RendHeaven

@LfcCharlie4 I really appreciate the response man. Those are amazing objections and you phrased them in a way that wasn't insulting. I showed your comment to my best friend & mentor Jason, who is single handledly responsible for my current nutrition paradigm... here are his answers! Firstly, wasn't the lifespan literaly 40 in the 1800s, and likely even shorter before that, couldn't that be one of the reasons? Not lifespan, average life expectancy, that's a really important difference... The average is confounded by infant mortality. And, most people tended to die from infectious diseases such as TB & things like Pneumonia. Right. As opposed to the chronic diseases (heart disease, cancer, stroke, Alzheimer's, diabetes) that plague modern civilization. So, considering heart attacks average age is 64.5, is it not just a matter of it takes longer for these habits to have an effect on the CV system and lead to CV disease, which is the number 1 killer in the developed world according to WHO. Same for Lifestyle causes cancers- its very rarely a 18 year old smoker getting lung cancer for example? Solid logic, but no. There is this tacit assumption that chronic disease is inherent to the human condition. It's not. But it is true that these diseases take time to develop. NEVER FORGET THIS 18 WORD SENTENCE: "Consuming more polyunsaturated fat than that found in nature will SLOWLY oxidize your body and cause chronic disease." The fact that this oxidative process is slow is actually precisely why it's difficult to ascertain the true danger of seed oils in a short-term study. But for evidence that modern humans do not have to succumb to chronic disease in old age, look no further than the Tokelauans, whom exist to this very day, and thus nullifies the argument that our ancestors are not an apt comparator. Also, the studies / reports of the 'Bluezones' and populations who live the longest do seem to eat a very plant rich diet, low in all forms of processed foods of course, but also low in Red Meat - https://www.bluezones.com/recipes/food-guidelines/ . Yes. The antioxidants in plants offset the linoleic acid in olive oil, but animal fats would still be superior. A plant rich diet however IS NOT enough to overcome a diet which also consists of seed oils, and to appreciate that fact, look no further than Israeli Jews, and yes, that is true TODAY, not merely historically or ancestrally. To me, it makes much more sense to look at what people have done recently to increase lifespan, than a time period where the causes of death were completely different, like night and day difference, due to living standards etc Right, but the causes of death historically were precisely NOT chronic disease, and that's the whole point. Yes that's true, living standards are a confounding factor, for example nowadays we have to contend with air and water pollution (rich in heavy metals that can cause oxidation) Also, isn't pure survival completely different to optimizing yourself for not just a longer lifespan but healthspan? True. The goal is to have your health span most closely approximate your lifespan, i.e., live 90 good years and then bite the dust due to natural causes. But evidence of good healthspan is lack of chronic disease. In terms of the benefits you've seen, this is incredibly common, especially if you had food sensitivities / insulin sensitivities beforehand & you've basically done an elimination carnivore-based diet, meaning you've stripped anything that can cause issues. Okay. Addition through subtraction, that's a fair point. But then again, to truly understand, you would need to actually eat a pound or two of beef per day. Pony up, wontcha? Or would we rather not put the onus on ourselves to smoke the psychedelic, to look through the telescope, so to speak? Long-Term I would argue such a diet will increase the risk of various chronic diseases, and I think within the next 3-5 years we will see much more evidence of this in Carnivore based communities. [RendHeaven speaking here, my mentor responds cheekily here but he means no ill will haha] Oh good, finally someone puts a timeline on this. Perfect, I'm adding this to my Google calendar right now, and we will follow up in 1826 days which accounts for the leap year in 2024. This gives you the benefit of the doubt by using the end of your time interval, that being 5 years. In the meantime let's ask 13 year carnivore doctor Lisa Wiedeman which ailments she experiences! One more thing, if you were eating a lot of carb heavy meals before, especially processed carbs, that could explain the benefits, I just finished a book called Glucose Revolution and after implementing the hacks have seen great improvement in just a week. Essentially if you was constantly snacking or eating lots of processed carbs / carb heavy meals in a certain way you could've just fucked your glucose & insulin sensitivity which leads to a lot of shit outcomes basically. I think this could partially explain the benefits seen on a high fat based diet. Glucose control is important, yes, but I, for example, recommend a high carb animal-based diet which offers the same benefits. It's not the macronutrients conferring this effect, i.e., the high carb, low fat, or whatever, but rather, it's the bioavailable micronutrients in the meat that take you to the next level.

@Michael569 I actually appreciate you so much bro. Seriously, I don't even care about being right, or having people agree with me. I simply believe I've found answers for myself in a taboo place (eating tons of red meat) and I want to have an open discussion about it without being instantly shut out. For context, I began veganism in early 2020 (and I supplemented to the best of my ability, kept track of all of my macros and micros on cronometer). It lasted for about 4 months as I developed many gut issues and brain fog. This was the beginning of my chronic bloating and lack of energy. I remember when I was strict vegan, there were many days where I literally couldn't even will myself to get out of bed, and I would spend the entire day lying around on my phone. At first this struck me as a willpower issue, but we will see that as I reintroduced animal products, the brainfog slowly went away... Switched to vegetarian (lots of eggs) until the fall of 2021, thinking that I must've done something wrong by cutting out animal products entirely. But the issues persisted. The bloating especially was so bad. It would be painful, cause me to fart CONSTANTLY, and frankly looked horrible + gave me low confidence. No matter what I seemingly did, my stomach would bulge like I was pregnant, and it was undeniable that I was eating wrong. I tried prebiotics, probiotics, more fiber, less fiber, low FODMAP, less veggies, more veggies, eating slower, chewing more, sitting on the toilet for hours/day and literally nothing would work. In fall of 2021, I caved and began eating meat. I ate chicken and otherwise followed a diet similar to the so-called Mediterranean diet, still eating many servings of veggies. This finally began to slowly heal my 2 biggest issues - gut health and brainfog - but I still didn't feel 100%. I would continue to obsess over my ever-constant pregnancy bulge, and I would take naps in the middle of the day out of fatigue. At a certain point, I began to accept that this was normal and that I was "healthy." I began eating purely beef, eggs, rice, and fruit in July of 2022. Here are the main benefits I've accrued: 2 years of stubborn chronic bloating and gut issues permanently gone 2 years of chronic low energy and lack of mental clarity permanently gone. In fact, I am so unreasonably zesty and energized that I unironically leap out of bed every morning. I used to take modafinil in 2021 (as a band-aid), and I can say without a doubt that now I feel as though I am on constant modafinil... except I'm not! Until this year, I could not gain more weight than 148lbs. I have been 148lbs or less my entire life, chronically skinny despite working out consistently and progressive overloading. Switching to this new diet, I have BLOWN UP in muscle mass. I am currently sitting at 154lbs of lean muscle mass for the first time in my life, and I attribute it to my new diet since my other habits have not changed at all. I will be 160lbs in no time. No more cravings. This may be the most important benefit on this entire list. Before when I was eating chicken and veggies, I would battle ice cream cravings, instant noodle cravings, chick fil a fried chicken cravings, etc. at least once a week. I would literally be internally screaming for junk food and I would either suppress the desire and deprive myself, or accept the desire and indulge. Either way it felt negative and I would think "man why am I so weak." Over the last 5 months all of my food cravings have VANISHED. Utterly evaporated. I feel NOTHING for ice cream or noodles, it's rather remarkable. In my own head I chalk it up to saturated fat being genuinely satiating and nourishing. I have had dandruff my whole life, and I have been using anti-dandruff shampoo for the last 5 years. I learned about the "no shampoo" trend a few years ago and tried it to devastating effects. I decided back then that I will need shampoo forever. Now, I no longer have dandruff, nor do I even need shampoo. The natural oils on my scalp seem to self-regulate for the first time ever. Again, diet. As long as this lasts I will never use any hair products! I have had a severe lifelong dog energy. My eyes would get bloodshot, puffy, and itchy, at the slightest touch of a dog, and it would be an overall awful experience. Historically I would have to guzzle claritin in order to touch dogs without suffering. Recently I accidentally found myself in an apartment with a dog who was all over me, and I was unprepared. To my utter shock, despite shedding all over me and licking my skin countless times, I had ZERO reaction. I was practically immune. This absolutely blew my mind. I let my friend & mentor Jason know what happened and he chuckled at my surprise. Apparently this is a common anecdote from people who increase their saturated fat intake and lower their polyunsaturated fat intake. Jason himself had this effect occur for him with respect to pollen, cats, etc. Speaking of my friend & mentor Jason, I think it's worth mentioning him here. 90% of my dietary paradigm is thanks to Jason alone. He is rather undiscovered (for now) but perhaps one day he will be an online influencer in his own right. I largely do not place my faith in carnivore/animal based influencers or their ideas. Fun fact: I never heard of liver king until the recent steroid scandal. Earlier in this thread I suggested that eating animals is healthy and good, and I found it amusing (but understandable!) that you responded by preemptively attacking the credibility of shawn baker and paul saladino. All that being said, paul saladino is indeed the one public figure who espouses ideas closest to that of Jason (and by extension, me), so I do trust him more than any other public figure when it comes to diet. Still, I do not outsource all of my authority to him, which is evident from my white rice consumption (paul is against all grains). If you are interested to hear more about Jason or his ideas, LMK! I find it fascinating when people suggest that eating red meat "is good for elimination diet but not for longevity" this assumes that the least inflammatory food right now is somehow inflammatory... later on? I don't intuitively see why the best food NOW and the best food 10 years from now would be different things. Jason has devoted a decade of his life to the study of nutrition, and he himself has an even more underground and well-studied mentor named Luke. Jason has been eating an animal-based, high saturated fat, low polyunsaturated fat diet for over 6 years now and he has flawless biomarkers and no hint of disease or even predisposition to disease. Jason's mentor, Luke, has been eating this way for roughly 20 years with the same results! I trust these guys because they walk the talk and they put their own skin on the line. According to these guys, the primary driver for modern disease is excess POLYUNSATURATED fats (NOT saturated) because polyfats, and by extension linoleic acid, are especially prone to oxidation. According to Jason: "It's not the fact that LDL carries ApoB, it's the fact that it carries linoleic acid, becomes oxidized and then atherogenic/injurious." This explains both the French Paradox and Israeli Paradox. Jason recommends looking into the Minnesota Coronary Experiment and the Sydney Diet Heart Study. Also look up PMID30364556. Again, in this moment I don't particularly care about being right or having people agree with me... I want to have an open discussion about this potential answer without being instantly shut out. Ultimately you are right that time will tell. In 5, 10, 20, 50 years these competing hypothesis will play out on the battleground of life. Which is truly injurious: excess ApoB or excess LA? Medical consensus or the contrarians? I've staked my chips on the latter because I trust my friends and mentors (who, for the record, have NOTHING to sell. They are scientists in the purest form of the word). Oh, and the immediate benefits are too good to give up

@Roy So many needless ad hominem attacks, my man. I sympathize with Nilsi because it seems we share similar stories. Ex vegan -> disasterous health consequences -> found animal based eating -> now thriving. It's not fun to report the one thing that has healed you, only to be called "stupid," "bullshit," "insane," "disgusting." I for one will not call you names, and I hope you will give me the same charity. I just want to leave this comment to suggest that you may have firm conclusions despite missing an entire side of the story, which to me feels hasty and yes, insincere. I have been in your current frame. Just last year I was advocating for a global reduction in meat consumption. I remember lecturing a slew of my friends on how ethics and dietary preferences are inseparable. Although there was great truth in my old rhetoric, I now see that I was also myopic. Back then I didn't consider how eating solely plant foods could malnourish or toxify one's body, making their day to day life hyper dysfunctional (indeed, that was my own fate). I had always assumed that death = bad, and that contributing to death therefore made a person = selfish and discompassionate. Since I valued self-actualization and wholism - I therefore extrapolated that compassion was a necessary step in my development. And thus the surrender of animal products, the next logical step. For me, this was all assumption and ego playing a character. I now see and occupy the opposite side of the coin. I, and many of my closest friends now believe (and have experienced firsthand) that eating mostly animal foods will nourish and detoxify our bodies, making our day to day life hyper functional. This difference in "vitality" cannot be so casually hand-waved away unless you personally experience the difference. If you respond to this by dismissing my claims to vitality, I say that this is precisely your closed mindedness and insincerity. Death is not bad. In fact, it is necessary. Contributing to death is indeed selfish (no doubting that) but not necessarily discompassionate. By siphoning all of our concern towards the animals staying alive, the trade off is that many humans may suffer. I certainly suffered. Thus being vegan is not inherently the compassionate choice. Being vegan for me was discompassionate towards myself. Allthewhile I told myself that I was "being compassionate," i.e. I was playing a character & hurting myself all at once. What about that is remotely conscious or whole? lol- there is no grounds upon which to insist that the animals staying alive trumps the health of humanity (or even the health of your current vessel). I've had a string of recent awakenings where the perfection of the "cycle of life," the perfection inherent to consuming animal products, was made clear to me. But of course, the perfection of veganism, the perfection of abstaining from animal products, this was also made clear to me. That is - all choices are beautiful and good. This is quite radical and opens pandora's box, so perhaps it's best we don't go there. But I just wanted to mention that this is my current, honest, understanding of the world. Judgement of various aspects of existence, and expecting people to act or be otherwise no longer resonates with me. I also understand that invoking the "cycle of life" is a convenient way for meat-lovers to ignore and deny their own selfishness, and to spread evil unconsciously. When I invoke the cycle of life, this is not a license to turn off awareness, and to do whatever your dirty soul craves. These days as I consume my animal products, I am highly aware of what it is that I am doing. I understand and accept that I am selfish. It never escapes me, that I am able to thrive only because I leave a trail of death behind me. I unironically do a little prayer to God before every meal for this reason, to express gratitude. The animal-defender would see what I've written here and still be disgusted. They would call my prayer futile, they would insist that I am stuck in post-rationalization, and that all of my consciousness talk is a mask for my own greed. Perhaps that's true. I don't deny my own selfishness. I embrace it wholeheartedly, as does God, and there is nothing anybody can do about that. You are free to tear apart my words however you'd like - but just notice this: I see where you're coming from. Do you see where I'm coming from? I actually accept the behaviors and proclivities and fates of all beings, including myself. Do you?

No, this is exactly what I mean. I do not agree with this statement, in fact I stand in stark opposition to it In my current view, organic 100% grass-fed cow flesh is THE HEALTHIEST food (AT LEAST for me), period. Nothing comes close to it - certainly not grains or plants lol!

@Nilsi I've eaten ONLY salted ground beef, eggs, white rice, and a small sprinkle of fruit (+calcium supplementation) for roughly 5 months straight. Strict, no exceptions, no cheating. I have personally accrued a slew of unbelievable, paradigm-shattering benefits in that time which I simply cannot chalk up to placebo or confounding factors. My new way of eating made me better, period. It gets tricky when the discussion becomes about how other humans ought to eat. I am not so confident yet telling everyone to eat like me (and so for the most part I refrain) - but I will not stand by idly when others tell me that beef is "unhealthy"! @Michael569 Thanks for the response brother you've given me a lot to work with, I'll get back to you in a bit!

Sorry bro... This is EXTREMELY sloppy reasoning. Just intuitively speaking, without appealing to flawed, biased, epidemiological "studies" (aka self-reported surveys full of healthy user bias, misreporting bias, etc.): Our ancestors have consumed fatty animals for millennia, period. This is indisputable from isotope testing alone - but that aside, In the cold of winter where there are no plants, prior to the agricultural revolution where we learned to store a surplus of grains, how could we humans have possibly survived? We don't hibernate or have the ability to consume grass or shrubbery buried beneath snow. That leaves the obvious: animal fats. We have tangible evidence of tribes that thrive almost solely on red meat + animal byproducts alone, to this very day. The hadza, the maasai, the tokelau, eskimo populations, etc. These tribes have the LEAST signs of disease! This is NOT something you can so easily brush aside. Cancer, diabetes, atherosclerosis, arthritis, macular degeneration - AKA diseases of MODERN CIVILIZATION... the rates of these began to SKYROCKET in the last 120 years. In the 1800s, a heart attack was so rare that it wasn't even in the medical literature. And you're seriously telling me that red meat which we have eaten for literally thousands of years is CAUSING disease that has risen in only roughly the last century? Please...... To my knowledge, there has never been a single large scale, long term interventional study that convincingly vilifies red meat. I'm eager to hear your response! Edit: as you can tell, for now I have clearly adopted a pro-red-meat stance. I am not interested in telling people how they ought to eat per se, but I am greatly puzzled when people disparage red meat before thoroughly contending with the above points I've laid out!

I love you Michael, but I do not trust epidemiological data, and I am surprised that you have no qualms doing so. It also seems here that you are perpetuating the narrative that "elevated cholesterol" is indiscriminately undesirable. I personally don't buy into that narrative. I am happy to have elevated cholesterol levels so long as my cells are not inflamed. Time and time again we are finding that measuring elevated LDL cholesterol (or any cholesterol for that matter) has little to no meaning as a predictor for disease. As far as I'm aware, tracking HDL + triglycerides is a more meaningful predictor of disease, as you get a rough estimation of the inflammation accumulating in your body. Anyway, I'm just sharing this since it puzzles me when people flee from "elevated cholesterol." In my independent study I am beginning to see that not only is native LDL cholesterol not bad, it is likely good for us. I'm glad to see you're doing well

@Leo Gura unfortunately our friend is stubborn... just like a human

lol classic

@Leo Gura Seems you've locked into the optimal human diet! Reminder that beef > chicken.

Are you still carnivore?

this video here already somewhat addresses your question

The deletion of the entire universe + absolute lucidity

That's reason enough for a hard no.

lol alrighty prince canute.

I am not "thinking" Infinity. That's a game that you alone have decided to play.

Only insofar as you decree that understanding and infinity are unidentical

You are describing a limit. That ain't Infinity.

Does "being Earth" come with connotations of a geometric sphere (a formed, shaped, object) with diametrically opposed rounded surfaces, or does this experience have no regard to comprehensible corporeal form? How does one know itself with certainty to be the totality of Earth in the absence of mathematical (or even physical) concept-anchors, and can you describe the accompanying sensations?

can confirm

:')

No way. That's my favorite book. In fact it's the only book I carry around with me everywhere.

psychedelics heal, period

One of my best friends asked me for my help this morning, because his sister raised concerns that her lack of emotional expressiveness might stem from trauma. This was my response. It seems that my communication was received well, and so I hope to send it out into the larger world as well: To me, being emotionally expressive is not merely a matter of feeling good, or even being a healthy human. It's more fundamental, on the level of being an entity of metaphysical integrity/oneness. In truth we are WHOLE and UNITED (as the universe), so rejecting or suppressing any aspect of experience results in a split, divided, false self. I am no expert on trauma healing - I am just a young guy with inordinate self awareness and the ability to confront myself head-on. Just from her texts, I suspect that your sister is suppressing or repressing, just from the tone of her words. And she knows this, but is seeking some sort of external validation/confirmation for what she already knows because we fear the consequences of our gut instinct being correct. This is such a tangled topic that I don't know if it's right to diagnose/suggest action steps as though the path forward is linear: but here is what I would personally do in her situation. 1) feel into the hurt of your current gray/neutral/apathetic existence. We adopt this "passive" stance in life relative to our strong inner emotions in hopes of escaping pain, but notice that this strategy never actually even worked. The pain is still there. In fact, new pain might have arisen (such as inability to open up to and communicate with [current significant other]) 2) notice that there is a lack of congruence between what is inside and what is shown outside. If you honor or value the prospect of being a COMPLETE, thriving, wise entity - the fact that you are 2 different people on the surface and below the surface should sound alarm bells. Notice that the emotions we withhold are still actually there, buried under layers of armor!! Don't think for a second that they've ever disappeared entirely. 3) spend more time alone, without distractions, reflecting on the past (not just to [recent instances of hurt], but even back to growing up as a 10 year old). I suspect we will find numerous occasions where emotional expressiveness has been invalidated or discouraged. And notice how our young, frail, impressionable, validation-seeking egos have bent over backwards to fit into the tribe. Historically, whenever our emotions were invalidated, we simply learned "don't emote." But could this have been the wrong move? Maybe there is a way to emote without negative consequences: a third option which we never explored. 4) in my experience, there has to be a certain fire or passion that underlies your trauma healing journey. This is not something you haphazardly decide to do. You are sick of being a divided person inside and out. You wish so desperately to know yourself and to shine your authentic light onto the world instead of a dimmed, fake, projection/caricature. 5) attempt to be more open, first in solitude, and lastly, around people. This means, when a feeling arises, you allow it to bubble up to the surface without micromanaging it. No image control. Just let it be. Notice that this hurts (at first). Don't let this discourage you. This is the precise hurt that you've been avoiding all along. Either you battle it now, or it haunts you to your grave. 6) you will likely fear the consequences of being more open. People taking advantage of you, people rejecting you, etc. These concerns feel real and they will crush your healing progress. More than anything it is important to remember that you are now stronger than you were in your past. You have learned from your pain, you have clearer boundaries now. So given all of this, allow yourself to open up and emote - and if someone tries to take advantage of that or belittle you - trust in yourself that you can firmly say NO, walk away, and laugh it off. 7) lastly and most importantly, notice the shocking beauty of the world and life that opens up to YOU. although emotional openness entails high-highs and low-lows (and those lows look scary at first), the highs are actually so astronomically high that it's not even a comparison. For some reason, when you are an integrous individual with true self knowledge and true self expressiveness; reality skews SIGNIFICANTLY towards bliss, happiness, joy, beauty, excellence, and love. Never forget that

Beautiful & inspiring