Breakingthewall

Then don't argue and show your understanding

Enlightenment is what is beyond the form, but then the form is still here. I agree that focusing on form and understanding is a mistake due to the very fact of its infinity. You cannot grasp the infinite, only open yourself to it, and that is enlightenment, the opening to the totality. That's the business and the rest are small things. but still, the form exists and it is impossible not to try to understand its dynamics, even knowing that ultimately it is impossible, because there is not end, infinite dimensions. The mind must surrender itself to that fact. But as a, let's say, hobby, it's interesting. Well, I'd say that the only possibile comprehension of infinity is that it's infinite and can't be comprehended. Understanding is an illusion. Sad but true.

Italians the lovers? Sure the swiss are better. Anyway, Why don't you see the point in Leo's alien awakening? Yes, ok, the essential thing is to realize your true infinite nature, but once that is done, the wheel keeps turning. Better an interdimensional hyperintelligent alien than a schizophrenic in the Congo, or not?

You mean the essence of the reality, it's true nature, but look a fact: the reality is limitless, then it's always in movement, that means that there is always a shape, an illusion if you want. Then , the shape can not to be here neither. Is for you, as a shape in movement, the same a shape than another?

Yes, I know that perfectly, and I'm aware of that right now, and if I meditate 15 minutes, more deeply, and yet I don't like to live in the garbage being bitten by rats and insects, I prefer to have a business, money, good friends, girls around me, have air conditioning and not sleep at 40 degrees and not be tortured by the gestapo.

Real or illusion is a meaningless distinction. When you suffer for something, that suffering is also an illusion and yet it happens. If reality wanted you to be indifferent to the rape of your 12-year-old daughters, you would be. If he wants you to suffer, it is for a purpose. anything is real as soon as it happens. I may be fully aware that the form is transitory, but at the same time I know that the wheel of karma demands movement in one direction, and my push is in that direction, since my desire, the desire for reality, is the ascension. The Taoist master in your story had the ability to relativize his suffering by comparing it to the infinite being, but surely in specific moments he would suffer and that suffering would drive his movement, because that is the nature of reality. Otherwise it would be immobile Btw, that monk was fighting actively in a war, he wasn't in a cave meditating. Maybe he wanted some revenge

"A thought is just a thought, and yet it is a thought". --A thought

Human life is a creation of the reality, same than everything else. I'm aware of that right now without psychedelic or anything. This is an structure built over many structures, like a fractal with a concrete shape or vibration. It's so real as any shape could be. You could say that shape are illusion, that only the formless is real, but what with that? Shape still exist. I'm aware of the substance, the formless being, but that doesn't mean that the shape will dissapear.

Jesus Christ was just a being, the reality manifested, same than anything else. Why he's so special for you? Instead of emphasizing the fact of being enlightened, or being this or that, I think it is better to express your vision of reality, what you are beyond labels, and perhaps it will resonate with someone or many.

If the illusion is infinite, it is not an illusion, it is reality. If the illusion is infinite, you are not trapped in it, you are it. It never began and it never ends therefore, you are not dreaming, you are reality and reality is the infinite cosmos flowing over itself in its infinite facets and dimensions. Beyond the form we are all the same being, but there is no being without form, since the fact of being implies the creation of the form, so things seem to be more complicated than an agent performing an action with a result.

And it could not be the case that they would say: I know that I am the infinite being but I suffer since my 12-year-old daughters have been kidnapped by ISIS and are being raped 60 times a day. Suffering being part of reality, I'm eating my share.

Hating the lie is a good point to open yourself to the truth you focus on the form, not the content. forget the embellishments and see what is correct or incorrect in what he says. Conciousness is very ambiguous term, it implies being aware of something, but it is used to describe reality. The question is: is there reality if you are not aware of it? Or put another way, is there existence outside your field of consciousness? For me it is obvious that yes, since my field of consciousness is limited, and it is also obvious that reality is self-aware, a rock floating in intergalactic space is aware of itself in a way incomprehensible to us, space-time is aware of self, and gravity. Reality is infinite planes of consciousness/reality superimposed, and my field of consciousness is one among infinities, the tip of an infinite iceberg, formed by an infinite number of self-aware holons in turn formed by an infinite number of holons, infinitely. Each atom is infinite, and a human in turn is a holon that is part of another holon, which in turn is part of another so on to infinity. Let's say that the material of everything is reality becoming aware of itself in a certain way that, by virtue of the unlimited intelligence that it is, organizes itself in more and more complex patterns at unimaginable levels. Without end to infinity? It's impossible to represent that by the mind.

He's describing a moment of opening. He explains quite good some parts and others not so. I told you what I saw doubtful, because I know what he's talking about. The guy has been meditating for 30 years with surprising and quite strange results, interdimensional trips, telepathy and more. I checked him because Waterriver always mentions it. I understand when listening to that story the gap that opens in reality, how one first perceives reality and oneself as the pure light of existence, even could be intelligence or emptiness, and how at a given moment reality opens and shows itself its heart, what It is, what you cannot think or remember but that seems like it is going to burn you, to produce cancer because it is radioactive, the immutable and unfathomable that at this moment I can only evoke in a distant way, the last experience of that kind was about a month ago, which means that it lost its transparency a long time ago, although some imprint in the constant vibration always remains. If you are in spirituality, the thing is hit and hit, be obsessive in the determination to break the barrier. meditation, psychedelics, whatever is necessary as many times as necessary.

The guy talks about how after a week-long meditation retreat he had an experience of total enlightenment, which produced a definitive change in his perception of himself. There are two things that seem doubtful to me, first when he says that reality is light. This is a way of perceiving reality that is true, but not unique. The manifestation of the pure light of existence is something recurring in mystical openings, but you can also perceive reality as life, intelligence or emptiness. Second, when he talks about the moment in which the mystical opening occurs, the revelation of the nature of reality, he does so vaguely, repeating: no words can define, blah blah. This is true for everything, including the taste of lemon juice, but we must try to define and explain it as precisely as possible. I see the feeling that he describes as real, that a complete and permanent opening would be toxic and deadly, you cannot be both individuated and total. Seems doubtful when he says: then the silent companion manifested himself and I was him. There is no hidden companion, there is something closed that opens, and recognizing oneself as the unfathomable, not as "someone" who from that moment on is always there.

Why do you think that guy is fake? Analize. Maybe you are right. I ve some doubts about what he said, but in another hand some agrees with many experiences I have had.

But agree, I was just doing devil advocate. 99% they are shit , and without his position nobody would want sex with them 😅

If you do that, you are a cheater and a fake, and of course you are manipulating. But it's that the case?

The concept here is "manipulate". Implies that sex is a kind of predation where you get sex with the women manipulating them. I see it different, like, I'm giving them energy and life, pleasure and divine connection, same than they to me

Yeah, seems a narcissistic quite toxic

No one of those gurus, like mooji, adyashanti, Ralston, Spira, ram dass, Krishnamurti, Osho, etc.etc were done with the human thing. Maybe andamayi ma was a saint, the other were men with mystical opening in some extent . They had a big influence, very positive, but they were humans. Imagine that someone says that Ramakrishna used to have homosexual sex with some of his disciples. Would you say that's bad? Or ram Dass with his guru. Is that impossible? Why sex is dirty, or wrong? Sex could be, and should be very spiritual and true

Agree, As far as I know, Mooji doesn't preach chastity, and if living close those things happen, what? Another thing is that he is the leader of a sect with levels of power, where people are forced into submission, etc., but I don't think that is the case. If girls appear saying, that guy is toxic, I was in a state of submission, I come from a broken family and he took advantage, then yes, but if they are whole and free people, everything is perfect

I was thinking in jiddu Krishnamurti, quite fake imo, like mostly of the auto proclaimed enlightened

That's the interesting question. I would say that it is the total absence of obstacles in the mind. Enlightenment does not imply knowledge or ability, although it may facilitate it. It is the free mind, which flows without bouncing back on itself. The human mind is almost always, or always, built on a foundation of fear. self-preservation and fear of rejection. We are individuals who want to remain individuals, and the possibility of being destroyed terrifies us. This is a genetic preservation mechanism, without it the species would not have prospered. We are also social beings, part of a hive, and we need to be accepted to survive and reproduce, another instinct genetically encoded by fire. On these bases a complicated mental tapestry is built with many ramifications. The mind identifies in adolescence with the social matrix and goes deeper and deeper with that identification. It is a natural mechanism that makes humanity work as a single being and be able to do things like send ships to Mars. an extremely sophisticated and effective, definitive evolutionary mechanism. The mind takes on a life of its own and separates itself from matter, evolving at ultra-fast speed. We are servants of the mind, supports that give our processing power to the matrix, slaves. It is a trapped life, moved by unconscious stimuli, where every act and every gesture, from the decision to have a son to the slightest thought, are given by social/genetic programming, since both merge. In this panorama, the individual who suffers, in most cases opts for evasion, and in a few, for liberation, and in few manages to understand his chains and break them, and be free ,then the understanding can start.

Could be, I suppose that very serious enlightenment seekers would go to India, they would look for the guru who vibrated at their energy level and if the circumstances were the appropriate, it would happen. But how many gurus are? It's very rare thing. At the end you have to be your own guru, and change your energetic and karmic pattern by actions, meditation and psychedelics. But who knows, maybe in any moment a guru appears. I see it very difficult, if there were gurus in every neighborhood, sure, but that's not the case. Maybe there are 1,2, maybe zero, in all the world

How can a guru cause a change within you? doing what? He can't get into your mind, only you can do it. He could suggest do yoga or meditation, or explain to you some concepts, but what else?