Elisabeth

@petar8p I agree that the green color kinda influences who we notice on the forum. The hierarchy seems on purpose. Leo is a firm believer in developmental stages, and in there being noticeably different levels of consciousness. He chooses his mods, meaning he chooses whom to trust with the power that comes with moderation rights, so as to have a group of helpers who are reasonably developed and resonating with his vision for the forum. The hierarchy is necessary since moderation is necessary. Marking mods highlighted is a choice that has pros and cons. A lack of transparency would cause ample problems. Like this, you almost can't help noticing a mod anytime he writes something, even if they just express their very subjective opinions, however, they are also very self-aware of what they say, because they know they'll be watched more closely. However, sometimes I also find the green names distracting. I'd prefer if the mods had a way to mark certain posts where they exercise their moderation power - like locking a thread or issuing a warning to the debating parties - and otherwise wouldn't stand out that much.

Should I really do techniques that bring up stuff? Does "shadow work" ever end? I'm mostly happy with my path, but sometimes I've also wondered how much it destabilizes me and if it's worth it. Kinda the "dark side of meditation/psychedelics/breathwork" question.

@VeganAwake Good luck and thank you!

Thank you for trying, but these are only words for me, they miss the mark. I know that's how Fred talks about nonduality, but mostly it was his meditations and pointers ... sometimes ... got me into the right mindset (?) for direct inquiry, reading isn't doing the same for me. You wanted to know if anyone had insight from Fred's material, so I gave you my experience, that's all. I'm curious how your one on one session turns out

I watched some (well, quite a lot) of Freds video's and no, I'm not awake... but some of them send chills down my spine, which I take as the ego defending itself.

I see. I'm thinking about what your group can offer. Discussion of topics and feedback, sure. But these will be very different depending on the level, as you say, advanced people don't want to form a group with beginners only. Therefore I would say you need people of about the same level - driven beginners (to intermediates) eager to get into the field. If that's your companions, maybe making goal-setting and accountability one of the main points on schedule is not a bad idea. You learn together and within a year your beginner group can advance to intermediate. It depends though what your personal needs are from this group. If you need to speak to someone advanced, asking for mentoring may be more appropriate.

Ok, you don't have to be very specific. But tell us more, because different fields work very differently. Are there a lot of other beginners around you? Is it very competitive, are those people competing with you at the same time? It would be very different to set up a group in science vs. in business vs. in social work.

Interesting, I'll follow. What's your field?

Would it be possible next time to snap out of panic enough to tell your bf that you're taking a sleeping pill and cancelling your date? Because it seems that now knowing what happened is what freaked him out. Understandably, I'd say.

... and I have to tell you because I can't stop thinking about it So I was just randomly browsing job offers, and there was an unusual one: A small nonprofit networking other nonprofits regardless of their particular area of impact. I immediately thought it's a good endeavour, and I went to the nonprofit's website, read about their values and mission and thought "wow, yellow". The job they offer is to network leaders of non-profit organizations across the "Visegrád Four". (At first I didn't realize this was the case, I thought I could start in just Czechia ) I applied, and amazingly, was considered, because of my experience with personal development and facilitating small groups. (Btw. the director absolutely knows Spiral dynamics and subscribes to Wilber's "integral" vision.) I have no experience with either the non-profit sector, the V4 region, networking organizations, evaluation of projects, or organizing big events, and the little I know about Hungarian politics is scary. i was totally honest about my (lack of) experience at the interview. Since then I'm thinking. It's likely they will take someone else, but what if they do call back? Could I take this challenging endeavour on, or is that too much of a jump? Will I be able to facilitate communication between leaders of foreign NGO's operating in a harsh political climate??? I'm a good listener and often I can point out the important, but generally, I tend to be kinda shy in communication. Do I want to travel every month? Also, I haven't been interested in politics very much so far - that would have to change, and I don't know if it would bother me to follow all the trouble closely (as has been the case so far), or if I'd be able to take it as a necessary and interesting part of work. It's clear that this is potentially way more impactful and meaningful than the phd in physics that I'm doing now. But I'm unsure whether I would be able to rise to the challenge. Comments welcome.

It's "spiral dynamics" stage yellow, and it's rather rare to find organizations this advanced. Of course, labeling this one as yellow is based just on my own understanding of the model.

@Omni Thanks a lot for your post, especially the bit about these being my expectations is spot on. I somehow knew, but I still need to hear that. My purpose is still at the making. I think I need more real-world experience. I have some experience with groups. I have made at least two posts here on the forum about my search for purpose (the first one is more a result of contemplation, the second one is a bit more of a momentary mood, but still somehow true)

Nope, something else. Could be still green though, yeah. I didn't get the position yet, so don't worry

@Aquarius Yes please. Tell us about the "accidental" overdose. That does not sound healthy either Are you ok now?

@Strangeloop I think the thing you are hinting at is where your subconscious doesn't really recognize a negative sentence. So you shouldn't use them in affirmations and other techniques trying to influence your subconscious. But don't worry, your neocortex/waking mind is perfectly capable of recognizing a no.

Yes. Go for money and status, just temper the worst exploitative excesses you might be inclined to do. Getting a business or a job might be enough to get you interested in the next level.

@Preety_India What Leo sais is good. You can also try to change the communication style by setting boundaries. If he shames you, you can point it out and insist that you are bothered by this, even if he tries to downplay it all. Be consistent, don't let shaming remarks slide just because you don't want to "ruin" the moment by conflict. If he's unconscious of what he's doing yet willing to change, he may learn from this. He may also react badly and escalate his violence. Then you know for sure it's time to leave. Of course, leaving right away is alright too, if you're not happy in the relationship overall.

Hi, I'm thinking about preparing a lecture about spiral dynamics, or perhaps adult development in general, so as to spread the message. However, citing Don Beck's books as the only source for spiral dynamics knowledge doesn't seem quite convincing. Has the SD model been confirmed by further research in the last two decades? Or is it a one-man show? I know Ken Wilber supposedly wrote a book comparing different developmental models - which one is it? Should I perhaps take some kind of a more mainstream view on cultural development than the (trademarked) spiral dynamics? Leo has talked at length about how SD is relevant to American politics, but how about Europe, and post-communist countries especially? Are there any books which apply spiral dynamics to the development in the former "eastern block"? Is there any literature on how to help societies transcend into more green and yellow? Thanks a lot

I asked my facebook friend, who's like the head of a sociological institute, if he's ever heard about Clare Graves or Spiral dynamics, and... guess what, he hasn't. It's probably really fringe ideas. I know SD is known in coaching circles, and maybe Ken Wilber is better known in USA, but nope, not our sociology. Knowing how academic research works today, I'm not surprised - you can't take on broad bold subjects, because you have to deliver quick results.

@Dan502 The thing is, we have a very bottom-up new political party in Czech Republic. They are getting a lot of conscious politics right, I would say a lot of their base is still orange(-green), but the leaders aspire to green-yellow. I thought it would be totally cool if at least some people in that party had this tool at their disposal. I don't know exactly how to reach that audience yet, but they have platforms such as "open university" where anyone can speak, so it might be doable. However it's probably not going to happen, as I'm extremely nervous Maybe I'll try a 'safer' audience of people who I know first to get some confidence, or I'll find a communication channel which doesn't involve my public speaking on a topic where I'm still shaky.

@Girzo Thank you! @Leo Gura Thank you too. Yes I still seek authority. It's partly because I'm afraid to speak. I know dismissive reactions will come, and I can't stand my ground. Of course, this could be because my understanding is not deep enough. Even if there is not a wide consensus, I was hoping to see at least some new supporting evidence from academic circles - spiral dynamics being around for 20+ years.

I got some of my answers from this website http://www.integratedsociopsychology.net/ The author makes an effort to compare the different developmental models out there and comments on discrepancies. Seems some of them are sorta kinda in agreement. But she will admit there hasn't been enough research, and stuff is unclear - even stuff like whether you can skip stages. Even stuff like whether Maslow's pyramid is a valid model, i.e. whether higher needs only emerge when lower needs are satisfied and whether they emerge in the same order in all people (she hints they probably don't). I find myself torn between "I knew it, the model(s) can be trusted", and "I knew it, the model(s) can't be trusted". Like, yeah, the overall picture is interesting, but some of the most suspicious parts? Serious researchers have also questioned them and came up with contradictions to the original claim. It seems to me psychological "rules" never ever apply to everyone. The most questionable claim of spiral dynamics - to me it is still this connection between culture and the individual. I suspect the link between cultural history & competing stages in the contemporary world & and individual development isn't quite working. After all if you're born to green parents, you'll probably never go the same kind of orange as someone who wasn't in touch with green. But maybe I don't understand it right.

I think what they do in my area is select the "peer consultants" well, give them some basic training, and supervision - really important. Over here it's probably funded either by the government or by EU grants. So there are some real psychiatrists or psychologists looking over for the program, and some money available both for the consultants and the medical people involved. But I mean, someone had to have the idea, engage the people, apply for the grants. And maybe you'll figure out other ways of financing. There are also self-help organizations less tied to medical professions, AA being a well known one, but I also know about one for people with social anxiety, for eating disorders, etc. There's probably good knowledge available.

@wk197 The thing is, a big age difference is not always a problem, but in some cases, it amplifies or induces abusive relationships dynamics. If your partner is much older, there is almost automatically a power differential introduced into your relationship: the opinion of the "more experienced" matters more, the older one tends to have more money and possessions, somehow they are the one setting the tone. That's why not-so-healthy men who want to be in control will date young girls who can be influenced easily. Even if both people are healthy and well-intentioned, the power differential is definitely something to be conscious about, because if you aren't, you can fall into abusive patterns by accident. An age difference of 10 years is not much of a problem if you are 25 and out of school and your partner is 35, but if you're 18 and don't make any money of your own yet and your partner is 28 and confident... yeah, there can be some problems.

Actually I do have one idea that you could also use, there's a "peer to peer" program at our local mental hospital where ill people can talk to someone more experienced who have been battling mental illness for quite some time. If that appeals, maybe you could start a program like that.