UnbornTao

"Hey I'm nice please sleep with me"

Maybe, it is whatever it is, go contemplate.

Didn't say that. I said that the Absolute is whatever's absolutely true, it is not a matter of only or many. But yeah, it is deliberate that I don't fill in the blanks about what "the absolute" is, primarily because I'm not conscious of it and even if I were, you'd tend to either believe it or dismiss it which are irrelevant, the only thing that matters here is direct, personal consciousness. Get you. That's all. Grounding helps as a way to direct the mind. It's a way to create a common ground so that we can talk about some matter. When it comes to enlightenment, it doesn't really matter, except perhaps in order to not to further bog down the mind with useless stuff. It also keeps you honest and tied to your experience, so it helps in that. These are still relative, which is okay -- language, communication, practices. The absolute, on the other hand, is unknown; better to toss everything you've got about it. It's up for grabs.

Maybe something that appears to exist but actually isn't true.

Finally a God I can get on board with.

A third possibility: experiencing the emotion fully without having to act it out nor suppress it.

Sure. Possibility is literally open-ended. But in order to talk about any topic at all, some grounding is needed. Saying it's all god doesn't say much, does it? It still leaves the question what is god open. So time to get down to business.

We should be careful not to conflate our understanding of a model with understanding what the model aims to represent. This is a subtle point that bears repeating. But good work overall.

@Yimpa what? We would also need to know what a paradigm is. But that's a different discussion. Paradigms are relative, your true nature may not be.

Okey-dokey.

You can start taking responsibility for your own thinking, feeling and acting now. A few superficial manifestations of this principle: If I'm overweight, I can start moving and eating healthy. If I smoke, I can stop smoking. If I feel incapable, I can increase my personal effectiveness If I can't focus for long, I can read and meditate consistently If I dislike my environment, I can either move or change my disposition If I do disempowering shit, I can do functional shit

@vibv Are you committed to ignorance or to whatever's true? You can't lie your way to the truth. In any case, live however you want. Happy contemplation.

Why bring up things such as evolution and omniscience when talking about one's nature? Confabulating is not contemplating. It's possible for you to become personally conscious of your nature. You only need you, everything else -- belief, concept, conclusion, knowledge, hearsay -- gets in the way. So dropping them leaves you with less crap added on top. What you've got of enlightenment is all fantasy. You can trust me on that, or not, I don't mind. Advancing evolution is a completely different pursuit, awakening is not relative. Again, avoid jumping to conclusions, remain open, face the "wall" of uncertainty and stay there. Listen, be honest. Be ruthlessly honest with yourself. Once that's done, be even more honest. It's actually OK to not be conscious of what one is. It's not a bad -- neither is it good, it's just simply the case. This is not meant to make you or anybody else wrong but to put you back on track on contemplating. I apply this advice to myself as well. I'm starting to think people don't like their fantasies being destroyed.

Set out to experience what it is.

@vibv @Yimpa barking up the wrong tree. What you conceive can't possibly be it, idea, belief, expectation is all fantasy and you don't need it. This matter is inconceivable. Mind will make stuff up about it regardless. Just get you. If it's absolute, the only thing to do is grasping what is. The experience of grasping the nature of something is fundamentally different from the expression that arises out of that understanding. Hearsay is of no use when engaging in self-inquiry. You pretend that by convincing yourself with explanations, you now understand the matter while you also lack the consciousness that sourced the expression in the first place, if it was an authentic experience. In your experience, are you absolutely certain of who and what you are? Are you deeply conscious of that? Remember, be honest. Bottom line: pretty much nobody knows so there's a shitload of contemplation to be done, not just about you, mind, life, other, and reality but also about relative aspects such as emotions, perception, experience, skill, the body, etc.

@Yimpa @vibv you guys should stop making up nonsense. Is it that hard to contemplate? Everything you have about enlightenment is crap, seriously. Toss it. It just gets in the way.

Ok then.

I doubt it. Give it a decade or two.

Why hasn't he predicted the next lottery number winner and gets rich already?

Thinking of enlightenment as a paradigm, something to transcend. If it's absolute it can't be grasped by mind and is best left as an unknown. I don't think you can truly understanding life, self and reality without "enlightenments". Are you absolutely and completely conscious of everything there is? Is there more you could become conscious of, both in the relative and absolute domains? Be honest with yourself. It's OK you don't know. As a matter of fact it's the game in town.

@vibv Have several enlightenments first. Can't transcend what you are not conscious of. In any case, it is silly to think that it can be transcended. You are talking about something relative, perhaps an insight, and may have concluded this is all there is to the story. I'm suggesting you might actually not know what enlightenment is. In that case, remaining open and contemplating, as if you were waiting, is better than making conclusions. In your post there's a lot of "stuff", not you.

No. Not offended. It's just clear you are conflating relative things and are trying to concoct or validate a certain cosmology. That has nothing to do with enlightenment work. Your mind is trying to rationalize the matter which is OK but it isn't it.

You're full of it. It's possible you've had insights but enlightenment is a different matter and there's nothing to work out. Have several enlightenments first. Until then, it is best not to presume to know what that is.

Speculation is making stuff up based on conclusions and assumptions whereas contemplating is truly aiming to grasp what's true about any subject matter beyond belief and ideas. The boundary is set depending on how you hold these distinctions. One is based on not-knowing, the other on ignorance.