Natasha Tori Maru

I refer to the illusory self in that .. it appeared to be present, then did not. As a deception we generate that acts as a sort of overlay between awareness and object. But otherwise, I do not think I follow!?

Unfortunately, this is how the average normie - and even some users here - react to being told this. They refuse to look into it. All they hear is 'he is saying I am the cause of my mental problems, fuck you'. The obhur any responsibility pushed onto them. It doesn't occur to them it might be THEM generating suffering or illness: despite the fact 2 people can have the same experience, but both are not guaranteed to walk away with trauma. Even that does not promote enquiry. It seems obvious to me to want to investigate what is happening there? What is one person doing (or not doing!) that is causing trauma and mental illness. Wooooosh

Do you think you can miss details as a result of seeing the overarching direction? I have this issue - I try to be aware of it. In addition - I pay no heed to the truthfulness of statements made in isolation. Which can make me irritated when I read a truth because I can think of a few contexts in which it doesn't apply.... I admire logical thinkers who go for pure definitions. And that is because I miss relevant details as I seem to only pay attention to the parts I can directly apply. I default to 'how can I use this' with truth So I never get to the point of asking 'is this true in all situations?' instead it is 'how is this truth relevant to this and how can I gain leverage with it'. Another shortfall of mine I am working on to enhance my thinking. BOY THATS A LOT OF OVERTHINKING

Fuck, it's so true - I just remembered greentext, trips, quads, 'rolling', Zyzz... all 4chan. Not to mention the gratuitous cocks and pussys you randomly encounter in the most benign places....

@ivankiss Some of the most vile shit on the internet originated in that cesspool. /b/ is one of the most famous boards. Meme's evolved out of 4chan as it is predominantly an imageboard with no retained history. And anonymous. NEETs, incels all originated there before they evolved out into the 'pills' red/black etc I spent wayyyy too much time there mid 2000's while at uni.

Horse racing. Greyhound racing. Cock fights IE using animals for sport

@Adrian colby 🎯

I agree with this take! FWIW I do not feel triggered at all when watching Sadhguru - my hypothesis above was just a general possible reason others feel emotional reaction to him. I have never had any sort of emotional reaction to listening to him. Your point regarding him cutting into a question before the interviewer is valid also - and it is something I had to train myself out of in dialogue with others: I get an immediate sense for where the question is leading to so quickly, I feel the need to interrupt to cut the enquiry off to prevent the person (and myself) from wasting energy. The reason I trained myself out of this? The person often felt unheard, or that I was dismissing them. This resulted in me being labelled a snob and arrogant in my younger years - so I think it is a habit he may have adopted with the thought 'I will prevent you wasting time' rather than 'I know what you are going to say and it is irrelevant'. Just one possible reason he does this, and has good intentions behind it (saving energy) On the flip side is - behind that lies the assumption he KNOWS where this is going. And that IS actually slightly arrogant - because sometimes you cannot predict the direction an enquiry will go. It is a huge asset to remain open - and he does appear to be closed off in this way. It shows assumption - another reason his delivery might not agree with others. When I witness this, I see it as a function of certainty and confidence - but many do not see it this way. Speaking for myself - often I know exactly where something is going, but I now hold my tongue as the recipient being heard is a way for me to 'plate up' my answer in a nice way for them to enjoy the eating, rather than gag because I threw the food on the ground and said 'Here, enjoy your gruel'. It makes a point easier to integrate for the recipient. I had to learn patience. Yes, I felt this too - but this might also come down to the interviewers. They may have needed to really think on how they can ask questions in different ways to prompt a deeper answer from Sadhguru. When I have interviewed others, I have done extensive research into the person prior to the interview and deliberately targeted areas of enquiry that I felt had not been probed. And formulated my questions in different ways as a prompt to reframe the answer. Sadhguru - like Leo - has his style. So it seems to me necessary to take a different approach to questioning him. I wouldn't have the hope for him to change his style based on my questions

I do not. Which is weird because I normally get reads and feelings from people when I pay attention. Just within the context of this interview - my impression was Sadhguru had a bit of mirth with his delivery, almost laughing at 'westerners' not seeing the obvious. It appears to me he is so far removed from the experience of typical seekers his delivery fell flat, as he seems unable to bridge the gap between his experience and the typical seeker. I have no issue with the substance of what he teaches and says - I think it's valid. The delivery was just very odd to me, and I felt wholly unsatisfied with how he answered Dr. K's questions.

Leo is integrating emptiness 😜

@OBEler you found it! I was trying to search for that clip between meetings at work. I accidentally fucking shared my screen trying to dig it out! Cheers

I believe psychedelics increase the connections between neurons within the brain, as well as promoting growth and strength (prefrontal cortex). In addition there has been a lot of evidence shown they shut down the default mode network - responsible in part for the identification of the 'self'. No self ay? So I imagine this is part of the mechanism behind removing the illusion of the self and assisting with breaking down deception.

Same. I actually return to it often and read passages as a refresher. I find as I grow, my perspective shifts. The result is I see something new upon revisit.

@Socrates sure, you do you boo. But there is a mature and open way of approaching conversation available to you. And you chose not to take it. Evidenced by phrasing and tone. It's a discussion, not an emotional dumping ground.

@Socrates why are you so upset?

I think users here are underestimating just how bogged down people are in their minds. You can silence the mind - but it is hard. You effectively have to train it into yourself like a habit with thought-disidentification. Practice will get you there - but this comes easier to some more than others. Think 20 years of doing something you are trying to stop. You won't even realise you are doing it. How often do you pick up your phone to read a message and find yourself on Instagram? Habits. Thoughts. Unconscious actions.

He did say a few times you 'stop doing it' using the walking analogy. Silent mind does imply a cessation of something being done. 'Mind diarrhea' was also used. Excessive thinking/worry which is the root of compulsion. And he says that needs to stop. Stop doing it. It is just that he doesn't make clear the necessary actionable steps to do this. Thought dis-identification is the beginning - but I think the purpose of the interview was that Dr K wanted to know the mechanisms going on there. As is his bias being a doctor and all

@Adrian colby I think if Leo screens well and for maturity he can bullseye the type of experience with individuals as you describe. Being able to sit with unpleasant feelings when deep concepts and ideas are being explored is a huge deal. When you probe too deep with most people they nope out due to emotional reaction over their capacity to handle it. This is one of the issues I have run into in new age circles, as it just so happens most face-to-face gatherings are of this 'new age' spiritual type. It also takes a mature person not to make meaning and with-hold that mechanism when some of the deeper truths are spoken of. No self, solipsism etc - if these are approached without maturity, one of the issues I have seen (in my own circles), is seekers making meaning and drawing false conclusions based on insights handed to them incautiously. 'It's all imagination' = I can do whatever the fuck I want, consequences and integrity be damned. Generally a mature & open person will withhold judgement or false meaning making. A retreat with these sorts of individuals, especially in a facilitated manner, would be really special.

I think maybe people expected Dr K to elicit a deeper elaboration from Sadhguru than his standard guru 'talking at you' mode. More like a western Q&A style interview. People probably thought he was going into actionable steps and deep mechanisms to try to fix mental issues - instead it is just 'mind/body is being poisoned by bad dirt' 'realise you do it' . It is just that most people simply cannot realise that. I suspect maybe Sadhguru thinks stating this will unravel the complex - but some people are so stuck in habits (something they do they aren't conscious of) a simple realisation won't cut it. If you have been doing something for 10 years unconsciously, most of the time its going to take some additional work to unravel the complex involved. Not always, but commonly - and this is where the whole 'you can't teach an old dog new tricks' saying comes from. People naturally become fossilised into their habits as they age. I think it is easy to read Sadhguru as arrogant because he doesn't hide his rather incredulous (mixed with some laughter) disposition people cannot have the 'you are doing it, just stop' realisation. To him, it seems so simple. I feel he is literally dumbfounded and cannot suppress this, which comes across as insulting. This is independent of him being right or wrong. Most people will totally miss the message based on how it is being served up - too much salty seasoning for them to taste the meat underneath. Hard to have clarity of mind when emotions are being triggered. Just how I read it, totally subjective.

Probably my most influential book so far 🌱 Not only spirituality, but applied directly in career !

It has a bit more culture going on, and due to less anonymity than say, Reddit, I appreciate the ability to have rapport with others. There is some measure of forced integrity that prevents de-evolution into full cesspit mode a la 4chan/Reddit. More like the old-school forums circa 2000. I also appreciate the overall focus, even when we all go into banter mode. We usually boomerang back to the topics involving contemplation, enquiry with good openness 🙂

@Leo Gura Pink Floyd?

'Don't Die' religion he wants to spread, 'my competitor is Jesus' - Bryan Johnson. Ex-mormon. He wants everyone to live by an AI algorithm that tells them what to do. He hosts dinners to convince people. I am sure he has done more psychedelics than just ketamine. The above are facts if you look hard enough. His experiement is N=1 and not very well controlled, but he's trying something new which is interesting. I think his doctor abandoned him when they had several disagreement. It seems his fixation on not dying has innoculated him from really living, having 'experience'. This is just how it comes across due to his rigidity. Coupled with claiming experiment is for health and health span, but he puts a lot of work into appearance and surface stuff. Not sure what to think really !

@emil1234 Agree, I too noticed the dogpiling. Normally in a neutral toned Q & A, questions are open. But in this case, users are framing the questions loaded with some pre-formed assumptions. Which sets a certain tone to things. A tone you can feel but not often put your finger on.

Explore concept that has been a ponderance of art for many a year: to separate art, from artist.