DocWatts

@EmptyVase @nistake Great advice, thanks!

My own understanding is that while we could interbreed with people from 300,000 years ago, humans with the sort of cognitive capabilities that exist today are actually far more recent, closer to 40,000 or 50,000 years from what I've read. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.businessinsider.com/human-brains-may-only-be-40000-years-old-scientists-say-2018-1%3famp

I've been curious about this as well. Easy enough to find Green and even Yellow online, but I do miss having the sorts of discussions that take place on this forum on a face to face basis. Having participated in the Occupy movements when I was younger, it would be awesome to find a local organization with that sort of energy but focused in a more pragmatic direction (perhaps addressing something more focused such as ways to address deficiencies in the American political system).

Closest person that comes to mind which fits the description would be someone like Marcus Aurelius. If survival conditions for a society are such that democracy is unworkable I suppose its better to have a conscious and developed person in charge, but regressing to those conditions is something to be avoided rather than to aspire to.

Not denying that Trump (or Hitler for that matter) is a damaged person, but my own perspective is to look at who's being harmed versus who's benefiting from the dynamics at play. Intentionally and maliciously deceiving millions of people for personal financial and political gain, with zero regard for other people, seems like a reasonable place to draw the line. Just because "whatever helps me, damned the costs or consequences" happens to be Trump's Personal Truth, doesn't absolve him of anything. Not like Trump actually cares about his legions of cult like followers, where the dynamic is akin to an abusive relationship. So yeah, I can extend some sympathy to the people who have been conned and manipulated by this grifter without extending my sympathies to the schemer at the top.

In my mind is it really so difficult to delineate between demagogues like Trump, who are knowingly and maliciously spreading misinformation to millions of people for completely self-serving political purposes, and the victims of that process who are ending up in the hospital after being manipulated by people who couldn't give two shits about them? Save that venom for the people running the damn Cult, rather than for the dummies who were unfortunate enough to get sucked in because they couldn't recognize a grift.

@RareGodzilla Sure mindless media consumption is a problem (video games included in that), but the only way you actually solve the problem is by instilling a healthy relationship with digital media from an early age. Which involves (surprise, surprise) engaged parents who are actually knowledgeable about digital media. That and actually having opportunities available for social engagement and fulfilling activities away from a screen. That's of course leaving aside that online games are to at least some degree being scapegoated for more affluent young people in China choosing not to engage that country's toxic work culture (with the expectations that one need work 12 hours a day 6 days a week).

Disappointing that people here are reveling in shadenfreude towards what are effectively Cult victims who were ruthlessly manipulated and exploited by a Con Artist, and ended up dying because of it.

The book I'm referring to is A Theory of Justice, which is a landmark work of 20th century political philosophy by John Rawls, that's concerned with the ethics of socio-economic inequality in democratic societies. In it he proposes what's come to be regarded as a famous thought experiment known as The Veil of Ignorance, which is designed to challenge the ways in which we use self-bias to justify societal inequalities. In the thought experiment, we are asked to imagine that we are designing the socio-economic system for a society that we'll be living in, without knowing who or what we'll be in the society we're designing. We have no idea whether we'll be born rich or poor, whether we'll be a man or a woman, or whether or not we'll be part of an ethnic or religious minority, Furthermore, we won't know in advance what our moral compass and level of development will be, nor will we have any idea whether the skills and talents we develop throughout our life will be something that's valued by the rest of the society. Removing self bias from the consideration, and you'll quickly notice that is becomes much harder to justify many of the forms of gross inequality that exist in the world. But at the same time Rawls does recognize that some level of inequality is in fact beneficial for everyone in the society, including its least well off members. So the conclusion he comes to is that some level of socio-economic inequality is ethically justifiable so long as the form of inequality in question benefits the least advantaged members of that society. For example, it's to the advantage of the least well off to have competent doctors and teachers in the society, so it makes sense to pay doctors and teachers good salaries to attract people to those professions. On the flip side of that, it's much harder to justify a CEO of Walmart making thousands of times more than an average Walmart employee in this scenario. Nor is it justifiable for a tiny handful of billionaires to own more wealth than the entire bottom half of the society. ______________________________ To add to that and address the larger issue at hand, the existence of extreme wealth inequality is problematic for other reasons because in practice it tends to damage social solidarity and erode democratic institutions. When a handful of people own more wealth than entire segments of society, it gives those individuals plenty of opportunity to game the system for their benefit and isolate themselves from societal problems. If inequality gets bad enough what tends to happen is that the rich and poor begin living in two completely different isolated realities, and when that happens the sense of social solidarity required for democracy to function beings to break down. Think of the things that we take for granted today that exist due to public investments in innovation through agencies like DARPA and NASA; the Internet and GPS were both government funded DARPA projects, after all. While I'll agree that profit motive from private Industry can be a powerful incentive for innovation for many things (such as consumer electronics), don't forget the ways that a Profit motive can also disincentive many kinds of important research. Think of something like the Large Hadron Collider or International Space Station, hard to see how either of those could exist if they had to make a quarterly return for an investor. Public private partnerships hold a lot of promise in my eyes, and I'm all for public investitures in to private industry for things that are socially beneficial (such as renewable energy).

A number of good points on the issue from a therapist who struggled with game compulsion when he was younger.

Not sure whether this has already been posted somewhere else, but the compassionate approach taken by the therapist conducting the interview is a good reminder that people who embody SD-Red aren't monsters so much as people who are easily deceived and manipulated because they're lacking in development. Many of these people have led sad lives, and use conspiracy theories as a dysfunctional way of coping with unmet deficiency needs.

Being that the entire notion of Free Will comes from mistaken Enlightenment era assumptions that the Mind is somehow disembodied, having something that was a Myth from the very beginning confirmed to be not true by Empirical evidence shouldn't be a cause for distress.

I see this more as a non issue owing to mistaken assumptions behind how Free Will is framed, which itself is a legacy of Enlightenment era philosphy. A common misconception is to conflate the empirical evidence for the lack of Free Will with the idea that all of our Choices are pre-determined, which itself takes for granted that the a-priori assumption that we live in a deterministic 'clock work' universe. Just because the Mind is not Free to think whatever it wants due to the embodied nature of the conceptual systems we use to navigate reality, doesn't mean that we lack the capacity to think and reflect on out lived experiences. Nor are we prevented from using that process to inform the ways we approach life. Think about it. If we didn't have the ability to do so, from an evolutionary standpoint how could we possibly have survived and developed to the point to speculate om philosophical questions?

What would someone living by 'socialist ideals' mean in your view? From Vaush's own political ideology (Libertarian Market Socialism), his socio-economic ideals as I understand them involve an expansion of democracy in to the workplace (acceas to the means of production through worker owned businesses) and de-commoditization of essential goods and services. So how is being a self employed political commentator a betrayal of these goals? As others have already pointed out, socialism is not against the idea of wealth, it's against using control of Capitol for exploitative purposes.

Not sure what people are expecting as far as Green individuals meeting their Survival Needs in an Orange society. A life of asceticism? Living "off the grid" in a hippie commune until capitalism collapses? Having any impact at all on the broader culture entails having to engage with the socio-economic system that exists, which in the States is Capitalism.

Liked the video, but maybe framing a sociological discussion as a Conspiracy Theory right at the beginning was a mistake. That's like putting a loaded machine gun in to the chimp enclosure with the assurance that surely the chimps won't pick it up and use it

Haven't seen anything particularly objectionable in his political content, aside perhaps from some jokes that could be taken in out of context in Bad Faith if someone were so inclined. I don't agree with all of Vaush's takes, but that's not necessarily a bad thing. Nothing so far from what I've seen leads me to think that any of his content has been irresponsible, like a certain person on Spotify that's been platforming toxic Right wingers and spreading Covid misinformation.

Any Stage above the center of gravity for one's Culture will require some degree of exceptionalism to navigate and embody, simply because the support structures which help ordinary people imbue said Stage are either Limited or Non Existent Perhaps in a couple hundred years societies will be structured in a way where the natural 'pull' is towards Yellow, but that's a long way off.

More like China does not yet have the same level of global power and influence as the US, though that gap has been progressively shrinking over the last half century. If the United States is a bigger threat to world peace than China, it's not because China's governmental system is any more ethical than the United States. It's because China hasn't had as much of an incentive (nor the opportunity) to become an Imperialist power to the same degree as the United States. Look to Tibet or Hong Kong if you have any doubts that China has moral qualms about engaging in Imperialism, or at least any more than the United States.

@captainamerica Sounds like we don't have a broad disagreement so much as a difference in emphasis. Some amount of inequality is not only unavoidable but beneficial to a society (in this respect I'm in complete agreement with the political philosopher John Rawl's treatment of inequality in A Theory of Justice). Where my emphasis lies is in the need for a socio-economic Floor, so that inequality doesn't leave people destitute to the point of being unable to participate in society and unable to enjoy a dignified life. As far as education, high quality education should at a minimum consist of (in no particular order): (1) Civic education which allows people to participate in electoral democracy in an informed way. This would involve things like the economic factors you mentioned, but also things like Media Literacy, Epistemology, and History. Social awareness about race and gender relations would go here as well. (2) Career training and education which helps people cultivate a passion for something that they can make a living off from. STEM, technical training in a Trade. This would also include how to navigate the job market, how to transition in to career. How to write a resume, negotiate a salary, etc. It should also cover basic entrepreneurship as well, with more extensive training as an option for those who are interested. (3) Basic life skills such as comprehensive sex education, nutrition, emotional mastery including conflict resolution, and personal financial literacy. Also honest and comprehensive drug education based on Harm Reduction rather than abstinence (basically the opposite of the flagrantly dishonest D.A.R.E. program that many of us grew up with).

Consider the way you're Framing the problem, by way of focusing exclusively on entrepreneurship. The vast majority of people in society are not entrepreneurs and will never attempt to start a business. Nor could our current society function if everyone decided to quit thier jobs and become an entrepreneur. The vast majority of work done in our society is waged labor, and is likely to remain so for at least the foreseeable future. Imagine someone with the potential to become just as intelligent and driven as Elon Musk, but who began life as an unwanted pregnancy and was born in to a family which is financially destitute, where perhaps one or both of his parents have serious substance abuse problems as a way of coping with thier stressful and depressing situation. Not hard to imagine how growing up in a stressful and desperate situation can scar that person psychologically in ways that make good judgement more difficult, and thus damage that person's chances of succeeding compared to peers who grow up in more privileged circumstances. Also imagine that because of the difficult survival circumstances this person is faced with, they end up getting in to trouble as a young adult and end up with a criminal record that makes securing a job (let alone a loan to start a business) much more difficult. While it's undeniably true that it's unrealistic to negate all inequity that comes with the Birth Lottery, much of the disadvantages from my earlier example has at its Root social causes (poverty in this case), which can be addressed by social institutions (ie the gov't) putting in place redistributive mechanisms such as universal health care, high quality universal education, labor rights, etc. Just consider the fact that in a place the like the US public schools are funded by local property taxes, with the quality of one's education being tied to the income level of one's zip code, and how this structurally bakes in inequality. People are not being given anywhere close to an equal opportunity to succeed under this sort of system.

Have you ever considered as a video topic the use (and misuse) of the Western philosophical tradition? Hegel would make an interesting topic for the blog or as a short form video.

Sure, and that's not to say that someone's Efforts don't also play a large role in how successful that person is. But success in our society also depends on having access to social and financial capital so one can actually better themselves through thier efforts. And access to Social and Financial capital is in large part determined by the Birth Lottery (though well functioning redistributive mechanisms can mitigate at least some of this). Working hard without having access to these things will more than likely result in someone ending up as an exploited Wage Slave.

Not so much a comment on Jordan Peterson who's at least a bit more nuanced about the idea of 'personal responsibility', but the way that 'personal responsibility' is typically used by conservatives is as a highly self serving ego defense mechanism, completely taking for granted the role that privilege and luck have had in thier own success. "I know that I succeeded because I'm honest and hard working, so if someone else isn't as successful as me it must be because they're lazy."

This ^ %100. Nor is this incomparable with taking the time and effort to understand what causes someone to adopt the role of a victimizer. Just that our first ethical obligation is to extend empathy and compassion with people who have been disempowered and victimized, and only secondarily towards thier victimizers and abusers.