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@Username Thanks for clarifying. I tend to determine one's stage (as well as my own) via "center of gravity." Which stage has the highest percentage of one's gravity? I'm not sure why only having 10% Yellow would make someone Yellow, since we could also say that same person has 10% Orange, but we wouldn't consider them Orange. Let me know your thinking on this.

@Username From my POV, Leo is not "higher than Turquoise." He's exactly where he says he is: mostly Yellow and moving into Turquoise. Just because one has awakened to Stage Turquoise or Coral insights does not mean they are actively embodying that nor are grounded in that stage. Building Leo into some false god feels unproductive and dangerous.

@Hyacinth Read a ton of Stage Yellow content, books, podcasts. Study all the various maps of developmental psychology. Consider integrating your stage Blue shadows via a mystic branch of the religion you were raised in. Christianity? If so, check out Richard Rohr, a great stage Yellow Christain mystic. I wrote a bit about my journey from Orange to Green to Yellow, if you're interested in reading: https://tuckerwalsh.medium.com/a-map-for-my-younger-self-bfa1dcd22243

Coaching, guiding, consulting, therapy, some academia, some tech industry sectors, some business / corporate training or advising, transpersonal psychology, content creators like Leo, Rebel Wisdom, Integral Life, etc.

Have you seen the movie Soul? It's basically about this topic. Amazing film (don't overlook it just because it's animated).

@Mu_ Will do. Just to share, from my understanding this seems to contradict one of Leo's central teachings, which is that what I am experiencing right here right now is all there is. This is the entire Universe. There is nothing else except what is in my direct experience, whether that's a "human" view or anything else. Is this a misunderstanding of Leo's teaching?

@Mu_ Thank you for your response to my question. I'm still not clear though and wondering if you can help clarify. Is it correct to interpret what you're saying as, "The awareness that is experiencing this present moment is not aware of other present moments happening elsewhere?" Apologies for the confusion.

@Mu_ Yes, but that example involves me, which is right here right now. I was asking about somebody else like my cousin in Georgia. If he gets his penis cut off, and I don't know about it, did it actually happen?

@The0Self Can you clarify these two points? Not sure I'm following, but I sense they're important. Thank you.

@Leo Gura I guess the question is whether the "other" as a figment of God's imagination can experience suffering outside of the direct experience that is right here right now. Or the simpler question, is there anything other than what's right here right now? From how I've understood your teachings as well as my own insights via psychedelics, the answer is perhaps no. But I could see how that knowledge could lead to some twisted places, or at least twisted in the construct of what society deems to be twisted. Or twisted in how the ego hijacks this absolute truth and uses it to reorient life in a sociopathic way. Please let me know if I'm misunderstanding something.

I have had the thought run through my mind in the past that goes something like this: "This is all a Dream, and all that exist is in my direct experience right here right now (as per Leo's Guided Exercise for Realizing You Are God video). Therefore if I kill myself there will be no family and friends that I leave behind who will grieve me because they are just an illusion, and they will cease to exist once the dream of Tucker dies. Therefore, my suicide will not cause any pain or suffering because there is literally no one else to experience this pain and suffering." A part of me still wonders if this line of thinking has aspects of truth or not. I'm sharing this so that it can be discussed and hopefully clarified rather than me just repressing these half-baked ideas into my shadow. Thank you.

Thank you!

@RendHeaven I know, that's why I'm asking Leo because I want to know what advice myself would have for myself But thank you for your reply and appreciate your words

@Leo Gura I've realized God Consciousness a couple times via psychedelics in the past year. Your latest video helped reaffirm this experience. Thank you 1. What does one do after they've realized This but are not stabilized in any "nondual" state typically associated with Enlightenment? Should I even pursue classical Enlightenment at this point, or is that just more illusion? 2. Are there other teachers who speak of the same Truth illuminated in your video? Ramana Maharshi? Nisargadatta Maharaj? Any modern day teachers you could point to (besides you)?

It seems every stage of the Spiral is focused on saving something. Stage Yellow is obsessed with building maps to save humanity from existential threats. Is Stage Turquoise the first stage of the Spiral where something is not trying to be saved, fixed, controlled? Stage Beige: Save myself. Stage Purple: Save my tribe. Stage Red: Save my power. Stage Blue: Save my religion and my community/country/ethnicity. Stage Orange: Save our economy and my freedom. Stage Green: Save Mother Nature and our toxic society. Stage Yellow: Save humanity from existential threats. Stage Turquoise: Savor the moment?

Yeah but it's fun. Let us play!!

@Nahm Thank you.

@Nahm I've been pondering your contemplation via Jesus, and honestly I'm not sure if it's fully registering. I do find that funny actually but probably not for the reasons you meant Do you mind restating or expressing in a different way? Thank you

@cigologic Love Fred! Hoping to book an Awakening Session with him. Really enjoyed his 12 Steps book.

@RendHeaven Yeah just to clarify, I'm not talking about trying to "get" to Turquoise. I don't claim to be anywhere near there yet. It's more of a conflict between the Strategist stage and Construct/Ego Aware (using SCG model).

@Nahm @Leo Gura I've been wondering recently if the map is creating my territory. I first got into Spiral Dynamics, Ego Development, Integral Theory, etc a little over a year ago after an out-of-body mystical experience that somehow transitioned me into early Yellow. For the past year I've diving head deep into all these maps essentially putting myself through developmental psychology school. It's been fascinating, and I'm super passionate about it. But after several God consciousness psychedelic ego death experiences in the past year, I found myself in the Construct/Ego Aware stage which has been illuminating yet certainly destabilizing. I have a story that I need to "work through the Yellow / Strategist stages" before I can/should further focus on awakening. But I'm starting to deconstruct all these maps and wonder how much of them are creating my reality vs guiding me through actual reality. The challenge is I feel I have one foot in two worlds: one in Yellow that wants to focus on mapmaking and solving all the existential problems in the world while further self-actualizing, and one foot in the nondual world that wants to focus on deconstructing everything that's creating this "I" story and fogging deeper awakenings. Perhaps I can do a little bit of both, but in a sense they seem like polarities - one is constructing and the other deconstructing. Is staying identified with the ego and spending a year or more deepening into Yellow a worthy pursuit, or will I just be adding more shit to my bag that I eventually need to let go of? And if so, what's the point? Is the map, at this point, simply creating my territory? It certainly feels like that, at times. Grateful for any advice or guidance.

@Nahm BOOM. Mic drop I guess when "I" experience there being no more stages I will stop asking these types of questions

An easy way to do this is to switch from “you” to “we”. For example, instead of saying, “You have no what the nature of reality is” one could say “we humans often have no idea what the nature of reality is.” It makes it inclusive and doesn’t presume that one knows everything about the person watching. It feels invitational rather than confrontational. Could really help in softening the delivering, though I’m not even sure that’s Leo’s intention...

This to me is a fantastic example of Stage Orange vs Yellow worldviews. I peg Bret Weinstein as very high Orange with some cognitive abilities (like systems thinking) that verge into Yellow. But fundamentally his worldview is Orange. He looks at the world from an almost entirely materialist's paradigm, specifically through a scientific evolutionary lens. He talks about the purpose of life being nothing other than to pass our genes onto the next generation. He talks about death in a very Orange way. He speaks about how important it is to save humanity from existential threats but fails to include that same concern for nature and animals. He mentions he doesn't believe in "fate or anything close to it." Most interestingly, Bret talked openly about how dark his worldview is, verging on a sense of nihilism that is common to Stage Orange. Jamie Wheal, meanwhile, has a visibly lighter spirit which several people in the YouTube comments noted. He spoke about "radical hope" and frequently referenced spiritual teachers and religious texts. He brilliantly weaved together many different fields of studies unlike Bret who almost always brought it back to his domain of science and history. Jamie advocated for post-modernism and indigenous wisdom at one point. Bret acknowledged that Jamie embodies a more "emotional" approach while Bret admitted to being more rational and analytical. What Jamie did so well - a huge tell of Stage Yellow - is he met Bret where he was at instead of debating him or calling him out (as the Green part of me wanted him to). Jamie was cool, calm and gracefully agreed with Bret's underlying points while expanding the conversation to include a more macro perspective, often which Bret agreed with...in other words, Jamie didn't go too far and loose his audience. He knew where to meet Bret and where to gently push him. This conversation also highlights to me some of the limitations of Yellow and Jamie's worldview. He still fundamentally is trying to save a material world and mapping the universe into infinity without expanding beyond the human mind into Turquoise territory, except for a few transcendent peak states of consciousness via psychedelics and breathwork, which he's spoken about. Jamie even joked that his wife makes fun of him for creating a map about whether he should lovingly touch her left shoulder or not, rather than just being a human and giving physical affection to his wife. He recognizes the limitations of map making and endlessly "complexifying" the world (calling out his fellow Stage Yellow friends), yet he mostly embodies the same shadows as they do. That's my analysis. Curious to hear what others think