ...so I didn’t think of that. So Sunday night... 1570 1571 Q: So Sunday night - during which conversation? The - so one we’re talking 1572 about now... 1573 1574 A: Um, I don’t... 1576 Q: ...is your first - you referred to it as your first conversation. Um, I don’t 1577 remember, uh, you had two that were lengthy. One, I believe, was from 9:00 1578 to 11:00 at night, um, and we had talked a little bit... 1579 1580 A: It was... 1581 1582 Q: ...about this previously, about him saying that he wasn’t gonna go to the 1583 office, um... 1584 1585 A: Yeah, so - so he - okay, so - I’m - I’m sorry. It’s, like, I jump around 1586 sometimes... 1587 1588 Q: That’s okay. 1589 1590 A: ...when I start remembering stuff. So he, um, the big conversation that we’re 1591 talking about, the really important one where he, like, gave me all those, like, 1592 weird, uh, one off details, that was the first, long conversation on Monday 1593 night. I don’t know what time that was, but that was, like, the first long one 1594 where he said all of that stuff, like, all of that was in one conversation. 1595 1596 Q: That - and when you say all that stuff, like, the smelly sheets, uh, talking 1597 about... 1598 1599 A: The ring. 1600 1601 Q: ...the ring... 1602 1603 A: ...the wedding ring... 1604 1605 Q: Okay. 1606 1607 A: ...the weird part where he slipped up about, like, him being the one to push... 1608 1609 Q: The se- okay, gotcha. 1610 1611 A: ...them separating and not her... 1612 1613 Q: So... 1614 1615 A: ...and, like, like, and - and then the EpiPen thing and then, um, all of that. And 1616 then so - so back to Sunday the - August the 12th, that night I believe we only 1617 had one phone conversation. I looked at it. I pulled up my phone records today 1618 and I’m pretty sure we only had one phone conversation, and then I think I 1619 just went to bed 1621 Q: Okay. 1622 1623 A: Um, but on Sunday night, um, that phone conversation - that’s the one where I 1624 heard the TV on in the background and I was, like, “Maybe he’s staying up 1625 and waiting for her.” Do you remember I told you guys that? 1626 1627 Q: Yes. 1628 1629 A: I was, like, “I think it was really weird that the TV was on, because he talks to 1630 me when he’s in bed and he wasn’t in bed.” Um, so that - that’s - this is the 1631 same conversation. In that conversation, he told me, “I have to go straight to 1632 the field tomorrow.” And he was just, like, you know, like, “I - I’m not gonna 1633 get to see you in the morning.” And I was just, like, “All right.” And I was, 1634 like, “Why?” And just, like, I gotta go, um, he’s, like, “I gotta go check out a 1635 site.” And, uh, like a release in the morning and a release is, like, when - when 1636 the oil industry has, like, like, a release of any type of, like, oil products or 1637 anything, like, from any of our equipment. And I was, like, I remember asking 1638 him, I was, like, “Well, why would you have to go check out the release? 1639 You’re not part of the environmental team.” 1640 1641 Q: So when you say release, is that... 1642 1643 A: He was... 1644 1645 Q: ...like, a spill? 1646 1647 A: Kind of, yeah. I mean, I don’t wanna call it... 1648 1649 Q: Or, like, something’s leaking or... 1650 1651 A: ...’cause - yeah, like, something’s leaking, like... 1652 1653 Q: Okay. 1654 1655 A: ...any - anything that’s involved with the oil and gas industry, anytime, like, 1656 so- like if a piece of equipment leaks. I mean, you gotta think they’ve got 1657 millions and millions of pieces of equipment, like... 1658 1659 Q: Sure. 1660 1661 A: ...it happens. And so he’s, like, “I have to go check out a release.” And I 1662 remember asking him, I was, like, “Why do you need to go do that? You are 1663 not part of the environmental team.” Because, like, our field operators, they 1664 will find releases and they’ll call - they’ll call our environmental team, which 1665 is, like, who I work for. They don’t call me though, ‘cause I’m not the one that

1216 1217 Q: What friend was that? 1218 1219 A: (Charlotte). 1220 1221 Q: Okay. So did (Charlotte) ever meet Chris? 1222 1223 A: No, none of my friends ever met him. 1224 1225 Q: Okay. 1226 1227 A: And then, um, uh, on the way back up, we stopped in Colorado Springs to eat, 1228 and we stopped at a restaurant called BJ’s. 1229 1230 Q: On Nevada and I-25? 1231 1232 A: Uh, honestly, I don’t know. I mean, I just remember... 1233 1234 Q: Right by the col- 1235 1236 A: ...what it’s called, like... 1237 1238 Q: ...University of Colorado? There’s a bunch of buildings, uh, and it’s a big, 1239 strip center. 1240 1241 A: Uh... 1242 1243 Q: There’s, like, a Costco... 1244 1245 A: Oh, wait, I think I remember the Costco. I think I remember Costco ‘cause 1246 don’t kind of have, like - like from the highway you can, like, see it... 1247 1248 Q: Yep. 1249 1250 A: ...from the highway, but that main road, you can, like, see the Costco and then 1251 you have to kind of, like, turn in and around into... 1252 1253 Q: Yep. 1254 1255 A: ...shopping center? 1256 1257 Q: Mm-hm. 1258 1259 A: Yeah, that’s the one. 1261 Q: Okay. BJ’s, it’s more like a, um, Brewhouse I guess kind of? 1262 1263 A: Yes. Yes. And it’s, like, really nice - that place. It’s just, like, it’s, like, a nice 1264 restaurant. I mean, not, like, nice, but it’s just, like, it’s - it - yeah, it’s... 1265 1266 Q: Okay. 1267 1268 A: ...it’s a decent place, so we... 1269 1270 Q: So that would’ve been... 1271 1272 A: ...the - it’s a big place. That’s what I was looking for. 1273 1274 Q: Yep. 1275 1276 A: It’s a big restaurant. 1277 1278 Q: Sunday... 1279 1280 A: Yeah, so... 1281 1282 Q: ...July 29th? 1283 1284 A: That - what, uh, what - what - what days did you want to know... 1285 1286 Q: Would - would that have been... 1287 1288 A: Yes, it was Sunday. 1289 1290 Q: ...Sunday, July 29th? 1291 1292 A: Yeah, it was Sunday, July 29th. And if you walk in the restaurant - so picture 1293 walking in, um, and the front doors are behind you, we were sat to the right on 1294 the, like, first level, like, there’s - there’s, like, a few different levels so we 1295 were sat on the right side and then in the right side, we were on the, like, left 1296 portion of the section on the right side, like, there’s - there’s little, like, single 1297 seater booths. 1298 1299 Q: Okay. 1300 1301 A: There’ really small. 1302 1303 Q: Okay. 1304 1305 A: So almost, like, in the center of the restaurant. Almost, but just, like, kind of 1306 on the right section of the - the main floor. 1307 1308 Q: Okay. 1309 1310 A: Okay. So there was that and... 1311 1312 Q: Did you pay - did he again pay with a gift card at that time? 1313 1314 A: Yes. Yes. 1315 1316 Q: Okay. All right. 1317 1318 A: And then we went home. 1319 1320 Q: Okay. Did you see him the following weekend? 1321 1322 A: Uh, no, ‘cause he was out of town. 1323 1324 Q: Okay. Do you know where he went? 1325 1326 A: He - yeah, he went to North Carolina. 1327 1328 Q: Do you remember the dates? 1329 1330 A: Uh, no, I think - I think, uh, I wanna say that he left on the 31st of July. I’m 1331 almost positive ‘cause we hung out the weekend prior at the sand dunes and 1332 then I came into work on Monday the 30th, I remember that. And then I think 1333 he left on Tuesday the 31st of July. I think. And I don’t remember when he 1334 got home. 1335 1336 Q: Okay. Next time you guys go out? 1337 1338 A: Uh, it was that Saturday... 1339 1340 Q: Saturday? 1341 1342 A: ...uh, the 11th... 1343 1344 Q: And you guys... 1345 1346 A: ...and that was... 1347 1348 Q: The Lazy Dog? 1349 1350 A: ...yeah, the st- yeah. 1351 1352 Q: Okay. So we got that all down. What’s next on your list? 1353 1354 A: Um, sorry, I was not - I forgot about all of that stuff and I didn’t... 1355 1356 Q: That’s all right. 1357 1358 A: ...(unintelligible), um... 1359 1360 Q: So we ran through something that I - on - you know, the first time we talked 1361 you were really tired. The second time you were overly stressed and you had 1362 thought of some very important stuff that you wanted to talk about, so it’s 1363 fine. And it - I don’t mind talking to you as many times as I have to talk to 1364 you to get everything down that could atten- you know, at some point be very 1365 important. It’s fine. 1366 1367 A: Understood. 1368 1369 Q: So just don’t - don’t... 1370 1371 A: Understood. 1372 1373 Q: ...worry about that. I, you know, my job is to talk to you and make sure that 1374 this stuff is, um, you know, placed in - in a - a report so it’s there forever, so 1375 it’s - it’s fine. Again, I - I just keep telling you every time, you - when you 1376 remember things, just call me and - and we’ll get it down, all right? 1377 1378 A: Okay. Okay. Yeah, and I hope you guys pull cameras on all that ‘cause, like, 1379 I’m trying to help you. I’m, like, I’m really, honestly disappointed that you 1380 guys don’t have all my text messages or don’t think that you do, like, it makes 1381 me sad, like, I really - I want you guys to have them, like, you need them and 1382 it’s - it’s frustrating to me, but it’s, like, I’ll just tell you everything I know 1383 and we’ll go from there. 1384 1385 Q: That’s right. 1386 1387 A: Um, hold on. Uh, hold on. What else? (Unintelligible). Oh, okay. So now let’s 1388 go to this last week. 1389 1390 Q: Okay. 1391 1392 A: Um, uh, let’s see (unintelligible). Okay. Um, so Monday. I think probably the 1393 most important conversation that I’ve had - I had with him after all of that 1394 took place was that first phone conversation on Monday night, like, the later 1395 one. Remember I told - you were telling me there’s two big ones?

901 A: God, um, okay, so that day, I’m glad you brought that up, um, prior to going 902 to, uh, Bandimere, we went to, um, what is the name of that little town - it’s 903 not Evergreen, it’s, like, in between Lakewo- Morrison. 904 905 Q: Morrison? Okay. 906 907 A: We went to Morrison. And there’s a patio bar there, um, I do not know what it 908 is called. It’s on top of an Italian pizza place. I think it’s literally called, like, 909 the Morrison Grill or Morrison Patio Bar, like, something real simple. Um, 910 and we went - it - it’s just like a rooftop bar, um... 911 912 Q: And you went before the... 913 914 A: ...and it’s above... 915 916 Q: ...drag races? 917 918 A: Yeah, we went before the drag races... 919 920 Q: Okay. 921 922 A: ...and we hung out - yeah, and we hung out there probably for a while. I think 923 we were there for a little while and we ate there, so that’s where we got food. I 924 totally... 925 926 Q: So you - you ate lunch there? 927 928 A: ...spaced it out until just now. Yeah, we did. 929 930 Q: Okay. 931 932 A: Tacos. 933 934 Q: Okay. 935 936 A: Um, this is a really bar by the way. Um, yeah, so we - we - we ate - we, um, 937 we did that and then we went to Bandimere and then I don’t know what we 938 did after Bandimere. I think we just went to (unintelligible). I’m almost 939 positive, like, I don’t think we did anything after that ‘cause it was pretty late. 940 And then on weekend of July 28th through the 29th, um, we went to the sand 941 dunes - we went to the Great Sand Dunes National Park. 942 943 Q: Down in, uh, Alamosa? 944 945 A: Yes. 946 947 Q: July 28th, 29th. Did you guys stay anywhere? 948 949 A: It was the 28th. What did you say? I’m sorry. 950 951 Q: Where did you - where did you stay? 952 953 A: Oh, we camped. 954 955 Q: Okay. 956 957 A: We camped. I don’t remember the name of the campsite, but if you, like, just 958 let me go through probably, like, my old phone navo or, like, go through just 959 the internet and try to look up campsites, I can probably come up with a name 960 for you. 961 962 Q: Let me - let me ask you this. There was, um, some attachments that, uh, when 963 I was looking at some of your phone stuff today, although very limited, 964 there’s a - a man with a backpack, um, he’s got a beard. He - he does not look 965 like Chris to me - in - in your photos. Do you know who I’m talking about? 966 967 A: Yeah. Is he, like, the little, heavier set? 968 969 Q: Yeah, I’d say he’s a little bit bigger. 970 971 A: Yes. That is my friend (Jim). That is the one that I was with on the Monday 972 and Tuesday of last week. 973 974 Q: Okay. So there is some photographs - you mentioned the museum - the car 975 museum. I think I remember seeing a couple photos of - of cars and it didn’t 976 strike me as anything then. Um, so there may be a little bit more on your 977 phone than what I think, uh, but there is definitely no photos of Chris, and I 978 don’t remember seeing, um, any pictures of the sand dunes, but - so did you 979 camp inside the National Park there? 980 981 A: No. It was outside. I think we camped at Zapata Falls. I think that’s the name 982 of the campsite. 983 984 Q: Yep, Zapata Falls? 985 986 A: I think it was the Zapata Falls. 987 988 Q: Mm-hm. 989 990 A: Yeah, it’s Zapata. We... 991 992 Q: It’s before you come to the - you - you turn off 160 and you’re going towards 993 the sand dunes and then you turn off and kind of go up a 4-wheel drive road to 994 Zapata Falls? 995 996 A: Uh, yeah, that, like, really gnarly - one with all the switchbacks... 997 998 Q: Yep. 999 1000 A: ...and the rocks? 1001 1002 Q: Mm-hm. 1003 1004 A: Yeah... 1005 1006 Q: Okay. 1007 1008 A: ...there. And so we - we camped there. Um... 1009 1010 Q: Was it, like, an established campground, or was it just dry camping? 1011 1012 A: No, it was an established campground. There’s a campground up there, like, 1013 you hang that left to go to Zapata Falls Trail, and then you go right and 1014 there’s, like, a big campground loop. 1015 1016 Q: Okay. So that’s where you guys were there. 1017 1018 A: Yes. 1019 1020 Q: All right. Keep going. 1021 1022 A: And then, um, we went to the sand dunes - not the first day, so we got there, 1023 uh, fairly late on - how did I do - how did we get - no, no, no, no, no, that’s 1024 right. So I just - I need to think about this (unintelligible) this was Saturday we 1025 got there, we set up camp and then after we set up camp, we went to the 1026 National Park. 1027 1028 Q: So ac- you went and hiked the - whatever, the - the sand dunes? 1029 1030 A: Yeah. Yeah, we tried and I just remember it was super windy. Oh, my God, 1031 the sand hurt so bad. I was - it was - it started raining, um, and we stayed. We 1032 stayed even though the weather was bad ‘cause there was, like, nobody else 1033 there. Um, and so we did that for most of the afternoon. And then, um, we 1034 came back to the campsite and I showed him how to light a fire ‘cause he’d 1035 never done it before. Um... 1036 1037 Q: He’d never lit a fire? 1038 1039 A: ...he lit - no, he’s never been camping before. He told me he’d never been 1040 camping before and I was... 1041 1042 Q: Oh. 1043 1044 A: ...like, “Well, if you wanna go, I’m trying to go to sand dunes.” So that’s why 1045 we went ‘cause he said he’d never done it. 1046 1047 Q: Okay. 1048 1049 A: Um, so we... 1050 1051 Q: Did you guys visit any, um, there’s not really very much stuff around there, 1052 uh, there’s no restaurants or anything in that area... 1053 1054 A: No... 1055 1056 Q: ...so... 1057 1058 A: ...no, we did stop at the - I think it’s called, like, The Oasis or something. Um, 1059 it’s, like, this little - it’s, like, on the way to the Dunes. It’s not in the Park, but 1060 it’s, like, on that road that you take to get to the Dunes and it’s, like, it’s 1061 almost, like, a little gas station. And we stopped there and we rented a sand 1062 board, um, to go sandboarding on and, um, we got - I think we got more ice 1063 for cooler, I think, and we got firewood for... 1064 1065 Q: So it’s, like, a gas station? 1066 1067 A: Kind of, but it’s, like, the one-stop shop that everybody goes to ‘cause there’s, 1068 like, nothing else around there. 1069 1070 Q: Right. 1071 1072 A: Like, you wouldn’t - I’m almost sure - I’m almost positive it’s called The 1073 Oasis and they actually have their own campground back there too. 1074 1075 Q: Okay. 1076 1077 A: It’s, like... 1078 1079 Q: I know where you... 1081 A: ...on that road. 1082 1083 Q: Mm-hm. It’s right before you get to the... 1084 1085 A: Yeah. 1086 1087 Q: ...entrance to the - the Park? 1088 1089 A: Yep. Yep, yep, yep. 1090 1091 Q: Okay. 1092 1093 A: On the right-hand side when you’re driving in. Um, I’m glad that you know 1094 what I’m talking about... 1095 1096 Q: Well, I worked, uh... 1097 1098 A: ...because, um... 1099 1100 Q: ...I worked in Southern Colorado for the last five years and I spent a lot of 1101 time around Alamosa and - and The San Luis Valley, so... 1102 1103 A: Oh... 1104 1105 Q: ...I know... 1106 1107 A: ...gotcha. 1108 1109 Q: ...I know a lot of - about that area, unfortunately. Um, so I... 1110 1111 A: Oh, well, that’s - that’s good. That helps me. 1112 1113 Q: ...know where you’re talking about. So you - you got ice... 1114 1115 A: So... 1116 1117 Q: ...um, and, uh, firewood... 1118 1119 A: Yeah. And I got - I’m not sure if we got ice. I think we did just ‘cause I like to 1120 re-up ice every time I go camping. 1121 1122 Q: Who - who paid for it? 1123 1124 A: He did. 1126 Q: Okay. Do you think he used the debit - or the, um, gift card again? 1127 1128 A: Probably. ‘Cause that was the plan in the first place. He was just, like, “Well, 1129 hey, I’ve got these gift cards if you wanna use ‘em. You don’t even have to 1130 spend any money and we can just use these.” And I was, like, “Well, that’s 1131 great.” So I remember for the trip I filled up my gas tank and I paid for gas 1132 and I bought a little bit of groceries, uh, for the cooler. And then, um, he took 1133 care of, like, the campsite and the board and the firewood and all of that. 1134 1135 Q: Okay. 1136 1137 A: Like, I didn’t actually go into that Oasis place I don’t think. I’m almost 1138 positive I didn’t go in there, he did. I - I got in line for the board, I remember 1139 that. But their - their, like, little board rental shop is, like, outside of the 1140 building. 1141 1142 Q: Okay. 1143 1144 A: Or he went inside ‘cause he went and got firewood. Um, and then we went - 1145 went to the Dunes... 1146 1147 Q: And I’m just... 1148 1149 A: ...and we hung out... 1150 1151 Q: ...looking at your dates so you know you’re right. The Bandimere Speedway, 1152 the Mile-High Nationals was July 21. 1153 1154 A: Yeah... 1155 1156 Q: So... 1157 1158 A: ...uh, that’s what I was gonna say. Get online and see if that matches. 1159 1160 Q: Yep, it does, so... 1161 1162 A: Okay. So the - so then all... 1163 1164 Q: ...we’re good. 1165 1166 A: ...those other dates - all those other dates should be good. The only one that 1167 I’m not 100% sure about is the movie. It was that weekend, that movie... 1168 1169 Q: Okay. 1171 A: ...on the 6th and the 7th. It was that weekend, I just remember what day... 1172 1173 Q: Okay. 1174 1175 A: ...of the weekend. I think - I don’t think it was a Sunday though. I really think 1176 it was a Friday or a Saturday, like, I’m almost positive I didn’t have to work 1177 anyway. 1178 1179 Q: All right. So what’s after, uh... 1180 1181 A: Um... 1182 1183 Q: ...the Great Sand Dunes? 1184 1185 A: Okay, so we went to the - the dunes and then, um, we went and returned the 1186 board and then we went back to the campsite and we lit fire and we ate and we 1187 just hung out by the fire for a few hours and just visited and then it started 1188 raining really hard. So we put everything in the tent and put out the fire and 1189 we went in the tent and I remember he was, like, wide awake and I was so 1190 tired, like, oh my, God. I wanted to sleep so bad and he just, like, would not 1191 sleep and it was kind of bugging me, like, I would - I think I would - I would, 1192 like, almost, like, wake up and, like, half subconsciously, like, have a 1193 conversation with him for a sec and then, like, doze back off. And I just 1194 remember being so tired and he was up - probably for a while. 1195 1196 Q: Okay. And... 1197 1198 A: And then... 1199 1200 Q: ...so you guys... 1201 1202 A: Go ahead. 1203 1204 Q: ...come back to the Denver metro area on Sunday? 1205 1206 A: Kind of. Yeah, but we - so we went, um, one of my friends wanted us to go to 1207 the Renaissance Festival and she didn’t know who I was with, but she was 1208 with, like, uh, the Renaissance Festival in Colorado Springs, and she’s, like, 1209 “Oh, you should stop by.” And I made up and excuse to not go over there. I 1210 just her, I was, like, “Yeah, I don’t really know, you know.” And I, like, kind 1211 of got out of it because I didn’t want her to meet him. 1212 1213 Q: I got it. 1214 1215 A: Um...

2NDPH21AUG645PM 721 A: And I remember, um, we got there and the first showing was sold out I think? 722 I don’t remember. I think either we were gonna go see another movie and it 723 was sold out, or that one was sold out. So - but when we went up there to start 724 with, it was sold out and so we - we left and we, um, we went and, like, 725 walked down to these benches that were, like, right across from the Victoria’s 726 Secret. Um, and I don’t know what corner of the building that would be on, 727 um, if you guys need me to go to there and try to figure out, I can do that. 728 729 Q: No, we- I’ll figure it out. That’s okay. 730 731 A: Um, yeah, and we, like, sat in these benches - on this bench under this tree 732 and, like, just bullshitted until the next showing of the movie. Um, and they 733 we went to the second showing of the movie. And it was really late. I wanna 734 say... 735 736 Q: Do you - uh... 737 738 A: ...it was, like, 9:00 something. 739 740 Q: PM? 741 742 A: Yeah, it was late. 743 744 Q: On - on the 5th? 745 746 A: And I wanna say - I don’t - I - I just - I just don’t even wanna say it’s Sunday 747 ‘cause I feel like it was, like, not Sunday. I don’t think it was my birthday 748 though. I don’t know. 749 750 Q: Okay. 751 752 A: I don’t know. I might have all my dates mixed up. If I have all my dates 753 mixed up, just... 754 755 Q: That’s okay. 756 757 A: ...(unintelligible) camera or something, just... 758 759 Q: That you get - you’re getting us close. 760 761 A: ...you - you’ll find it. Okay. So then, um, let me go back to, um, no. I was 762 looking at August, that’s why the date - the date sounded weird. It was - it 763 was, like, it was either the 6th of July or the 7th of July. 764 765 Q: Okay. 766 767 A: I was looking at the wrong month on the calendar. 768 769 Q: So Sunday the 6th - pardon me... 770 771 A: No, it’s - it’s either - I think - ‘cause on this one I’m saying I didn’t think it 772 was a Sunday, so it is either Friday the 6th... 773 774 Q: Okay. 775 776 A: ...or Saturday the 7th... 777 778 Q: Uh, the... 779 780 A: ...of July. I’m sorry. I was... 781 782 Q: That’s okay. 783 784 A: ...looking at the wrong calendar. Um, so one of tho- well, ‘cause I remember 785 that was, like, our first, like, outing. That was, like, our first date and it was 786 the weekend right after my birthday week, so... 787 788 Q: Okay. 789 790 A: ...um, so it had to have been, yeah, either probably the 6th or the 7th. And 791 then... 792 793 Q: Okay. 794 795 A: ...we didn’t go anywhere again until the next weekend. And that weekend, on 796 Saturday the 14th, that’s the day that I went to his house. Um, we went up to 797 Boulder and we went to the Shelby Mustang Museum, so this was July 14th. 798 799 Q: Okay. 800 801 A: Yeah. So we went up there, took a tour and then, um, after that we left and, 802 um, we went to his hou- 803 804 Q: Do you remember time that would’ve been? 805 806 A: That we left? 807 808 Q: Mm-hm. 809 810 A: I don’t know. It was probably... 811 812 Q: Well, what time do you think you got to the museum? 813 814 A: Uh, God. I don’t even remember, um... 815 816 Q: Morning? Afternoon? Night? 817 818 A: I think it was pretty, like, a decent time in the morning. I bet you we got there 819 at, like, 11:00 or so, ‘cause I remember it took us probably, like, an hour, an 820 hour and a half to walk through it I think. It was - it’s a small museum. And 821 then after that we were gonna go to lunch in Boulder and then we decided not 822 to. And then, um, we just went to - we went to his house and I dropped him 823 off ‘cause I had picked him up to go to the museum, so I dropped him off... 824 825 Q: So you’re dri- 826 827 A: ...at - what? 828 829 Q: ...you’re driving your 4Runner? 830 831 A: Yeah. We - we drove my 4Runner all the time. I told you I was only in his 832 vehicle one time and I think... 833 834 Q: Right. 835 836 A: ...it was, like, so he could go get gas or something, like, everything - all of 837 these adventures were all done in my truck. 838 839 Q: Okay. 840 841 A: U- um, so then, uh, we went to his house and, um, we were over there for a 842 little while, but then I was just, like, “I don’t really wanna be here.” So I left 843 and I left him there. He didn’t go with me. 844 845 Q: At his home? 846 847 A: Uh, yeah, like, I left him there. 848 849 Q: Okay. 850 851 A: Um, and I left by myself. And then on the weekend of the 21st? And this is 852 how you’ll know if my dates are lined up. I would base it off of this date and 853 work your way backwards, but, like, um, this weekend I went to Bandimere 854 Speedway with him. As I we- and saw - think it was called the Mopar Mile- 855 High Nationals 856 857 Q: Mm-hm. 858 859 A: It might’ve been called (Thunder on the Mountain). I don’t know. It was the 860 drag races though and it was on - yeah, Saturday the 21st. 861 862 Q: Okay. 863 864 A: And were there, like, the majority of the day. I think - I think we got there, 865 like, early afternoon and we were there till it ended pretty much. 866 867 Q: Was that, uh, late in the evening? 868 869 A: Yeah. Those things go pretty like, like, it gets dark. 870 871 Q: Okay. So you guys - so you... 872 873 A: So (unintelligible)... 874 875 Q: ...dro- did you pick him up again and then drive your truck or - or your 876 4Runner, right? It’s a 4Runner? Drive your 4Runner? 877 878 A: I didn’t pick him up. No, I didn’t - I didn’t pick him up again because I never 879 went back to his house, like, he came to my house and then we carpooled. 880 881 Q: Okay. So he drove to your house, you guys... 882 883 A: So... 884 885 Q: ...carpooled down to the Mile-High Nationals and you stayed a majority of the 886 day? Is there anybody... 887 888 A: Yes. 889 890 Q: ...with you guys on any of these dates, or is it just you two? 891 892 A: It’s just us. 893 894 Q: Okay. Did you, um... 895 896 A: Um... 897 898 Q: ...have meals anywhere after you left there? Did you stop at any bars or 899 anything?

2NDPH21AUG645PM 406 407 Q: Yeah, and I appreciate it and your - that’s the kind of things that... 408 409 A: Yeah. 410 411 Q: ...I want, uh, when we talked prior, uh, just to - re- get you to recall things that 412 didn’t seem out of place then that - but when you reflect back, may have 413 seemed out of place now with what you know. So, what’s the next... 414 415 A: I agr- I mean, it was scary to me, like, it was scary that he lost that much 416 weight on that stuff, but I guess a lot of people do and I keep thinking about it. 417 418 Q: Yeah, I mean... 419 420 A: I’m, like, it almost seems like it’s a drug. 421 422 Q: ...if you look at any diet though, I mean, I - I’m not a fitness guy, if you read 423 about Atkins or any of these other diets, people lose excessive amounts of 424 weight in short periods of time, so, um... 425 426 A: Yeah. 427 428 Q: ...yeah, but, whatever. I - I think it’s interesting that, uh, this Thrive played a 429 part in it, um, and quite frankly, I - I am gonna get one of these patches, uh, to 430 try to figure out what it is. Um, so we’ll - we’ll - we’ll figure that out, um, at 431 some point. So... 432 433 A: Okay. 434 435 Q: ...what’s next on your list? 436 437 A: Um, let’s see, let’s see, let’s see. Um, oh, okay. So this is Saturday. This is 438 when I made... 439 440 Q: So Saturday... 441 442 A: ...a reference to... 443 444 Q: ...would’ve been... 445 446 A: This is Saturday the 11th of August. 447 448 Q: Okay. 449 450 A: Was that the 11th? 51 452 Q: Okay. 453 454 A: This is the night that we attempted to go to the Lazy Dog on 120th and 455 Federal and we walked in and I looked at their menu a bit, like, trying to seat 456 us, and I looked at their menu and I was, like, “I’m not eating here.” 457 458 Q: Right. 459 460 A: Um, and because - yeah, so we went to the other Lazy Dog, which is actually 461 owned by somebody else, so they have a different menu, so we went to the 462 Lazy Dog off of - I think it’s 144th that I told you guys, and we sat down and 463 we ate. And we were attempting to watch the... 464 465 Q: It’s on Highway 7, right? 466 467 A: What’s that? 468 469 Q: Is it on Highway 7? 470 471 A: I don’t think so. It’s on I-25 and, like, 144th. 472 473 Q: Okay. 474 475 A: I mean, I can look it up and I can... 476 477 Q: No, that’s okay... 478 479 A: ...screenshot it and send it to you. 480 481 Q: I think, uh, there’s... 482 483 A: Um... 484 485 Q: ...two of ‘em and I think there was some confusion. One of our guys went, and 486 I just wanna make sure he went to the right one, um, I don’t - I don’t - I don’t 487 know the Lazy Dog, but I’ll ask him tomorrow. 144th is right by... 488 489 A: The... 490 491 Q: ...Highway 7. 492 493 A: Okay. Well, I - I don’t know that. I don’t know. 494 495 Q: Yeah. 496 497 A: I’d just - I had never been to that one, so, um, I think it’s 144th. It might be 498 135th. I will it up tonight and... 499 500 Q: Okay. 501 502 A: ...then will just screenshot you the address and I will send it so that you guys - 503 if you guys need to pull those videos you can find it. 504 505 Q: Okay. 506 507 A: Um, but one thing that I noticed about this is that, um, so normally when we 508 went out, um, I try to keep things pretty cheap, just to be, like, respectful, like, 509 I never went to, like, expensive places or anything and sometimes I would pay 510 for things, sometimes he would, but when he paid, he would always use these, 511 like, Anadarko gift cards, um, like, these little, gray gift cards, and they were 512 always, like, $25 or $50 and they always came in, like, like, denominational 513 increments that made sense. And he told me that he got these from Anadarko 514 as rewards for, like, doing really good stuff at work. And is that true? I don’t 515 know. I don’t know if, I mean, I know that him and his wife have a lot of 516 financial issues so I don’t know if maybe he’s the one who actually wanted to 517 spend all the money and maybe he was cashing his paycheck in the, uh, gift 518 cards so that his wife couldn’t track it. I don’t know. I don’t know... 519 520 Q: Okay. 521 522 A: ...but I think it’s something you guys will need to confirm with Anadarko. 523 524 Q: So were they actually in the name of Anadarko? Do - do you remember - or 525 did he just tell you that they were gift cards? 526 527 A: They - they would say - no, no, no, no, I’ve seen ‘em. 528 529 Q: Okay. 530 531 A: They say Anadarko on ‘em. They’re, like, little sil- dark silver, like, credit 532 cards, but they’re, like, gift cards. 533 534 Q: So, you’re - you’re... 535 536 A: Um... 537 538 Q: ...just suspicious that potentially he was hiding money from his wife with 539 these gift cards? 541 A: Honestly, no, I think Anadarko legitimately gave him these, but oil industry is 542 pretty good about - when our operators do things that are safe, um, or they do 543 a really good job at something, um, they - they, uh, they usually provide, like, 544 gift cards or some sort of incentive for - it’s just a safe (unintelligible)... 545 546 Q: So they bonus these guys out if they’re doing a good job or being extra, like, 547 they have no safety violations and stuff? 548 549 A: Yeah, yeah, yeah, stuff like that, so it’s, like, they’re, like, safety rewards, so... 550 551 Q: Okay. 552 553 A: ...um, yeah, so - so do I think they were legitimate? Honestly, yes. I - I - I do. 554 That’s something you need to confirm with Anadarko though, because I 555 wasn’t one of their employees so I don’t know. 556 557 Q: Okay. 558 559 A: Um, but I did think to myself, like, if they do have money issues, maybe he 560 was possibly concealing it, but the thing - it’s not even the gift cards, I think, 561 that are, like, the main focus on this right now. For me, the main focus, uh, I 562 wanted to bring your guys’ attention is he always paid with those. Always. 563 And then... 564 565 Q: Every time you guys... 566 567 A: ...on the night... 568 569 Q: ...so you - you - we talked about this, um, prior and let’s just revisit it, um, you 570 guys never really went out on a date per se, with the exception of this 571 Saturday night on the 11th? Usually you guys... 572 573 A: No, we went... 574 575 Q: ...spent time at your home, um, versus going out? Un- unless I’m mistaken on 576 what you’re saying. 577 578 A: You are. I... 579 580 Q: Okay. 581 582 A: ...so we on most nights would hang out at my house, but we went out a few 583 times and I have dates for everything and... 584 585 Q: Okay. 586 587 A: ...I can give you that, once... 588 589 Q: Yeah. 590 591 A: ...I’m done with this. Um, so, um, the reason that this caught my attention was 592 not because of the gift cards, it was the lack of the gift card. So when we went 593 out to dinner, he went to pay the check and I noticed that instead of using one 594 of the Anadarko gift cards, he had a baby blue credit card in his hand that he 595 used to pay. 596 597 Q: Okay. 598 599 A: And I just remember thinking to myself, like, why isn’t he using any of those 600 gift cards? I’m pretty sure he still has a balance on one of those, but I couldn’t 601 remember. And then I was just, like, I was, like, maybe - ‘cause, you know, at 602 this point - at this point he had made it clear to me that they were, like, filing 603 for divorce, like, it was, like, done. So I was, like, “Well, maybe he just 604 doesn’t really care anymore, you know.” And - but then another part of me 605 was, like, “But technically, they’re still together so why would he do that?” 606 And, like, I just - I didn’t ask because, like, at - he had made it sound like by 607 that Saturday that they were so far removed from each other that I was, like, 608 “It’s plausible that now he’s just not, like, has nothing to cover up, you 609 know.” But then at the same time, I still feel like, until your divorce is 100% 610 completely final and you’re out of that house, why would you do that? 611 612 Q: Sure. 613 614 A: I mean, so, again, I didn’t ask him, like... 615 616 Q: So you just found it was a little bit suspicious, um, that he used a credit card 617 versus the, um, the gift card? 618 619 A: It was, like, he had nothing to hide... 620 621 Q: Right. 622 623 A: ...or nothing to lose. He... 624 625 Q: He... 626 627 A: ...was just, like, “Yeah, I’m gonna pay with this...” 628 629 Q: Right. 631 A: “...and I don’t care.” 632 633 Q: Okay. So - and that would certainly be, uh, if it was a credit card, um, just 634 thinking, uh, would be something that maybe his wife would see at some point 635 and he would have to then... 636 637 A: Yes. 638 639 Q: ...try to have to explain that. So in your mind, he’s, like, “Oh, well, we’re 640 divorced or I don’t care anymore. Um, she’s gonna find out that I have a - a - 641 a girlfriend.” 642 643 A: I don’t really know what he was thinking. I mean, I can’t think for that man, I 644 mean, I don’t even - I can’t even process half the shit he’s done or the lies he’s 645 pulled at this point so I don’t know. I just think that that was extremely 646 peculiar because he had never done that before... 647 648 Q: Okay. 649 650 A: ...and it didn’t seem like a big deal to him. 651 652 Q: All right. I - I get where - where you’re going. Um, so it kind of made you 653 think that he didn’t have anything to hide anymore? 654 655 A: No, not at all. And again, you know, I mean, there was other parts of our 656 relationship where it’s, like, he talked to me on the phone pretty freely, like, 657 all the time, you know, so for me, like, he never really seemed - it never really 658 seemed, like, on the phone, like, he had to hide anything at all. And that’s 659 why, you know, when he’s telling me, “Yeah, we’re getting separated. Yeah, 660 I’m sleeping in the basement.” Like, it didn’t even, like, occur to me, like, 661 maybe this isn’t happening because it was, like, he was so liberal about his 662 communication with me, even if they were in the same house together at the 663 same time. And so for me, I was, like, “All right. Well, maybe she’s upstairs, 664 he’s downstairs, they’re separated. It doesn’t really matter if he makes a phone 665 call.” And so that he was always liberal with, but when it came to, like, paying 666 for things, it was always the Anadarko gift cards. And again... 667 668 Q: Mm-hm. 669 670 A: ...like, I don’t know if that’s ‘cause he was hiding it from her or if that was 671 because he happened to have these gift cards and why not spend those as 672 opposed to, like, the money in your bank account. I mean, I don’t know. I just 673 noticed that that one last time that we hung out, that he paid with a credit card 674 and I was confused because I was pretty sure that he still had a balance 675 remaining on, like, one of those Anadarko cards, but I - I... 676 677 Q: Okay. 678 679 A: ...I don’t know. 680 681 Q: Got it. 682 683 A: I don’t know. 684 685 Q: All right. What’s next? 686 687 A: So - all right. And then, uh, let me just give you dates real quick... 688 689 Q: Sure. 690 691 A: ...um, for the thing when we were out in public. So I think I have these rights, 692 I hope I have these right, um, but on Sunday - I think it was Sunday - I think it 693 was Sunday the 5th. I think. 694 695 Q: July 5th? 696 697 A: Um, yeah, that’s what I meant. I’m sorry. I’m glad that you’re paying 698 attention to this ‘cause - yeah. So July - I think July - I’m gonna start at the 699 beginning. 700 701 Q: Okay. 702 703 A: So I went out of town for my birthday. I came home on July 3rd, which is the 704 night of my birthday. On the 4th of July, I went over to his house in the 705 morning and then - and helped him with his, like, meal plan thing, and then 706 after that I went to the 4th of July Rockies game with one of my friends. And 707 then on the 5th? I think it was the 5th, I don’t remember, um, we went to go 708 see a movie, um, and we went to the movie theatre that is up by that Lazy 709 Dog, I think, on 144th and I-25. Um... 710 711 Q: What movie... 712 713 A: ...he wanted to go... 714 715 Q: ...did you see? 716 717 A: That new Jurassic Park movie. I don’t know what it’s called. 718 719 Q: Okay.

181 182 Q: So, wh- 183 184 A: ...uh... 185 186 Q: ...I’m gonna ask ya - I think I already asked ya and we discussed this one, but 187 July 4th was the first time you went to his house? And then I think... 188 189 A: Yes. 190 191 Q: ...you said, like, the following Monday or Sunday was the - the fin- the second 192 and final time you’d been to his home? 193 194 A: Um, I - well, I have to - it was a Saturday and I’ll have to look it up. It was 195 either the Sat- it was - hold on, let me pull out a calendar. I really just wanna, 196 like, uh, that’s July. So the 4th and then that weekend and the - I think - I 197 think, and I will double-check this, but I’m pretty sure - I know for a fact I 198 was at his house on July 4th... 199 200 Q: Mm-hm. 201 202 A: ...and I think the second time I went to his house was Saturday the 14th. 203 204 Q: Okay. And - and do you - those are - if I remember right, you only had been 205 there two times, right? 206 207 A: Yeah, like, I didn’t wanna go back. After that second time that I was there it’s 208 just, like, “I don’t wanna be at this house. Like if you wanna hangout, come to 209 my house.” So - so yeah. So the 14th was the last time I was there. 210 211 Q: Okay. 212 213 A: Uh... 214 215 Q: Great. 216 217 A: ...but back to this - so the - the Thrive thing, so I - I was - I was, like, kind of 218 concerned that he was losing so much weight, um, but I also wasn’t because 219 he was, like, kind of fine tuning his diet, but it was enough for me to look at it, 220 um, because I was, like, well, I mean, it’s - it wasn’t, like, a - a - a severe 221 weight loss, but it was - it was kind of fast. So, like, okay, “Well, are you 222 getting enough calories? What’s going on?” And I couldn’t figure it out ‘cause 223 I was looking at what he was eating and it was, like, healthy proteins and 224 vegetables and - and he was eating a decent amount of food and I’m just, like, 225 “How is this man losing so much weight?” And then I started thinking about it 226 the other day and I’m, like, “Oh, my God. It’s because he was, like, doubling 227 up on all the Thrive stuff and he was starting to eat really healthy.” So that, I 228 think, is where the weight loss comes from. 229 230 Q: So did you see change in him, personally, during that time from July 4th - or, 231 pardon me, July - July 4th to August 11th when he lost that kind of weight? 232 233 A: What did you say? What was the question you asked because I... 234 235 Q: Did - did you s- did you see a lot of change in him, like, um, not physical 236 change, but was his personality different or was it just the weight loss? 237 238 A: No, it was just the weight loss, like... 239 240 Q: Okay. 241 242 A: ...I didn’t think he was any different, but this is the one thing that I wanted to 243 point out to you guys was that - that he always this way, I just wanna state that 244 right now, like, this was not something that started at any certain point, but 245 from the first time that we started hanging out, he always had a ridiculous 246 amount of energy. And it wasn’t that he was, like, super high strung and 247 bouncing off the walls, it was that he could stay up. He, like, didn’t need to 248 sleep. And he was always that way, like, when we would hang out, he - oh, 249 my God, I would try to get him to go to bed at, like, 10:00 every night. I’m, 250 like, “If you’re gonna stay here, you need to go to be at, like, 10:00 because I 251 have to get up and go to work in the morning and so do you.” And he - he 252 would keep me up, like, every night and we - usually I would say, I mean, it 253 kind of fluctuated, but typically I would say that we went to bed somewhere - 254 when he stayed the night at my house on those nights, somewhere between 255 11:00 and midnight every night. And it used to bug me because it was, like, I 256 was so tired. I’m so - I wanna go to bed. 257 258 Q: What time did you wake? What time... 259 260 A: I’m sorry? 261 262 Q: ...what time did you usually wake up? 263 264 A: Um, it kind of depended on the day and what I had going on at work, but I 265 would say in between 4:30 and 5:00 is, like, a pretty accurate assumption of 266 when I’m supposed to get up for work. 267 268 Q: Okay. All right. 269 270 A: So, I mean, and then so what I would do is I would go to work all day and 271 then when I would get off work, I would sleep. I would go home and nap and 272 I would - and my naps varied in time. Sometimes it was a half an hour, 273 sometimes it was, like, an hour and a half. It was, like, whatever my body 274 needed and then I would get up and I would go to the gym. And then after I 275 got back from the gym, he would come over to my house and it would be the 276 same thing where it was, like, he would keep me up. And I will tell you 277 without those naps, there’s no way I would’ve been able to keep up with him. 278 No way. 279 280 Q: Okay. 281 282 A: And - and an- and another thing about that too, and he was always like that, 283 always, and - and it used to - he - I could tell, like, his body wanted to sleep, 284 but, like, his mind couldn’t sleep. And the reason that I say that is because he - 285 I - he - sometimes I would see him, like, he would keep me up so I’d be, like, 286 “All right, well, like, let’s watch a movie, you know, uh, if you wanna 287 hangout.” And so we’d be up and I’d see him, like, doze off, and then, like, 288 wake right back up and, like, doze off and wake right back up. 289 290 Q: Okay. 291 292 A: And there was a few times - there was a few times that we were having a 293 conversation and he would be talking to me, Kevin, he would, like, fall asleep 294 mid-sentence and wake up... 295 296 Q: Okay. 297 298 A: ...like, snap - yeah, and he would, like, snap out of it, like, five or ten seconds 299 later and keep talking right where he left off. 300 301 Q: That’s weird. 302 303 A: Yeah. It always, like, blew my mind. I was, like, “This guy must really like 304 me if he’s, like, avoiding sleep to be with me.” And it was, like, I just - I 305 couldn’t do it, like, I napped probably almost every, single day... 306 307 Q: Right. 308 309 A: ...after I hung out with him. 310 311 Q: Right. Okay. I get - so I get... 312 313 A: So it was just - honestly, it was all... 314 315 Q: ...so 316 317 A: ...it was like he was on speed. 318 319 Q: ...so you think the Thrive thing contributed to that or at least his own drive for 320 losing weight and getting in shape and maybe his, um, attraction to you, um, 321 drove him? Because you’re pretty physically fit and he was kind of motivated 322 by that? I think I remember you saying that earlier, um, but you were trying to 323 help him get in better shape. 324 325 A: Well, and, I mean, he was already in good, physical shape and he was already 326 taking care of his health and his diet and the gym. I just think he was, like, 327 “Hey, since you’re already in the, uh, live a healthy lifestyle, uh, would you 328 be willing to just give me some input?” 329 330 Q: Okay. 331 332 A: Maybe I can fine-tune it. 333 334 Q: But do... 335 336 A: You know, I never (unintelligible)... 337 338 Q: ...you think that was some of the motivation for him to... 339 340 A: Uh... 341 342 Q: ...stay awake long hours and, um, you know, maybe use multiple patches of 343 Thrive to try to impress you, for lack of better terms? 344 345 A: No, I think it was the Thrive and I think his body wanted to sleep. I think it 346 really wanted to sleep. I think he legitimately was trying to lose weight and I 347 think that’s what was keeping him up... 348 349 Q: Okay. Cool. 350 351 A: ...because at the end of the day, like, I wanted to sleep, but he just was, like, 352 really restless and didn’t seem like he wanted to, but he always seemed, like, 353 really respectful of my wishes, so you would think that he would be onboard 354 with that, but it was almost, like, he, like, couldn’t calm his brain, you know, 355 and... 356 357 Q: Mm-hm. 358 359 A: ...like I said, he wasn’t acting high energy, he just, like, wouldn’t sleep and I 360 almost think that’s what it was. It was almost restless where it’s, like, “Hey, I 361 can’t turn off at the end of the night. Stay up with me.” And he never said that, 362 but that was kind of the impression that I got. 363 364 Q: Okay. 365 366 A: And so... 367 368 Q: All right. 369 370 A: ...and again, the double Thrive patches, I mean, maybe, but I don’t really think 371 he was trying to impress me. I mean, he told me, like, “I plateaued on this 372 stuff.” So I think maybe he was, like, “Whoa, what if I double dip?” 373 374 Q: Mm-hm. 375 376 A: So... 377 378 Q: Right, so he’s trying to get over... 379 380 A: ...I’m not sure... 381 382 Q: I get it. Okay. 383 384 A: Yeah. So I don’t - I don’t think that was a - a me motivated thing for him. I 385 think that was - he - ‘cause he was already working on the Thrive thing and, 386 like I said, and his fitness. He was doing all that prior to me being in his life. 387 388 Q: Okay. 389 390 A: So, and - and so - and I don’t know if he was double patching before I met 391 him. He double patched the whole time I knew him, so I don’t know if, like, 392 that occurred once I came into his life, or if he had already started doing that 393 once he plateaued. 394 395 Q: Right. 396 397 A: I never asked. 398 399 Q: Okay. All right. 400 401 A: I just found that really interesting, so... 402 403 Q: Yeah. 404 405 A: ...I just wanted to bring that up.

Code - 2NDPH21AUG645PM 12 Q: Today is August 21, 2018. This is Agent Kevin Koback from the Colorado 13 Bureau of Investigation placing a phone call to Nichol Kessinger, also known 14 as (Nicky), at 720-656-9605. The current time is 6:45 pm. 15 16 A: Hello? 17 18 Q: Hi, (Nicky), it’s Kevin. 19 20 A: Hi, Kevin. 21 22 Q: How are you? 23 24 A: I’m okay. 25 26 Q: All right. Um, can you - I - I’m running a recorder so you know, um... 27 28 A: Okay. 29 30 Q: ...I - I just want you to introduce yourself again for the tape recorder, just say 31 your legal name for me, and then we’ll get started. 32 33 A: Okay. Okay. It’s Nichol (Lee) Kessinger. 34 35 Q: And your birthday, Nichol? 36 37 A: July 3rd, 1988. 38 39 Q: And you go by (Nicky), correct? 40 41 A: Yes, sir. 42 43 Q: Okay. All righty. So you text me this morning, we had a brief conversation 44 regarding some new information that you remembered, uh, from just 45 reflecting on what’s been going on with this case. So... 46 47 A: Yes. 48 49 Q: ...you wanna start with that? So you - did you write some things down? 50 51 A: I did... 52 53 Q: Okay. 54 55 A: ...so they’re kind of out-of-order. They kind of just, are, as they came to my 56 head. 57 58 Q: Sure. 59 60 A: Um, so we’ll go over them in the order that I wrote them down. 61 62 Q: That’s fine. 63 64 A: Um, so I was thinking about the whole, um, uh, what is the - the name of the - 65 the stuff she sold for Le-Vel? Um... 66 67 Q: Thrive. 68 69 A: ...the, uh - I’m sorry? 70 71 Q: Thrive? 72 73 A: Thrive, that’s right. I was, like, it starts with a T and I’m drawing a blank. So I 74 started thinking about this whole Thrive thing because I remember that we 75 spoke la- at the end of last week and you’re asking what I thought of it and I 76 made it clear that I just - I didn’t understand it, um, and the reason I had a hard 77 time understanding it was because I didn’t understand how people who were 78 living sedentary lifestyles and had poor diets were losing so much weight on 79 this - on this program, and Chris was never able to tell me what was in it, like, 80 he always - he not always, but when we first met, he was, like, “You should 81 try this stuff. You should try this stuff.” And I never - I never wanted to. I was 82 uncomfortable with it because I didn’t know what it was, um, and I even had 83 looked on their website and I still didn’t completely understand it and so I just 84 kind of - I stayed away from that. And not only that, I mean, he told me, you 85 know, the only things he pretty much told me is, “It gives you energy and it’s 86 like a weight loss supplement.” And I’m not trying to lose any weight, like, I 87 don’t need that and I didn’t feel like I needed the energy either. So he never 88 pushed it again and I never - I never, like, he always sore the Thrive patches 89 and I never questioned it. It was, like, what he did. Um, but one thing I do 90 remember him mentioning to me when he first tried to introduce me to Thrive, 91 was that you needed one patch a day, um, and when he would hang out with 92 me, he always wore two - always wore two. 93 94 Q: Okay. 95 96 A: And I don’t know if he’s just, like... 97 98 Q: Do you remember where he... 99 100 A: ...doubling up or... 101 102 Q: ...where he wore ‘em? 103 104 A: Yeah, so he would usually wear one on, like, his left tricep, bicep area, and 105 then sometimes he would wear another one on the right side in the same spot, 106 or he would wear it on his, like, lower back. 107 108 Q: Okay. 109 110 A: Um, but he always had two and I remember thinking, like, “I thought you only 111 needed one of these. Why are you using two?” And I never - I never 112 questioned it because for me, I mean, like, I never questioned him about it 113 because to me, I just felt like since I wasn’t involved with that program and I 114 didn’t wanna be involved, it wasn’t really my - my position to - to - to 115 question him. 116 117 Q: Sure. 118 119 A: Um, and now I know that there’s also supplements that go with it. There’s, 120 like, a pill and - and, like, a morning shake or - there’s, like, a lot of stuff that 121 goes with it, but there’s, like, a daily routing of, like, three or four items that 122 you are su- supposed to take. Now was he doubling up on those other items? I 123 am not sure. I do not know that. 124 125 Q: Was he fol- do you know if he was following the complete routine? 126 127 A: Um, as far as I know he was following it. And he had told me that that is why 128 he lost a bunch of weight. He said that the reason he’d lost so much weight 129 was all because of Thrive. And then he said at some point a few months ago, 130 he had started getting stagnant with the weight loss and so that is when he 131 decided that he was gonna start working out again and that’s when he decided 132 he wanted to start eating healthy as well because he was realizing that he’d, 133 like, plateaued and he - he still wanted to continue with his fitness, but I think 134 he was realizing, like, maybe a diet, like, a healthy diet and exercise is what I 135 need at this point. So that was the avenue that he was starting to go down and 136 he’d been going down by the time I met him, um, but he was still doing 137 Thrive on top of it. 138 139 Q: Okay. 140 141 A: So the thing that caught my - yeah, so the thing that caught my attention about 142 this recently when I was thinking about it is the fact that, um, I think maybe 143 the reason he was doing the two a day, and this is just speculation, is because 144 it had, like, plateaued so maybe he was doubling up because he thought it had 145 plateaued. So the reason that this comes to my attention is because of this 146 weight loss. So, um, he lost 13 pounds in about 5 weeks. In fact, I can give 147 you the dates. He lost 13 pounds from July 4th to August 11th is how much 148 weight he lost, because August 4 - I mean, July 4th was the day that I went to 149 his house and sat down with him and asked him, “How much do you weigh?” 150 And he asked me, “Can you just, like, look at my macros and see how much 151 protein people my size would usually eat and all?” And just asked me to, like, 152 glance at it. So that’s why I went over was to... 153 154 Q: So that’s... 155 156 A: ...kind of, like, help him. 157 158 Q: ...when you say his house, that’s his house in Frederick that he, uh... 159 160 A: Yes. 161 162 Q: ...Shanann? 163 164 A: Yes. That’s the... 165 166 Q: Okay. 167 168 A: ...one that I told you guys I went to... 169 170 Q: Right. 171 172 A: ...on the 4th, and that was why I went there was to - to sit down with him that 173 morning of the 4th and just discuss his goals, you know, and again, I’m not a 174 fitness trainer so he already had a de- he- an idea in mind, he was just asking 175 me, like, “Can you just glance at this and tell me what you think since you pay 176 atten-” 177 178 Q: Right. 179 180 A: “...close attention to these things?” So anyways, um...

TIMDAD16AUGROOM 5986 they’re going to ask you. And r- really the only thing you have to remem- I 5987 mean, if you’re worried about your recollection or your recall or, you know, 5988 how you might remember this, everybody worries about that. Even we do. We 5989 spend hours on the stand and it’s very difficult. But the only thing you have to 5990 remember is tell the truth. And the truth will never change in your mind. You 5991 know what happened during these six weeks. You know what happened on 5992 Monday and Tuesday. And as long as you tell the truth then d- you - there’s 5993 nothing to be worried about. If you don’t remember something, you don’t 5994 remember it. Um, might they pick on ya a little bit about that? Absolutely. 5995 They usually pick on us a lot more than they do you guys. So, um - but y- 5996 that’s so far down the road. I mean... 5997 5998 A: I mean, how long are we talkin’? Like, how long is this whole process gonna 5999 take? 6000 6001 Q: That could be - well - so he has the right to a speedy trial once he makes a 6002 plea, which is 45 days. Do I think that’s gonna happen? Absolutely not. I can 6003 tell you that the majority of the homicides that I work on average somewhere 6004 between one and three years. 6005 6006 A1: Yeah, look at the clown man. 6007 6008 A: So I gotta just deal with the media like... 6009 6010 A1: With the theater. 6011 6012 A: ...knockin’ on my door like that for, like, three years? ‘Cause that’s, like, 6013 enough to go cr... 6014 6015 Q: Your - this case will be hot until the next unfortunately crazy case comes up. 6016 And - and you know it’s true. 6017 6018 A: That’s just... 6019 6020 Q: I don’t know if you watch the news. There’s a reason I really don’t. 6021 6022 A1: Every week. 6023 6024 A: I don’t watch American news. 6025 6026 Q: But you know there’s something new every week that’s the hot topic. This one 6027 might be hot for a week, two, three, whatever. And then something else is 6028 gonna happen. And - and they’re gonna forget all about this one until it comes 6029 back to court. And then it’s gonna be revived. If it - if it ever does. I don’t 6030 know if that... 6031 6032 A1: So... 6033 6034 Q: You know, he has all sorts of - he could plea. He could say, “I wanna go to 6035 trial. I didn’t do this.” Whatever. He could say whatever. Um, so it could be 6036 tomorrow, it could be five years. It’s - it just depends. I mean, there’s a lot of 6037 things that can slow cases down. Um... 6038 6039 A1: Yeah, look at that theater thing. I mean, that was a whirlwind for, what, a 6040 month or so? 6041 6042 Q: Sure. 6043 6044 A1: And then all of a sudden it - as soon as people started figurin’ out what that 6045 guy was all about, all the sudden they started just, like - “Man, he’s weird. He 6046 was psycho. Look at him.” And - and he just kinda just... 6047 6048 Q: And then it petered off and then... 6049 6050 A1: But then he also shows up every... 6051 6052 Q: Y- a huge - that’s a huge, huge event. 6053 6054 A1: Yeah. 6055 6056 Q: Um, you know, certainly un- unprecedented. 6057 6058 A1: But it shows up every six months or year here. 6059 6060 Q: Sure. 6061 6062 A1: Um... 6063 6064 Q: You know, I mean, you look at - I - I just - there’s no way to - to know that. 6065 6066 A1: Okay. 6067 6068 Q: But if - like your dad’s saying, you know, like, on that, that guy was sent to 6069 the state hospital for evaluation and that takes a long, long time and that can 6070 draw out cases if there’s evaluations. There’s all sorts of things that come into 6071 play that really, don’t worry about. Um, i- put this thing out of your mind as 6072 much as you can and when the time comes, if it ever does, that you had to 6073 testify, you will be in good hands. We’ll take care of you, the att- the attorneys 6074 handling this case are gonna (unintelligible). ‘Kay? 6076 A1: Okay. 6077 6078 A: So, um, I don’t... 6079 6080 Q: And if you have questions that you (unintelligible), just call me. 6081 6082 A1: Yeah, I don’t - I don’t think we’re gonna talk to the other side, from what we 6083 were discussing. 6084 6085 A: I don’t... 6086 6087 A1: They can get the discoveries from you guys and it’s... 6088 6089 A: I don’t wanna deal with him anymore. 6090 6091 A1: ...it’s - it’s the last thing... 6092 6093 A: (Mark) already said - he’s like, “He might try to call you.” I think I’m gonna 6094 just ignore that. 6095 6096 Q: Who? 6097 6098 A: Chris. I don’t know if he will try to call me. I hear- did they find those little 6099 girls yet? I know they’ve been lookin’ for ‘em. 6100 6101 Q: We don’t - we don’t know. 6102 6103 A: And they thought - or they knew where they were at. You don’t know yet? 6104 6105 Q: I don’t. 6106 6107 A: ‘Cause you’ve been in here with me? 6108 6109 Q: Right. 6110 6111 A: Ah, my God. 6112 6113 A1: I find the whole thing very weird if they (close) - as much as you told me that 6114 he doesn’t - he was as normal as he was but yet some c- very close friend 6115 would call within a couple of hours of her not answerin’ the door or what was 6116 it, a - just... 6117 6118 A: Well I think she was, like, on meds or something. Like, so I think he - she 6119 wasn’t concerned about Chris. 6121 A1: But to call the - but to call the police within just, like, the same day and yet he 6122 acted normal on this end, that is just - that is weird. 6123 6124 A: Yeah. 6125 6126 A1: Somebody - there’s - the - two different lives there or something. 6127 6128 A: Oh there’s definitely two different lives there. That’s why sometimes I have 6129 to, like - I feel like - when he’s like, “Well what did she” - people are like, 6130 “What did he say about her?” And it’s just like, “I don’t even know if I wanna 6131 say it ‘cause who knows if that’s what’s really happening.” 6132 6133 Q: Mm-hm. 6134 6135 A: I mean, maybe. Maybe not. 6136 6137 A1: Uh, (Molly) called me back so we’ll call her from (unintelligible). 6138 6139 A: Okay. I think I might need to approach Anadarko. I really don’t wanna go to 6140 work tomorrow. I don’t think I’m going to. I think I’m gonna just take the 6141 week off and then we can sort things out on the weekend and then I can, like, 6142 reach out to my supervisor and EAP or whatever. 6143 6144 A1: Yeah, you need a little sleep and some time. 6145 6146 Q: Yeah, you definitely need some sleep. Don’t drive tonight. 6147 6148 A: (Unintelligible). 6149 6150 Q: (Unintelligible) get the - I’m gonna shut this off. 6151 6152 A1: She’s, uh - um... 6153 6154 6155 The transcript has been reviewed with the audio recording submitted and it is an accurate 6156 transcription. 6157 Signed______ Agent Kevin Koback 090718 6158 ____________________________________________

TIMDAD16AUGROOM 5716 5717 A1: Yeah, because the company... 5718 5719 Q: Make a decision. 5720 5721 A1: It - I don’t think it would be in their best interest legally, morally or profit- 5722 wise to have a bunch of junk goin’ on. They would suppress it to keep it at 5723 least where everybody’s treated with respect throughout the company. This is 5724 a tough situation. It d- l- you know, they’ll put the - the presidential speech in 5725 it but... 5726 5727 A: I mean, I could do that job, like, 75% of that at home. 5728 5729 A1: Yeah, I would... 5730 5731 A: I’ve already been thinkin’ about that. I was thinkin’ about just askin’ 5732 (Unintelligible) like, “Hey, man, just let me come in at, like, 5:00 in the 5733 morning and deal with the gas monitors, like, two days a week. No one will 5734 even know I’m there. 5735 5736 A1: And I believe that... 5737 5738 A: And let me just work at home.” 5739 5740 A1: ...they probably made a statement on that - what do you call it? OHP or... 5741 5742 A: EAP. 5743 5744 Q: EAP. 5745 5746 A1: EAP. 5747 5748 A: They put out a notice today. 5749 5750 A1: If they put that out and it says your confidentiality will be respected... 5751 5752 Q: It has to be. 5753 5754 A1: If that got leaked through an HR department and that got out after you told 5755 ‘em something, that would not be good for... 5756 5757 Q: Em- employment law is very strict on that kinda stuff and... 5758 5759 A1: Yeah, so I - I think you should just atta- not attack it but be proactive in it and 5760 snuff it because 5761 5762 A: And what, just go tell my boss, like - not what I told you guys but, like, a 5763 summed up version of it like, “Hey... 5764 5765 Q: But they - they... 5766 5767 A: ...my name is about to get released in the media and there’s a lot of stuff tied 5768 to me that’s tied to”... 5769 5770 Q: I don’t know if I’d do that in that fashion. I might j- you just need to figure out 5771 a tactful way to do that. And perhaps an employment - there’s attorneys that 5772 deal with employment law. Um, and maybe you wanna reach out to one of 5773 them. That might help you. I don’t know. Um... 5774 5775 A: Ah, damn. 5776 5777 Q: You know, uh, it - it’s - it’s a decision that you might need to make or you 5778 might wanna talk - I think I would talk to EAP first ‘cause it’s not gonna cost 5779 you any money. Um, but... 5780 5781 A: See if they’ll do something - I hope so ‘cause they’re not actually my 5782 employer so that... 5783 5784 Q: Well they’re an outside, uh, agency that just knows what’s going on. 5785 5786 A1: But both c... 5787 5788 A: So yeah, I don’t know so sh... 5789 5790 A1: Both companies, it would be in their best interest to protect everybody 5791 including all the foremen he worked with, apprentices he worked with. I 5792 mean, all of those people have a lot of information, too. 5793 5794 A: Not like me. 5795 5796 A1: But again, they don’t wanna hear it, they don’t wanna have - you know, they 5797 don’t wanna talk about it. They have the same rights. So it would be a 5798 company-wide thing. So I would just... 5799 5800 Q: On the media stuff... 5801 5802 A1: We’ll work on that. 5803 5804 Q: Yeah, I think you’ve got a grip on that. Um, on the media stuff for you, I 5805 wouldn’t talk to the media. Just tell ‘em you don’t have any comment and for 5806 you, probably the same. And if they just persist, um, you - you know, maybe 5807 per- put somebody - it - it seems like your dad is your - your biggest 5808 confidante here and maybe make a brief statement. If - you know, “My 5809 daughter doesn’t wanna say anything. Have a nice day.” Whatever. You 5810 know, ‘cause if you appease ‘em a little bit, sometimes they’ll go away. Um, 5811 that would just be my suggestion. Um, don’t talk to them. The - you don’t 5812 need to. 5813 5814 A: I’m not going to. I guess they’re gonna make their own assumptions. You, 5815 uh... 5816 5817 Q: But, um, so... 5818 5819 A1: So does your neighbor, so does the p... 5820 5821 Q: Right. 5822 5823 A1: ...guy that’s stopped at the red light. 5824 5825 Q: They’ll be talk- as soon as they figure out who you are, they’re gonna talk to 5826 your neighbor and they’re gonna say, “Oh yeah, I saw Chris, you know, and 5827 her together, you know?” Whatever. You know it’s gonna happen. Just 5828 prepare yourself and then it won’t be - there - there - there’s an... 5829 5830 A: Are they gonna, like, swarm my house? 5831 5832 Q: I don’t think so. 5833 5834 A: No? They were, like, swarmin’ his. He told he that, he’s like, “There’s media 5835 everywhere.” And it’s just like, “I hope that does not happen to me.” 5836 5837 Q: Well - yeah. 5838 5839 A: I mean, I have, like, a little - I have, like, a safe house in Denver that I can go 5840 to that I have the keys to... 5841 5842 Q: There you go. 5843 5844 A: ...that has nobody there ever. 5845 5846 A1: That’s what we’re - that’s what we’re thinkin’ for the next couple weeks. 5847 5848 A: And that’s - all I have to do is check the mail and there’s no questions asked 5849 and nobody knows where it is and I’m not telling anybody. But it’s, like, a 5850 really nice spot for me to, like, hide out... 5851 5852 Q: Go there. 5853 5854 A: ...and I don’t have any friends in that building. I mean, it’s an apartment but 5855 it’s - it’s safe. 5856 5857 A1: And we will answer your phone calls but the same house is from... 5858 5859 Q: Go - go there. 5860 5861 A: The safe house is the safe house. 5862 5863 A1: ...people bangin’ on her apartment door. 5864 5865 A: When should I go there? When do you think all this is gonna start happening? 5866 I mean, it’s kinda... 5867 5868 Q: I mean, might be just good for you to go there anyways for your sanity. And 5869 stay away from this place that you had a connection to this man with and get y 5870 really thoughts in order and... 5871 5872 A: That’s so sad. That was my nest. It was, like, such a warm little place. 5873 5874 A1: That was your... 5875 5876 A: And now it’s like, I haven’t even slept in my bed. I’ve just been sleeping on 5877 the couch with the dog. I don’t even wanna do it. 5878 5879 Q: What other questions can we answer before we go? I - I kn- I don’t foresee 5880 talkin’ to you again regarding this. Now an attorney might review something 5881 and go, “Hey can you ask her another question?” Um, and that would be a 5882 long ways down the line. I don’t think there’s anything else. I let you talk for a 5883 long time today to get it all out. Um, so we don’t have to do this again ‘cause I 5884 don’t wanna traumatize you again. Um, but if there is important things that 5885 come up, please know that I do wanna talk to you about those. Other things 5886 that we haven’t talked about today or if something just - I mean, “I gotta tell 5887 him,” just call me. 5888 5889 A: I mean, like, some things I thought were really important, like, the other day, 5890 like, I didn’t mention the wedding ring thing and then I was like, “That was 5891 really creepy. I should probably tell them about that.” 5892 5893 A1: And yeah, the... 5894 5895 A: And you got those cards. 5896 5897 Q: Yeah, um... 5898 5899 A: I gave you those cards. 5900 5901 Q: So you gave me cards and there was clothing in there. 5902 5903 A: Yeah, I just - I don’t care what you do with it all. I just don’t want it. 5904 5905 Q: The clothing - wa- was any of the clothing anything he wore this weekend? Or 5906 is it stuff that was from... 5907 5908 A: No, no, no. It was, like, stuff that he brought over, like, prior to that. 5909 5910 Q: Okay. 5911 5912 A: None of that - like, some of it’s been washed and folded since then. Yeah, I 5913 just wanted it out of my house and didn’t wanna throw it away. 5914 5915 Q: We’ll - we’ll take care of it. 5916 5917 A: So you guys can deal with it. 5918 5919 Q: We have it. We’ll take care of that. Um, if I have questions on the context of a 5920 text message, I might just call you and say, “The hell does this mean?” ‘Cause 5921 I might not understand what you were talkin’ about. 5922 5923 A: Okay. 5924 5925 Q: If that’s okay with you. Um... 5926 5927 A: Yeah, that’s fine. 5928 5929 Q: If - if it’s - I’m not gonna bother you unless it’s really important. I - ‘cause I 5930 think I have everything I need from you today. 5931 5932 A1: Okay yeah, we just wanted to make sure you guys had it so that... 5933 5934 Q: Well and we don’t - I d- I don’t... 5935 5936 A1: You could find the right person or something and get it done. 5937 5938 Q: We don’t wanna do it again. Yeah. And we know we have the right person. 5939 And I’m sorry that you’re involved. I am. It’s never a good time to say 5940 anything like that but it’s - it’s a bad deal, this whole thing is. And this is one 5941 of the tougher cases that I think - I’ve been doin’ this a long time. It’s - you 5942 know, it’s tough. So for you to - it’s even tougher and don’t forget to reach out 5943 to somebody for your sanity. Like I told - I asked you downstairs a question 5944 and you said, “No.” You remember what question I asked you, right? 5945 5946 A: No. You know how many questions you’ve asked me tonight? 5947 5948 A1: Did you want a pizza? 5949 5950 Q: Well he’ll a... 5951 5952 A: Pizza. I love pizza. 5953 5954 Q: Well I want food, too. I asked you if you had any, um conce- I asked if sh- I 5955 should be concerned at all about you hurt - hurting yourself. 5956 5957 A: Oh. No. I don’t feel the need to do that. 5958 5959 Q: Right. 5960 5961 A: I just want people to leave me alone. 5962 5963 Q: And if you... 5964 5965 A: I just feel like I wanna, like, hide for a little while while all of this is 5966 happening. 5967 5968 Q: Just please reach out to your family or even me and if there’s any - if you have 5969 any things that’s struggling, I w- like I told you, there’s people I could put you 5970 in touch that will talk to ya. I’m not a psychologist, I’m not - that’s not what I 5971 am. But people sometimes that get caught in these situations, they end up 5972 having lots of emotional issues and you need to address ‘em. Don’t just hide 5973 that stuff, okay? 5974 5975 A: All right. Um, are you guys gonna help me if we go... 5976 5977 Q: You’re super - you’re super, super intelligent so... 5978 5979 A: I appreciate that. That’s a nice compliment. When we go to, like, trail for this, 5980 if that’s what he so feels the need to take this to, um, are you guys gonna help, 5981 like, coach me through these questions? 5982 5983 Q: Of course. So we would be there, um, to re-discuss our conversation today, 5984 the conversation you had with (Mark) and then an attorney would, um, talk to 5985 you prior to any questioning on the stand regarding what kinda questions

TIMDAD16AUGROOM 5491 happens. Um, I can tell you right now, probably sometime early this week will 5492 be his, you know - he’s gonna enter a plea. Either I’m guilty or not guilty. 5493 That will probably be sometime Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday of this coming 5494 week. W- I would imagine, uh, from what I heard today. Now it might be a 5495 little more delayed. And then that starts the legal process. So, uh... 5496 5497 A1: But if he pleads guilty though... 5498 5499 Q: If he pleads guilty, um, you know, could that happen today? Cer- certainly. I 5500 mean, he could go to his attorneys - you’ve seen it happen before. Um, if he 5501 pleads guilty, is that information still available? Absolutely. Because there’s 5502 still, uh, got to be legal process... 5503 5504 A1: Mm-hm. 5505 5506 Q: ...regarding is he competent to stand, uh, for - can he make that plea? I- are - 5507 are the attorneys gonna allow him to do so? 5508 5509 A1: All the stuff. 5510 5511 Q: You - you know what I’m talkin’ about. 5512 5513 A1: Yep. Okay. 5514 5515 Q: So tha- all that information still goes to them. Um, and then that would play 5516 into, you know, potentially what is the sentence, what - what could be the 5517 penalty, all those things have to be looked at by attorneys. So, um, there is no 5518 not them ever getting her name. Uh, it is gonna be there at some point. And, 5519 um, I don’t know - I - I understand your fear. A- and that’s why I told you that 5520 if anybody m- I don’t care if somebody calls you and says, you know, 5521 anything minor, you call me and let me know please. I won’t... 5522 5523 A: I appreciate that. 5524 5525 Q: I will not stand for that, okay? 5526 5527 A: Well I’m (unintelligible)... 5528 5529 A1: So it’s the - it would be - the news people would be the only ones that - and of 5530 course they already know what to... 5531 5532 A: God, work is gonna be such a mess, too. That’s gonna be, like, a whole 5533 ‘nother level. Like, everybody at my work I heard was so, like, just damaged 5534 and broken today. And then it’s like, “Let’s just add (Nicki) into this whole 5535 mix.” It’s not gonna be good for all of their m- like, mentally either. It’s just 5536 gonna be a mess. 5537 5538 A1: Maybe your employer could transfer you to another business. 5539 5540 Q: I think that’s a fair state- I will tell you right now that I - Anadarko has been 5541 very, very helpful with us and is very concerned about their employees in this 5542 event. Um, and I - I’m tired, too. Uh, but you may - uh, your employ- your 5543 employer definitely n- is - has an indication of your relationship with Chris I 5544 would think. 5545 5546 A: They’re not my employer. 5547 5548 Q: Oh that’s right, you work for a different company. 5549 5550 A: Yeah, but... 5551 5552 A1: But... 5553 5554 A: ...you’re saying... 5555 5556 Q: I think... 5557 5558 A: ...Anadarko has an in- has knowledge of that. 5559 5560 Q: Well f- maybe... 5561 5562 A: Who are you talkin’ about? Tasman or Anadarko? 5563 5564 Q: Uh, I don’t even know what Tasman is. 5565 5566 A: Tasman is the people that cut my check and I’m contracted out to APC. 5567 5568 Q: So I think people n- um, sus- have suspicion that there was a relationship 5569 Chri- with Chris. Not saying you but they may know that - I think there was 5570 some suspicion that he was havin’ a relationship with somebody else. Not 5571 your name specifically. But if you went to your bosses and said, “I have an 5572 issue that I don’t” - you know, like your dad’s saying, I think that you might 5573 find that they’ll just get you out of there. 5574 5575 A1: See, that’s what - and - and that’s what we were talkin’ about today ‘cause 5576 they probably have a policy for, um, psychological health, they probably have 5577 a policy for, uh, inquisitive, you know, people buggin’ other employees. Uh, 5578 that’s a big company with a lot of HR and there’s... 5579 5580 Q: Do you have an employee assistance program? EAP? 5581 5582 A: I don’t - uh, oh yeah. That - so that - they were there all day today. But it’s 5583 like I got so many calls today from people I work with. 5584 5585 Q: Those are questions that you can ask them anonymously and that information 5586 is retained. 5587 5588 A1: See, that’s what I was sayin’ because if... 5589 5590 A: So what am I supposed to do, tell my boss? 5591 5592 A1: Well - well what - no, but they’re - your boss isn’t gonna want rumormongers, 5593 they’re not gonna want, uh, people f- stressin’ you out, they’re not gonna wait 5594 - they don’t want erratic workflow, they don’t want any of that. So they’ll - 5595 they’ll probably do a broadcast letter of, “Anybody that was friends, 5596 acquaintances of it... 5597 5598 A: They already did. They already dealt with all the (unintelligible) stuff today. 5599 5600 A1: ...or anything else, please respect that employee’s feelings.” And right there, 5601 “Oh and by the way, if any of you have a problem (unintelligible), you can 5602 call Mickey Mouse at” - you know, and that - and that’s probably... 5603 5604 A: See, but... 5605 5606 A1: ...they probably have a policy with that. 5607 5608 A: Here’s the problem though. 5609 5610 A1: And I’m hopin’ that they do. 5611 5612 A: I don’t work for them. 5613 5614 A1: But they can still protect you under that. 5615 5616 A: But if they, like, transfer me, like, they’re gonna be like, “You’re not even our 5617 employee.” Like, I’m pretty sure I’m about to lose my job over this. 5618 5619 A1: No, I... 5620 5621 Q: No, you’re not gonna - why would you lose your job? 5622 5623 A: I don’t know, ‘cause I feel like people are just gonna complain about being 5624 uncomfortable with working with me. Like, I - I am not gonna have any 5625 respect from anybody there. I think I’ll have, like, two people that still... 5626 5627 Q: You really didn’t do anything wrong. 5628 5629 A: I had an affair was married man who lied to me and made me believe that he 5630 really wasn’t, like, as married as I think he was. But the media is not gonna be 5631 so kind to let everybody know that. I think people are gonna think I’m, like, 5632 the reason that he went off the deep end. 5633 5634 A1: Well when... 5635 5636 Q: That’s prob- probably a fair statement. I would probably agree with you to 5637 some effect but if these people, you know ‘em at work then you... 5638 5639 A1: And the company will... 5640 5641 Q: Protect you at some point. 5642 5643 A1: The company will buffer that as much as they can because if not, it’d be - it’d 5644 be chaos amongst employees and they can’t have that. 5645 5646 A: I’m just so sad. Like, this is, like... 5647 5648 A1: It’s just not good in their - their best interests. 5649 5650 A: ...the job of all jobs I’ve ever had in my life and I fucked it up. 5651 5652 A1: It’s really... 5653 5654 A: Aw... 5655 5656 A1: Well she been out in the field - what, you been home, uh, three months of the 5657 year on an average... 5658 5659 A: Not even. 5660 5661 A1: ...in s- staggered amount out in the middle of nowhere on oil rigs. This little 5662 thing was out hangin’ on oil rigs and now they got her in environmental where 5663 she’s able to clean up stuff. 5664 5665 Q: Right. 5666 5667 A1: And it’s a hot job, man. It’s just a hot job. And... 5668 5669 Q: I - y... 5671 A: I mean, would you advise me... 5672 5673 Q: I wouldn’t start... 5674 5675 A: ...talking to, like, my head higher-up? 5676 5677 Q: I can’t give you legal advice. Maybe the best thing to do on that is talk to your 5678 EAP, whoever the - the employees assistance people are. They’re anonymous 5679 , they know all your HR rules, they know all your policy and procedure stuff 5680 and, “How do I - h- h- how can I mitigate this?” 5681 5682 A1: Fair (unintelligible). 5683 5684 Q: And also f- the - your problem, too, is not just - i- is this gonna become, uh, an 5685 environment where you can’t work? Um, you know, so you have to call those 5686 people and say, “I don’t want this to happen so how do we take care of it? I 5687 wanna continue to work for you guys. I love my job.” Whatever. Um, you 5688 know, just be proactive. I don’t know, um, your bosses on site. 5689 5690 A: Yeah, she’s pretty cool. I don’t know. She’s... 5691 5692 Q: I think that’s a personal decision you have to make. 5693 5694 A1: Yeah. But I - I don’t think... 5695 5696 A: Yeah. I mean, I didn’t even think about talkin’ to them at all but I keep 5697 thinkin’ about ‘em like, “Man, when my name gets out in the news, this is 5698 about to be crazy.” 5699 5700 A1: No, like, uh, w... 5701 5702 A: Like, I had people call me all day. Like, my office mate would not shut up. 5703 She just called me today and she was just like, “Oh my God, did you read this 5704 article and this article? And what did you think? And oh my God. And this 5705 and this,” and I’m just like, “I don’t - I don’t wanna talk about this. Please 5706 leave me alone.” And, like, it was really overwhelming. And my project 5707 manager called me and he’s really chill so we made it a very quick 5708 conversation. But some people just, like, didn’t get it. And it’s so hard to me 5709 ‘cause I feel like I’m... 5710 5711 Q: I would get in front of it. 5712 5713 A: ...lying to them. 5714 5715 Q: I’d get in front of it. N- don’t...

TIMDAD16AUGROOM 5221 5222 Q1: Where - where would that have taken place? 5223 5224 A: At my house. 5225 5226 Q1: When he went to go pick you up before headin’ up to, uh... 5227 5228 A: He didn’t pick me up. We drive my vehicle. But, um, yeah. Prior to and 5229 immediately following afterwards. So it was like, he... 5230 5231 Q1: So when he dropped you back off... 5232 5233 A: ...he came to my house... 5234 5235 Q1: ...you - you did... 5236 5237 A: ...it happened and then we went out to dinner and he came back to my house, 5238 happened again and then he left. 5239 5240 Q1: Okay. Any other stressors in his life besides finances and - th- that he 5241 mentioned? And his wife? 5242 5243 A: I mean, just the fact that they just - that she doesn’t, like, let him openly 5244 communicate. I mean, but other than that, no. I mean, nothin’ that I really 5245 know of. He was - I mean, we didn’t, like, dive super deep into that stuff. It 5246 was just, like, occasionally there’d be a conversation where it would come up 5247 and I mean, he - it wasn’t even really information that he wanted to provide. It 5248 was just, like, me being curious like, “Why are you separating from her? This 5249 is good to know.” Or, like, “What are your finances like in case I end up 5250 building a life with you?” But it was usually me, like, doing the inquiries. But 5251 I used to try not to be, like, super invasive about that stuff. 5252 5253 Q1: Mm-hm. What are the - in your mind again, just real quick, what are the 5254 things that - that really pop out to you that he would complain about about his 5255 wife? 5256 5257 A: Just that she didn’t listen to him. She, like, never listened to him. She always 5258 just, like, shut him up. Oh and he told me once that she used to, like - like, 5259 kinda, like, talk shit to him in front of his kids and his kids were startin’ to 5260 repeat it. 5261 5262 Q1: Did he give you an example? 5263 5264 A: Yeah, uh, she said - what did she say? He said he tried to ask her for 5265 something and ask her a question. I don’t know. Something he - he didn’t, 5266 like, dive super into this. This was, like, pretty early on. And he - she said, uh 5267 - she told him to shut up and that he didn’t know anything. And his kids 5268 started, like, repeating it. And he said that it made him really sad and he 5269 realized that that was when he needed to separate from her. 5270 5271 Q1: So - and - and he’d never though - he said she was a good mom? 5272 5273 A: Yeah. I mean, he never complained about her bein’, like, a bad mom or 5274 neglectful, anything like that. 5275 5276 Q1: Abusive, anything like that? 5277 5278 A: Nothing. Nothing. When it comes to, like, violence or anger or any of that, 5279 nothing. I mean, and he even said, like, “Yeah, like, so she - she kinda, like, 5280 gets bossy with me sometimes but as far as, like, arguing back and forth,” he’s 5281 like, “that never happens.” He’s like, “We don’t fight like that.” So I don’t 5282 know. He seemed pretty, like, even-keeled with stuff so... 5283 5284 Q: And just, uh - did they talk about how they disciplined their kids at all? 5285 5286 A: I never asked. I felt like that was not my place. 5287 5288 Q: Di- and he never mentioned it? 5289 5290 A: Nope. 5291 5292 Q: That’s all I was (unintelligible). Just making sure nobody else... 5293 5294 A: What time is it? I bet it’s so late. 5295 5296 Q: It’s 8 o’clock. 5297 5298 A: Damn. 5299 5300 Q1: Yeah, it’s... 5301 5302 Q: It’s time to go. You have my card. Y- things will probably come to your mind 5303 in the next day, week, month, year. Especially as you get some sleep and - and 5304 recover here. Please don’t hesitate to call me. My email’s on there. You can 5305 email me. The business phone number on there is not accurate. I used to work 5306 in our Pueblo office until... 5307 5308 A: So what is it? 5309 5310 Q: ...July. Just call my cell phone. I’m never in my office anyway. So... 5311 5312 A: Okay. 5313 5314 Q: Okay? My cell phone will always be the same. So just call my cell phone. 5315 Um, and - and I will respond to you as soon as I can. If - if you need, uh, you 5316 know, to send me an email, again, you can send an email to me. Okay? If I 5317 can help you in any way with some services to deal with the obvious trauma 5318 that you face, let me and I’ll get you in touch with the people that can help 5319 you. Um, also, uh, if you have issues with anybody intimidating you in any 5320 fashion, I will tell you right now, I have zero tolerance for that. Zero. I will 5321 charge anybody if I can prove it and I will take them straight to jail. Period. 5322 5323 A: Thanks. 5324 5325 Q: You are not - you’re not a suspect in anything, you’re merely a witness. 5326 Unfortunately for you, you met a man who did some terrible things. And I will 5327 not - I - I won’t stand for it. I - through my career period, zero tolerance. Uh, 5328 you will go straight to jail. You call me immediately and I will handle it. 5329 5330 A: I appreciate that. 5331 5332 Q: ‘Kay? And finally you probably eventually are gonna get media inquiries. 5333 5334 A: When are you thinking this is gonna happen? 5335 5336 Q: I don’t think it’s gonna happen soon. I really don’t. I will tell you today that 5337 there was an inquiry from a media member requesting to know if there was 5338 any other people involved in Chris’s life. Um, you know, is - I think they’re... 5339 5340 Q1: Fishing. 5341 5342 Q: ...the story is - they’re - they’re searching. But - but there is no - there’s only a 5343 multiple couple of time - reasons that somebody would think what would 5344 cause this. Are they... 5345 5346 A: Well, uh, they’re seein’ the financial stuff, they’re postin’ it. 5347 5348 Q: Right. And... 5349 5350 A: I’m seein’ it. 5351 5352 Q: So I think there’s a buffer for you for a couple of reasons. I told you today I - I 5353 did not see the affidavit. I don’t think your name was mentioned in it. I - 5354 there’s no reason for it I don’t think at this time for his arrest. When, uh, the 5355 affidavit becomes public, which I think they mentioned may be early next 5356 week, um, that’ll keep the m- media busy for a while. Um... 5357 5358 A1: Oh so her name wasn’t in it that you think? 5359 5360 Q: I don’t think your name was in it. 5361 5362 A: (Mark) said he didn’t publish that thing yet. 5363 5364 Q: Right. 5365 5366 A: So if he hasn’t... 5367 5368 Q: He - um, so I talked to (Mark) this morning and I know he has not written a 5369 report. Now I do know that he did talk to, um, the people yesterday just 5370 regarding her because it was important for some of the things we were doing 5371 yesterday. Again, I don’t think your name appears in that report. Um, so - but 5372 don’t hold me to that. I - I didn’t write the affidavit. But, uh, a- from - from 5373 what I know, it doesn’t. So at some point, this - your name is gonna come out. 5374 I mean, there’s just no way it’s not. And - and like I told you, I won’t... 5375 5376 A: So when do you think that is? Like, when we take this to trial? 5377 5378 Q: Um... 5379 5380 A: Like, at what point - because nobody knows about this. 5381 5382 Q: Right. But Chris does. 5383 5384 A: Yeah. I don’t think he’s in any rush to tell the media anything. I mean, maybe. 5385 5386 Q: These are mi- mitigators that he - in his mind or - uh, y- and you got a phone 5387 call from the public defender’s office. Whether you talked to them or not, 5388 that’s your business. 5389 5390 A: I did not. 5391 5392 Q: You didn’t? 5393 5394 A: I did not. 5395 5396 Q: Oh I thought you did. 5397 5398 A: I did not. 5399 5400 Q: Hm. 5401 5402 A: I didn’t know what to do. (Mark) said to ask you what to do. 5403 5404 Q: Okay so they - did they reach out to you? 5405 5406 A: Yep. 5407 5408 Q: Okay. You can - your decision. You don’t have to talk to ‘em or you can. Um, 5409 I - I won’t say either way. Uh, you have to make that decision for yourself. 5410 5411 A: I don’t really know what to do. I feel like if I talk to them, they’re either 5412 gonna try to, like, find some holes in my story or try to get me to, like, be 5413 Chris’s only ally and I don’t really feel like dealing with either one of those. 5414 5415 Q: Then I think you’ve made up your mind. 5416 5417 A: Yeah. I don’t want to... 5418 5419 Q: So then maybe confide in your father. 5420 5421 A1: No, that’s - we were talkin’ about that. 5422 5423 Q: Yeah. 5424 5425 A: Sh- we already talked. 5426 5427 Q: Um, I can’t really give you legal advice. They have every reason to want to 5428 talk to you. Just like if they got to you before I did, I would wanna talk to you, 5429 too. You understand what I mean? And I won’t hamper with their 5430 investigation is or anything. They - they want information, too. Certainly. 5431 They have a client that they’re tryin’ to protect and - and make sure that 5432 everything that we’re looking at is - is the same thing that they would wanna 5433 look at. 5434 5435 A1: But they can get it from you. 5436 5437 Q: They will get it from us. 5438 5439 A1: So... 5440 5441 Q: It’ll be, uh - in discovery, they’ll get, um, everything that we’ve talked about 5442 here. 5443 5444 A1: It’s in discovery. 5446 Q: And that’s - so when that happens, which is pretty short order, uh, the reports 5447 that we will generate, everybody involved in this case will be sent to the 5448 public defender’s office. I think at that time, you might, uh, find that - that, 5449 um, i- y- there could be some exposure for you. Um, so, uh, I am not gonna 5450 tell anybody who you are. If somebody called me today, I - I don’t talk to the 5451 media. I don’t have any business talkin’ to the media. (Mark) has no business 5452 talkin’ to the media. They don’t need to know who you are. It - your part in 5453 this is not relative to anything they - you know, to the story. I- for me. It - it - 5454 it’s nothing that they need to know. And, um, I don’t ever give information to 5455 anybody. 5456 5457 A1: Okay. 5458 5459 A: They’re gonna dwell on it though. They’re gonna try to use that as his why. I 5460 don’t think it’s his why. I really don’t. 5461 5462 Q: That’s why we a- I asked you that question. 5463 5464 A: You know... 5465 5466 Q: ‘Cause you think his why is financial. 5467 5468 A: Yeah. 5469 5470 Q: Uh, and whether or not we ever know what his why is, I don’t know. 5471 5472 A: Did he tell you guys what his why was? 5473 5474 Q: I can’t tell - discuss it with you. 5475 5476 A1: So, um, just a - a quick open question, the way the legal system runs, is it, um 5477 - if he totally confesses and pleads guilty, is there a reason for a trial? Or do 5478 they just pack enough discoveries together that this proves what he said and... 5479 5480 Q: S- so the purpose of... 5481 5482 A1: ...and he goes to a kinda court and it’s done? Or... 5483 5484 Q: The purpose for discovery is we have to sh- we’re obligated by law to share 5485 everything that we know with, um, the public defender or a private attorney. 5486 5487 A1: Absolutely. Right. Okay. 5488 5489 Q: Um, it doesn’t go the other way. Uh, they don’t have to share anything with 5490 us. So we are obligated to give them everything we have. No matter what

TIMDAD16AUGROOM 4771 don’t - and I - when he meant it, it was just like - like, just, like, the way you 4772 run your life. And so - ‘cause he got married really young, you know? And so 4773 to answer your question, I think inevitably it was going to happen. I think it 4774 just got propelled faster. I mean, I don’t think - I don’t understand what he 4775 would’ve achieved with - if he wanted to be with me that bad, what he 4776 would’ve achieved with me by doing what he did. I think his situation at home 4777 was way, way deeper than anything him and I ever had and it led to that. And 4778 I don’t know what happened in that conversation that they had. But I kinda 4779 have a feeling that it wasn’t even about her pregnancy or another man or me. I 4780 have a feeling it was about money. 4781 4782 Q: So drillin’ down, you think money... 4783 4784 A: I think it’s... 4785 4786 Q: ...for him is the - the biggest downfall? Uh, you guy- I mean, beyond the relat- 4787 really, I don’t know that you know too much about the relationship or the 4788 particulars just other than monetary issues, financial issues. That sounds like 4789 what you guys talked about when you talked about their relationship. 4790 4791 A: I mean, like, he told me other things. Like, they really didn’t, like, sleep 4792 together too much, stuff like that. But I feel like a lot of husbands and wives 4793 don’t do that. But it was like, “Well of course you don’t. That’s why you’re 4794 coming to me.” You know? Um, but, um, no. I think - I think I just - like, me 4795 being in his life just pushed that forward. I honestly think that there’s probably 4796 a good possibility that this would’ve just happened, like, further down the 4797 road where it would’ve just got... 4798 4799 Q: So did you see that i- before yesterday or Tuesday? Or was that just kind of 4800 something that you have reflected on and you’ve thought about this now 4801 goin’, “Man, I - now that I see that in this guy” - or just because of the 4802 lifestyle he was living? And if you didn’t get removed from it, h- this was 4803 gonna happen sooner rather than later like you said? 4804 4805 A: Um, you know, if I was to reflect on anything over, like, the past few weeks 4806 besides, like, the stuff, the last few days where you’re like, “Hey is there, like, 4807 any red flags?” um, I would say, like, no. But one thing I did notice one time 4808 is we were sittin’ on my couch and I was tellin’ him, like, “My house” - I have 4809 a really beautiful house. Like, it’s set up, like, really nice. But everything I 4810 have is, like, from Craigslist or Goodwill. Like, I have pieced it together and 4811 it’s all, uh, like, markdown stuff. And I have pieced it together in a way like, 4812 “It’s pretty, huh? It’s a pretty house.” But you would never guess that, like, 4813 everything I got is, like, super discount. And, um, one day we were sittin’ on 4814 my couch and we were just, like, bullshittin’ about some stuff. And I was 4815 tellin’ him like, “Oh yeah, you know, like, I got this marked down, American 4816 Furniture ‘cause, like, the corner was dented. And, like, I got this one off a 4817 guy on Craigslist. And I put it all” - and I was, like, tellin’ him, I was like, “I 4818 put it all together.” And I was like, “To me,” I was like, “material things don’t 4819 make a home.” I was like, “It’s the energy and the love that you bring to the 4820 home.” I was like, “It’s not about what it looks like.” I was like, “It’s about 4821 what you, like, bring to it mentally.” And he, like, collapsed in my lap and 4822 gave me, like, the biggest, most genuine hug I think that man has ever given 4823 me. And he just laid there. And he was just like, “You are so different.” I 4824 didn’t even say anything. I just, like, put my fingers in his hair and just let him 4825 chill there. And I assumed that it had to do with the finances. But it didn’t, 4826 like, stress me out. It was just, like, this relief sigh where he just, like, dropped 4827 into my arms. And I didn’t, like, really think too much of that event except for 4828 that I was like - this was, like, a - it was, like, a really genuine hug. Like, 4829 collapsed into my lap. Like, just so relieved. And I didn’t really think much of 4830 it until, like, I started reading about, like, their bankruptcy and all this other 4831 shit and I was like, “Oh.” So I think it might’ve been bigger than he let on 4832 ‘cause he never told me about his bankruptcy. 4833 4834 Q: Sure. 4835 4836 A: You know, he just told me about his current financials and he didn’t even get 4837 that in depth but I’m assuming they’re trash. And so yeah, I think - I think her 4838 spending all that money and not listening to him and him not standing up for 4839 himself in a calm and, you know... 4840 4841 A1: Just elevate? 4842 4843 A: Yeah, manner just kinda... 4844 4845 Q: La- last hard question regarding this. 4846 4847 A: Go ahead. 4848 4849 Q: And - and then I - I have just two cursory questions regarding some - 4850 something else and then I think maybe Tim has a few questions for you. But 4851 the - I think what you, um, say about the finances directs - direct- ra- dir- 4852 directly at his wife. Do you think that goes to the children as well? Because 4853 she took, uh - did she treat them like that, like they were gold and they got 4854 everything as well that you know of? Or do you think there’s a separate issue 4855 for why he may have, um, done what he did to his children other than 4856 financial? 4857 4858 A: That part, I don’t have an answer for. I can’t fuckin’ explain that. I don’t even 4859 think there is an answer. I don’t - I don’t even think there’s any sort of, like, 4860 computing up here that could possibly give a rational explanation for why that 4861 would’ve happened. 4862 4863 Q: ‘Kay. 4864 4865 A: I mean, the only thing that I’ve honestly thought of when I play the scenario 4866 over in my head is that maybe they woke up and saw him doin’ in their mom. 4867 And he was like, “Fuck. 4868 4869 Q: ‘Kay. 4870 4871 A: Now I gotta do this, too.” I don’t know. I’m like - I’m like, “Why?” Because 4872 they were, like, his, like, little lifeline, you know? He - he - that was 4873 everything to him, you know? And I get, like, those two have problems. 4874 4875 Q: But he had a great relationship his - but from what you’re accounting is he... 4876 4877 A: With his kids. 4878 4879 Q: ...he loved his children. 4880 4881 A: Yeah. Like, I’m - that part - it just - it’s - oh my g- that’s the worst part of this 4882 whole mess. The worst part of this whole mess. And... 4883 4884 Q: We won’t dwell on it. We don’t have to do that. 4885 4886 A: No. 4887 4888 Q: Let me ask you, um... 4889 4890 A: But - so no, I don’t - I don’t have an explanation. That’s the only thing I can 4891 possibly, plausibly think of is maybe they saw it. But other than that, I don’t 4892 know what the fuck. 4893 4894 Q: Okay. Who’s (Charlotte)? 4895 4896 A: Are you asking me who (Charlotte)... 4897 4898 Q: Mm-hm. Mm-hm. 4899 4900 A: Like, one of my friends? 4901 4902 Q: Mm-hm. 4903 4904 A: Uh, she’s, like, a really good friend of mine. Why? 4906 Q: Did you have some conversations with her regarding another boyfriend? 4907 4908 A: No. 4909 4910 Q: That you might have met on eHarmony? Or did she meet somebody on 4911 eHarmony? 4912 4913 A: No. She’s gay, she doesn’t... 4914 4915 Q: Okay. 4916 4917 A: She’s engaged. 4918 4919 Q: So there’s some text messages that - between - that we got off your phone 4920 obviously. 4921 4922 A: Mm-hm. 4923 4924 Q: Um, and the only reason I’m asking this is because he found out maybe you 4925 had another boyfriend, you understand the - my l- uh, m- my line of 4926 questioning that looked like maybe you had another boyfriend. And I don’t 4927 know if that’s this (Jim) guy... 4928 4929 A: No. 4930 4931 Q: ...that maybe you guys were - no, I’m not sayin’ that he’s your boyfriend. That 4932 - that when we were interpreting the text messages, that it seemed like he 4933 might - you know, “This man came to my house, he has a key to my house,” 4934 that you’re saying right now. 4935 4936 A: Oh. 4937 4938 Q: When I look at that from my perspective, (Jim) may be another boyfriend for 4939 you. 4940 4941 A: Oh no, no, no, no, no. (Charlotte) is, like, my oldest friend. I love that girl. 4942 4943 Q: So did you have a conversation with (Charlotte) about (Jim)? 4944 4945 A: I mean, sometimes we talk about him. We’re all friends. 4946 4947 Q: W- did - or would - did you guys ever have a conversation about eHarmony? 4948 That’s the - an online... 4949 4950 A: I mean, possibly. I was on there for a while. 4951 4952 Q: Okay. 4953 4954 A: But I didn’t actually ever go out on any dates f- with guys from eHarmony. 4955 4956 Q: Okay. 4957 4958 A: Not one. 4959 4960 Q: Okay. 4961 4962 A: Like, I talked to a couple guys on there but I was like, “No.” I didn’t go on 4963 any dates. 4964 4965 Q: So another - s- the only reason n- would be another potential reason for him to 4966 be upset. 4967 4968 A: No. 4969 4970 Q: And... 4971 4972 A: He knew about (Jim). He’s always known that (Jim) is one of my good 4973 friends. 4974 4975 Q: Okay. 4976 4977 A: And I lay it out at people at the beginning, like, “I have friends that are male, I 4978 have friends that are female. These are my friends. That’s what it is.” 4979 4980 Q: Okay. 4981 4982 A: Like, he never to me seemed, like, jealous of (Jim) by, like, any means. So no, 4983 I’m curious what texts you’re talking about with (Charlotte). 4984 4985 Q: I have m- I have, like, a hun-... 4986 4987 A: I wanna look that - I talk to that girl so much. 4988 4989 Q: I have 153 pages of text messages so I can’t r- if I could pull it up, I would but 4990 I don’t know where it is. 4991 4992 A: I thought you guys just got my texts. 4993 4994 Q: We got, uh - when we asked for everything, we - for seven days, they give us 4995 everything. 4996 4997 A: Oh so why did you need to just do that if you just had ‘em? 4998 4999 Q: ‘Cause I don’t know that it’s - they’re completely accurate. Again, what they 5000 send me is - I don’t have any way to verify that they’re accurate. 5001 5002 A: Got ya. 5003 5004 Q: And - and if you delete a text message, sometimes those are not retained by 5005 carriers. Um, they - they’re still on your hand set. There’s a way to recover 5006 ‘em from your phone. 5007 5008 A: Got you. 5009 5010 Q: But they may not be held - there are certain carriers that don’t even keep text 5011 messages. And I won’t tell you who those people are but they don’t keep ‘em. 5012 We can’t even get our hands on ‘em because they don’t have a database, they 5013 won’t pay the money. They’re stored on your stuff and your stuff only. So 5014 that’s why we ask for it. And some of those things disappear in three days. 5015 Five days. Seven days. Unless we ask them to keep ‘em. And sometimes we 5016 don’t know in time. So that’s why we do it, too. ‘Kay? So just, uh, a q- it was 5017 a question because it also would provide potentially a motive for what Chris 5018 did if - if he found out that you had another boyfriend. And... 5019 5020 A: Why would he kill his family ‘cause I have a boyfriend? 5021 5022 Q: Well he wigs out that he finds out that you have a boyfriend and just loses it 5023 altogether. Do you understand? ‘Cause he’s already losin’ his wife and now 5024 his new girlfriend has another boyfriend. And he just - he can’t - there’s 5025 multiple reasons why it just - it was a concern that... 5026 5027 A: His cheese slid off his cracker. So sad. I don’t know. He’s, like, not even the 5028 same. I look at those, like, mugshots and it’s - they’re scary. They scare me. 5029 5030 Q1: Yeah... 5031 5032 Q: Tim? 5033 5034 Q1: ...that’s what you said about that video, too. It didn’t - I had noticed it was - I 5035 would’ve been a wreck. Woof. 5036 5037 A: I don’t know, I mean, I volunteer with some guys for - when I did the arm- 5038 military stuff that had PTSD and they were tellin’ me when they went through 5039 trauma that they, like, kinda locked up. So, like, I didn’t even think it was the 5040 fact that he was calm that freaked me out. It was, like, his... 5041 5042 Q1: Oh when you were helpin’ those guys out... 5043 5044 A: ...eyes. 5045 5046 Q1: ...when the - from the... 5047 5048 A: Yeah. 5049 5050 Q1: Oh yeah. 5051 5052 A: It was his - like, that part didn’t - ‘cause I was like, “I - I’ve seen” - there’s 5053 these guys that have been at battle that I’ve worked with that are like, “Yeah, 5054 I’ve experienced this. This is how I handle my trauma.” And they’re, like, 5055 very, like, just kinda like zombies. But - so I didn’t hold that against him. It 5056 was just his eyes. Um, the - just the - the light is g- gone from him eyes. 5057 5058 Q1: So let me just finish just with a couple quick questions here but besides the 5059 obvious, you know, and - and what he’s done, uh, do you - was there - what’s 5060 the worst thing about this guy? Did you ever have just some sense - you seem 5061 to be pretty together with who you date, the people you, you know, hang 5062 around with. You - you seem to know a lot about people. Was there some 5063 impression he gave you that was negative? 5064 5065 A: The whole time - like, the whole time we were together? 5066 5067 Q1: Yeah. Anything negative that sticks out? 5068 5069 A: I didn’t think anything negative. I mean, like, I have preferences. Like, I 5070 thought he was, like - I don’t wanna use the word clingy ‘cause that’s fucked 5071 up. He was, like, really - he was a lot more into me than I was into him. And it 5072 didn’t make... 5073 5074 Q1: The entire time? 5075 5076 A: Yeah. I mean, I really enjoyed his company though. I mean, enough so that I 5077 kept everything going despite the situation. And I mean, like, it didn’t scare 5078 me or anything. It’s just, like, I don’t move that fast. 5079 5080 Q1: Okay. 5081 5082 A: So I think things were moving... 5083 5084 Q1: What were his long term plans with you? What did - what did he discuss with 5085 you? 5086 5087 A: Like, I mean, we’d, like, bullshit about it every once in a while and be like, 5088 “Oh yeah” - like, I asked him, I was like, “If you didn’t have that big house,” 5089 ‘cause he didn’t wanna live in it and he had made it very clear he didn’t pick 5090 that out, he didn’t - none of that. I was like, “Well if you could have a house 5091 that you wanted, what would your house look like?” And he would tell me, 5092 like, “I want a little ranch home. Like, it doesn’t need all these floors. Just a 5093 few bedrooms. Enough space for my kids. Maybe some property so they can, 5094 like, run around. You know, two-car garage, maybe three. Put the old sports 5095 car in there,” ‘cause he liked cars. Stuff like that. You know, I’d tell him, I’m 5096 like, “I’m simple, too. So if you end up doing that and we end up staying 5097 together, let’s do it.” But it was never like, “Sell your house. Let’s go buy a 5098 house.” Like, it was very... 5099 5100 Q1: He ever say anything about gettin’ married? 5101 5102 A: To me? 5103 5104 Q1: Yeah. 5105 5106 A: I mean, w- it was, like, a thing where it was, like, offhandedly, like, “One day, 5107 maybe this will happen.” But again, it was like, these were - I did not take 5108 these as very, like, deep, deep conversations. It wasn’t like, “This is when 5109 we’re gonna get married. This is what’s gonna go on.” 5110 5111 Q1: Okay. 5112 5113 A: You know? Um... 5114 5115 Q1: And you knew him for how long? 5116 5117 A: F- brief. 5118 5119 Q1: In total. Just - not even - not dating him but I mean, when did you - when were 5120 you first aware of him? How long? 5121 5122 A: I don’t know. Probably the beginning of June or maybe May. So, like, two and 5123 a half, three months tops. I mean, this is all, like, really fresh. Like, all of this 5124 is compounded into, like, a very small timeframe. 5125 5126 Q1: Very quick. 5127 5128 A: Yes. 5129 5130 Q1: Has he worked for the company for a while? 5131 5132 A: Yeah. I don’t know how long. I wanna say, like, five or six years off the top of 5133 my head but I don’t know. But he’s... 5134 5135 Q1: Did he supervise people? Do you know anything about that? 5136 5137 A: Uh, yeah, kind of. So he was an operator and the way that operators are set up 5138 at Anadarko was they have operator 1, operator 2, operator 3. But then each 5139 operator is, like, broke down into, like, the basic guy, the medium guy and, 5140 like, the foreman. And then it starts all over again. So he is still on level 1 of 5141 the operators but he’s, like, the top dog on the level one of the operators. 5142 5143 Q1: Okay. The whole time you known him is two or three months? Did he ever 5144 complain of anything, any medical issues whatsoever? Or did you ever pick 5145 up on anything? Does he - is he allergic to anything? Does he have any - you 5146 know, a s- a special diet? Anything that’s - that’s messin’ with him 5147 physically? 5148 5149 A: Not that I’m aware of. Not at all. 5150 5151 Q1: Okay how about psychologically? Did you ever think, “There’s - there’s 5152 something wrong with this guy”? I mean, was it... 5153 5154 A: N- I wouldn’t have dated him if I did. He - honestly - I mean, maybe because I 5155 thought he was, like, one of the, like, most laid back and, like, decent men I’d 5156 ever met and I just haven’t met a lot of people like that. But I mean, no. Not 5157 up until all this stuff started happening. Then I was like, “Whoa. You are not 5158 the person that I thought you were.” Um, but prior to that, n- no. Not at all. 5159 5160 Q1: Okay. 5161 5162 A: I really didn’t. I enjoyed his company. 5163 5164 Q1: You think he was datin’ anyone else? 5165 5166 A: No. 5167 5168 Q1: No way? 5169 5170 A: No. 5171 5172 Q1: Okay. 5173 5174 A: He was way too invested in that. 5176 Q1: Um, was the relationship pretty - was it sexual right off the bat? 5177 5178 A: Pretty close. I mean, like, once we got it to be, like, where we’re hangin’ out 5179 outside of work, yeah. I mean, it wasn’t, like, immediate but shortly following 5180 that, yes. And then it just continued. 5181 5182 Q1: Okay. Pretty consistently throughout the relationship? 5183 5184 A: Mm-hm. 5185 5186 Q1: So kinda hot and heavy. Um, you mentioned that maybe you guys were 5187 sendin’ some photos back and forth. What did - what kinda photos is he 5188 sending you? 5189 5190 A: Well see, he would, like, send me, like, workout photos, stuff like that. He 5191 sent me a couple of inappropriate pictures. I did not request those. I didn’t 5192 even want ‘em. I was just like, “Why do men do this?” 5193 5194 Q1: What - what were they? 5195 5196 A: Oh it was of his - his package. And I’m just like, “Okay cool.” Um... 5197 5198 Q1: Like, his face and everything? Or just... 5199 5200 A: No, no, no. 5201 5202 Q1: Okay. 5203 5204 A: Um, no. That’s it. But I think he only did that, like, one time. It was just like, 5205 “I don’t even really want this.” But usually he would just send me pictures, 5206 like workout pictures, like, progress picture stuff. And I would just kinda keep 5207 him updated. Like - ‘cause he - like, he had some, like, fitness goals in mind. 5208 So I was kinda, like, tryin’ to help him out with that. 5209 5210 Q1: Okay. 5211 5212 A: Uh... 5213 5214 Q1: When was the last time you guys were intimate? 5215 5216 A: Uh, Saturday. Saturday. 5217 5218 Q1: Was that the Broncos game? 5219 5220 A: Uh-huh.

4546 4547 Q: Well were some of the scared - was there s- fear in you that people were 4548 gonna find out about your relationship, too? 4549 4550 A: No, I didn’t even care about that at that point. 4551 4552 Q: At that point, there was n-... 4553 4554 A: I was just, like... 4555 4556 Q: Okay. 4557 4558 A: ...scared, like, of the situation. It was just, like, getting escalated and it was 4559 freaking me out. And he was just, like, not - he was strange. So another thing - 4560 so that was Tuesday. And that was it for Tuesday but I forgot some stuff on 4561 Monday that I did need to bring up to you guys. So Monday, um, when we 4562 were on the phone, at one point he mentioned to me - I can’t even believe I 4563 have to say this. She left her wedding ring here and I said something along the 4564 lines of, “Does that mean you two are done?” And he was like - uh, oh my 4565 God. He said, “How much do you think it’s worth?” And I r- like, remember 4566 hearing him say that and being like, “What the fuck?”And I remember 4567 thinkin’ to myself, like, “I don’t even know how to respond to this.” And so I 4568 was like, “I don’t know. Pawn it, man.” And I was just, like - I was like, “I 4569 pawn jewelry all the time.” I was like, “I pawned jewelry a few times.” I was 4570 like, “It’s not worth shit though.” And I was like, “So I don’t know if you 4571 really wanna do that.” And he’s like, “No. No. I think I’m gonna get it 4572 appraised. It’s a nice rock.” And I was just like, “Okay.” And it was, like, 4573 really awkward. And then he, like... 4574 4575 Q: And that was on Monday? 4576 4577 A: That was on Monday night. And that, to me, was, like - it was kinda strange. 4578 And then the Tuesday lying thing - like, I’m telling you, it started, like, 4579 Monday night, him saying that, that was why I couldn’t sleep. ‘Cause he made 4580 the comment about the wedding ring. 4581 4582 Q: Okay. 4583 4584 A: And then Tuesday, her still not comin’ home and then him lyin’ to me. And I 4585 was just like, “Oh my God. Oh my God. Like, what if something happened?” 4586 And it was, like, really hard for me to put... 4587 4588 Q: When - when you say, “What - what if something happened?” what were you 4589 thinking? 4591 A: Like, what if somebody took her? Like, could he possibly hurt her? And that 4592 was, like, the first time that I really, I think, genuinely considered, “Did this 4593 man hurt his wife?” And it was, like, hard for me to grasp. And, uh, I thought 4594 about it a lot and I - I waited for the night ‘cause I wanted to see if she would 4595 come home. And it was already pretty late. And I had company and I was just, 4596 like, “Let me just see how this plays out.” And, um, my buddy (Jim) left, I 4597 don’t know, probably, like, 9:00 or 10:00. Probably just, like, the same time 4598 he always leaves. And then, um, I couldn’t sleep then. It was really bad. And I 4599 woke up in the morning and I saw the interview that he had with the 4600 newspapers. And he just looked really different to me. 4601 4602 Q: How so? 4603 4604 A: The white in his eyes is gone. They’re, like, a different color now. It’s like he 4605 has no soul. I swear to God. I saw it and I was just like, “Look at his eyes.” I 4606 saw his mugshot. They’re not even the same color. Like, when you guys 4607 retrieve the pictures that are on my phone, look at his eyes then compared to 4608 now. Like, it’s the scariest shit I think I’ve ever seen in my life. It freaked me 4609 out. I was like, “That’s not even the same man that I know.” And it was really 4610 uncomfortable. Um, but anyways I saw that report in the morning and I was 4611 just to the point where I was just like, “All right. Like, something happened.” 4612 This woman is missing. Whether it was him or someone else, I know, like, a 4613 woman went missing not too long ago in Longmont. Like, I think it was, like, 4614 two months ago or something like that. And you guys - not you guys. But 4615 somebody up there called off the search on her. I don’t think they ever found 4616 her. So I was like, “I don’t know, maybe that’s connected, maybe somebody 4617 came and got her. Maybe he did something. I don’t know.” But I knew, like, it 4618 was a problem. And at this point, I was like, “I’m in a very messy situation 4619 with this man. And I don’t know what to do.” And so I called my dad ‘cause 4620 he’s, like, the only person that I trust with everything in the whole world and I 4621 was just like, “I have a problem.” And I told him everything and my - I was 4622 like - we just discussed it and it was like, “We need to go to cops.” Definitely. 4623 Because I figured you guys would find me eventually but I was like, “I feel 4624 like they need to speak to me. I feel like I’m a very important person for you 4625 guys to communicate with.” 4626 4627 Q: You are. 4628 4629 A: And so, you know - and again, I wish I’d have done it sooner but it just, like - 4630 it just kinda took the sequence of events of his lies and all of his bullshit 4631 falling apart for me to process that I needed to address the situation. And so - 4632 you know, and the time. And so that, to me - and another thing he lied to me 4633 on I caught him on Monday night, he was like - oh it was right after the 4634 wedding ring thing. He was talkin’ about - it might’ve been before. One of the 4635 two. But he was - he was, like, talkin’ about how, um - he, like, reflected on 4636 North Carolina and he was talkin’ about how he wanted the separation and all 4637 this stuff. And I’m like, “Wait a minute. Wait a minute. Wait a minute. I 4638 thought you were the one tryin’ to make peace with her and she’s the one who 4639 didn’t want it.” He’s like, “No, I wanted it.” And I was just like, “Okay.” And 4640 another thing on Monday night, his breathing was, like - uh, it was like his 4641 voice would crack sometimes. But I didn’t, like, condemn him for anything 4642 like that because I was like, “Well yeah, he’s probably stressed the hell out. 4643 His family’s gone,” you know what I’m saying? 4644 4645 Q: Sure. 4646 4647 A: So I don’t know. So that happened. And then, um... 4648 4649 Q: He never made any admissions to you about anything that he had done? 4650 4651 A: Nope. 4652 4653 Q: Um, he never said anything about doing - or at any time, not - not just in these 4654 days but during your relationship, did he ever say anything about hurting his 4655 wife, his children? 4656 4657 A: Never. Never. 4658 4659 Q: Did - in - in - on these conversations from Monday to Tuesday, um, did he 4660 ever say that, um, you know, somebody did something to them? Or did he 4661 ever give s- uh - um, an excuse to you how this could’ve happened? 4662 4663 A: No. I mean, he - he was... 4664 4665 Q: Other than they just were goin’ to a friend’s house. 4666 4667 A: Yeah, or he was like, “Yeah, I think she’s, like, with one of her friends. She 4668 doesn’t wanna talk to me,” kinda thing. 4669 4670 Q: So... 4671 4672 A: But other than that, no. I mean, like, he told me, like, “Yeah, she said she was 4673 with another man. But I think it was out of spite.” Like, he never really, like, 4674 held that she was with another dude. Like, sh- he never was like, “Yeah, she’s 4675 with some guy.” Like, she said it but I don’t think she meant it. 4676 4677 Q: Mm-hm. 4678 4679 A: Is kinda what he was, like, directing towards me. But no, he - I think that’s 4680 why I gave him the benefit of the doubt so long. Like, he has always been 4681 such a civil, gentle man to me. And he’s always been pretty calm and, like, 4682 levelheaded when he talks about the d- like, the differences between him and 4683 his wife. And I mean, that’s a sensitive subject. And he never, ever seemed 4684 like he was, like, aggressive about it. I mean, he was always just, like, chill. 4685 And he never talked ill of his children. He was always so bubbly about them. 4686 Like, those were his babies. So when all this happened, I was just like, “What 4687 the fuck?” And... 4688 4689 Q: S- so that brings me to a question real quick. I mean, you got - you - I don’t 4690 think anybody over the last six or eight weeks knows this dude better than - 4691 than you. I really don’t. You guys probably spent more time together than 4692 anybody. 4693 4694 A: Mm-hm. 4695 4696 Q: Um, conversation, whatever. Relationship. Um, what do you think - the - 4697 what’s the catalyst for this event? Do you have any - have you had - and I - I 4698 know it’s a hard question but I wanna get it out now we’re here. If - if there’s 4699 a thought that you have, um, that might lead us to understand a little bit why 4700 he might’ve done something like this, um - like I said, I don’t - I met Chris on 4701 - on Wednesday. Um, so I don’t know Chris. Not like you do. 4702 4703 A: Um, you know, I’ve thought about this. And sometimes I think to myself if I 4704 wasn’t in that man’s life, would his family still be alive? And I’ve thought 4705 about this a lot. And I think I can give myself different responses. But in all 4706 honesty, I think they might be alive but not permanently. I do not think that 4707 this man just snapped. I don’t think that he just met some fuckin’ amazing 4708 woman and he was just gonna try to fuckin’ murder his family and then think 4709 that I was okay with, like, building a relationship with somebody who did 4710 something like that. Like, at what fucking point, you know? And not only that, 4711 like, I always try to say, you know, like, “When we get to a point where we’ve 4712 been together long enough, I would love to meet your children.” Like, I never 4713 (discluded) them from anything. Like, I remember comin’ back from 4714 Colorado Springs and I was like, “Oh my God, they got the Cheyenne Zoo 4715 down here. You gotta take your kids. And, like, the - you can feed the giraffes 4716 and they would love it.” Like, I always tried to, like, in- like, show him cool 4717 things like, “Hey, man, would your kids like this? ‘Cause my nephew would 4718 like this. Like, check this out.” You know? Like, I sent him a screenshot of 4719 some rainbow u- unicorn Lucky Charms the other day. I was like, “Do your 4720 daughters know about these? ‘Cause I bet these are epic.” Like, little things 4721 like that where it’s like - like, genuinely - like, I care. I do. Like, despite how 4722 messy this is and how I’m sure I’m gonna be portrayed in the media and 4723 everything, like, I care about, like, his wellbeing with his children and all of 4724 that. And so for me, like, when I think of, “What was he - going through his 4725 head?” I find it really hard to believe that I am the catalyst for all of this. I will 4726 be willing to say that I think me being in his life accelerated what was 4727 inevitably about to happen. But I don’t think people just snap. Love does not 4728 murder. Hate and resentment murder. That’s the way I look at that. I do not 4729 know what is the truth anymore and what’s not and I don’t have all of the 4730 details. But this is just my, like, opinion but I’m pretty convinced that that 4731 woman and him did not get along very well and the reason they stuck together 4732 was, “Hey we’re gonna do kids.” And I think they also stuck together because 4733 they were in a very bad financial bind. And I think that she continuously 4734 disregarded it. And I think he messed up because he was too passive to say 4735 anything to her about it and really address it. And it just got to the point where 4736 it’s just like, you file bankruptcy and then what do you do? Just wait 'til you 4737 file the next one? I don’t know. I don’t know what their finances look like 4738 now but from the way it made it sound, it’s probably a pretty stark situation. 4739 And I don’t know if hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt over and over 4740 and over again are enough to lead a man to, like, wanna take somebody out 4741 but I don’t know. I’ve heard of people committing suicide over that shit 4742 before. And I would never justify what he did. I think it’s fuckin’ disgusting. 4743 It’s - ugh. Like, he’s such a fuckin’ pig. But I just - I try to, like, be like, 4744 “Why?” I try to come up with the why. And I really think that he was 4745 struggling with her really bad and not only that, he’s got a third child on the 4746 way and I know he was probably just like, “I can’t fucking afford a third kid.” 4747 Wants it but can’t afford it, you know? And he always told me he, like, 4748 wanted a little boy. You know? He wanted a third child. 4749 4750 Q: Mm-hm. 4751 4752 A: And so I think that it was just something like I think they were in a financial 4753 situation and I think she was very non-responsive to him trying to - to, like, 4754 solve problems and, like, get out of the situations that they were in. And I 4755 think people just get complacent is what it is. And then, you know, I think, uh, 4756 he met me and I think I was, like, a breath of fresh air for him where it was 4757 like, he could get away and just be like, “You know what? I can be myself. I 4758 don’t have to worry about money right now.” Like, you know, and this girl, 4759 like” - I have my shit together. Like, my life is so, like, very in order. 4760 4761 Q: You seem very, uh, organized and independent and dialed in for a 30 y... 4762 4763 A: Always. Like, I do really good at - I do really good at work, I have, like, 4764 almost a perfect credit score. I’ve been savin’ money for a house. Like, I don’t 4765 mess around. I mean, I did. I screwed up. This is, like, my one screw up ever 4766 and it’s about to be on, like, n- national news. But, um, just very dialed in. 4767 And I think it was, like, a breath of fresh air for him to, like, be around 4768 something like that because I don’t think that he knew that that was, like, a 4769 real thing. And he had told me that, like, numerous times. Like, “I didn’t 4770 know, like, women like you, like, existed.” I was just like, “All right.” Like, I

TIMDAD16AUGROOM 4276 me so I don’t think so. 4277 4278 Q: ‘Kay. 4279 4280 A: Um, but, uh - oh and I forgot something else that’s really important. I will add 4281 it in there, too. But let me just finish this thought. So then, um, Tuesday - were 4282 we talkin’ about - oh. Yeah. So I kept tellin’ him, I was like, “Chris, I know 4283 it’s yours. It’s okay.” I was like, “Go find your family,” you know? And I 4284 was, like - was I - was I hurt? Yes. But at the time, I realized, like, his 4285 situation with what he had going on was, like, way more important than, like, 4286 our situation. And so that’s why I was just, like - like, I had - I confronted 4287 about it and then I was like, “You need to go find them.” And, like, we talked 4288 about it for a little while and then I was just like - I don’t remember exactly 4289 how it went but something along the lines where I was like, “Why can’t you 4290 just be honest with me?” I was like, “Stop lying to me. Like, stop lying.” 4291 4292 Q: Did - did you have an inclination - you’ve talked to this man a lot. And during 4293 this Tuesday, Wednesday conversation, did you feel like he was bullshittin’ 4294 you? Uh... 4295 4296 A: A little bit kind of, yeah. I mean, because he was like - not Monday. Monday, 4297 I did not. But Tuesday, yeah. That’s when it all started to click. I was like, 4298 “Oh my goodness,” because he was like, “Well” - like, he just didn’t seem as, 4299 like, concerned as he should be and he was, like, super worried about shit with 4300 us. And I’m just like... 4301 4302 Q: So concerned about his family and overly concerned about your relationship? 4303 4304 A: Yes. 4305 4306 Q: ‘Kay. 4307 4308 A: And I kept, like, tryin’ to put it on the back burner. And shame on me for 4309 bringing it up in the first place. I was just really taken back. Like, “Wait a 4310 minute. She’s 15 weeks. Like, how would you not notice that?” Like, I was 4311 just, like - I was confused. And I was also like, “Is he lyin’ to me?” And I 4312 kinda wanted to know because I realized that, like, there’s a situation at hand 4313 here and I’m just like, “What is going on?” You know? And for part of it, it 4314 wasn’t even, like, me trying to find out ‘cause I’m upset. It was almost, like, 4315 me tryin’ to find out ‘cause I’m like, “Is there something else I’m missing 4316 here?” Like, I felt like there was, like, pieces to this puzzle that I didn’t know 4317 existed that were, like, not in place and it was strange. And so, um, anyways I 4318 told him, I was like, “Be honest with me.” I was like, “Don’t lie.” And I don’t 4319 remember exactly how it went but I was, like, tryin’ to emphasize, like, “Stop 4320 bullshittin’ me.” So he told me the truth. And he told me it was his and then 4321 he knew about it. 4322 4323 Q: ‘Kay. 4324 4325 A: I was like, “Okay.” And then he asked me again, like, “Did that ruin 4326 everything?” And I was like, “No, it didn’t.” And in the back of my head, it’s 4327 like, “Yeah, I’m done. I’m not dealin’ with that. Don’t lie to me.” But his 4328 situation is so critical right now that it’s like, I’m not gonna, like, ruffle his 4329 mental feathers because they’re already, like, really ruffled because of the 4330 situation. So, like, out of respect for his mental health, I just, like, dropped it. 4331 And I just kept telling him, like, “We’re okay. We’re okay. We’re okay.” But 4332 then I, uh... 4333 4334 Q: How many times do you think he asked you during these phone calls... 4335 4336 A: Oh it wasn’t a phone call. This was text. 4337 4338 Q: Pardon me. 4339 4340 A: Text Tues... 4341 4342 Q: Text... 4343 4344 A: Text Tuesday. 4345 4346 Q: Text Tuesday. How many times did you think he brought up your relationship 4347 and if you guys were okay? 4348 4349 A: Probably, like, two or three times. 4350 4351 Q: And how many times did he bring up concern for his children or his wife? 4352 4353 A: I think he brought it up a lot, too. I mean, he kept tellin’ me that he was, like, 4354 worried about them. 4355 4356 Q: Okay. 4357 4358 A: I mean, it happened. It wasn’t like he was just, like, spaced out. I mean, he 4359 was definitely showing that, too. I was just surprised that he was, like, also 4360 showing it for me. ‘Cause at that moment, if I had some crazy stuff goin’ on 4361 with somebody in my family, I would be putting all my relationship stuff on 4362 hold like, “Look, like, baby, I gotta deal with this. Someone in my family’s 4363 missing. When I find them, we will talk.” And that would just be it. But that’s 4364 just me. I mean, that’s how I would address the situation. And that’s kinda 4365 how I’ve been, like, gauging how I handled Monday, Tuesday and Wednesday 4366 as, like, “What would I have done?” 4367 4368 Q: Sure. 4369 4370 A: You know? And - and kind of, like, that’s why I didn’t contact you guys on 4371 Monday, because I probably wouldn’t have done that for one of my friends. 4372 And not that I’m coldhearted, it’s just, like - it’s just - uh - uh, that’s just not 4373 how me and my friends work. So it didn’t - you know, so anyways... 4374 4375 Q: There was a - there was extenuating circumstances that you wouldn’t have 4376 known that caused her friends to be concerned. 4377 4378 A: Mm-hm. 4379 4380 Q: Just so you know. I- there’s nothing wrong with you for not goin’, “Oh 4381 something’s wrong,” and not callin’ the police. The people that provided the 4382 information to the police initially had way more information about her than 4383 you do. So that’s why they came forward. So I can see a - I can feel a little 4384 reservation that you’re like, “Why didn’t I do something? Why didn’t” - you 4385 didn’t know enough. I think a normal person on Monday - a reasonable person 4386 is just goin’, “Shit, this woman’s in a w- whacked out relationship with her 4387 husband, she’s got two kids. Now she’s pregnant. She just takes off.” So don’t 4388 blame yourself for not making a phone call to the law enforcement or goin’ to 4389 the poli- you didn’t know anything. So I’m just tryin’ to help you get past that. 4390 Don’t worry about it. 4391 4392 A: Okay. 4393 4394 Q: It’s - it’s not - the - the people that came to us had way more info than you did 4395 regarding what was happening with her life. 4396 4397 A: Okay. 4398 4399 Q: Okay? So... 4400 4401 A: So - thank you. 4402 4403 Q: Don’t get - don’t - don’t blame your- beat yourself up over that. Please don’t. 4404 4405 A: Okay. 4406 4407 Q: Okay? 4408 4409 A: And then, uh, so Tuesday after that conversation, I told him - I was like - I 4410 told him to delete his texts ‘cause I knew he was, like, going crazy texting me. 4411 And I didn’t want any of his friends to see him texting me because they didn’t 4412 - I don’t think they knew about me. It had nothin’ to do with you guys. It was 4413 just, like - I mean, and you’ll see ‘em, you know? But it was... 4414 4415 Q: The secrecy of your relationship. 4416 4417 A: Pretty much. And I - I just, like, feel like he was, like, texting me so much 4418 openly and he had friends there that I was like - I didn’t want them to see that. 4419 And so I was, like, tryin’ to get him to slow down. And then I told him, too, 4420 like, um, after he lied to me, I was just kinda like - I was done. And I was 4421 tryin’ to find a way to, like, get away from the situation without alarming him 4422 or panicking him. So I told him, like, “Everything is all good. I’m still here for 4423 you.” And I feel bad ‘cause, like, I lied to him but I mean, I, like, just tried to 4424 keep him calm and then I told him, like, “Contact me once they find your 4425 family. And then we’ll talk.” 4426 4427 Q: That was Tuesday? 4428 4429 A: That was Tuesday. 4430 4431 Q: Okay. 4432 4433 A: And he sent me a text back saying something along the lines of, like - what 4434 did he say? Something like, “Please just think of - of” - oh and, like, I kept 4435 tellin’ him I was scared. I was really frickin’ scared. In fact, that’s another 4436 thing I’m missing. I’m so tired. Monday night, like, I called him back in the 4437 middle of the night. ‘Cause I could not sleep. I could not sleep at all. And I 4438 remember when I called him, he sounded like he was sleeping. And I was like, 4439 “How the hell can you sleep right now?” I think that’s exactly what I said to 4440 him. And he was just like, “I’m just kinda dozin’ off and on on the couch.” 4441 And I just remember thinkin’, like, “I haven’t shut my eyes yet and this is not 4442 even my family.” And so that happened on Monday night. Um, so then I was 4443 going somewhere with that that had to do with Tuesday and I forgot what it 4444 was. I’m so sorry. 4445 4446 Q: Take - take a breath and relax. 4447 4448 A: Um... 4449 4450 Q: We’re - we’re almost to Wednesday and then we’re out of here. 4451 4452 A: Yeah. So then, um - yeah, so then once he - he lied to me, I just really tryin’ 4453 to, like, push him away and he was like, “Just don’t forget, like, the person 4454 that you knew me to be when you were with me,” or something like that. And, 4455 like, it was almost... 4456 4457 Q: That’s - was that strange? 4458 4459 A: It just kinda sounded almost like a farewell. And, like, I didn’t think it was too 4460 weird because I was like, “I think he realizes that I’m up- really upset that he 4461 lied to me and I think he’s aware of the fact that I’m probably about to walk 4462 away from him.” So I think that was, like, his way of, like, saying goodbye. 4463 So it didn’t really seem strange in the context of what was going on between, 4464 like, the him and I part of stuff. And then, um - and I kept asking him, too, 4465 like, “What did you do, Chris? What did you do?” And he was like, “I didn’t 4466 do anything.” And I’m like, “Where’s your family?” And, like, I asked him 4467 that. I don’t know if I started doing that on Tuesday or if I started doing that 4468 on Monday. But I definitely - I think it was Tuesday. ‘Cause I don’t really 4469 think I was that alarmed on Monday. And then, um - uh, so that was supposed 4470 to be, like, our final sign-off text. And then (Jim) got there at my house and I 4471 was hanging out with (Jim). But I was still, like, in my head, just kinda, like, 4472 stressed out. And I remember I, like, walked to the room, went in my bedroom 4473 and texted Chris one more time and I told him, I was like, “If you did 4474 something bad,” I was like, “you’re gonna ruin your life.” And I was like, 4475 “And if you did something bad,” I was like, “you’re gonna ruin my life.” I 4476 was like, “And I promise you that.” And he responded back to me and he’s 4477 like, “I didn’t hurt my family, (Nicki).” And that was, like, the last text. That 4478 was the last time we ever talked. And I never said another word to him after 4479 that. 4480 4481 Q: That was Tuesday? 4482 4483 A: That was Tuesday. And then he left me alone. He gave me the space that I 4484 asked him. He respected it. And he didn’t, like, mess with me at all. 4485 4486 Q: Was that a phone call where you said it? F... 4487 4488 A: No, that’s all Tuesday - text Tuesday. 4489 4490 Q: Text Tuesday. 4491 4492 A: Just call it text Tuesday. 4493 4494 Q: All texts. Okay. 4495 4496 A: Everything was texts. I did not talk to that man on the phone at all that day. I 4497 mean, I don’t think so. I’m pretty sure it was all texts. 4498 4499 Q: ‘Kay. 4501 A: Um, and then, uh... 4502 4503 Q: So at that time in your mind, if you said that, what - what are you thinking? 4504 What - were you thinking that he maybe did something to his family? 4505 4506 A: Yeah. I started gettin’ really scared. 4507 4508 Q: What - what caused that thought? 4509 4510 A: The fact that he lied to me. 4511 4512 Q: Okay. 4513 4514 A: And that she still wasn’t home and it was day two. I figure if you’re upset for 4515 a day, you leave for a day but you come back. And she wasn’t back. And it 4516 was, like, midday. And not only that but, like, she doesn’t have her phone, she 4517 doesn’t have her - her car, she doesn’t have the kids’ EpiPen. She doesn’t 4518 have any of that. So what I’m thinkin’ in my head is like, “For a night, if 4519 you’re really upset, somebody comes, pick - one of your friends picks you up, 4520 like, okay.” But I can’t explain that for two days. Like, that just doesn’t, like, 4521 logically process in my mind as something that any woman I know would do. 4522 The one-night thing, I know women that would do that. But the two-night 4523 thing, no. And so I’m like, “She’s still not back and he just lied to me. And it 4524 made me - like, I just started getting scared. And I remember, like, telling him 4525 that throughout the whole day. Like, I - I don’t even know how many times I 4526 texted him that. I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s, like, eight, ten times. I’m just 4527 like, “I’m scared. I’m scared. I’m scared.” And one of the last texts that I sent 4528 to him, too, I told him - I said, “I’m scared because I feel like I don’t know 4529 who you are anymore.” And I s... 4530 4531 Q: And his response to that? 4532 4533 A: I don’t even remember to be honest with you. I think that was, like, in that, 4534 like, sign-off text that I sent to him. 4535 4536 Q: Okay. 4537 4538 A: Um, but I mean, I was. I was, like, kinda scared. I was - what I was really 4539 scared for was scared for his family’s wellbeing because, like, I don’t know 4540 where these people are at this point and it’s scary. I mean, it’s scary that she’s 4541 gone but it’s even more scary to me that these little girls are gone. Like, that 4542 was the part that really freaked me out. Like, if it was just her, I’d be like, 4543 “Well maybe she took off with somebody. Maybe she didn’t. I mean, I don’t 4544 know because she’s a grown woman and she can make those choices.” But 4545 if...

TIMDAD16AUGROOM 3916 when one of my friends is gone, I’m, like, “Oh my god. They got murdered. 3917 We should address this. Like, I haven’t heard from them for four hours.” 3918 3919 Q: It’s not a typical thought when somebody... 3920 3921 A: No. 3922 3923 Q: ...just checks out for a day. 3924 3925 A: No. So it got late at night and, like, I remember telling him - I was, like - he’s, 3926 like, “I think she’ll be back tomorrow.” And he was gonna go into work. And 3927 I told him not to. I was, like, “You need to stay home and you need to help the 3928 cops.” I’m like, “And you need to wait for her to come back.” And he’s, like, 3929 tellin’ me, like, “Well, what if, like, she comes back and she sees my truck?” 3930 And I was, like, “You know what I would do?” I was, like, “I would ask one 3931 of your good friends who’s off of work tomorrow, to come over to this house 3932 and hang out with you while you’re here.” I was, like, “And go park your 3933 truck down the street.” I was, like, “So she’s upset at you and she wants to 3934 come back.” I was, like, “But she doesn’t want to be here if you’re here, 3935 maybe?” I was, like, “If she comes back,” I was, like, “and she doesn’t see 3936 your truck, maybe she’d be more willing to come in the house.” I’m like, 3937 “You know?” I’m like, “But don’t be alone with her.” I was, like, “Because if 3938 she’s upset enough to leave,” I was, like, “you don’t know what kinda 3939 confrontation you’re gonna have when you get back in the house.” And I was, 3940 like, “So that’s why you should have a friend there. So that you’re not alone 3941 with her.” And I was, like, “And if, for some reason, you are alone with her,” I 3942 told him - I was, like - I really thought she just left. I did. I was, like, “Get 3943 your phone, put it on video, and put it in your pocket.” And I was, like, “And 3944 just zip it up.” And he’s, like, “Why?” And I told him. I was, like, “‘Cause 3945 you can voice record.” I was, like, “So if she comes home,” I was, like, “and 3946 you two are still, like, you know - if there’s some choice words being said 3947 because you guys obviously got into, like, something that’s, you know...” 3948 3949 ((Crosstalk)) 3950 3951 Q: Did he ever articulate what their argument was? 3952 3953 ((Crosstalk)) 3954 3955 A: He did, and I will get there, but you know, I told him, like, “Just be prepared.” 3956 You know, ‘cause at this point, like, it wasn’t, like, I was, like, tryin’ to make 3957 her to be a bad person. It was just, like, I didn’t know what was going on. I 3958 assumed that she had left, so I was, like, “Well, when you get back,” because I 3959 knew that they were going through a divorce. It was, like, “Just cover your 3960 bases. You know, try not to be alone. And if you are, just record what you 3961 guys are talking about. So like, at the end of the day, like, nothing bad 3962 happens to you, you know?” And, like, that was kinda how I processed that 3963 whole situation. And so, um, he was, like, “All right.” And then, uh, she didn’t 3964 come home that night. That was Monday night, right? Yes. 3965 3966 Q: We’re talkin’ about Monday. 3967 3968 A: Monday? Monday night. Yes. Um, and he told me, um, what he - this is what 3969 he told me they talked about, and I realize that this was, like, total bullshit. 3970 And I think he’s telling you guys a different story. And I think the reason that 3971 he’s telling me what he’s telling - I think the story he’s telling you is probably 3972 slightly more accurate than the one he told me on this case, and the reason is 3973 because I think he was tryin’ to save his ass with the fact that she’s pregnant. 3974 So he told me, um, that they - that she had asked him to wake her up before he 3975 left for work on Monday morning. And so I don’t know if she did that in a text 3976 or how it was supposedly communicated. Um, but he said that he went to get 3977 her up - which I also found weird. ‘Cause, like, she’s still sleepin’ when he 3978 leaves. ‘Cause he - she gets up with the kids, and they get up shortly after that 3979 but, like, it’s just him in the mornings, you know? And so she w- he 3980 supposedly - he said that she woke up and those two kinda just, like, got in a 3981 disagreement, and I don’t know what all was said, but he was, like, “She was 3982 bein’ pretty mean.” And then he said, uh, “She told me that she’s pregnant, 3983 and she told me that the kid is not mine.” That is what he told me. 3984 3985 Q: So he - “She’s pregnant, the kid’s not mine...” 3986 3987 A: And that she s... 3988 3989 Q: Like, he’s playin’ he didn’t know she was pregnant? 3990 3991 A: Yep. 3992 3993 Q: Until that morning? 3994 3995 A: Yep. 3996 3997 Q: And that it’s not i- she had an affair with somebody else. 3998 3999 A: Yes. And this is before I knew she was 15 weeks pregnant. 4000 4001 Q: Okay. 4002 4003 A: Like, all the stuff on Monday that I read i- from my recollection - ‘cause I 4004 didn’t find out she was pregnant ‘til Tuesday. So anything that got posted on 4005 Monday did not emphasize the fact that she, like, had a baby on board. Um, so 4006 then, um... 4007 4008 Q: Let me ask you somethin’. You said that he usually s- gets up in the morning 4009 and just it’s him and she gets up and takes care of the kids. Is that the routine 4010 that you know for them? Um, or do you know him to get up and, like, prepare 4011 meals prior to him leaving the home? 4012 4013 A: Oh, he gets up and he, like, goes to the gym and he, I mean, works on his 4014 basement. 4015 4016 Q: Uh, what - okay. 4017 4018 A: And, like, makes breakfast. And I don’t know his whole routine. 4019 4020 Q: Does he make breakfast for himself or does he make breakfast for his 4021 children? 4022 4023 A: D- I don’t know. I think - I don’t know. They’re still sleeping at that point. 4024 Like, all I know is he, at one point in some time in this whole thing, he told 4025 me that they usually get up at, like, 6:30 and she gets - she gets them ready 4026 and takes them to school and, like, does all the morning stuff with them, as far 4027 as I know. And then in the afternoons, when he gets home from work, he 4028 kinda does more of the afternoon stuff. 4029 4030 Q: Okay. 4031 4032 A: So it’s kinda, like, a tag-team operation that they have going on, but I think 4033 she does more in the AM and he does more in the PM. 4034 4035 Q: Right. 4036 4037 A: Is kind of how I process that, but I don’t know. 4038 4039 Q: Okay. 4040 4041 A: Um... 4042 4043 Q: So then she’s mean to him and then throws this out? 4044 4045 A: Yes. 4046 4047 Q: That she’s pregnant from another man? 4048 4049 A: And I said, “Do you believe her?” And he was just, like - he said somethin’ 4050 about, like, “Oh, yeah. Like, she’s - she kinda looked like she was showing 4051 when we were in North Carolina, but I wasn’t sure.” And I’m like, “So you 4052 think she’s pregnant?” And he’s, like, “Yeah.” And I was, like, “Do you think 4053 she’s, like, having an affair?” And he’s, like, “I think she said that out of 4054 spite.” And he’s, like - and I was, like, “Okay.” And then - and, again, like, I 4055 think he’s just saying all this to me to try to cover his tracks with me. Like, I 4056 think w- I don’t know what he told you guys, but I bet it’s probably very 4057 different, and I think that what he said to me - it - it was, like, directed towards 4058 me. Like, this whole bullshit little box lie that he had right there was, like, the 4059 lie directed at me - at me. 4060 4061 Q: Did he say when the arguments started? 4062 4063 A: Nope. 4064 4065 Q: Um... 4066 4067 A: He just said it was in the morning. 4068 4069 Q: Did he say i- did... 4070 4071 A: He said he woke her up in the morning. 4072 4073 Q: Okay. Did he say when she came home? Did he ever let you know that? 4074 4075 A: Uh, I think he w- I want to say he said around, like, 2:00, but I don’t know. 4076 4077 Q: Okay. 4078 4079 A: Um... 4080 4081 Q: And then he woke her for what purpose? 4082 4083 A: ‘Cause she asked him to. 4084 4085 Q: Okay. 4086 4087 A: So I was under the impression that he was asleep. I’m assuming this is how it, 4088 like, went and what he was tryin’ to tell me. Is that he was asleep by the time 4089 she got home, and she sent him a text and said, “Wake me up before you 4090 leave.” And then he woke her up and they got in an argument, and then he 4091 went to work. 4092 4093 Q: Okay. 4094 4095 A: That is how I processed it. 4096 4097 Q: And the context of that argument, again, was just the she’s pregnant and is 4098 there anything else that he shared with you? 4099 4100 A: He did not elaborate on it, and I didn’t ask. I didn’t ask. 4101 4102 Q: W- what were you thinkin’ at that time? 4103 4104 A: Uh, this was, like, on Monday. I don’t - I mean, I - again, at that point, I was, 4105 like - I still thought she left. I mean, this was all on Monday. Like, I 4106 legitimately thought this woman left the premises with her kids and just 4107 wanted nothin’ to do with him for, like, 24 hours. 4108 4109 Q: So his story was believable? That she was pregnant from another man and 4110 maybe she took off for that guy or... 4111 4112 A: I - he - he - I mean, he said several times, like, “I think she just said that out of 4113 spite.” 4114 4115 Q: Okay. 4116 4117 A: Like, he thought she was with one of her friends. 4118 4119 Q: So he sto- held true to that story? Uh, she’s... 4120 4121 A: Pretty much. 4122 4123 Q: She’s just leavin’, and she’s with a friend? 4124 4125 A: That was kinda what he thought. And that’s kinda what he had me believing. 4126 And, at the time, I wasn’t really alarmed, because it’d been, like, a half a day. 4127 4128 Q: Sure. 4129 4130 A: Um, and so then Tuesday rolled around, and... 4131 4132 Q: Did you see him at all on Monday? You said you didn’t. I... 4133 4134 A: No. 4135 4136 Q: Right. Or... 4137 4138 A: I did not see him? 4139 4140 Q: Okay. 4141 4142 A: And I went to work Monday and Tuesday. 4143 4144 Q: Did he ever try to convince you to come see him? Or say he wanted to come 4145 to your house? 4146 4147 A: No, not at all. We were supposed to go look - pick out apartments to go look 4148 at on Wednesday - so yesterday. Um, but, uh, that obviously... 4149 4150 Q: Right. 4151 4152 A: ...didn’t work. 4153 4154 Q: So on Monday you never - he never tried to be convincing to get you to come 4155 up to see him? 4156 4157 A: No, no, no, no, no, no. 4158 4159 Q: Nothin’? 4160 4161 A: Not - not that I’m aware of. I don’t think so, because he - I had - my buddy, 4162 (Jim), was over Monday and Tuesday, and he knew (Jim) was over Monday 4163 and Tuesday. And that’s why we were gonna hang out on Wednesday. 4164 4165 Q: Okay. 4166 4167 A: Um, so no. He didn’t ask me. Um, so Tuesday rolled around, and she still 4168 wasn’t around. And this is when I started gettin’ kinda sick. Like, my friend, 4169 (Jim) was sick on Monday when he came up and I don’t know. I just started 4170 feelin’ like crap as it was. And then, um, I was just kinda havin’ a hard time 4171 focusing and, like, thinking about what was going on. ‘Cause - and I’d asked 4172 him a few times. I’m like, “Where’s your family, Chris? Like, where’s your 4173 family?” You know? And he would tell me, like, “I don’t know.” Or, “I want 4174 them home.” Like, I - it - it - I asked, like, several times. So I think I got 4175 different responses, but each time, like, he didn’t know where they were. You 4176 know? And I’m like, “She’s still not home?” And he’s, like, “No.” And - oh, 4177 and I had also asked him to, like, um - he said he had a friend, (Dave), named 4178 - that was a cop. Which I also find convenient that there’s another (Dave) 4179 working this case, who’s a cop. Um, but he would - I was, like, “Well, 4180 (Dave)’s off. Why don’t you just have him, like, post up outside your house, 4181 too, and see if she shows up?” You know? And he told me on Tuesday 4182 morning - he was, like, “I called (Dave) and asked him to sit outside my 4183 house, and he’s gonna do it.” And he’s, like, “And then my friend, (Nick), is 4184 coming over later on this afternoon.” And I was, like, “Okay.” 4186 Q: Did you ever hear (Nick)’s name before? 4187 4188 A: I’ve actually heard that name a few times. Like... 4189 4190 Q: Okay. 4191 4192 A: ...around him. Like, there’s certain - I never heard “(Dave)” before. (Dave) 4193 was new. But I’ve heard the name (Nick) a lot, so I don’t know if that’s, like, 4194 real or what, but if I was to guess, like, friends that he, like, legitimately has, I 4195 would assume that he was one of them. Um, but yeah. Because I know he’s 4196 told me before, like, when we first started hanging out, that (Nick) lived kind 4197 of in the area and he’s, like, um - he’s, like, “He actually goes” - he’s a trail 4198 runner. And he’s, like, “He runs at East Lake #3.” 4199 4200 ((Crosstalk)) 4201 4202 Q: ...in your area? 4203 4204 A: Kind of. 4205 4206 Q: Okay. 4207 4208 A: And I remember him saying that to me once. He’s, like, “You know that park 4209 that we, like, hung out at?” I was, like, “Yeah.” He’s, like, “My buddy runs 4210 over there. We should not go to that park anymore.” And I was, like, “Okay. 4211 Um, that’s cool.” And, uh, anyways, where were we at? 4212 4213 Q: Tuesday morning. 4214 4215 A: Tuesday morning. 4216 4217 Q: We’re almost done. 4218 4219 A: I know. I’m just - I’m just - I’m tryin’ to just keep it all together here for you 4220 guys. Um, Tuesday morning. Oh, so he said (Dave) was gonna stay outside of 4221 his house and (Nick) was gonna come over that afternoon. I was, like, “All 4222 right.” And then, um, I don’t - I think most of the texting throughout that day 4223 was kinda, like, “Have you heard anything? Like, what’s going on?” It was 4224 kinda, like, me checking up on him. Um, and I don’t remember everything, 4225 but it wasn’t a - a - I didn’t even make it through the entire work day. Like, I 4226 was feeling really, really sick. Um, like, in general. And then I decided on my 4227 lunch break to get on the internet and look at what was going on with all the 4228 reports. And I saw a report that was, like, this woman who’s 15 weeks 4229 pregnant and her two daughters are missing. And I was, like, “Whoa. What?” 4230 And I was just, like, so floored and I read a couple other articles, just to make 4231 sure that - you know how the newspapers are. And, like, just double check. 4232 Like, am I really reading this right? And then I’m like, “Okay.” And sh- he 4233 had told me previously, like, “She says she’s pregnant with another man’s 4234 kid.” But he’d said, like, he could kinda tell in - in North Carolina. But that 4235 girl is, like, obviously pregnant. I mean, in her photos. I mean, 15 weeks. 4236 That’s, like, four months. That’s pretty far along. And so it’s - that’s, like, 4237 how would you not know if she’s showing? Like, you totally know she’s 4238 showing. And so oh my god, I got so sick. I was just, like, “I need to go.” I 4239 just, like, packed my stuff and I left work, and I went home and, uh - I 4240 remember I told (Jim) that I was gonna get home early. And he wanted to 4241 come over right away, and I was just, like - I just needed some time to, like, 4242 process what was going on. But I did tell him - I was, like, “You can come 4243 over earlier than you did yesterday.” ‘Cause he didn’t want to wait in traffic. 4244 That was the thing. He’s, like, “Save me some time.” So I don’t remember 4245 what time he got there. Um, I probably still have that text, ‘cause I don’t have 4246 any reason to delete those. Um, but he - so he came over a little early, but I 4247 did have, like, a gap of time in there. I don’t know how long it was. I bet it 4248 was, like, after I got - from the time I got home to the time (Jim) got there, I 4249 bet it was probably, like - I don’t know. Hour-and-a-half, maybe. Somewhere 4250 around there. Um, and, uh, I remember talking to Chris during this time, and it 4251 was, like, all text. I did not talk to him on the phone at all on Tuesday. And I 4252 was pretty upset, where I was just, like - you know, I was going back and 4253 forth. Like, “Where’s your family?” This and this and this. But I’m like, 4254 “She’s pregnant.” You know? And this and this - and he’s, like, “The baby’s 4255 not mine. The baby’s not mine.” And I’m just, like, “You told me yesterday 4256 that you think that when she said she cheated on you, she did it out of spite.” 4257 And he was, like, “Yeah.” And I’m like, “So then it’s your kid.” And he kept 4258 denying it. And then, like, he started, like, kinda worrying about us. He’d just 4259 be, like, “Well, does this ruin everything with us?” This and this and this. And 4260 I’m like, “No.” I’m like - and I’m, like, just trying to, like - his situation is so 4261 much more important right now than, like, our situation. 4262 4263 Q: But his main concern is you and him. 4264 4265 A: Kinda, sort of. I mean, and I keep, like, askin’ him. Like - I’m like - and I told 4266 him numerous times, which is also in the texts that you guys will pull - I’m 4267 just, like, “You need to focus on finding your kids and your wife right now.” 4268 And I was, like, “And you need to focus on finding all three of your kids.” 4269 And I, like, kept, like, emphasizing to him, like, he had three kids, you know? 4270 And, like, I wasn’t even, like mad about it. I was just like, “You need to find 4271 your family. You need to f-”... 4272 4273 Q: Did he ever go look for them that you know of? 4274 4275 A: Uh, I don’t know. I don’t think so. That, like, doesn’t even, like, ring a bell to

TIMDAD16AUGROOM 3601 ((Crosstalk)) 3602 3603 Q: And I’m not saying you have to... 3604 3605 ((Crosstalk)) 3606 3607 A: Just leave (Jim) alone. Just leave (Jim) alone. 3608 3609 ((Crosstalk)) 3610 3611 A: (Jim) does not need to be wrapped up in this. 3612 3613 Q: ...some point - if at some point I needed (Jim)’s info to - let’s say we couldn’t 3614 find your phone records. Would you tell... 3615 3616 ((Crosstalk)) 3617 3618 A: You can have them. I will give them to you. 3619 3620 Q: Would you tell me who (Jim) was if I couldn’t get them? 3621 3622 A: If you had to. 3623 3624 Q: Okay. 3625 3626 A: I don’t really want to involve him in this. 3627 3628 Q: Perfect. 3629 3630 A: That is not fair to him. That’s not - no. If I do not have to do that... 3631 3632 Q: That’s fine. 3633 3634 A: Um, yeah. So anyways, Chris was, like, “Call me.” 3635 3636 Q: And this is the 3:45 text? 3637 3638 A: Yeah. He sent me, like, a few. There were - I think there was three of them, 3639 and I don’t remember what the other one said. But something about, like, 3640 “Yeah, my family’s gone.” Or - I don’t remember verbatim, but “Call me 3641 when you can.” Or have - “Call me when you have a chance.” Something to 3642 that effect. And so when he told me, “Call me,” I was, like, kind of alerted. 3643 Where I was, like, “Okay. What’s goin’ on?” You know? Um, but first when 3644 he told me, like, his family was, like, not home, that didn’t really seem odd to 3645 me. That his family wasn’t home. It was really vague. I’m like, “Okay. Like, 3646 are they at the grocery store? Like, elaborate.” And so you know - and then 3647 but he says, “Call me,” like it’s, like, an emergency, but then just says that 3648 they’re not there. And so I am, like, really, like, floored by the - well, I’m not, 3649 like, floored but just kinda, like - he says, “Call me,” so I’m concerned, and 3650 then he’s really vague. So I’m like, “Maybe he just wants to talk to me.” I 3651 don’t know. I think it took me a little while to, like, really process the severity 3652 of the situation, just because this is not something that you expect to see every 3653 day. And the way that he talked to me made me believe that this is not what 3654 was goin’ on, at all. 3655 3656 Q: Okay. So you make a phone call to him and you guys have a conversation? 3657 3658 A: I did. I stepped outside. Um... 3659 3660 Q: This is 3:45? 3661 3662 A: Ish. I mean - well, like, I think I actually interacted with (Jim) for, like, 3663 probably a good 15 or 20 minutes. I mean, he’s my guest. He’s in the house. 3664 Um, so I don’t think I called him right away. But, like - I mean, I’m tryin’ to 3665 balance the fact that I have my friend here, and then Chris is saying that 3666 something needs to be addressed. But, to me, it didn’t sound like an 3667 emergency. I mean, it was all the time. Like, people aren’t home right now. 3668 You know? So it just - it wasn’t, like, “Oh my god. I have to take this call. It’s 3669 an emergency.” 3670 3671 Q: It didn’t register as being serious? 3672 3673 A: No. No. I mean, it just - it was the way he said it. And I was, like, “Okay.” So 3674 I, um - I remember hangin’ out with (Jim) for a while, and then I stepped 3675 outside, and I made a call, like, out on my back patio. And I called him. And 3676 he didn’t answer the phone. And then he texted me back? Oh, no. Did he 3677 answer the phone? I don’t remember. I think he missed my call, and then he 3678 called me back. Or he just answered. Either way, it was a very short talk to 3679 him where he was just, like, “I have to go. The cops are here.” And I don’t 3680 remember if he said that on the phone or over text. I don’t... 3681 3682 Q: That’s okay. 3683 3684 A: ...even - I’m so tired. 3685 3686 Q: That’s fine. You don’t need to... 3687 3688 ((Crosstalk)) 3689 3690 A: But either way, like, the cops... 3691 3692 Q: It’s - it’s the context. 3693 3694 A: Yeah. I mean, you guys’ll figure it out. “The cops - the cops are here.” And 3695 I’m just like, “All right.” And then I remember we were, like, in a - like, we 3696 were texting, but I was, like, hanging out with my company. So it wasn’t, like, 3697 a non-stop text. It was just kinda, like, I would check my phone every once in 3698 a while, and we would communicate with each other. And he was just saying, 3699 like, they weren’t there and that her friend, Nicky, was there. And that her 3700 friend, Nicky, had called the cops. And I’m like, “Why would this girl call the 3701 cops?” And I’m like - I honestly do not remember the order of operations on 3702 all of this, but I’m pretty sure the majority of our conversation that night, until 3703 my friend, (Jim), left the house - which was probably pretty late. I don’t even 3704 know what time. Like, 9:00 or 10:00 - was all via text. So you should have 3705 this via text. 3706 3707 Q: Okay. 3708 3709 A: Like, I don’t think we started talking again on the phone until, like, after my 3710 company left. Um, and he was, like, uh - I don’t know. He just started, like, 3711 giving me details about stuff, and I don’t remember what order. But he was 3712 sayin’, like, Nicky was really upset, and that the cops were there, and that they 3713 were, like, searchin’ the house. And I was just, like, “What?” You know, like, 3714 “What? Why?” And he was tellin’ me that, um, they had, like, had a 3715 disagreement or something like that and then, um, he told me, like, she was 3716 gonna go to a friend’s house. And I was, like, “Okay. Well, maybe she left. 3717 You know, maybe she just, like, went to her friend’s.” And then I think he - I 3718 don’t remember, but I think he was the one that told me that her cell phone 3719 and her purse were still there. I think he told me that. 3720 3721 Q: He told you her cell phone... 3722 3723 A: I’m... 3724 3725 Q: ...and purse were still there? 3726 3727 A: I think he did. I don’t remember. 3728 3729 ((Crosstalk)) 3730 3731 Q: What’s the significance of that, in your mind, at that time? 3732 3733 A: At that point, I thought this woman was really tryin’ to get out of this house. 3734 3735 Q: Okay. 3736 3737 A: That’s what I thought. ‘Cause he said that they’d had a disagreement, and I 3738 was just, like, “Okay. Well” - I mean, I leave my cell phone at home, 3739 sometimes. 3740 3741 Q: But he - he said disagreement. What - did he tell you what it was about or... 3742 3743 A: Not at that point. Not at that point. 3744 3745 Q: Okay. 3746 3747 A: So, um, again, like, you guys are gonna have to check these texts, ‘cause it’s 3748 all, like - I don’t know. My brain’s... 3749 3750 ((Crosstalk)) 3751 3752 Q: That’s okay. 3753 3754 A: ...mashed potato right now. Um, but I remember him sayin’ that and I’m just 3755 thinkin’, like, “Well, maybe she was in a rush, you know? Like, maybe she 3756 was just, like, ‘I’m goin’ to my friend’s. I’m leavin’ my cell phone here 3757 because I don’t want you callin’ me. I don’t want anyone else callin’ me.’” I 3758 mean, there are days where, like, when I’m outside of work, I will just shut 3759 my phone off. I just do it and it’s, like, my way of getting peace. So to me, 3760 that - I mean, like, it was weird that she - w- it wasn’t even that weird to me 3761 that she left her phone, just because I leave my phone. But it was weird to me 3762 that she left her purse. But knowing the fact that that girl was, like, always on 3763 her phone, then yeah. I guess it is kinda odd. 3764 3765 Q: Like, she lived on her phone, I think. 3766 3767 A: Uh, yeah. 3768 3769 Q: Pretty much is my understanding of her and a phone. So... 3770 3771 A: Yeah. 3772 3773 Q: ...I don’t know if you knew that... 3774 3775 A: I did. 3776 3777 Q: ...until prior to the media stuff or just from Chris. 3778 3779 A: I did. 3781 Q: So did that - so did that strike you as odd? But if you were thinking... 3782 3783 A: Kind of. I mean, agai... 3784 3785 Q: ...maybe she just left? 3786 3787 A: I just thought she needed to, like, get away from the situation. I mean, I - that 3788 didn’t seem that awkward to me, that a couple that is going through a 3789 separation would be, like, “We’re - I need to leave.” 3790 3791 Q: Mm-hm. 3792 3793 A: “I just need some space.” Like, it didn’t even, like, process. I was, like, 3794 “Okay. Like, give her some space.” You know? And, um, on that note, too, 3795 um, when he was in - we’re gonna jump back for just a second. 3796 3797 Q: That’s okay. 3798 3799 A: I had a thought. So when, uh, he was comin’ back from North Carolina, that 3800 was when he officially told me, “We’re gonna get a divorce and we’re gonna 3801 put the house up for sale.” Like, he told me they were separating and they 3802 were, like, gonna put the house up for sale, but they hadn’t done it yet. And 3803 then, when he got back from North Carolina, that was when he was, like, it 3804 was, like, a sealed deal. 3805 3806 Q: Okay. 3807 3808 A: Um, and the reason that is of significance is because at some point over the 3809 weekend - I don’t remember when - he told me that they were putting the 3810 house up. I - I don’t know if it was they were putting it up on Monday. Like, 3811 the day they went missing. Or if it was that they were calling the realtor to 3812 verify some stuff so they could put it up that week. Like, I don’t - I don’t quite 3813 remember. I just remember, like, the house was supposed to be, like, on the 3814 market, like, that week. 3815 3816 Q: Did he name a realtor ever? 3817 3818 A: Yeah, he did, and I don’t remember her name. It was a female. 3819 3820 Q: Okay. 3821 3822 A: And I don’t remember her name. 3823 3824 Q: That’s fine. 3826 A: Like, at all. I was tryin’ to think of that for you guys not too long ago. 3827 3828 A1: Is it a company? Do you got the company name? 3829 3830 A: No. He never gave me that. He, like, gave me her name and he’s - it was the 3831 same name twice. He gave it to me once when he was in North Carolina, and 3832 then once - the other time - ‘cause I remember askin’. I was, like, “Who’s 3833 that?” ‘Cause he was, like - he’s, like, “I’m gonna have to have her call so- 3834 and-so today and make sure everything’s still good to go.” I was, like, “Who’s 3835 that?” He’s, like, “The realtor.” I was, like, “Oh.” Or not today but, like, 3836 Monday. 3837 3838 Q: If it ever comes to your mind, just... 3839 3840 A: Yeah. I doubt it. 3841 3842 ((Crosstalk)) 3843 3844 A: That was such a... 3845 3846 Q: Yeah. 3847 3848 A: I will try. I don’t... 3849 3850 Q: Lots of names. 3851 3852 A: ...remember what it was. 3853 3854 Q: That’s fine. It’s not that critical. Um, that person may come forward to us 3855 anyways, um - uh, perhaps. So... 3856 3857 A: Okay. 3858 3859 Q: ...don’t worry about it. Let’s go back to the phone calls on Monday afternoon. 3860 3861 A: Yeah. So, um - so he’s, like, texting me a lot of this information, and I’m 3862 startin’ to kinda freak out. And it’s not like I’m freaked out, like, “Oh, she got 3863 murdered.” I mean, that is not what I thought. It’s, like, “Okay.” Like, the way 3864 I looked at this, like, apparently his wife had been gone since mid-day. Well, 3865 was when she got, like, reported missing. I didn’t know that. Like, he’s - the 3866 way I looked at this, it was, “I got home from work just now.” I mean, he 3867 didn’t say that, but I interpreted, “I just got home from work, and my family is 3868 not here.” 3869 3870 Q: Okay. 3871 3872 A: So when we’re texting for, like, a few hours - like, the cop thing was kinda 3873 weird but he’s, like, Nicky insisted they call the cops. Nicky insisted they call 3874 the cops. And I’m like, “Okay.” You know? And I’m just tryin’ to figure out, 3875 “Well, like, what role does this woman play in this situation? Like, is she...” 3876 3877 Q: Did you know who she was? 3878 3879 A: No. I don’t know any of his people. Um, like, this has been pretty, like, tight 3880 wrapped for a while, which is probably a really good thing. Um, but anyways, 3881 um, I didn’t know, like, who she was. And so, um, like, I started askin’ him. I 3882 was, like, “Well, where do you think your wife is at?” And he’s, like - he’s, 3883 like, “I think she’ll be back tonight. Like, I think she’s, like, out with 3884 somebody.” And he was tellin’ me that they had had a disagreement. So I was, 3885 like, “Well” - I remember s- telling him - I was, like, “You should make sure 3886 that you have a f-” oh, um, wait a minute. No, no, no. So all that happened, 3887 and then it starts gettin’ kinda late out. And I remember we talked for text for 3888 a while and part of this conversation. Then it moved to the phone. Um, and I 3889 remember tellin’ him - ‘cause he was, like, “I think she’ll just be back 3890 tomorrow. I think she’s just gonna be gone for the night, like, with a friend.” 3891 You know? And I... 3892 3893 Q: Did he name the friend? 3894 3895 A: No. He didn’t. And, like, I - well, and ‘cause I - I don’t think - he made it 3896 sound like he didn’t know, like, what friend’s house she would be at. And I 3897 remember talkin’ to him and I was, like, “Well, maybe it’s that Nicky girl.” 3898 And he’s, like, “Well, Nicky called the cops. So why would she be at Nicky’s 3899 house?” I’m like, “I don’t know. Kinda throws her off the trail of where she’s 3900 at, you know?” And it’s, like - it sounds kinda weird but it’s, like, I - he really 3901 made this sound like this woman was just, like, upset, left the house, and that 3902 was probably what he thought happened to her. And so I - I didn’t really put 3903 too much, like... 3904 3905 Q: Did he tell you the kids were missing, as well, with her? 3906 3907 A: Yes. I knew... 3908 3909 Q: Okay. 3910 3911 A: I mean, which made sense to me, ‘cause I was, like, “Well, if you were at 3912 work all day.” I mean, he didn’t tell me he got home early. He didn’t say that 3913 to me. So I mean, it made sense. Like, if she’s gonna leave, they should 3914 probably go with her. Um, and - and so, uh, I don’t know. I wish - I feel like I 3915 wish I should’ve, like, processed all of this earlier, but I just don’t feel like,

TIMDAD16AUGROOM 3421 A: Yeah. And then he goes - and so like, they’re only in the office for the 3422 morning. Like... 3423 3424 Q: Right. 3425 3426 A: ...some days it’s longer than others, but I would say by a maximum of 7:30, 3427 every single morning, they are all gone. And they don’t come back unless they 3428 have, like, a meeting or something that they have to attend. So like, not seeing 3429 him for the rest of the day is not, like, an un-normal thing. 3430 3431 Q: Okay. 3432 3433 A: Like - but, like, I’m saying, like, we don’t really - the only reason we interact 3434 was kind of, like, by an off-chance thing. Like, I don’t work with him. 3435 3436 Q: Mm-hm. 3437 3438 A: Um, so he, uh - yeah. We talked, like, randomly throughout the day, but it was 3439 really sporadic, and he seemed pretty busy. So we didn’t talk too much. Like I 3440 said, didn’t put too much thought into it. It happens all the time. Um, waited 3441 ‘til about 3:45, then sent that text to me. And, yes, he does know that I will be 3442 home at that point, or getting home. Like... 3443 3444 Q: Did you give (Mark) (Jim)’s information? 3445 3446 A: No. I would really, like, not like to involve him in this. 3447 3448 Q: Okay. 3449 3450 A: He does not know about this. He didn’t - and he was not - like, he doesn’t 3451 know any of this is occurring. 3452 3453 Q: Okay. 3454 3455 A: Like, I was literally tryin’ to... 3456 3457 Q: So he - he knows, certainly, through the media that somethin’s occurred? 3458 3459 A: Yeah. 3460 3461 Q: With... 3462 3463 A: He’s, like, out of town. 3464 3465 Q: ...Chris. 3466 3467 A: He’s probably has no idea. 3468 3469 Q: Okay. 3470 3471 A: He doesn’t know... 3472 3473 Q: Okay. 3474 3475 A: ...who Chris is. Like, he’s not - I do not - no. 3476 3477 Q: So he’s just a friend of yours... 3478 3479 A: Yes. 3480 3481 Q: ...um, that was... 3482 3483 A: He does not need to be dragged into this. 3484 3485 Q: ...coming to your apartment and doesn’t know anything about Chr- does he 3486 know anything about Chris? 3487 3488 A: No. 3489 3490 Q: Okay. 3491 3492 A: Nothin’. Absolutely nothin’. 3493 3494 A1: Yeah. We’ve known (Jim) for... 3495 3496 A: He - yeah. 3497 3498 A1: ...ye- years and years. 3499 3500 A: Yeah. 3501 3502 Q: You’re not datin’ him or anything like that? 3503 3504 A: No. 3505 3506 Q: He’s just a friend? 3507 3508 A: He’s, like, one of my very good friends. Like, my dad knows him. He’s a 3509 great guy. He just - he - he works out of state a lot. So when he’s in town, um, 3510 we hang out. But when he’s in town and he’s off of work, to save time - I - so 3511 I - I gave him a key to my house one, ‘cause I trust him and he’s one of my 3512 best friends, and two, ‘cause, uh, sometimes he will just meet me there. 3513 Because I’ll be, like, “Hey, I’m gettin’ off of work.” And then if I get stuck in 3514 traffic or something, he ends up, like, sitting outside of my apartment waiting 3515 for me to get off of work. So I’m like, “Here’s a key.” And, like, my dog loves 3516 him and stuff. So no. 3517 3518 Q: Okay. 3519 3520 A: He’s not involved with it... 3521 3522 Q: So he’s just a family friend? 3523 3524 A: Yes. I don’t even want him dragged... 3525 3526 Q: The only reason I ask... 3527 3528 A: ...into this. 3529 3530 Q: A- and I’m not really concerned, uh, about your location. Um, I think we 3531 already have your cell phone records. Um, at some point, i- did (Mark) ask 3532 you to supply - uh, did they ask for consent to get cell phone records. That’ll 3533 probably be done by warrant, if we... 3534 3535 A: Isn’t that what you just did? 3536 3537 Q: Nope. What I’m talkin’ about is your movement. 3538 3539 A: Oh. 3540 3541 Q: Um, by GPS or by cell phone tower. To show where you were. Obviously - 3542 and I don’t want to cause you concern. We want to know where you were that 3543 day, too. You’re dating a man who did some egregious stuff, and we want to 3544 put - we want to show that you were never near him that day, period. 3545 3546 A: Oh, I mean, you guys can... 3547 3548 Q: So... 3549 3550 A: ...track my stuff. 3551 3552 Q: No, i- I mean, that - that was somethin’ we will have to get a warrant for, 3553 anyways, to - I’m just saying if - if we asked for it, would you have any 3554 objections... 3556 A: Yeah, you’re... 3557 3558 Q: ...to that? 3559 3560 A: No. You can have it. 3561 3562 Q: All right. So, um, we’ll... 3563 3564 A: I’m - I’m a pretty boring person. I don’t... 3565 3566 Q: Well, it sounds like... 3567 3568 A: ...go too many places. 3569 3570 Q: ...you just went to work that day and then you came home and you were there 3571 at 3:45. 3572 3573 A: Yeah, like, give or take... 3574 3575 ((Crosstalk)) 3576 3577 A: ...like, five minutes. 3578 3579 Q: Yeah. Right. 3580 3581 A: But yeah. So 3:45 I meet (Jim) there. Yeah, I would totally do... 3582 3583 Q: And so (Jim) is a - understand from an investigative point, he could be a 3584 person who could say, “Yeah. I was there at 3:45. I don’t” - he doesn’t know 3585 Chris. He doesn’t know anything. He could say, with one phone call, “Yeah, 3586 she came in at 3:45.” Done. 3587 3588 A: Totally. 3589 3590 Q: Do you know what I’m sayin’? 3591 3592 A: Yeah. 3593 3594 Q: And I don’t have to ask anything more than, “Hi, Chris. My name’s Kevin. 3595 I’m...” 3596 3597 A: Oh. 3598 3599 Q: Or - or - or (Jim).

TIMDAD16AUGROOM 3151 walk in and there’ll be, like, two of them as opposed to, like, six or seven. 3152 3153 Q: Do you know what he did Sunday, during the day? 3154 3155 A: Um, I don’t even know what I did on Sunday during the day. I am so tired. Let 3156 me just think about this. (Daniel) came over Friday. I hung out with him 3157 Saturday. And then Sunday... 3158 3159 Q1: When did (Jim) come in? 3160 3161 A: Monday. 3162 3163 Q1: Huh. 3164 3165 A: (Jim) got here Monday. What did I do on Sunday? I am, like, drawing a blank. 3166 I’m really tired. I don’t know. Can I get back to you on that? 3167 3168 Q: Did you guys have any conversations on Saturday night during your meal, 3169 what he might be doing on Sunday? 3170 3171 A: I’m sure we did. I don’t know why I’m drawing a blank, ‘cause I haven’t 3172 slept. 3173 3174 Q: I- if I say that his - he may have, uh, done something with his children, would 3175 that refresh... 3176 3177 A: Oh, yes. 3178 3179 Q: ...your memory? 3180 3181 A: He went to a birthday party. 3182 3183 Q: Okay. Um, do you know whose house he was going to? 3184 3185 A: Nope, but I know that they had a water balloon fight. 3186 3187 Q: Okay. He - he had one or his children? 3188 3189 A: His children did. 3190 3191 Q: Okay. 3192 3193 A: He said he used to get really into it. He said he got, like, really interactive with 3194 his kids. He’s, like, “So many adults don’t really spend a lot of time playing 3195 with the kids, but I always do.” 3196 3197 A1: We went to the museum on what day? Saturday or Sunday? 3198 3199 A: Sunday. 3200 3201 A1: Okay. 3202 3203 A: That’s right. 3204 3205 A1: Okay. 3206 3207 A: So - yeah, that’s what I was, like, “Was I hanging out with you?” God. Uh, 3208 so... 3209 3210 Q: Very memorable event, huh? 3211 3212 A: Uh, we hi... 3213 3214 A1: That was, uh... 3215 3216 A: Me and him and my - my m- stepmother... 3217 3218 A1: My wife and... 3219 3220 A: ...and my sister went... 3221 3222 A1: Yeah. 3223 3224 A: ...to, uh, the museum. And that’s right. 3225 3226 Q: What museum? 3227 3228 A: Uh, the Denver Museum of Nature and Science. And they went to brunch 3229 prior to that, and I skipped brunch. Um, and I went to the gym. 3230 3231 A1: You shouldn’t of. It was good. 3232 3233 A: I had to do core day. That was the last time I worked, actually. Um... 3234 3235 A1: That’s what we did Sunday. Okay. 3236 3237 A: And - yeah. So core day, and then we went - we went to the museum, and 3238 then, um... 3239 3240 Q: When did you - did he tell you about the water balloon fight on Sunday 3241 evening, during your conversation on the phone? 3242 3243 A: I think so. 3244 3245 Q: Okay. So... 3246 3247 A: I think so. 3248 3249 Q: ...you don’t know whose house he went to on Sunday? 3250 3251 A: No. 3252 3253 Q: Um, but you knew it was for a child’s birthday? 3254 3255 A: Yeah. And he had told me about that in advance, really. So I don’t know if it 3256 was Saturday that he had told me that he was gonna go to the birthday or, like, 3257 Friday. I just remember he was, like, “I gotta go to this birthday party...” 3258 3259 Q: Okay. 3260 3261 A: “...with my kids.” 3262 3263 Q: Um, any other conversation that makes sense? 3264 3265 A: I mean, honestly, at this point, I’m really tired, so I know there are certain 3266 things that I need to tell you guys that we’ll get to as these days progress. 3267 3268 Q: Yep. 3269 3270 A: Um, but in all honesty, if it doesn’t stand out to me now... 3271 3272 Q: Today? 3273 3274 A: ...it probably wasn’t... 3275 3276 Q: That’s fine. 3277 3278 A: ...relevant. 3279 3280 A1: What about that 9 o’clock thing you were tellin’ me on Monday? 3281 3282 A: Oh, what he told me? Oh, yeah. Well, we’ll get there. We’ll get there. We’re 3283 still on Sunday night. 3284 3285 Q: So we’re on Sunday. 3286 3287 A: We’re - we’re gonna go... 3288 3289 ((Crosstalk)) 3290 3291 Q: We’re gonna get - we’re gonna get to... 3292 3293 A: This is gonna be a long day. 3294 3295 Q: We’re gonna get there to Monday. We’re - we’re getting there. So Sunday 3296 night - or Sunday during the day, you had your own personal, um, stuff going 3297 on... 3298 3299 A: Mm-hm. 3300 3301 Q: ...with your family. 3302 3303 A: Mm-hm. 3304 3305 Q: You never see him on Sunday. Is that accurate? 3306 3307 A: No. I didn’t see him. What did I do the rest of the day? I came home. I think I 3308 might’ve just chilled at my house. I don’t remember. I think I cleaned my 3309 house. I don’t know. I didn’t see him, though. 3310 3311 Q: Okay. And... 3312 3313 A: Yeah. Saturday was the last time I saw him. 3314 3315 Q: Okay. Sunday, you’re at home. You talk to him from - we know he - you have 3316 a conversation... 3317 3318 A: Mm-hm. 3319 3320 Q: ...in the late evening hours, and then... 3321 3322 A: Mm-hm. 3323 3324 Q: ...you go to sleep? 3325 3326 A: Mm-hm. 3327 3328 Q: Um, on Sunday night? 3329 3330 A: Mm-hm. 3331 3332 Q: When’s the next time you talk with Chris? 3333 3334 A: Probably Monday morning. 3335 3336 Q: Do you know what - what time? 3337 3338 A: No. I mean, so we used to, like, randomly text each other, like, throughout the 3339 day. But we both get really busy. So some days, like, I don’t hear a lot from 3340 him, and some days I don’t text him until, like, 2 o’clock in the afternoon. 3341 ‘Cause I’m just, like, busy. And I - I remember, I didn’t hear a lot from him 3342 that day. Uh, which was, like - that’s not out of the normal for either one of 3343 us, um, during the day. Um, but at one point, I do remember he, like, text me 3344 and he’s, like, “Oh, it’s been a really busy day.” And then, like, said some 3345 other stuff. Which I’m sure you will find in my text. What he said, I don’t 3346 know. It wasn’t obviously, anything that was, like, alerting to me. L- that’s 3347 what I’m sayin’. Like, at this point, like, I remember really key things. But if 3348 it’s, like, a conversation, then I’m like, “I don’t remember exactly what was 3349 discussed.” It’s ‘cause it was probably just bullshit. Like, just... 3350 3351 Q: Just... 3352 3353 A: ...talkin’ to each other. Yeah. 3354 3355 Q: ...small talk stuff? 3356 3357 A: Yeah. Um, but I remember he was busy that day, and we didn’t talk that 3358 much. And then I - I clocked out at 3:00 is what my timecard says. That’s 3359 what I was showing, um, (Mark), the other day. And I got home to go meet 3360 my buddy. One of my good friends was comin’ over to my house. And he 3361 actually has a key to my house. So he was actually there when I got there. 3362 And... 3363 3364 Q: Who’s that? 3365 3366 A: My friend, (Jim). Um, and so (Jim) came over and I got home. He was there. 3367 He had, like, just walked in the door, and, um, I remember, like, briefly, after 3368 he got there, I checked my texts. I mean, briefly after I met up with (Jim), I, 3369 like, glanced at my texts and Chris said something about, like, “My family’s 3370 not home.” Or, like, “My wife and kids aren’t home.” Like, something to that 3371 effect. And I told (Mark) - ‘cause he asked me for a time, and I don’t have an 3372 exact time, but I remember it was, like, right after I walked in the... 3373 3374 Q: That was a text message, though? 3376 A: Yeah. It’s in a text. And it’s, like - it was, like, briefly after I walked in the 3377 door. So based off how long it takes me to get home from work and when I 3378 clocked out, it was probably about 3:45 PM. Um, text me and tells me that. 3379 And, like, he knows when I get off of work, too. So he doesn’t always bug me 3380 if I’m busy. So I don’t know what’s up with that, but that’s when he - that’s 3381 when he sends that to me. And, um... 3382 3383 Q: So you’re saying that he - he would’ve known that you would’ve had your 3384 phone available to you and not been at work when he sent you that text 3385 message? 3386 3387 A: Uh, yes. That’s what I’m trying to say. 3388 3389 Q: So looking back at it, you think it was purposefully sent at that time? 3390 3391 A: Oh, I’m sure. 3392 3393 Q: Is - I’m - the - I’m just asking your feeling on that. 3394 3395 A: Yes. And then he said, “Call me when you can.” And I was, like... 3396 3397 Q: There was no other communication between you and him that morning, on 3398 Monday morning, at all? 3399 3400 A: Well, there w- there was, but it was, like, random, like... 3401 3402 Q: It - but nothin’ about this event? 3403 3404 A: No. No, no, no, no, no. 3405 3406 Q: About, like, “My mo- my wife’s missing” or... 3407 3408 A: No. 3409 3410 Q: “...My” - w- anything? 3411 3412 A: Nothin’. 3413 3414 Q: Okay. 3415 3416 A: Nothin’. 3417 3418 Q: And you knew he wasn’t comin’ to the office, ‘cause he had told you that 3419 Sunday night.