OBEler

The difference is, I was on the other side (the natural path) before for decades. So I know the other side very well. But the other side doesn't know the psychedelic using side. So they really are clueless. That's the difference.

From our common sense. It should be enough to see that sadghuru is spiritual more developed than trump through his actions, his speeches. You cannot say absolutely that and you can never prove that but then we already touch absolute truth and comparisons will be not possible.

That might be right from an absolute perspective but let's not destroy every discussion with such plump truth. Don't mix absolute truth with relative or we cannot even discuss about anything. It's like we discuss deeply a topic about which products are healthier, burger vs an apple and you come and tell everyone that there is no truth everyone is right. Because everyone lives in their reality and it's all subjective. It's like people who tell no one exists so no one is eating. Eating is an illusion. End of discussion.

@Salvijusok another example: Trump thinks sadghuru is delusional about spirituality.sadghuru thinks Trump is delusional about spirituality. Is there still one who is more delusional or are both equally delusional of spirituality overall? Just because both think of each other as delusional doesn't mean both are same delusional Now replace trump with non drug users and sadghuru with serious psychonauts. That's what I want to tell.

@Salvijus If you study spiral dynamics both groups, higher vs lower, think of each other that the other group is delusional. But from a meta perspective the higher one is less delusional than the lower one.

@Salvijus I know what I say will trigger some sober yogi people here. But it is what it is. Drug free vs drug users, it's funny to observe how mostly drug free users get angry at them and try to dismiss their achievements which are obviously way bigger in some fields (not in all of course). Especially in sports this makes a world difference between those two groups. Let's just be honest. They are jealous at them. Like Peter Ralston would probably jealous at Leo who didn't do much consciousness work like Ralston did. It dismisses somehow his work and I can understand that. Should I read Ralstons book or take 20 minutes of 5 Meo and then probably could write the book by myself after? But of course there exists natural people who even could outgrow drug users. It's pretty rare but possible and these people would with drugs probably go to levels no human accessed before.

Yes that happens, even after 5 Meo. I don't say this is delusional free. But I see so many people, especially here on this forum, who do yoga and meditation only and become even more and more delusional and stupid over time if they haven't done a good amount of psychedelics before. I think psychedelics will at least self correct you the deeper you go. With normal tools this would take decades. So better grow fast with some delusional states in-between than stay a stupid guy for decades until he reaches the next little yoga progression.

She took 5 meos. Yes then things happened. She became god. So what? When sadghuru was sitting on the mountain for hours also things happened. Do you think only yoga and meditation as a tool is allowed to raise your consciousness, otherwise it's false? This thinking is limited and cannot pass reality check. If someone pumps 300 kg with steroids in just a few months and the other one trains natural his whole life and pumps 120 kg, who at the end pumps more at a contest? You see the drug free one cannot even compete. So with consciousness work.

She says such things completely sober and it's her baseline reality, without taking anything. Well what I just want to show you that you have not found a proof against Solipsism at all. You are just taking wild assumptions

My girlfriend is enlightened, she cannot tell the difference between a real job offer and a scam job offer. She for me a very delusional being. She sees people who don't exist. If you think these people are somehow real, she also saw Mickey mouse.Yes Mickey mouse is not real for her, but I am also not real for her. She knows that no one exists and everything is one. There is only one. There you have it. Or do you think she is not enlightened enough? Can only sadghuru see the consciousness behind a person? Well I bet my girlfriend is already more enlightened than him even without yoga, without reading any spiritual books.

@Salvijus and that is what I meant that your argument is weak. You right now want to disprove solipsism with the claim that an enlightened being can see through things if they are real or not . Because they are so self conscious and connected they can see through things. Some super human detection of consciousness. In this claim are some heavy speculations. Are you enlightened? Do you know enlightened people who did this experiment successfully? Probably you think this would be the case but what if your assumptions are wrong? I know enlightened people who got scammed so these people are not somehow special to overcome delusions. I bet even Peter Ralston would fall in love with a followerin which is in truth a chatbot with a ai generated picture of a girl. If you think that would not be possible then you need to drop some fantasys of enlightened people.

I think you don't know how some deliriants work. You are completely functional and can have a strong sense of who you are, even stronger than in sober states. And then suddenly you see persons which dont exist. You can even talk to them for hours. Look for "Stechapfel" trip reports. Can't you think a little far in the future? To make it more obvious for: Let's take 1 million years of improvement into ai. What do you think would be capable of convincing a human that he talks with another human but it's ai? And ai already passed the turing test. Humans cannot differ anymore if they talk with an ai or not. Please don't come now with technical details or that you can still see the difference. Can't you go meta and see how this is possible? If not now then 100% in the future? But it's already now so if you have problems with looking into the future this one should not be so difficult. "Could you ever replicate the feeling of seeing an enlightened being in their eyes and having your whole being shaken" Well absolutely. You just resonate with what you see. Like watching porn videos can shake your whole being. And these porn videos don't need to be real, it can be manga porn.complete fantasy. By the way you can watch transmission YouTube videos and people tell same shaking experiences like in real life. But they just see Pixels on the screen. And pixels can be Generated. Ai can easy copy that just train them with some transmission videos and there you have it.

Yeah please think about what I mean here. Don't go into technical details I was just looking for an example how it would be possible. Remember, just one counter example needed and your whole proof is broken. You can also think about people who take deliriants and talk to persons which they imagine and they think it's 100% real. But in a nanosecond it vanished. You can also think about real persons talking to you via zoom but they are dead already and it's just a recording. There could be many other examples. VR avatars probably would be best to convince you.

I like your other comments but that evidence is weak. If I look in a remote video session into the people I see that it is consciousness in them like in me. However in the near future how do I know that these people are not ai generated ? If they are not real, 100% ai generated and no consciousness behind them, I still would probably recognize consciousness in them. But there is nothing behind them.

I gave Shee the advice to switching to observer mode.He told this got infinitely worse. I gave my girlfriend advice to concentrate on breath. Didn't help at all. And got even worse. Why don't help common psychological cope mechanisms help in a bad trip?

@Forestluv wow you vape in the middle of shamanic breathing session? How does this work? You need to hold the smoke in your lung for long time And what happens with combination of these techniques? Is it a good idea for someone like me who never had a breakthrough to test this combo of breathing and 5 Meo DMT out?

Yeah you are right, Ralston should at least try it.

Trump's voice is somehow destroyed. Hear his voice if he speaks moderate. Does he have a cold? Is it his age?It's really broken

@Javfly33 haha I mean just it all is such a flow state, I do automatically almost. I feel everything 100 times more intensive. I am so focused. Try it out and see

I thought also about that. This game will be reality one day. Will probably suck hard but it will be a unique game.

@Ishanga I hope you will get the chance one day. Don't wait too long Besides that this forum is evolving. So it is not always the same talk, also not always the same people. We all evolve. New techniques, new advanced topics come out, new focus. We had very good posts this year, especially about politics.

Thanks for sharing! I don't know, this bad feeling what exactly is it. Could be ego backslash but could also hangover effects from psychedelics. I had hangovers as a beginner but it vanished after some tries and now I get good after effects. But often I don't recognize anythingnand feel total normal. Rarely feel I bad

@inFlow can you elaborate what exactly happened? I feel psychedelics heal/improve your chacra/energy system if you dose right.

@Javfly33 to point 3, LSD helps strongly on this one. This will not be boring. It's like you become shambhavi mahamudra. You merge with this exercise

@davecraw i discovered this recently. It is the most incredible experience I had on LSD or should I say on shambhavi mahamudra. Please try it out and report. As I said 1/4 of LSD tab is enough (I didn't try out higher. Kundalini awakening will be guaranteed I think so don't dose too high). Wait 2-3 hours until you really trip and then execute shambhavi mahamudra. So different! I understand now way better how this yoga exercise works