DocWatts

There's a core of MAGA supporters that more or less behave as if they were in a Cult; no amount of reconciliation or reasonableness on your part will be enough to get them to abandon the Cult of Personality they've fallen under. Some portion of this group are literal white supremacists who subscribe to a fascist ideology; these people need to be socially ostracized from polite society, as allowing thier views to become normalized is extremely dangerous. Moderates on the other hand, or Conservatives who aren't Trump loyalists, should absolutely be reached out to and included. But we need to be able to draw distinction between people with whom we have political disagreements, and people operating in Bad Faith to undermine Democracy.

Similar to Spiral Dynamics, for as powerful as the Hegelian Dialectic is, I tend to see a lot of sloppy applications of it (for the H.D., often by Conspiracy Theorists who happened to take an intro level philosophy class at some point). Nevertheless, there's a number of ways you could use it too look at systems, such as: Thesis : Late Stage Capitalism / Neo - Liberalism Antithesis : Socialism (from the Left). Also Fascism (from the Right) Synthesis : Social Democracy (better scenario), -OR- White Ethno-State Plutocracy (worst case scenario).

Don't particularly agree with the McCain's politics and wouldn't have voted for him, but what a stark contrast between this man and Trump. One accepts defeat with humility, congratulates his opponent, and uses his concession speech to send a message of unity. The other whines and cries like a toddler while inciting civil unrest and blaming everyone but himself for losing the election. Also a good reminder that people of Integrity did exist at one time in the Republican Party, and it wasn't always the pro-fascist organization that it devolved in to.

Very true. Goes to show how pivotal leadership is in either encouraging or disapproving of that sort of behavior. No way an equivalent of the MAGA Cult would have reached the status it did with out a charismatic figurehead capitalizing upon fear and resentment.

Sadly I think this is an 'out of sight, out of mind' issue for many Americans. Until more attention is brought to this issue, and Puerto Rico becomes a spotlight of national attention, I don't see this obvious injustice changing.

Seconded! Thank you!

Guess the first 25 or 30 years of my life where I assumed the fascism question to have been largely settled was just an illusion.

How about we push to get some oversight over Presidential authority, and re-assess our nuclear weapons policy ASAP before we get another Sociopath who's intentionally trying to steer the country into an iceberg.

The man certainly has a way with words. It's like listening to a modern day Shakespeare in all of his eloquence.

How many Republicans on the national stage have publicly repudiated and broken ties with Trump? I can think of a few offhand (Mitt Romney, Arnold Schwarzenegger of all people); but it's far from being even a sizeable minority.

That's the question. Is the next Republican candidate going to be another fascist, or will there be at least some small degree of self reflection in the next four years? John Mccain and Mitt Romney certainly come across as reasonable, sane people when you put them side by side against Trump. Hell, a swing towards Ron Paul style libertarianism would be a much healthier direction to emerge out of a potential schism on the right.

Was more just entertaining the possibility, but sadly we have a terrible record in this country of having Presidents be held responsible for the crimes they've committed in Office. Not to equate Trump with someone like Nixon for example, as Trump is on another level entirely; I really hope that Trump on trial for the crimes he's committed will discredit him in the eyes of at least some of his followers, but I have my doubts.

Dan Carlin makes a somewhat compelling case that one way to de-escalate the cascade to Civil War would be to give Trump an easy way to leave Office, rather than setting up a situation where his Survival is basically on the line the second he leaves office. Makes some interesting parallels to the fall of the Roman Republic, where retributive lawsuits for public figures leaving office created an escalation feedback loop that lead to Civil War. As much as it chafes against my sense of justice to let Trump get away with the horrible crimes he's committed, from a harm reduction standpoint it makes at least some sense. Not sure if I entirely agree, but it may take some really outside of the box thinking to avert the very real possibility of an eventual Civil War. One one hand we don't want to incentivize the idea that you can commit crimes in public office and get away scott free, but something has to disrupt the course of polarization in this country.

Unless something drastic happens, the election is basically decided. I think some of the states are doing recounts, but that is highly unlikely to change the overall results. Plus legal challenges may possibly drag out making it official for several weeks.

Making claims of false equivalency between the two sides only serves to empower the pro-fascist MAGA Cult. Anyone who's not able to make a clear distinction between someone who's pretty par for the course in American politics, and someone who's intentionally steering the country into an iceberg to serve his own selfish agenda is obviously arguing in Bad Faith, and has most likely has been indoctrinated into a Cult of personality. Don't waste your time arguing with these people, and let the mods hit them with a Ban Hammer if they continue to spread misinformation.

False equivalency is the Maple Syrup that MAGA pours on thier Authoritarian pancakes.

Just look to the United States for a case study of how dangerous it is to not Integrate the lower Stages into your Society in a healthy and non-destructive way.

And probably broke as well.

About %65 - 70 percent of eligible Voters participated in the most recent election (the highest turnout in decades). Slightly less than half of them supported Trump. So if we extrapolate that to the rest of the country, we can conservatively say that roughly a third of the country is at level of development where they find Trump's authoritarianism and white supremacy appealing. So even if they're not a majority, a third of the country with that sort of mindset and worldview is enough to destabilize the country, and at the very least cause widespread and long lasting Civil Unrest (even if it doesn't spiral into Civil War). To say that America is a fractured and fragmented society is undeniable at this point. How we begin to heal these divisions over a 20 or 50 year time span, well that's a much bigger question that I don't have the answer to.

David Pakman hit the nail on the head as far ad the implications of Trump gaining six million votes despite everything that's happened over the past four years.

https://ijr.org/biden-calls-americans-stop-treating-opponents-as-enemies/ Just the fact that Biden's not intentionally trying to steer the country off a cliff, and seems to be a halfway decent human being, will be a breath of fresh air even if he doesn't end up accomplishing much in Office. Also we should keep in mind that even if Trump loses, his Cult isn't going away. America has some enormous challenges ahead.

Biden is on record saying that one of his his first acts in Office will be to renew the Paris Climate Deal. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.marketwatch.com/amp/story/biden-vows-to-rejoin-paris-climate-accord-on-day-one-if-he-wins-11604549000

Interesting; I suppose while that's better than what we have in the rest of the country, it's not a silver bullet, so to speak. I would think proportional representation would also be a step in the right direction as well, but don't see that realisticallylly happening in our system. Even of you got rid of all the structural unfairness against third parties in America, I'd be the first to admit that they would still be at a significant disadvantage compared to the Two Parties.

@Husseinisdoingfine Agreed, but what they can do is shift the Overton window Left and lay the groundwork for Social Democracy, and also make room for Socialist voices to have at least some influence in US politics. Bernie never would have had the impact he did if he were running as a Green Party candidate (or as an Independent). Also I think the harm reduction aspect of being strategic with your Vote cannot be understated; considering that the Republican Party has moved from neo-liberalism to what can arguably be called fascism (or at the very least Authoritarianism). Socialism can work within a liberal/neo-lib framework, but loses whatever pull it has when operating under a fascist framework.

@Husseinisdoingfine Former long time Green Party voter myself. Until First Past the Post Voting is abolished and something like Ranked Choice Voting is adopted, the obstacles for a third party winning a national election are such that I see little point in supporting the Green Party until a more fair system is in place. Changing the Democratic Party from within by supporting Progressive/Socialist Democrats like AOC or Bernie seems like a more realistic path forward in my view.