UnbornTao

Perceive what? You just wouldn't know what you are not perceiving, it seems to me. For example humans can't hear sounds outside a certain frequency range. A blind person simply doesn't have the faculty of sight -- it's not that she perceives the absence of this perceptive faculty. In her mind, there's no context in which to accurately represent or conceive of the existence of sight.

It does seem like perceptive organs, or some such, are a prerequisite for perception to occur. I wouldn't call it infinite. (I'm trying to appear humble).

We don't even know whether we, as selves, exist or not, or what our nature is.

Why doesn't the self want to look at itself? What is the nature of the entity doing the avoiding?

If we could pinpoint "experience", what would we point at? It might be that sensation and concept are experienced, yet we're tackling the fact of experience itself, rather than the "experience" of something. What is that about -- when concept is set aside?

What is your experience of experience?

@blackchair English-only, please rewrite the post. Thanks.

@Natasha Tori Maru Okay, thank you.

@Davino I haven't looked into that principle but it may be useful to start with balance as a physical dynamic, since that helps us ground the investigation. For example what does it take for the body to be balanced? What creates balance? Also, as some of your questions might be implying, is balance a function of external things, or is it more about you and your relationship to things? Something to think about! Please share what comes to mind.

We can observe that experience always occurs now, yet this now is not readily apprehended nor does it seem to be dependent on time. What we commonly consider now is a process and so it isn't actually now, as in when we say "I'm angry now," which is an activity that arises to serve some end. Without any concept, even without the assertions above, what's experience? How do you see perception and its relation to experience?

@ougyarg Good to hear, thank you.

Be open! For God's sake.

Is that because of my response? I'm just saying an answer can't do the job.

@Daniel Balan You want to run around the house without meeting the host. We don't know what relative/absolute is, so staying open is necessary.

You want an answer to a question, what does that give you? As an analogy, it's like asking the math teacher for a solution to the equation you're trying to solve. By all means keep looking into it, ask yourself what it is and go after an insight.

What did you take out of it, specifically? What principles did you get a handle on? What insights did you have? What would you say contributed to your growth the most? Also, how do you see communication and listening now?

A couple definitions to keep us going: experience: something personally encountered, undergone, or lived through the act or process of directly perceiving events or reality

@Someone here Zen stick for you.

You're engaging in speculation. Again, you need to get over this tacit assumption of yours that something you haven't investigated is impossible to discover because of a predetermined outcome that you hold in your mind. It isn't discovered until it is discovered. And I'm not saying it will be known as an answer; I'm just encouraging real openness. You might as well start with what language is, and how it is meant to represent experiences, but that's for another thread if you want to open it. For now, you're invited to focus on what experience is, not what you think about it. Avoid abstraction.

Start contemplating something already.

You're talking about things other than consciousness, which isn't madness; it's just being conscious of what is already true. An unprecedented openness might result from that but those are functions of mind, and activities. If that were the case, how come awakened individuals generally seem to be freer than most of us? Hey, it might turn out to be the other way around -- consciousness being the recognition of inherent wholeness at last. We may be getting sidetracked from the main topic, though.

Yep, tricky subject. I like this, although it doesn't seem to point to what it is in and of itself.

I see, thanks. Exactly.