About The Good Vs Evil Video

[Elektrisko]

I just watched the video about "Good Vs Evil - Why Evil Doesn't Actually Exist" and I have some thoughts and questions for Leo or anyone else.

As a very logical non-religious person I agree on a theoretical level that "evil" is just a word that we use to describe things in the world. Of course the "world" has no preference and these things does not actually exist. But still, I find that Leo made it a bit easy on himself in this video with taking examples of conflicts where there is always two sides that can have very complex motivations and views and where there may not be any "good" or "bad" side. However, even though on a totally logical level I recognize that "evil" is actually not a tangible "substance" that can be measured or seen, there are situations where I feel like the conflict examples makes it a bit to simple. 

I would be more interested in an example about a serial killer that kills only for his own pleasure. Say that he captures a whole family, a father, a mother and their two five year old children. He rapes the five year old girl in front of the family, he gauges out her eyes while she is alive and screaming, he cuts off her ears and nose, he cuts her mouth open from ear to ear and takes out her tounge and sufficates her mother with it. He cuts her belly open while she is still alive and the other watching and mastrubates into her carcass. All this he does for his own sexual pleasure. The horror and trauma that the family must feel is just totally unbelievable to even imagine. 

Now, even though on a "logical" level the world is of course oblivious and natural to all this going on, I find it hard to not still somehow see this act as an "evil" act. Even though this evil is not something of a "substance" you can measure. Is there not "something" created there from the mix of all those events and impressions? Even though that "something" is not anything "material" and might not have a name?

[drelamore]

@Elektrisko I know you are waiting for Leo to answer, but i would like to contribute an answer to this topic, cause it was life changing for me when i truly realized it.

If you do some introspection, you'll notice that everything you consider as good (Greater Good even...) and bad, are the things that you like and the things you don't. Those preferences are due to your psychology and how you were shaped through the years, but that's not the point...

The reason we label terrorists, thieves, rapists etc. "evil" or "bad" is because they do things we don't like. Morality is ultimately based on thinks we feel like doing and things we don't feel like doing. That's the reason why (if you sit and notice, while being truly honest with yourself) when your mood changes, it's a lot easier to do acts which you would consider as bad. Classic example is believing in peace, but when you are angry as fuck you wanna kick somebody's ass immediately .

So...you can see that morality is basically lots of beliefs, which can create dogmas too. There is a morality in capitalism, communism, fascism and you see people loosing time and energy deciding what they want to BELIEVE the goal of this life, or society, should be (as if it matters).

Just because we have an emotional reaction to certain things, it doesn't mean those things should be labelled as "bad". Bad in comparison to what? and why? what do YOU(meaning your ego) want to achieve? you want to stop that serial killer. GREAT! Stop him, but don't get lost in this morality business,.

[Primeval]

I think that there is a difference between cultural morality and Good VS Evil.

For example, in China they eat dogs.

But, we all know that animal abusers are pieces of shit and deserve what's coming to them.

And let's call the OP's graphic example for what it is.

You know you can think and philosophize your way into believing either side of the coin.

Quote

 Classic example is believing in peace, but when you are angry as fuck you wanna kick somebody's ass immediately .

But at the end of the day if you heard of something like in the OP, you wouldn't pause to think, you'd acknowledge that that scenario IS evil.

[Isle of View]

My take is very easy:

is it condusive? Beneficial? 

or

is it incodusive and detrimental?

 

In general when you walk the earth you look around and that's your compass. 

Groups and societies, through tradition and convention,  have declared what' good and what's evil. That's morality. It's in place in order to keep the group or society alive, help it survive. What they decide is condusive is called good, what is detrimental is called evil. 

The problem with this is, that some seemingly evil situation can trigger people into unpredictable reactions where the situation maybe was not evil at all. People are killed because they have different beliefs, There is nothing really inherently evil in having different beliefs, but from the standpoint of the group it may be that they decided it is detrimental to their survival.

So, there you have morality. It's a group thing.

On a personal level you can have different conclusions but can't express your views. There you go: group-think, group-pressure, morality.

For your own safty it is sometimes good to know what the groups morality is like. But it shouldn't stop you to have your own views on things.

Forget about labels like good and evil when you look into things for yourself.

Is it condusive and contributing from your own point of view? Or is it harmful and detrimental? 
Transcend good vs. evil and get free from environmental conditioning. 

~Chris

[Primeval]

I believe that the Measure of Good & Evil is 'Health'

[drelamore]

@Lha Bho No, that's my point! I find it maybe disgusting, maybe frightening...whatever. but not evil, not anymore.

[Primeval]

Well it is a LOADED word like "God", I'll give you that one!

[drelamore]

@Lha Bho True, but it's also a lie created by the mind

[vizual]

The OP assumes that there is such a thing as free will. That every thing we do is a calculated and self decided action, but this is just an illusion. Everything and everyone is motivated to reach the best optimal outcome in every given situation. The serial killer is making decisions which are the best thing he can do in that moment of his life. It's his life experiences which has shaped him to come to these actions. At the time he is doing his deeds he probably doesn't feel like he is doing something evil. 

From the perspective of a vegan, eating meat is evil, eating meat is the murder of sentient beings. But in the eyes of the average meat eater he does not feel guilty or evil when eating meat. It's all a matter of perspective. Just as there was a time when racism was completely normal and just plain 'common sense'; the white man was superior. The only thing we can do is make agreements about what we the majority finds 'evil'. Most people on this planet view murder and rape 'evil' in this day and age, we make these things get outlawed. But in nature, rape and murder is a pretty normal thing. Just another day in the jungle.

When we travel a few years into the future the landscape of morality will look different than it is today. The universe never stops changing, including the people.

[Primeval]

I believe we have two hands for a reason; one is for good, the other evil.

If somebody attacks your family, you are at liberty to use evil: kill the predator.

"The Greater Good & The Lesser Evil."

Edited March 17, 2016 by Lha Bho

[drelamore]

@Lha Bho Again, why is it evil?

3 minutes ago, Lha Bho said:

evil: kill the predator

 

[Primeval]

It's just a word really.

[drelamore]

@Lha Bho ...which creates suffering, that's what we must realize.

[Primeval]

The problem isn't the word, the problem is your attitude towards the word.

[Elektrisko]

20 minutes ago, vizual said:

The OP assumes that there is such a thing as free will. That every thing we do is a calculated and self decided action, but this is just an illusion. Everything and everyone is motivated to reach the best optimal outcome in every given situation. The serial killer is making decisions which are the best thing he can do in that moment of his life. It's his life experiences which has shaped him to come to these actions. At the time he is doing his deeds he probably doesn't feel like he is doing something evil. 

 

Actually I don't believe in free will. And to clearify, I don't think the actual killer is "evil". What I am questioning is the whole situation. I am questioning and arguing that the "situation" can be described as "evil" (for the lack of a better word). In the bottom, yes there might not be any free will involved, and at a base level it is just atoms reacting to each other etc etc. But like with the body, that is made up of cells, the body and the mind is a sum of all that parts that become something else, something "more" than the sum of its parts. In my view, there is "something" that is there, call it "evil" in that situation that is a sum of all those parts. 

Edited March 17, 2016 by Elektrisko

[drelamore]

@Elektrisko Emotional reaction. Period.

[Elektrisko]

3 minutes ago, drelamore said:

@Elektrisko Emotional reaction. Period.

It is no emotional reaction of me that there is immense, incredible suffering, horror and fear going on there. That is objective. That is no emotional reaction.

Edited March 17, 2016 by Elektrisko

[DJ]

 @Elektrisko Its just nature and it is what it is, not good nor evil. Like when a lion chases down a gazelle and eats it alive. Is that evil? What you have described is just your mind putting a label on what is.

[drelamore]

@Elektrisko Ok, so you don't feel, why bother?

[Primeval]

6 minutes ago, DJ said:

Like when a lion chases down a gazelle and eats it alive. Is that evil?

@DJ It IS Evil. Lion needs to feed the cubs though. Letting them starve would be a greater evil.

Edited March 17, 2016 by Lha Bho