Natasha Tori Maru

@Thought Art Oh yes that is all good - not contesting how you feel or the validity of it. It just seems like there could be more at stake here - and maybe Leo's reaction is what is at stake for you, and less so Bryan and his worldview !

There is some contradictory behaviour with Bryan also - don't we think? I find it strange he dyes his hair, got false teeth, injected fat into his face. Focus' in hair regrowth. I suppose on the one hand you can say this is part of the experiment - but not all he does it for longevity or the benefit of others. Despite him earnestly attempting to communicate this message. There is vanity there I wonder why he does not own? He could be bypassing this vanity with longevity arguments. One other part I find odd: if just losing a small amount of sleep or changing schedule so slightly totally bricks your mood/energy/experience I have to wonder about that. It communicates fragility, not resilience.

@Emerald I get it For me I love using this forum to reveal ego and become triggered. I allow all my reactions and emotions and observe them. Accurately name them. Find their root cause. I am always rejecting something within myself when I disown, disagree or have a catalytic conversation. And I want to integrate all sides as an attempt to discern, but not judge. To bring wholeness and unity to my experience. In particular I often learn a lot when I am prompted to gently provoke others

Do you perceive it as inauthentic because you do not think so harshly of Bryan, but others do not share this opinion? I ask as in previous threads relating to Bryan, you have always appeared to be defending him. Just a theme I noticed. My brother has used psychedelics. His experience did not widen his view at all.... Agree. The religious stuff he goes for is what gets me as well. He hosts dinners sort of as a long format enquiry and introduction to his religion he is attempting to grow 'Don't Die'. Those dinners are very odd endeavours (if anyone cares to watch them, a couple are on Youtube). Does he fear death? That tells you all.

I purge a lot of emotion and expression here. I am determined to understand all perspectives. Posting here has rid me of a lot of shame I never knew I was carrying. I don't understand the process, only that it is processing Always value and appreciate your contributions, Emerald !

Suppression is what I see. 99% of the time.

Wasn't sure where to put this tbh - thought some of you might enjoy this. Not a fan of DOAC but thought the debate was interesting. I don't think Greg Koukl (Christian) or Dr K (psychiatrist) had the rigor of Alex O’Connor (atheist), but it was interesting as it went from meaning, purpose, God, psychedelics, panpsychism, motivation and back again.

Consider this masculine/feminine frame can also be limiting. It might be worth enquiring onto how looking at the world this way 1) benefits and 2) detracts. This might also to help to realise why you use the frame itself. Is it to find a romantic relationship? To grow yourself? Equinimity? In medical professions, when a treatment just isn't working, this usually means the diagnosis is incorrect and needs some further investigation.

Yep, got it. I am not leading anywhere with these questions btw - just open, probing enquiry to find out where interests generally lie. And maybe unexamined values. But no need to answer if these sorts of questions bring up stuff ❤️

What would you rather do, in that case?

Do you feel like 'sticking to it' is a waste of time? In which case, are there a host of things you would rather be doing that fall into 'pleasure seeking?'

Haha everyone projecting their own reasons for Leo's travel destinations onto him 🤪

Definitely depends on intention. Back and forth can also facilitate union. I think perhaps you are assuming what others are attempting or the meaning behind the dialogue.

@Emerald interesting point regarding the study. Perhaps the deciding factor is choice and personal conduct. Veganism is a choice - and when we choose differently to others (especially when this choice is ethical or runs counter to society norms) it forces people to reflect on their own behaviour. Something like race does not have the loaded nature of choice associated with it. I find similar issue when others find out I do not drink or eat processed food. Problematic in Australia as our drinking culture is intense. People bond through alcohol. And yes I did raise that with Coral (that transparency is always best from the outset), she simply viewed it as removing obstacles to dates or life options. But that in itself is problematic: one should not have to pretzel themselves into something else to get on. I dislike that sort of behaviour in myself because it breeds resentment over time. Resentment is poison to me.

One of my housemates around 2020 was a vegan and openly dating on apps (women). When we interviewed her to move in she never mentioned she was a vegan. We found out a week in when she casually mentioned it. I, in my usual direct way, asked why TF she didn't tell us when we were interviewing her: 'I just find it invites trouble and prejudice. It's easier to just do my thing and not impact anyone else. Mentioning I am a vegan has gotten me rejected from applications' Apparently she had asked why she missed out on a few houses and the girls all reported it was the vegan thing. This housemate was chill, and totally fine with seeing meat and using a kitchen where meat had been prepped. She didn't impede on others. Same shit with dating. She would never mention she was a vegan unless she really had to. Her mindset was her eating habits wouldn't impact anyone else (or shouldn't), and she could usually find something to eat that was vegan on any menu. Weird thing to have to hide, but that's how she approached it dating wise. She hid what others might reject her for 🥹 She was also the first chick I lived with that told me her family was haunted. And I dismissed her... Until I saw some wack as fuck shit happen while she lives with us.

Apologies OP, for the derail. Definitely continue on here we will keep in back in track 🌱🙏

I think the dialogue between Breakingthewall & Zurew was an attempt to understand differing views, not agree or disagree - just how I perceived it. If that's what you reference 🙃

Everything you do at a normal hippies festival - just minus the clothes Music, dancing, acid/shrooms, yoga, markets, performers, body painting. Drum circles, workshops.... and just lots of socializing. Being naked completely changes how open people are in this bizarre way - you've seen them without clothes, so people were always so earnest/genuine They are pretty strict though - consent, zero tolerance for creeps or staring/photos. No sexual behavior in public areas. In private though of course there is a LOT of sex. Definitely contributed to me breaking free of inhibitions

Oh - what makes you think I do not care? I may have not expressed myself properly. It is not that I do not care - I do. But I am confident and secure my partner is with me for me. I trust they want to be with me, and to be honest if they change their mind. In an open relationship: it is just respectful as that has always been the terms I have entered into one on. STIs are a large factor there, as even protection can fail. And some people have diseases they do not disclose. In a committed monogamous relationship: I would expect someone to be honest and not just have sex with someone else. If they are feeling that need then I would expect them to be mature and talk about it rather than just fuck someone else I dunno, isn't it normal to expect communication?

I think women might be able to intercept and have a clearer understanding of their own emotions. But this could be a function of society; men are often told to 'get on with it' and could be trained out of emotional awareness. In my experience its been pretty equal. But in no way does this translate to being able to effectively communicate clear boundaries! My experience mirrors yours. Men and women both have issues with mature boundaries and effective communication. Good luck to us both on the search

I do not view flirting as necessarily sexual. I have a very loose definition of the term. I do not have to be attracted to a person to flirt with them. It doesn't have to be related to how they appear. It is more an intellectual joust; wit, banter, subtext, humor, timing, facial expression. Flirting is simply a signal to me. A display. Ego play. I flirt with women all the time. Kissing and sex are actions and have can have consequences. Bonding hormones, expectations, instinctual pair bonding circuits. There can be real effects from this sort of behavior when not communicated (disease). This is all just my opinion based on values of course. I have a very open fluid view of sex. I am not possessive of partners or 'claim' them. I have no hang-ups or boundaries like a normal person. I have no shame regarding sex. It is just pleasure like food. I suppose I do not have many 'conformist' society ideals baked into it. Very much stemming from how I was raised. Been to many a nudist festival I am mostly cautious because others have very strict boundaries around the act. For me it is simply a preference: flirting is chill. No need for permission. Kissing and sex with someone else? As long as it is communicated beforehand I am chill.

That is a line for me. If it were an open relationship (regarding kissing/sex) - in the past I have always been with partners who communicated their intentions prior to engaging another partner. I've been in committed relationships where my boyfriend flirted casually with women, but it was always an interesting talking point to dissect between us. If for any reason I felt insecure (about a partners flirting) I would openly state it. But I am very direct, which I do not think is usual for most women (can be men also, within relationships). I don't like leaving things unsaid. Even if it hurts a bit. Better to say it outright than let it fester. Nothing kills a relationship faster than resentment. My stance on flirting is unusual, I think

I think this should have been the premise - make it set in ancient Mesopotamia and work it into some of the mythos there etc Half the meaning of story is written if they take it from history and Frankenstein it together

Maybe it's just a personal thing, but to me, flirting is harmless. I don't mind my partners flirting with others. I love the display of wit and banter. Takes some nice skill. I'm not insecure about it. I am not territorial or possessive. For me this isn't theoretical as I have lived it. And I don't confine flirting to gender either. Man, woman and anything in between - you won't escape 😈

I view Alex as being slightly afraid or hesitant to take a stance or draw a conclusion