Seek and ye shall find. That's the whole trick.

[Joshe]

19 hours ago, LambdaDelta said:

Nobody's disputing that at the end of the day all the truth-seeking and awakening is a preference/bias/hobby,

Leo disagrees. 

But I agree with you. 

[Natasha Tori Maru]

@Joshe

Quote

Love wasn't even in your vocabulary until Leo introduced it to you. 

Love as a concept metaphysically has been around longer than philosophy, even. It is not originating from Leo.

Vedanta, Daoism, Confusian ren, ancient Greece, Christianity, Jewish Kabbalah, modern philosophy etc etc etc 

I could go on... 

[LambdaDelta]

9 hours ago, Joshe said:

Have you ever analyzed what a realization is and how they come into existence? 

If you analyze the chain of events and the relevant accumulations/iterations that involve a realization, you can (or at least I can) see the primary links of the chain that led to it. Even if you fail to see the chain, the chain is there. If you analyze those chains, you'll realize the realizations are never "discovered" - they're generated. 

A few questions: 

1. Has this idea ever crossed your mind? 

2. How does one distinguish "I found what was always there" from "consciousness rendered what I aimed at"? 

3. If it turned out that your 40+ realizations were generated rather than discovered, how would that impact you? 

Yes, and I 'realized' that they don't come into existence at all, they already exist, as does everything else. Anything 'new' (insight, life, action...) is an imagined distinction. There's no need for me to deny the chains — some I see, others I don't. #2: You make it sound as though the second option is somehow inferior because it implicitly strips you of agency or is illusory. A meaningless distinction. I (Consciousness) was always there, imagined forgetting what I am, plus the entire chain of events leading to an eventual rediscovery of the source. The two options seamlessly blend into a strange loop. Naive solipsistic idealism that doesn't incorporate Will and other important factors would indeed fail at eluding your mechanism, but this very mechanism is an indispensable part of the engine of reality; it works regardless of whether you're aware of or accept it or not, and it works with perfect precision and beauty. Try escaping it if you like, to a certain degree that's healthy skepticism, but ideally that would culminate in realizing that escaping it is impossible nor is there a need to, as you are the mechanism that has designed itself and all escape attempts. Thus, #3 becomes a moot point, since the difference between 'discovered' and 'generated' was itself generated (imagined), which doesn't bother me in the slightest. At any given moment I know and don't know as much as I need to, neither more nor less. All that's ever happening is light bouncing around at different angles within the fractal mirror of Mind ('happening', 'light', 'bouncing', 'different', 'angles', etc. are of course imaginary both as terms/concepts and the 'actual' things those words are pointing at). 

 

10 hours ago, Joshe said:

Maybe you guys should rewatch the video and see if you're applying your principles consistently.

Under the definition I previously gave and considering what's said above in this post, yes. You see, all of my wrongness, hypocrisy, and egotism are totally consistent with the trajectory Consciousness has set for me, and they'll be corrected (or not) when the time comes. Don't take this as avoidance of responsibility, I'm doing the best I can, as is everyone. 

 

10 hours ago, Joshe said:

Lastly, this pattern of assuming I need to be educated on basic shit is annoying and arrogant. The video you pointed me to is so basic I couldn't make it past 15 mins. I figured that stuff out in my 20s through simple observation of reality.

Unlike you, I rewatched the video in full. Maybe what's actually arrogant is going through 8% of the runtime and assuming the rest will just be the same since the introduction is already familiar to you. Imagine dropping a university class or some online course you bought because the instructor dedicated the first few lectures to reviewing and solidifying the priors/fundamentals. Without even going through 1/10th of the material, you presume to know it all. No wonder there are blind spots even in this simple framework you presented in this thread, let alone understanding of reality as a whole. Doesn't matter how potent your observation ability is, it's not enough; you still need talking heads, books, other perspectives, and much more, which can then be filtered and synthesized. Perhaps if you bothered to watch the full 3 hours you'd find many of your objections addressed. 

 

11 hours ago, Joshe said:

The difference is I didn’t merge my knowledge with my identity. 

Consider that you should. But also consider the nuances of that as to not dig yourself into a deeper hole. 

[LambdaDelta]

11 hours ago, Joshe said:

Leo disagrees.

Not really. Only when his job requires it. Just like a math teacher insists on the importance of learning math, or your parents on getting a good career or whatever. If they instead said that it's all a meaningless hobby and being an uneducated homeless drug addict is no better or worse, you can see how most people would choose to behave. But he explicitly stated that's it all a bias on several occasions. 

[Joshe]

4 hours ago, LambdaDelta said:

#2: You make it sound as though the second option is somehow inferior because it implicitly strips you of agency or is illusory. A meaningless distinction.

On the contrary, it's not inferior at all. I never thought it was, never said it was, and never implied that it was. 

Of course it's convenient to call it a meaningless distinction, because if you look at it closely, your 40+ realizations will be reduced to a hobby, no more significant than a grandma knitting a quilt. 

You guys think you're climbing to the heavens but you're climbing a horizontal ladder laid in the grass. I'm not knocking that, just like I wouldn't knock a grandma for knitting a quilt. What I'm knocking is the ego game and hierarchy this community is blind to. 

People think they're chasing after "Truth" because it's their "top value". But as said from the outset: for those most entrenched in this community, this is a cope that allows you to exist on a higher plane relative to everyone else. That higher plane is what you really want, not truth. It's nowhere near as simple as you "just want to know what is true".

If I were a true actualized member, I'd say something like: if you haven't realized this obvious self-deception yet, I feel sorry for you and I hope that one day you will be able to see the truth, because right now, you're lost in ego games and time is running out for you. Stop acting like you're too cool for school and go watch the ripping the fuck out of your ego series. 

But I don't talk like that because it's demeaning and I don't have a need to put myself above others. 

Setting that aside, either the hierarchy is based on something real or it's an ego game. One of us is wrong. 

This entire community unconsciously assumes "absolute this or that" is discovered rather than generated. If I am right, this would obviously be one of the MOST significant distinctions this community could make. But of course it would collapse the hierarchy, so it won't happen.