Epiphany_Inspired

That's an amazing response, thanks @ImDANiEL your mom sounds incredible! To answer your question, yes and no. I would not want to work in a sweatshop, factory, etc...but I am one of those people that sews some of my own clothes, + makes other belongings, and I grow some of my own food (seasonally) . Yes, I do desire and prefer this ( personalized clothes, superior nutrition, etc). Would I like to spend all of my time sewing, growing, fishing etc. with no time for personal development and hobbies, etc? No, I am very grateful for the abundance here too. I know Leo's video's aren't meant to be " soothing" ( I like that comment), but normally, if they shake me up, it's a good thing... something I can work on, etc...This concept is beyond that...i would love it, if like Leo's other videos, there was some sort of action I could take to "work on this".... @Leo Gura Thanks for your honest response Leo! ....I think, I was hoping for comments with a little more hope.... that said, I'd rather hope be genuine. I personally feel that even though things have improved, the conditions and wages still = slavery, or at least a disturbingly close modern version. Governments may stay corrupt, but I can foresee the continuation of improvements in infrastructure and education.... perhaps in our lifetimes, actualization will even become part of the curriculum!

@Amplituda I think you have given a great answer. I feel anyone with almost any type of anxiety could use this formula by simply replacing " interviews, job, and hired" with words that suit their own situation. For me, my main anxieties come from ptsd after being stalked and filmed for years. Currently I have security related anxiety and I will definitely try this method. @Anna I can relate to working on social anxiety too. I am one of those introverts that friends always mistake for an extrovert, BUT, so far, I can only converse on a relaxed level with people that are like minded and obviously not mainstream ( example; I am practically shaking talking to the lawyer in the suit, but I can blab away with the blue haired stranger with a banjo on her back... like we've known each other forever...lol....) I think once again we could use Amplitude's method and substitute the concept of speaking like friends with ANYONE.... by working hard on this, so far, I'm just making more of an effort to speak with the types of people that I feel I can't relate to....I am still anxious, but at least I'm talking to them... lol... what worked for you?

@loveplay1983 Hey Xuan, nice to meet you too!

I think, as conscious folks often tell me " consider it another tool in your belt". My dear friend and tattoo artist learned, and mastered hypnosis and NLP for the sake of his clients, I can say from personal experience, it helps with pain, relaxation, etc..... so, I can imagine it could be useful for actualization... at the moment I'm not entirely clear how, but I imagine things like combining it with meditation or something....hmmmm.....

@Lorcan I'm all for you being a revolutionary, the worlds need more for sure, I was just saying there is likely more to your path for personal growth... anyway, below I've copied\pasted a comment I made from another thread on this form about escaping society to actualize ( topic posted by luigi1994). I thought you might be interested in this organization/ or concept.... sorry, sometimes when I paste on this forum it crosses things out... I find the parts of mainstream society that are not congruent with self-actualization, can still be learning experiences. That said, I can only take so much of it....that's why I live in the forest, lol. I think you might like "Sea-Steading" (see The Seasteading Institute). It is based on the principal that every time an island breaks off (like Hong Kong, Singapore, etc), they become amazingly productive creators and develop a unique prosperous, abundant community with revolutionary ideas. Their plan is to create communities at sea beyond the boundaries of any countries regulations, where people are free to explore new ideas, new gov't, new technology, etc with no boundaries. The concept art for these micro cities is beautiful, so is the sustainable living from algae production etc, but they don't have the money yet. It's a cool idea regardless, maybe check it out.

@ExitDone I'm so sorry I was unable to read the entirety of your post but I got the gist of it. My mother passed away when I was 17 and by 19 I was on my own too. You figure it out pretty quick....if you were thrown into water you would try damn hard to swim, or at least float....the alternative is drowning, right? I can't offer you any mystical insight at this point in my actualization, but here are some tips from someone that has been there: 1. Assume you can do it, be confident, or at least "fake it till you make it" 2. You are never truly homeless if you have a vehcile (try to get your lisence/ car first). 3. Learn how to cook rice, beans, etc from dried ( buy in bulk) and budget food money for veggies, eating= top priority 4. Set up safety nets other than parents, where you can turn ( community help, etc) 5. Eliminate all addictions ( alchcol is a huge waste of time/ money, so is tv, gamming, etc) 6. Baby step it, don't try to live beyond your means until you are stable ( ex: rent a room before an apartment, etc) 7. Try to have back-ups for everything (places to stay, extra jobs-keep one really part time one for emergencies, etc) It may seem scary, but you will fucking love it! The freedom, independence and growth are just what you need, good luck!

@Clay CurlI always think of mean people like children (it's how they're behaving, right?). This causes a desire to evolve their behaviour with firm yet compassionate consequences. Sometimes these consequences are simple things like less time around me. I have no idea if this is a neurotic response or not..just how I deal with it... I also tend to counter insults with my positive perception of my true self, unless I can see their point....lol....I'm dealing with a person going through difficulty and a "mean" phase directed at me right now too....so this topic really resonates with my life, thanks.... @Ajax I agree with you totally....but the I feel the digging deeper thing may only work with people that you have a really intimate connection with (like your wife). Most people are unaware of the true cause of their insecurities/ anger triggers, and of those that are aware, most wouldn't put themselves in such a vulnerable position to admit it....I like the waiting until " the charge settles" concept a lot. Often time automatically makes things less severe....

It seems, perhaps..."revolutionary" is your life purpose. From what I understand, purpose is key to actualization, but finding your purpose does not automatically actualize you. There is more work for you, resolving neurosis etc....

@Rasmus Thanks for your honest response, it's awesome! This is a post about vegan vs. veggie, so I'd like to try to shift things back to that. I only brought up eating chicken\fish, because I was veggie for over three decades, (which is rare in our culture), and felt my health benefited from chicken/fish, fat/ bone broth, etc. I love many Buddhist philosophies, but I guess I disagree with that one. To answer your question, I do not in any way enjoy killing, I truly feel that if I do it personally with de-braining, I know % 100 that there was no suffering. Animals killed in slaughter houses are often traumatized and suffer when they die. Many people believe you take on that suffering when you eat an animal killed that way (see the work of Temple Grandon on compassionate slaughter). As far as honouring the animal, see First Nations cultures, my beliefs with; respect, honour, and compassion when eating animals are akin to these traditions. Thank you for asking so respectfully, I really appreciate that. @Neill Bolton I could elude to the possibility that your aggression could potentially stem from a lack of proper omega intake... @Phocus Instead, I'd like to respond respectfully, even though I feel Neill may not have been giving me that same courtesy (telling me not to even bring up my perspective, etc) @Neill Bolton The "great vegan honey debate" has changed the definition of vegan through many sources. Humans, our world, and our language/ definitions evolve perpetually....that's what actualization is really, evolution.... perhaps you could consider this.... or not... I agree, there is no " method" of slaughter that respects an animals life. That respect comes from within your heart and soul (like I said above, see First Nations culture). There are too many examples to post, plants do feel, in my opinion, it's not nonsense. Re: your statistics comment, thanks for sharing that. It now seems apparent that your real "beef" is with mass-meat- consumption, animal agriculture, corporations, etc. I am a big supporter of the concept that an individual CAN change the world, and I appreciate that you are trying to reach us (Rasmus and I) on an individual level... that said, we both consume very few animal products. You'd likely have a more meaningful, substantial, impact if you focused your efforts on; the animal industry heads, individuals that eat meat regularly, those that are ignorant and are making unconscious choices (normal/mainstream folks that no nothing about your statistics, etc). People on this forum, for the most part, are at least making conscious choices about eating animal products or not. My daughter was just having a tantrum that we'd run out of her fav vegan cheese (made from pea protein), it alerted me to the fact that I don't have time and energy to continue this, so I won't be commenting anymore....although I do respect this debate, thanks for your time as well.

@PhilipIt's been a while since I asked that question, it's unexpected but I'm happy to get such an awesome answer.... very insightful, I'm sure you are 100% right, thanks! Admittedly I'm still a little confused though... about how the faulty programming happened in the first place.... if, as you said, we are less trusting of others opinions, how did the opinions of others mess up our subconscious in the first place.... is it because we were too young/ trusted more in childhood, or is it because negative things repeated by the same external person or multiple external people could eventually sink in simply because of the repetition (just like affirmations)... or some other crazy reason I haven't even thought of yet....?

Thanks for the thoughtful replies @Phocus and Rasmus. @Rasmus I was shocked to read that you eat meat, my judgement had pegged you as "wouldn't hurt\ eat a fly", ha ha..I agree with you, those that choose to eat insects may no longer fit the standard definition of vegan... in the beginnings of veganism things were a lot more rigid, religious even. Currently, here on the west coast of BC where vegans are VERY common, the modern definition simply means a person that doesn't eat dairy or animals (it's normal to eat honey or take krill oil). Perhaps there could be types of vegan, the same way a vegetarian that eats fish is a "pescatarian", there could be a new term for insect eaters that avoid all other meat, "bug-o-tarian" "insecto-vegan"...lol...The "feeling pain" thing is perhaps a topic for an additional post... but there is emerging evidence that plants feel pain too ( an example is that trees feel the loss of their fallen comrades and continue to send nutrients to neighbour stumps long after death). Even water is known to react to positive vs. negative comments, music etc...Everything in nature is alive and connected. I think the message I have for this community is; regardless of what you are eating, plant or animal, respect it's life, and honour it's sacrifice\death. 1. Has the plant or animal lived a natural, preferably organic life? Was the plant/ animal\ animal product (dairy) altered in any way ( GMO\hormones\antibiotics\etc)? 2. Do you feel the plant/animal lived a "happy" life in good conditions (plants=good soil, light, water, animals= pasture, light, quality food, love, humane treatment)? 3. Did the plant/ animal die or "get milked" with honour? For plants you can choose things grown and harvested sustainably, preferably mostly by hand from small farms. For animal milk, in my opinion, you need to go to the farm and see for your self, even if it's the pasteurized stuff at the store, go see. Food animals, you could choose animals raised well, that are killed with compassion and honour. One thing that helped me with deciding to eat chicken, was learning to take the animals life myself with the de-braining method (so that they died instantly with no suffering, and so that I could personally honour their life). If you are unable to slaughter the animal, you could choose to buy from farms that accompany their animals to the facility and ensure that everything is humane ( the animal is calm, does not suffer, does not witness other animals dying, etc). To answer the initial question, veggie or vegan, let your personal ethics, and desire for sustainability guide your choices... the rest will follow...

There is a Tedx on turning affirmations into vision boards, also, many people combine visualizations and affirmations. I think that combination is something to strive to perfect, rather than trying to separate those functions.

@Leo Gura and other ovo-vegetarians; As fellow "pasture-raised-egg -eaters", do you feel that you could maintain optimal health for your body, if you eliminated all animal products including fish/ krill oil supplements? @Phocus; What do you think of the comments above by Rasmus and Neill Bolton? I have only briefly scrolled through all the comments in this topic but i appriciate your desire to have a healthy debate, i enjoy that too. @Rasmus, and @Neill Bolton; If you would like to disagree with me that's great, i am always open to constructive debates! let's talk goat keifer alternatives, etc... Please also consider, do your comments positivly reflect your peer community tittles of "expert" and "apprentice"? for the sake of others that may have wished to contribute to this topic, consider exercising tollerance toward different views, and treating everyone with respect. @Rasmus; fair enough, you are opposed to ALL "killing", like the dhali lama, i find this an admirable trait. you believe the killing of crickets is equal to the killing of chickens, and on a spectrum of consciousness, some people would rate crickets a small step above carrots, while others would share your view. From a sustainability perspective alone, crickets are far superior to chicken. I also have a spectrum of vegan friends, some are religliously rigid and avoid ALL animal products, others eat honey and krill oil, and maybe they'd eat crickets. Consider respecting; those that identify with the term vegan may be more diverse, after all, "vegan" should be a meat-and-dairy-free lifestyle choice, not a cult. For me, transitioning into a pesco pollo vegetarian diet from a lacto ovo one included a lot of rescearch, professional nutritional consultations, and personal trials to shape the evolution of my present food choices including checking the gauge on my personal moral compass. Consider that I am not advocating eating Mc'nuggets/ caged hormone chickens slaughtered in horrific conditions, or suggesting anyone drink puss laden cow milk products from similarly disturbing sources. Consider that happy goats milked by hand in small quantities, at small local farms, is actually a more sustainable practice than big agra almond milk etc... Did you check out the future food 2050 link? I think we will both be stoked for that amazing sounding lupine flower milk, yum! @Neill Bolton; With an open mind, i accept that i may be deluded about some things, with the exception of truly enlightend people, we are all deluded in our own ways (was there more to your comment, deleted something when edited?). You quoted me re: goats. yes, they are happy, they litteraly come running up smiling. Yes, they do live with their nursing babies, we know them all by name. Yes, raw goat probiotis did transform my child's health when vegan alternatives could not, amazing stuff! Re: chicken as the girl that vomited at every bbq (because of smell), i did have to force myself to eat chicken. my father worked in a slaughter house in his 20's so meat was banned from our home, my digestion evolved with limited tollerance. My perspective re: eating chicken and mental stability has not come from my personal experiences alone. Here's another example; 4 of my friends with bi-polar were vegan for decades and have also improved vastly after introducing eggs, fish/ fish oils, and chicken/bone broth. Consider that each person on the planet is unique, some folks may not be capable of proper mental function on a rigid vegan diet because the current omega and protein alternatives are not yet suitable in terms of meeting specific needs. You don't have to agree, just have an open mind and consider it.

As someone that was raised veggie, worked 10 years in natural foods, and has developed a new perspective in later life, I can offer a unique opinion. I agree that a vegan lifestyle is better for the planet, that said, I do not feel that the meat alternative industry is up to par yet, especially in the realm of fats. The key to health is; a nutrient-dense, natural, unprocessed and unrefined diet. Please see the research of Dr. Weston A. Price, (he saw the link between modern food and health decay). In aprox. 1920's he was able to travel the world and find the last truly healthy cultures. The only healthy plant-based culture he found (I think Africa) ate lots of insects (so vegans could consider cricket flour, cricket burgers, etc, sustainable animal protein). Weston price found that this insect culture was actually the least healthy, of all the traditional cultures, and the inuit, high-animal-fat culture was healthier (this does not mean you should eat big portions modern animal fat). For me, until I can buy/ make something like cricket burgers that contain a similar fat profile to chicken and fish I choose the healthiest, most sustainable animal choices: i drink raw milk from happy goats living in harmony with their babies year round, I drink bone broth/ eat happy chicken from a local farm, I eat pasture raised eggs, honey, and most importantly fermented cod liver oil, or krill oil! Ethically I'd prefer to be vegan, but my personal experience; as a veggie for 30+ years, I literally had to force myself to eat organic range chicken, but once I started I quickly had more emotional control, less negative emotions, and vastly improved mental stability and function. I am 100% with the Weston price foundation on PRO RAW MILK, I've witnessed it cure major illness in my child and others. Sauerkraut and fermented veg have awesome probiotics too, but so far the most amazing, powerful, probiotic I've ever discovered is raw milk Kiefer, a miracle of nature to which there is currently no comparable vegan alternative.... but the revolution is coming see: http://futurefood2050.com/what-will-we-be-eating-in-2050/ I also wanted to add my opinion re: veganism and evolution. I truly believe that enlightened future humans could evolve to live on a purely vegan diet. I think the current nutritional needs of humans stem from a vast history of animal fat consumption, and we have not yet evolved beyond this need.... hopefully soon... our minds are awakening, so our bodies could follow suit

I think everything everyone is offering you in these comments is great. Without being too prying, can I ask what causes your pain on a physical level? Did you have an injury, illness, surgery, etc? is the pain in your muscles, joints or nerves? I think that taking care of your diet and mental state, etc is rad advice. I may be able to offer my additional perspective if I knew more about the source....

@David, @TomKay so, I am loving this too, thanks for your rad comments. Yes, so refreshing and good for the scalp/hair etc. I am alternating with my typical hot bath therapy. David, is our well water colder than city-folks water? (my water is coming from 200 ft down inside a rock). TomKay, Has your circulation improved? I have not recovered from the cold in 5 min like the guy in that tedx vid. I have to stand under a hair dryer (lol), or i'm still numb and shaking after 5...but this is normal for me, after surfing I have a fire or a car heater. To both of you...How cold should the water be? Is between the cold that is just below luke warm, and maximum cold on the faucet cold enough? I still squeal, but not quite the full little girl squeal...lol... I have worked my way up to the 5 minutes with that temp, with the maximum well water cold I am only at 2 min....

Upon Leo's video suggestion I took the Myers Briggs Personality Test and was totally floored by how enlightening it was! I have never met anyone with a personality like me, and now I know why, it's the rarest (1-3% of humans). I took it a few times to be sure, it's definitely me. INFJ's include Ghandi, Martin Luther King, Mother Teresa, Nelson Mandela, etc,... but also Bin Laden, Hitler, etc,.. (better watch out for my dark side... lol...) anyway, most INFJ'S are like Leo, we have an innate desire to impact people. So, I'm assuming this community may be good place to find other actualizing INFJ's for that reason. We are the introverts that others mistake for extros (because of our conversation style, uniqueness, etc). I love Joanna Newsome's music, she is an INFJ. Are any of you too? Here's a link that describes us well enough, I had found the ultimate one, but I forgot to bookmark it I guess;http://regiesh.tumblr.com/post/44050304718/a-really-great-infj-description-maybe-the-best

@The Alchemist Awesome, tear those layers off and soar on wings of energy! Personally, I'm not that actualized yet. As difficult as it is to be infj, I like having this personality for the most part, and hope to use the positive aspects to help me on my journey...infj is not a prison to me. I was trying to make a silly Joke when I said you were "one of us" no intent to cage you...or classify...Etc. sorry... @Natura Sonoris I am learning to be open minded, I just haven't got to the Hitler level yet. I'm stoked for you that you have...I will aim for that too...

I just went to an ELDOA workshop at my local health fair, it's rad! The theory behind it is; to work on the "Fascia" the layer between the skin and muscles, so that you can eventually work the muscles and joints underneath more effectively! I only did about 5 different stretches, and I have that "good burn" like I've been working out for hours! I have some back and hip issues (hips were run over twice by delivery truck) and yoga/ other fitness activities can aggravate/ cause nerve pain. ELDOA was "good burn" only, no real pain! In fact it improved a number of things (my sitting posture, walking stance, etc). I plan to add this to my daily actualization rituals, even a few minutes a day of this would be effective. You could try it! Here's a random example from YouTube of one of the stretches:

So stoked for all of the comments! @Natura Sonoris thanks for being so thoughtful! All of the things that you suggested are things that I am working on for actualization (especially values vs. beliefs). I have really taken what you said to heart, at the same time, I agree with @Mad Cat, my fundamental operating system would likely be predominantly the same. @Natura Sonoris Funny that you mentioned Hitler in the "feels great to be like them" sentence though. I try to take Leo's advice not to think of anyone as "evil", but I am not that actualised yet (Hitler was a great inventor, but I definitely don't think of him as a role model). @X-ways I agree, it usually feels like it would be easier to be any other type, but perhaps like @Miicat said, maybe the potential within us will make it all worthwhile. @Mad Cat Oh perfectionism, my nemesis, the reality of what my hands/abilities can create never lives up to the visions in my mind. That said, I agree with you again, that other aspects of our inherent nature may actually benefit our actualization and help me resolve this. We have a unique role for sure! @The Alchemist I think you might be one of us just because of your apparent conflict alone, lol... One of my most ridiculous infj traits is constantly speaking in metaphors and analogies (like a cheesy poet or something, ha ha), I even take in information this way (convert knowledge, concepts etc to metaphors)... lol....

@Sarah_Flagg I really respect that you decided what is best for you. If you were unhappy with the situation it likely would have rubbed off on your child (I learnt that the hard way). Don't loose sleep, I have good news for you; I actually spoke to early childhood professionals about separation and they affirmed "the earlier the better", so it's a real blessing that you had this insight while he's only 2. Sorry if I seemed negative about living rural. It is also incredibly beautiful. I just wanted you to understand some of the challenges that come with the dream. As far as your crap in moderation rule, I agree. My mother was "no sugar", by the time I was 9 I had 3 paper routes so that I could get as much sugar as I wanted, the same thing happened w/ TV. @Leo Gura Thanks so much! It's blowing my mind imagining my toddler eventually learning to meditate!

@Sarah_Flagg I have actually become the single mom living in the cabin in the woods, I don't know that it's the right path for everyone. Being single, for me, yes, (the relationship was unhealthy). Only you can decide what's best for you (your needs matter too). Cabin = isolation, unless you have tons of gas $. My almost 3 year old is already wanting to move to the city (lived in this cabin her whole life). Education Issues: the "peer culture", food choices, etc in public schools is atrocious! That said, homeschooling an only child isolated in the forest, is a recipe for... social inadequacy, or something. The only rad alternative school is in the city. I'd like to find enough likeminded parents to start a network, or create our own school, but so far no luck. My daughter and I would have to spend 2 hours/ day driving to a car free school, seriously, (plus me having to be in the city all day too) just to avoid public school! We may have to leave the cabin.... Time Issues: living in a cabin is wayyyy more effort. There is firewood, kindling, food to grow (or more gas $ to buy it), weather preparation, land maintenance (branches so you can drive up, etc), rodent defence, predator safety, (I could go on and on). Less personal development time for sure. @Leo Gura So true, leading by example! I was telling my daughter & another adult that "I only watch learning TV now", and my daughter said that she only wants to watch "learning shows" too! She has always loved books, and now has a renewed love of educational cartoons (but she still wants her crap shows sometimes too). Luckily she's been raised on whole food\ doesn't like crap food, but crap knowledge is lurking everywhere! Do we try to keep our kids away from crap knowledge (how?), or bombard them with even more awesome knowledge (to tip the scales)?

@Phrae fair enough...i do not think that this personality type is better than any other, and it is very difficult to handle. That said, when you look at the history of civilization, it seems like so many important figures are INFJ. Imagine if King, Ghandi, Mother Teresa, Eleanor Roosevelt, Nelson Mandela, etc could speak in a forum, like we are now. I am not saying that we are as awesome as they are, I just think INFJ's united could be a good thing. I also think (with the exception of Hitler etc) that it's rad to have role models with the same personality type, and that could do a lot for actualizing infj's. @Mad Cat I've learnt those lessons too. Perhaps, work that doesn't compromise your values (if you are truly passionate about it), would eventually become more profitable. A love of quality things is apparently very infj, I share your quest for healthy food, and love antiques, vintage records etc @DizIzMikey I took 3 different versions of the test online, all said INFJ. I have no idea which is best, but there is a link to one above in Jesper's post. @Simon SO TRUE!

@David thanks, sounds like a good plan!

@Emerald Wilkins I love taking action based on intuition as well! Does your intuition manifest in a physical form? My positive intuition is like shivers down my upper arms and or lower legs. Even though they aren't INFJ's, most of my friends love their inner worlds too. That said, we often don't "relate" ...so I can relate with you... lol... at least there are likeminded friends online! @Brian Greendahl, @Simon, @jms0717, @Erica, @jimmy, @SenshiAna, @BeckoningCat, @Dhana Choko, @Amund Most of you seem to have evolved beyond the benefits of relating to this personality type... That said, if any of you have an interest in talking about your favourite/ least fav personal infj qualities. I'd love to hear. Also, if any of you have a desire to impact on the world in a meaningful way; What is your vision, and how to you plan to actualize it?