This 600 pound guy has a Girlfriend

[integral]

4 minutes ago, Valach said:

That is not exactly what I meant. Distraction from their -> distraction from their inner world and inner pain/suffering. The person getting drunk at the party is distracting themselves just as much as introvert playing video games etc.

This is true, but lets not flattens life style to distraction and copping, people have life styles.

Going to a party is not by default distraction and having a rooster of 5 is not by default a distraction. 

Some are copping, some are not but they all have life style preferences. 

Edited June 27 by integral

[Valach]

7 minutes ago, integral said:

This is true, but lets not flattens life style to distraction and copping, people have life styles.

Going to a party is not by default distraction and having a rooster of 5 is not by default a distraction. 

Some are copping, some are not but they all have life style preferences. 

I am more radical in this I suppose. The moment you are consuming any substances like alcohol, smoking etc.  at least somewhat regularly, you are definitely running away from yourself. And party lifestyle and casual sex etc. definitely goes hand in hand with substance abuse. Unless you are PUA, but then that has its own issues.

I have also never met a really conscious person who would have high levels of self awareness and would be highly promiscuous. Perhaps, they exist and I was just unlucky. But that is my experience nonetheless. 

Edited June 27 by Valach

[integral]

6 minutes ago, Valach said:

I have also never met a really conscious person who would have high levels of self awareness and would be highly promiscuous. Perhaps, they exist and I was just unlucky. But that is my experience nonetheless. 

It's easy to conflate Lifestyle with unhealthy party hookup culture. What you're describing is majority of people who are sleeping around and go to parties every week. So the majority pattern makes it look like there is no healthy life style or way of life to fit there.

The healthy people with this life style are not going to clubs but instead different types of events, and avoid the standard "getting hammered" type of party.

But ye to them socializing is them enjoying life, vibe hunters. 

Edited June 27 by integral

[Valach]

Just now, integral said:

It's easy to conflate Lifestyle with unhealthy party hookup culture. What you're describing is majority of people who are sleeping around and go to parties every week. So the majority pattern makes it look like there is no healthy life style or way of life to fit there.

The healthy people with this life style are not going to clubs but instead different types of events, and avoid the standard "getting hammered" type of party. 

Oh yea, that is fair. But I would not describe it as "party lifestyle" then.

What kind of circles/events did you find the most healthy people in?

[integral]

5 minutes ago, Valach said:

What kind of circles/events did you find the most healthy people in?

High class parties, dance events, open mics, cafes, jazz clubs, basically anything that is not the standard loud music club. 

Edited June 27 by integral

[Valach]

2 minutes ago, integral said:

High class parties, dance events, open mics, cafes, jazz clubs, basically anything that is the standard loud music club. 

I guess you meant "anything that is NOT the standard loud music club."

What are high class parties?

Edited June 27 by Valach

[integral]

10 minutes ago, Valach said:

What are high class parties?

2000$ bottle of vine lol places. but thats normally more of same developmental life style problem, but not always.

Developmentally a lot of what is "club lifestyle" is a Red/early-Orange relationship to nightlife -> status, conquest, sensation, being seen. The healthier version of it the same person has different center of gravity and uses the identical venue differently, or naturally go to a scenes that match where they are.

 

Edited June 27 by integral

[Valach]

6 minutes ago, integral said:

2000$ bottle of vine lol places. but thats normally more of same developmental life style problem, but not always.

Developmentally a lot of what is "club lifestyle" is a Red/early-Orange relationship to nightlife -> status, conquest, sensation, being seen. The healthier version of it the same person has different center of gravity and uses the identical venue differently, or naturally go to a scenes that match where they are.

 

Woudln't 2000$ bottle of vine places attract more still orange oriented people?

[integral]

1 minute ago, Valach said:

Woudln't 2000$ bottle of vine places attract more still orange oriented people?

Being orange is not unhealthy, it's a value system and developmental stage, there's a healthy way to do it then I unhealthy way

And then this ties back to Lifestyle, Orange with a social lifestyle or orange that has a different type of Lifestyle is going to play video games

[Valach]

Just now, integral said:

Being orange is not unhealthy, it's a value system and developmental stage, there's a healthy way to do it then I unhealthy way

And then this ties back to Lifestyle, Orange with a social lifestyle or orange that has a different type of Lifestyle is going to play video games

Yeah, okay, I am onboard with that.

Though in my perception it is very hard to be heatlhy and orange at the same time. Vast majority of people are traumatized and it is very hard to get in touch with your pain without developing self awareness, that would probably move you past orange anyways.

[integral]

2 minutes ago, Valach said:

Yeah, okay, I am onboard with that.

Though in my perception it is very hard to be heatlhy and orange at the same time. Vast majority of people are traumatized and it is very hard to get in touch with your pain without developing self awareness, that would probably move you past orange anyways.

I know what you mean, but High orange is essentially where self-development is unlocked. And there's a whole rabbit hole that people will go down and they become addicted to self-development and it's often some of the funnest happiest times to be alive.

Maturity is a separate axis from values.

A person could be stage red and mature. But because the center of our culture is mostly Orange they'll have a hard time in that environment because they adapted to red values when they should have adapted to be orange as that's the least resistance to culture and Society.

So they end up having conflict. But people who are centered orange and healthy have the best lives because they have no conflict with their environment. As everyone else shares the same values as them.

[Miguel1]

On 27/06/2026 at 2:51 PM, integral said:

Maturity is a separate axis from values.

A person could be stage red and mature. But because the center of our culture is mostly Orange they'll have a hard time in that environment because they adapted to red values when they should have adapted to be orange as that's the least resistance to culture and Society.

Hmm. With maturity, comes higher level of values.

An immature person might value money and sex, while a mature person will likely value empathy and integrity.

A healthy stage green person is generally more psychologically mature than an orange.

[Valach]

Just now, Miguel1 said:

Hmm. With maturity, comes higher level of values.

An immature person might value money and sex, while a mature person will likely value empathy and integrity.

A healthy stage green person is generally more psychologically mature than an orange.

How would you map development and maturity on trauma?

I feel like it is hard to differentiate between this for me because a person might be relatively mature (self aware, conscious etc.), yet at the same time many of his/hers desires and preferences will be stemming from unresolved trauma. I wouldn't say that makes the person immature but that person might look like that.

[Miguel1]

2 minutes ago, Valach said:

How would you map development and maturity on trauma?

I feel like it is hard to differentiate between this for me because a person might be relatively mature (self aware, conscious etc.), yet at the same time many of his/hers desires and preferences will be stemming from unresolved trauma. I wouldn't say that makes the person immature but that person might look like that.

Maturity is facing and healing your traumas.

[Valach]

Just now, Miguel1 said:

Maturity is facing and healing your traumas.

Agreed, but that is a lifelong process. The more mature I get the more I realize how unaware I am.