Tim R

You know, sometimes I realize how absolutely nuts we must seem to "ordinary" people. I mean, we're of course also ordinary people, but we have settled into an epistemological and ontological niche so far away from "normal" Joe Schmoe -mind and -consciousness that if we were to talk about some of the things that we talk about here with normal folk, we would immediately be regarded as complete and utter screwballs who must've escaped the boobie hatch. How have you guys dealt with this? How are you handling it? I sometimes just forget that people who aren't interested in reality and truth etc. see the world in a radically different light, and I tend to forget how it was for me. I really love it to get lost in this philosophical rabbit hole that we all know and when I talk to people about the things that I think about or which I understood, I really forget that what I am saying to them must sound completely messed up. Even if it's metaphors that are quite easy to stomach like "well you're like a wave in the ocean" or whatever, most people already think that you've lost it. For god sake they think you're woo-woo when you say "money isn't actually real". Not to think about how it must sound like when you really go deeper with these topics "time is an illusion, you're God aka infinite nothingness and oh btw, existence is love, also, did you know that reality is your mind? The mushrooms revealed my shadow to me and btw there's this toad when you smoke its venom you realize you're God. Ever heard about 4-dimensional elves in the dimethyltryptamine-realm that make you sing objects into existence?" or stuff like that. Complete lunacy But we tend to take these sorts of things for granted to some degree, I think. What do you think? I'm not really concerned that people might think that I'm "crazy", that's not the point, but I'd like to know how you remind yourself that they see reality different? Don't you have the desire to share these amazing things with them? Even if it means that they might reject you?

Lol and I came here to see how Leo would solace you haha

Enlightenment isn't feeling nothing and becoming completely stoic and emotionally immovable. You can still be sad or worried or whatever, but you're not attached to these things anymore. In fact, you can feel your sadness or your joy much richer, but without being consumed by them.

Your neighbors' dog.

You say you've accepted them, and yet you still want to get rid of them. So you haven't accepted them, not really. It's not the thoughts that pose the problem, but the way one relates to the thoughts. To try to get rid of or resolve/dissolve your thoughts will not work, because every attempt to do so will simply direct your attention to the very thing that you're trying to get rid of and thereby create a vicious circle. It's exactly like saying "this medicine will only work if you don't think of a green elephant while you take it". So, acceptance is the only way out. But it can be a very difficult thing to accept these thoughts, because your attempt to accept them is done in a spirit of non-acceptance, you see? You have to try to accept that, too. And if that doesn't quite work the way you want, this must be accepted too. Then, what might happen is this: In your attempt to accept something that you can't really accept, you might get to a point of complete frustration. And at this point, there is the opportunity to drop the whole thing - and then you have truly accepted and therefore solved the problem. You remind me very much of a good friend of mine and he is in exactly the same situation as you. It's possible to get out of this, don't forget that.

No, because then you're not aware of the living room itself, but only of the camera. And the camera isn't the living room. This I think ties up nicely with what @Someone here says: yes and no. @BipolarGrowth What this means is the following: you assume that your bedroom is something different from your living room. Which isn't the case No matter where you are, you are always the same place where you are In other words, the distinction between being and non-being (bedroom and living room) doesn't actually exist - therefore your living room exists, because it's the same place as your bedroom. Because no matter where you are, your always the same place. Show me the difference between your bedroom and living room.

I don't see how anything could exist "outside" consciousness. Because whatever "proof" one would come up with to verify the existence of your living room, one has to be conscious of it. And the only real "proof" for the existence of your living room is to be (in) it by being conscious of it.

In this forum, especially in this discussion (meditation, consciousness, enlightenment, spirituality), there is almost always made a distinction between "high" and "low" consciousness. I think this distinction is rubbish. I say "rubbish" and "bullshit" not because I have any real aversion towards it, but because by going to the other extreme, I hope to bring some attention to this distinction, which is so eagerly and quickly drawn in many threads. It seems to me that some people here get thoroughly hung up on "high" consciousness. We discriminate arbitrarily and deny the word "high" to some things and are quick to label them as "low" instead. These are just substitutions for "good" and "bad". There is nothing "high" or "low". Yoga, psychedelics, healthy food, meditation, etc., none of it. None of it is "high consciousness", forget about it. But equally of course, it is not "low consciousness" either. Ego, devilry, evil, addiction, bad temper, none of these are "low" consciousness. And none of these are "high" consciousness either. I don't know if Leo has ever spoken about this trap. If not, it's high time he does so, because it's a very sneaky one. So... I wanted to remind you of that. I don't know how much influence this thread will have, probably not much, depending on how many people read it, but it's an important thing to be aware of.

Great book written by Erich Fromm, I absolutely love it. His thesis is that two modes of existence struggle for the spirit of humankind: the "having" mode, which concentrates on material possessions, power, and aggression, and is the basis of the universal evils of greed, envy, and violence; and the "being" mode, which is based on love, the pleasure of sharing, and in productive activity.

@dflores321 By getting rid of the idea of "a path of clarity and a path of confusion"

Being aware of the oneness of existence isn't obstructing you in any way. After all, the world was also one before you saw it as one That's right! And to be more exact; you can't do anything whatsoever with "it".

@Moksha That's actually how I feel a lot of the time very true what you say!

@Nahm Thanks for the reply. I'm gonna have to read it a few more times I guess

@mmKay As I already said, this isn't about bashing relativism or denying distinctions. This is about being careful to not get stuck on the idea of "high" or "low" consciousness.

@Nahm Sounds interesting, could you elaborate?

@peanutspathtotruth Sure! I agree with that, too. All I wanted to show is that we have to be careful not to get hung up on these notions.

I agree. It's like "artificial" and "natural". Basically, everything is natural, even cars or planes or quantum computers

Yes and no. It depends on what you mean when you say "true".

I could never understand why someone as intelligent as him doesn't understand that e.g. "evil" or "good" aren't actually real and just arbitrary attributions. You know how he's always out to "make things better". "You're wretched and horrible and useless and resentful, get your act together, bucko!" This sort of attitude. How come he never heard of nonduality? (or at least never talks about it?) He even took some Psilocybin for god sake, he knows about psychedelics, he knows about DMT and the entities, he knows that mystical experiences are real (although I think he's afraid of the implications they bear). He's so well-read and knows so much, his knowledge and his philosophical position are almost contradictory. He knows that there's something very fishy about materialism. He even knows that consciousness is fundamental to reality! So... Why is he not looking deeper into these topics? He's definitely smart enough to be a full-blown stage Yellow thinker, and yet he preaches that we are miserable worms who need to redeem themselves. Classic original sin guilt trip, why does he buy into this stuff? Or am I not seeing something?

@Preety_India That's just such a naive and inappropriate position, sorry. I live in Germany and since 2015 we took almost 2 million refugees. And it makes a difference, I can tell you that. When around 2% of the population more or less suddenly consists of completely foreign cultures which completely different values, it influences society on many, many levels, it also influences politics, both left and right, it influences the economy, etc. Even a country as stable and rich as Germany is troubled by something like that. Well then I strongly suggest you educate yourself on the 3rd Reich a bit more. You can't compare it with today's nationalists, that's grossly inflationary. Actual Nazis as they lived 80 years ago were absolutely ready and eager to kill and annihilate anybody who didn't fit their NS raciology. That's not how your average nationalist of 2021 who rants about foreigners while drinking at his local pub thinks. These people aren't even close to Nazis. I can only agree with those here who emphasized that it's a very complex topic, because it really is a big deal.

It is already melting. Technology is merging with us more and more, it began with things like the TV or radio - your body was separate from it, but you had a certain relation to it. Then mobile phones were developed and you could carry your technology around. Then smartphones entered our lives, we always have them with us, either in our pocket or in our hands. A few years ago smartwatches were invented; now you could wear your technology and it was so close to you, that it knew about your most private data like your heart beat. If that doesn't scream "cyborg!" I don't know what does. The next step would therefore of course be implantation. Look at this. Incredible. No wonder people find it scary; their human identity is threatened. We will keep merging with technology until there won't be any difference between "tech" and "human".

You can use anything as a mantra. You can sing "nooooodles" until it becomes completely meaningless. And then maybe you'll actually find out that you don't know shit. I don't think you'll get to not-knowing by trying to trick yourself into it with this "I don't know shit"-mantra, because then you're gonna get hung up on the meaning of the words of this mantra. But try it, I don't know what works for you.

This is gonna be me in a few years lol. Can't wait to have access to my own lab

To this day I don't understand why this bs system hasn't been reformed yet. It's not a proper democracy if the majority doesn't win.

Comparing the events surrounding the Capitol with the "Reichskristallnacht" from 1938 isn't appropriate though. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kristallnacht