Breakingthewall

I watched half and it's very interesting. Relative to the thread's topic, it could be said that spirituality tells you that your emotions are something you are creating and that if they cause you unhappiness then you should simply stop creating them, since they are illusory, ego. Just be and let the negative fall, but this is deeply toxic because it is creating a duality between right and wrong emotions and also implying that you are creating them and you are suffering because you want to. The reality is that the energetic structure that you are vibrates in a certain way due to its alignment with its environment, and denying this by saying that there is no self or that you and the environment are one is a closure, and therefore it is a wrong perspective. Not wrong for me, but absolutely wrong, toxic and pointing in the opposite direction of openness, denying the ego as "false" when the ego is a manifestation of reality absolutely real as anything else

No, I see that it's difficult to have a conversation with you. I put an example , lets see if you understand: I compare something that was previously accepted with something that isn't now. In psychology, it used to be accepted that homosexuality needed to be cured. Even now, some psychologists still think this way. But it's fully accepted that psychologists should help human beings to understand and accept themselves, not modify themselves to fit a standard. Do you understand? It's a paradigm shift. So, I think that true spirituality is the human path of opening to the absolute. Another thing is an incomplete or limited approach, and therefore mistaken. The goal of spirituality is that, then any idea that point in that direction is correct. But there are many ideas that point in the opposite direction, because many spiritual masters don't understand what they are doing. Then they are wrong.

That means that you don't agree? Then instead being ironic, what if you say anything structured and precise? No, it's like saying that I'm closed to electroshock to cure homosexuality. It's not closure, it's the clear perception that it's a wrong path.

It's a really big and deep work, as any human evolution. Clear intuition is needed, and the problem imo is that when you get in this path and you start searching and reading, you don't know nothing and what is written is not precise, it's a mess.

Ultimately, real spirituality is the openess to your absolute nature, then if your spirituality is not about to open yourself to your absolute nature, it's not spirituality, it could be religion, self help or psychology. Subjective according to you, but it's absolutely objetive

Solipsism is a limited vision because it implies a limit: you as the center. In absolute openness, there is no solipsism because there is no center. One or many are the same, since there are no limits. Can't be understood, can be done.

Yeah, thats a essential part in the spiritual path. Using spirituality to escape your emotional reality is a total mistake; it's narcissism. It's very common because sometimes our emotional reality seems like a maze with no way out. So, spirituality is used to create a parallel self and all that, and that leads to dead ends. The true path requires total acceptance of your psychological reality, deep understanding before any transcendence

How do you know? I have done a lot of things. I'm now involved in intense things. Yes because I'm interested in spirituality. I'm sorry if for you it's not right Ok but all that It is unimportant in this context, which is a thread about spirituality, specifically about the inherent duality of nonduality.

Id say the point is to use trauma as a driving force for openness. Emotional trauma is inevitable, and it's always an evolutionary driving force. Human beings are the way they are because it's efficient to be that way. There comes a time when the evolutionary push leads to the spiritual path. It's something real, not an escape or an attempt to feel better, but a step the human mind takes. And the human mind is trying to find the best way to achieve this, as it always does.

Searching the way to open yourself to the absolute truth is not lack, it's what spirituality is about. Obviously there is a closure, that's why spirituality exist. It's the "science" to make the human open to the absolute. Then there is wrong spirituality, the one that closes, and right, the one that opens. It's not subjective, but entirely objective. It would be like saying that there's a correct psychology, one that accepts the patient and attempts to resolve their trauma, and an incorrect one, one that rejects them and attempts, for example, to resolve homosexuality.

No, after that you really perceive that you are limitless ,the nonsense ends, each breath has a butterfly effect that encompasses infinity, so no more doing stupid things like a meaningless job, a toxic wife, addictions, meaningless sex, etc. Reality shines and is sacred, what you seek is to align yourself with your total nature, opening yourself day by day more to what you are. You feel the flow of reality and you want to be one with it. Then not chop wood but make your structure the most equalized possiblity possible, even it means death in a given moment So, that of "before enlightenment etc" is very unenlightened statement that doesn't point to the reality of openess at all

"Real" is just an idea. What means real? Should mean anything to know what is unreal, right? Because if nothing is real, real means nothing. Then, unreal neither

Yeah, the ego death is impossible, the ego transformation is possible. The self exists as an expression of the absolute; it is the absolute in a form. This form can be self-referential or open. What we seek is the latter, because the other option is not necessary anymore, it's an hindrance

It's a matter of openess. You are the absolute truth, existing in a closed form, like everything else. In humans, this form tends to be unstable, radioactive. In our time, even more so. In many cases, the only path left is total openness or absolute nihilism

Sure man, sure. Don't get angry. I don't understood, honestly. Im trying to talk about spirituality, about how some spirituality is a negation of human nature, when human nature is just an expression of reality. If you don't agree you can state your points. If you get personal, then it's normal than the others answer you personal, because it's annoying

The self is a reality. It's an energetic structure that occurs in reality, just like a tree or an atom. That self functions in a way that involves a cloud of trillions of relationships between perfectly coordinated states. The same could be said of the functioning of a mushroom, for example, or anything else. So, this energetic structure, which is the self and which is occurring in reality, can now equalize its vibration in such a way that, instead of a mirror reflecting itself, it becomes a transparent crystal through which reality observes its ultimate nature.

Well, it depends on what we mean by spirituality. It's supposedly the search for absolute truth, or rather, the search for a way to unlock the absolute truth within us. So there's an incorrect spirituality, it's one that doesn't aim for that end. If you define spirituality as the searching of well being, then it's different

I think that if there is apparent change there is change. Where is the difference between real or apparent?

I answered you being polite even your message was nonsense. I shouldn't answer, you are not in the minimum level required .

@Eskilon a tip for that navigation: when everything opens your true nature remains, and it's unlimited, and the fact of being unlimited is the absolute glory, what you was missing, the end of the lack, the return of the prodigal son.

Agree , oh James, and it's not to argue, but now that James has burned and only being remains, doesn't that being realize its unlimited nature? And in perceiving itself as unlimited, that is, in not perceiving limits, doesn't that being suddenly see itself as the overflowing, ceaselessly flowing stream? Not as mind, but as being. Doesn't that being see that being is flowing? And in being/flowing... doesn't that flow realize that the very fact of flowing, which is the very fact of being, is absolute intelligence? Not as an observer observing the stream, but as the stream flowing, not thinking, just being. And the nature of this flowing is openness, an absolute potential, like a bottomless hole , and the nature of that openness is your nature. In it is everything, it is the total, it is the absolute glory that dances. It is you.

For me awakening or how you want to call is really perceive yourself unlimited, and perceive always the total openess that reality is. But if I am in something serious, I focus myself so much that i suffer and suffer. I learned to trust the flow, but anyway, if problems come my mind is like pressure cooker, and I know this is something positive, as it makes me give it my all. Without suffering, there is no glory. That thing about the end of suffering means negation of a facet of reality ; humans are suffering machines, that's life. If life tells you: suffer, you will suffer. That's what the flow of reality will be like. At least I see it like that. Suffering is the fire for the metamorphosis, for the breaking of barriers that opens new dimensions. Some people think: I'm enlightened, there is no more dimensions to open, it's the end of suffering. I think that reality doesn't work in that way. There are no limits, always is going to happen a new birth, a deeper way of existing, and suffering should be welcome as a the crucible that forges new structures capable of greater breadth

How did you arrive to that conclusion if you can see that reality is constant becoming? You could say that this becoming don't arrive to anything, but you can't deny the becoming, the constant flow. What is the mental process or the realization that makes you see that this becoming is not happening? "Happening" means precisely becoming, existence, change. There is change, you could say that it's imaginary but it's change anyway, it's the same if you call it imaginary, dream, it is.

Yeah sure, I feel ridiculous getting triggered talking about spirituality, but we are humans, what to do? Just learn day by day

Well but seems that they have fairly widespread support. I understand that Israelis feel threatened, but it seems increasingly clear that the government has sought conflict and massacre. The problem is that it's already a fact, and with it, they've lost legitimacy in the eyes of most of the world.